knicks1248 wrote:

arkrud wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

arkrud wrote:

Nalod wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:This FO has never made a trade that actually made sense, or one that we actually won.

Their entire timeline has been based on signing or trading players that they waive or trade 90 to 120 days later for pennies on the dollar.

Just no stability whatsoever..

Trading Morris or Randle means you go into next season as a yet another rebuilding season, leading up to 2021 Free agency as an extremely unattractive team with no stars.

So doing nothing, or give Morris 20 a year? Hardaway made 18 a year. Morris showing a lot. Whats do you pay him.
We know what's been done in the past, how do you win a trade? not doing one?

Stability comes when team get it's long term core in place.
We do not have any of this. Before that it is constant change of personal.
Morris is out of out timeline by 5 years.
If we want to get anything for him we must trade him at deadline.
He will sign in off-season with Phily for sure. This was most likely his goal from get go.
And he will do same regardless of finishing with Knicks of as mercenary for playoffs with Clips or Lakers.

Are you 2 brothers or best friends..smh

None of our young guys are stars, not even close, which makes them easy to trade.

I'm more interested in getting guys on Morris and Randles level than frank, knox, dotson, or trier. If your not winning, your changing.

It's time to take the young guys and flip them for guys on Randle and Morris and Payton's level 4 to 5 yrs in.

This trading good players for draft picks is a cycle that will never end..the sad part is you see it, and live in denial

Randle and Morris and Payton's level players will give you 40 wins max. What the point?
To build a good team in NBA you need to suck badly for 5 years with purpose.
Knicks managed to suck 20 years for nothing. Time to suck on purpose and build a good team not mediocre crap to please some infantile fans with 40 wins.

And young players like knox, frank, dotson, trier, dsj, will get coaches fired, Presidents fired, other players traded, 17 wins, no stability and label dysfunction.

A star will be more inclined to sign with a 40 win team that's a few pieces away as oppose to a young squad with no identity, no focusness, and just happy to be here...

I would keep Mitch and RJ, and trade the rest of them

40 win team which is build right way with no albatross contracts, pre-retirement vets, and overpaid stat collectors will indeed attract stars.
It is a big difference to have 40-win team with potential of with no future.
Team have to collect assets, develop own picks, find undrafted and second round diamonds, value trades, be patient, and be able to recognize when luck strikes.
There is nothing simple about it and it takes a long time.

arkrud wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

arkrud wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

arkrud wrote:

Nalod wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:This FO has never made a trade that actually made sense, or one that we actually won.

Their entire timeline has been based on signing or trading players that they waive or trade 90 to 120 days later for pennies on the dollar.

Just no stability whatsoever..

Trading Morris or Randle means you go into next season as a yet another rebuilding season, leading up to 2021 Free agency as an extremely unattractive team with no stars.

So doing nothing, or give Morris 20 a year? Hardaway made 18 a year. Morris showing a lot. Whats do you pay him.
We know what's been done in the past, how do you win a trade? not doing one?

Stability comes when team get it's long term core in place.
We do not have any of this. Before that it is constant change of personal.
Morris is out of out timeline by 5 years.
If we want to get anything for him we must trade him at deadline.
He will sign in off-season with Phily for sure. This was most likely his goal from get go.
And he will do same regardless of finishing with Knicks of as mercenary for playoffs with Clips or Lakers.

Are you 2 brothers or best friends..smh

None of our young guys are stars, not even close, which makes them easy to trade.

I'm more interested in getting guys on Morris and Randles level than frank, knox, dotson, or trier. If your not winning, your changing.

It's time to take the young guys and flip them for guys on Randle and Morris and Payton's level 4 to 5 yrs in.

This trading good players for draft picks is a cycle that will never end..the sad part is you see it, and live in denial

Randle and Morris and Payton's level players will give you 40 wins max. What the point?
To build a good team in NBA you need to suck badly for 5 years with purpose.
Knicks managed to suck 20 years for nothing. Time to suck on purpose and build a good team not mediocre crap to please some infantile fans with 40 wins.

And young players like knox, frank, dotson, trier, dsj, will get coaches fired, Presidents fired, other players traded, 17 wins, no stability and label dysfunction.

A star will be more inclined to sign with a 40 win team that's a few pieces away as oppose to a young squad with no identity, no focusness, and just happy to be here...

I would keep Mitch and RJ, and trade the rest of them

40 win team which is build right way with no albatross contracts, pre-retirement vets, and overpaid stat collectors will indeed attract stars.
It is a big difference to have 40-win team with potential of with no future.
Team have to collect assets, develop own picks, find undrafted and second round diamonds, value trades, be patient, and be able to recognize when luck strikes.
There is nothing simple about it and it takes a long time.

You described the Nets
They have about 70mm this year with bad shoulder Kyrie "Cybil" Irving and Surfire Durant who has the worst injury in the sport north of 30 years old. This was our great failure. The irony would have been incredible if knicks signed that duo. We "lost" the off season?
Granted, for Nets it was not about this year but........The team should have been creating a buzz about town and improved.
Im not gloating (maybe a little) but sometimes things don't go to plan. For knicks, we were foundationally rebuilding and then panic set in when Phil wanted to trade KP, then KP broke. Nobody wants to drop back and punt but sometimes it goes from bad, to improving, then to worse.
worst thing is to panic. Easy to say "its not working, lets just get.........". That's Drunk Uncle running out of patience on the obvious.
Knicks in a bad place. Nobody wants to be here. But its what you do when its ugly that can determine the future.

The Knicks need assets to make a future trade to obtain a superstar. Morris is playing at level he will be unable to sustain going forward and his value is at an all time high. Now is the time to turn these one year deals into assets. There is an arms race in the western conference and it's about time the Knicks took advantage of a situation for the first time since Sprewell and Camby.

Call the Sixers and get an asset for Bullock. Play the LA teams against one another. It shouldn't be difficult to put together a couple of favorable deals for the Knicks. We can always sign a overpriced veteran next offseason.

smackeddog wrote:I think the org wouldn't want to screw over Morris, so we'd only trade him if he was okay with it. He'd be okay going to the Sixers, and maybe he'd be okay with the Clips due to championship possibilities. None of the other playoff teams can realistically do a deal. Only two realistic options are Sixers or Clippers and of those two I think only the Clips makes sense for both teams. I'd maybe consider Morris and Dotson/Trier for Harkless, Shamet and their late first

Morris fried spurs for his contract. he'd be ok. he knows its a business. One year deals are ok to move a player if you paid him well. Gibson has personal reasons, that's different.

smackeddog wrote:Hmm, interesting Berman piece:

According to an NBA source, some members of the front office are leaning toward holding onto Morris at the deadline — unless they get back a star-type player in a large package.

The source said a minor Morris deal that would net a late-first-round pick and force them to take on a non-expiring contract is not an attractive option at this juncture. The Knicks prefer not to diminish their 2020 or 2021 cap space in any deal.

I've always assumed the Clips would be the most likely team, but they wouldn't need to send us a non-expiring deal, so I wonder what team they're talking about?- who'd give up a late first and ask us to take on a contract? Also would indicate that the Clips haven't made an offer (yet), unless they're offering back Harkless ($11mil expiring) and McGruder (2 more years at $5mil per).

Maybe Indiana? There really aren't many teams that it could be (they'd have to be a playoff team with their 1st tradeable AND only have no expirings that match the salary).

I'm guessing the larger trade for a star player is reference to Towns and the Twolves. Probably the Knicks preferred deal would be:

Morris ($15mil) and Portis ($15mil), DSj ($4mil), Knox ($4mil) and Mitch ($1.6mil) plus picks galore for Towns ($27mil) and Dieng (2years $16mil per), plus a couple of minimum contract players the Twolves don't want), Twolves could then flip Morris to whoever for another first. Think Perry and Mills are deluded with this strategy because OKC can massively outbid us thanks to all their picks, as can the Pelicans.

Then let them. Thunder has CP3 contract to contend with. That either will cost them to dump (they gained assets by taking him) or Minny will have to. That will cost Thunder even more.
Pelicans have to pay Ingram but as a pending FA his trade value is less. A mid year move for towns does not make much sense at this point unless there is a motivated 3rd team that can cash in by taking on what nobody wants.
This chess game is above my pay grade.
Nalod is focused on RJ Barrett and Mitch as our core with usual suspects on the fringe (Frank, Knox). Dennis is nothing at this point other than a flash point in a conversation.
Like most knick seasons we hype out on the trade deadline and lament when we don't make a change to move the dial. For all its worth Morris is a free agent and still just a low 1st round pick via trade. I sniff at KAT but there is not much leverage and he would not come cheap.
Minny sucks with him and I suppose we are just doing awful without that.

martin wrote:

smackeddog wrote:Hmm, interesting Berman piece:

According to an NBA source, some members of the front office are leaning toward holding onto Morris at the deadline — unless they get back a star-type player in a large package.

The source said a minor Morris deal that would net a late-first-round pick and force them to take on a non-expiring contract is not an attractive option at this juncture. The Knicks prefer not to diminish their 2020 or 2021 cap space in any deal.

I've always assumed the Clips would be the most likely team, but they wouldn't need to send us a non-expiring deal, so I wonder what team they're talking about?- who'd give up a late first and ask us to take on a contract? Also would indicate that the Clips haven't made an offer (yet), unless they're offering back Harkless ($11mil expiring) and McGruder (2 more years at $5mil per).

Maybe Indiana? There really aren't many teams that it could be (they'd have to be a playoff team with their 1st tradeable AND only have no expirings that match the salary).

I'm guessing the larger trade for a star player is reference to Towns and the Twolves. Probably the Knicks preferred deal would be:

Morris ($15mil) and Portis ($15mil), DSj ($4mil), Knox ($4mil) and Mitch ($1.6mil) plus picks galore for Towns ($27mil) and Dieng (2years $16mil per), plus a couple of minimum contract players the Twolves don't want), Twolves could then flip Morris to whoever for another first. Think Perry and Mills are deluded with this strategy because OKC can massively outbid us thanks to all their picks, as can the Pelicans.

Miami, Philly

You thinking Philly trades Emiiiiid? Its an interesting concept as Joel is a bit high maintenance and I think won't make it in the league past age 30. I may be wrong. I usually am, but what does Minny thing is what matters! Philly has issues but they should leave this team be for this year and see what becomes. If not, they have to look at the coach who took them as far as the might could go and is there another who could. There is always a good idea, but to fulfill it is not easy. Simmons and Emiid are great talents but not rounded. Joel is injury prone and motivationally challenged while simmons can't shoot. We not talking Kobe and Shaq here!!!!!
Miami with Bam as a centerpiece could make a good play. Its classic Riley. I though butler was not enamored with KAT lack of intensity while in Minny?

smackeddog wrote:

martin wrote:

smackeddog wrote:Hmm, interesting Berman piece:

According to an NBA source, some members of the front office are leaning toward holding onto Morris at the deadline — unless they get back a star-type player in a large package.

The source said a minor Morris deal that would net a late-first-round pick and force them to take on a non-expiring contract is not an attractive option at this juncture. The Knicks prefer not to diminish their 2020 or 2021 cap space in any deal.

I've always assumed the Clips would be the most likely team, but they wouldn't need to send us a non-expiring deal, so I wonder what team they're talking about?- who'd give up a late first and ask us to take on a contract? Also would indicate that the Clips haven't made an offer (yet), unless they're offering back Harkless ($11mil expiring) and McGruder (2 more years at $5mil per).

Maybe Indiana? There really aren't many teams that it could be (they'd have to be a playoff team with their 1st tradeable AND only have no expirings that match the salary).

I'm guessing the larger trade for a star player is reference to Towns and the Twolves. Probably the Knicks preferred deal would be:

Morris ($15mil) and Portis ($15mil), DSj ($4mil), Knox ($4mil) and Mitch ($1.6mil) plus picks galore for Towns ($27mil) and Dieng (2years $16mil per), plus a couple of minimum contract players the Twolves don't want), Twolves could then flip Morris to whoever for another first. Think Perry and Mills are deluded with this strategy because OKC can massively outbid us thanks to all their picks, as can the Pelicans.

Miami, Philly

I don’t think the heat can trade their firsts for a long time- they owe 2021 and 2023 to okc, so can’t trade a 1st until 2025. Philly would struggle to match the salary

Right. I should have explained more. I think the article is kinda sorta a message one, ie that the Knicks want first rounder and don’t want to take back long contacts which are probably being offered by those 2 teams. So ante up if you are calling about Morris.

CrushAlot wrote:

martin wrote:

Nalod wrote:

martin wrote:

smackeddog wrote:Hmm, interesting Berman piece:

According to an NBA source, some members of the front office are leaning toward holding onto Morris at the deadline — unless they get back a star-type player in a large package.

The source said a minor Morris deal that would net a late-first-round pick and force them to take on a non-expiring contract is not an attractive option at this juncture. The Knicks prefer not to diminish their 2020 or 2021 cap space in any deal.

I've always assumed the Clips would be the most likely team, but they wouldn't need to send us a non-expiring deal, so I wonder what team they're talking about?- who'd give up a late first and ask us to take on a contract? Also would indicate that the Clips haven't made an offer (yet), unless they're offering back Harkless ($11mil expiring) and McGruder (2 more years at $5mil per).

Maybe Indiana? There really aren't many teams that it could be (they'd have to be a playoff team with their 1st tradeable AND only have no expirings that match the salary).

I'm guessing the larger trade for a star player is reference to Towns and the Twolves. Probably the Knicks preferred deal would be:

Morris ($15mil) and Portis ($15mil), DSj ($4mil), Knox ($4mil) and Mitch ($1.6mil) plus picks galore for Towns ($27mil) and Dieng (2years $16mil per), plus a couple of minimum contract players the Twolves don't want), Twolves could then flip Morris to whoever for another first. Think Perry and Mills are deluded with this strategy because OKC can massively outbid us thanks to all their picks, as can the Pelicans.

Miami, Philly

You thinking Philly trades Emiiiiid? Its an interesting concept as Joel is a bit high maintenance and I think won't make it in the league past age 30. I may be wrong. I usually am, but what does Minny thing is what matters! Philly has issues but they should leave this team be for this year and see what becomes. If not, they have to look at the coach who took them as far as the might could go and is there another who could. There is always a good idea, but to fulfill it is not easy. Simmons and Emiid are great talents but not rounded. Joel is injury prone and motivationally challenged while simmons can't shoot. We not talking Kobe and Shaq here!!!!!
Miami with Bam as a centerpiece could make a good play. Its classic Riley. I though butler was not enamored with KAT lack of intensity while in Minny?

No I think those 2 teams are calling about Morris and offering garbage.

Philly prob looking at Morris, Bullocks and returning Josh Richardson and some young guys like Zhaire Smith and Matisse thybuma. Joshs contract pretty much 2 years beyond this one which is a no no

Has Richardson had a bad year? I thought he was a really good up and coming two way player with the Heat. I think he is only 25. If that deal is out there I think they would be smart to do it. They might need to move Dot but I think that is the type of deal you make.
The

Not so much of Richardson having a bad year and more of how can they upgrade. Philly needs more spacers for Embiid given Ben Simmons’ shooting. Morris and a shooting guard could also move Horford to bench which may be a long term good thing.

martin wrote:Interesting take:

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/tommybeer/status/1218699196787843072

Yeah, but Harris is younger. Plus, I don't think teams now have the assets Philly had. I'd definitely pull the trade if we got picks and a decent prospect along with expirings. But where can we get those?