What I watched last night was a good backup, if Frank can sustain this level of performance. To be a full time starter, Id want to see him get to the line more, be able to go on runs when the rest of the team is putting up bricks, be able to pick up the slack. Dont believe Frank is there right now.

GustavBahler wrote:Frank looked better, no doubt about that. Some of the shots he took, he wouldnt have in the past because he had just missed a shot seconds earlier. Kept firing away. In Frsnk's case, thats a good thing.

What I watched last night was a good backup, if Frank can sustain this level of performance. To be a full time starter, Id want to see him get to the line more, be able to go on runs when the rest of the team is putting up bricks, be able to pick up the slack. Dont believe Frank is there right now.

This! You nailed it in terms of what's required of the modern day lead guard. Attack, collapse the D and create for yourself and others at the same time have a respectable jumper. I'm not knocking Frank when I say this, but he is a back up guard at this point, particularly for this team that's thin on talent. With that said, last night is something to build on.

Uptown wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:Frank looked better, no doubt about that. Some of the shots he took, he wouldnt have in the past because he had just missed a shot seconds earlier. Kept firing away. In Frsnk's case, thats a good thing.

What I watched last night was a good backup, if Frank can sustain this level of performance. To be a full time starter, Id want to see him get to the line more, be able to go on runs when the rest of the team is putting up bricks, be able to pick up the slack. Dont believe Frank is there right now.

This! You nailed it in terms of what's required of the modern day lead guard. Attack, collapse the D and create for yourself and others at the same time have a respectable jumper. I'm not knocking Frank when I say this, but he is a back up guard at this point, particularly for this team that's thin on talent. With that said, last night is something to build on.

GustavBahler wrote:

arkrud wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:Frank looked better, no doubt about that. Some of the shots he took, he wouldnt have in the past because he had just missed a shot seconds earlier. Kept firing away. In Frsnk's case, thats a good thing.

What I watched last night was a good backup, if Frank can sustain this level of performance. To be a full time starter, Id want to see him get to the line more, be able to go on runs when the rest of the team is putting up bricks, be able to pick up the slack. Dont believe Frank is there right now.

You are describing elite scoring PG.
Not every NBA team can get that.
Not rebuilding for sure as this will be a waste of his prime and waste of team money.
Once in blue moon this kind of PG can be a part of youth movement when came from the draft.
We did not draft PG in many years. So this is not about the Knicks.
Frank can start a couple of years until we will be good enough to trade for this kind of PG or better get him as FA.
Can be our final peace for contention if we will stick with the plan.

Totally reject the notion that only an elite PG can do this. Doesnt have to lead the team in scoring, but has to be a threat at the rim in crunch time. Be able to get to the line, because thats often where games are won. Frank ia not at the point where he can be that guy, nevermind consistently.

The knicks don't have a finisher on the roster let alone Frank. Nobody is saying to give him the ball in last two minutes. But, if the defense dares him, he has to be at least average. And yes, he is not.

Most Frank convos have the word "If". "If he can......this", "If he can do that......" Last night you saw a bit more and more. That's all. We not asking for Baron Davis quite yet!!! LOL! That is our wishlist for Dennis! Frank we hope is Rubio but a better shooter. Rubio was an elite passer even as a rookie. Frank got that Defense thing. If not, He'd be toast.

My guess is that old school Knick fans like him more as he has more traditional PG skills now rather than the new modern scoring PG skills.

Yes, he needs to be even more agressive than he was last night - I beleive it will come!! Very few can defend like he can. FOr all that talk about D being most important, Frank is a critical part of that. He can set the tone but needs help. That is why RJ is good with him as is Dotson. DD can 3 and D. RJ creates his own and so can Trier. These are the type of players that need to surround Frank.

However, their front court is a defensive nightmare. Gibson can play D but get limited run. Portis and Randle are putrid. Morris tries. No Mitch - No interior D.

ITs about 2 way players and thye need to develop. Frank is in his 3rd year (end of 2nd really) - he needs to play and play and little by little improve his offense. It WILL COME.

He WANTS to defend!! He WANTS to MOVE THE BALL - OMG!! This is the player we want !!!! He can defend the 1-2-3 !!

GustavBahler wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

arkrud wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:Frank looked better, no doubt about that. Some of the shots he took, he wouldnt have in the past because he had just missed a shot seconds earlier. Kept firing away. In Frsnk's case, thats a good thing.

What I watched last night was a good backup, if Frank can sustain this level of performance. To be a full time starter, Id want to see him get to the line more, be able to go on runs when the rest of the team is putting up bricks, be able to pick up the slack. Dont believe Frank is there right now.

You are describing elite scoring PG.
Not every NBA team can get that.
Not rebuilding for sure as this will be a waste of his prime and waste of team money.
Once in blue moon this kind of PG can be a part of youth movement when came from the draft.
We did not draft PG in many years. So this is not about the Knicks.
Frank can start a couple of years until we will be good enough to trade for this kind of PG or better get him as FA.
Can be our final peace for contention if we will stick with the plan.

Totally reject the notion that only an elite PG can do this. Doesnt have to lead the team in scoring, but has to be a threat at the rim in crunch time. Be able to get to the line, because thats often where games are won. Frank ia not at the point where he can be that guy, nevermind consistently.

Please name a PG that is a threat at the rim in crunch time that is not an elite PG and can get to the line at will.

With the exception of your "at will" comment, just on this team over the last 3-4 years. Id say almost every PG who has come through here, with the exception of Frank and Baker, has shown the ability to get to the line in crunch time.

Most of them arent here anymore because they couldnt do it consistently, thats why they didnt make it as a long term starter. Lack of defense made it hard to keep some of them as a backup.

Frank got to the line for the first time last night. Can go literally weeks without taking a FT. You guys make it sound like its no big thing. Its a very big thing, when you're talking about a lead PG you want to contend with down the road.

My apologies to the "at will" comment. I thought that was implied. if that is the case then Frank is a threat at the rim like any other player. Now, can you quantify how much? Probably not but you can make your own assumptions. If you have the ball in your hand then you are a threat to take it to the rim. Question. When Frank has the ball...does the defender sag off? I have not seen anybody sag off Frank yet. That means Frank is a threat and the defense is still playing 5 on 5 and not the 4 on 5 people like to claim.

Frank got to the line for the first time last night. yes. he needs to do better. There are a lot of things he needs to get better at. To me this is all on the coach. Frank has shown that he can drive to the basket. Fizdale needs to take the ball away from Morris and Randle and trust that RJ and Frank can attack the basket.

NYKBocker wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

arkrud wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:Frank looked better, no doubt about that. Some of the shots he took, he wouldnt have in the past because he had just missed a shot seconds earlier. Kept firing away. In Frsnk's case, thats a good thing.

What I watched last night was a good backup, if Frank can sustain this level of performance. To be a full time starter, Id want to see him get to the line more, be able to go on runs when the rest of the team is putting up bricks, be able to pick up the slack. Dont believe Frank is there right now.

You are describing elite scoring PG.
Not every NBA team can get that.
Not rebuilding for sure as this will be a waste of his prime and waste of team money.
Once in blue moon this kind of PG can be a part of youth movement when came from the draft.
We did not draft PG in many years. So this is not about the Knicks.
Frank can start a couple of years until we will be good enough to trade for this kind of PG or better get him as FA.
Can be our final peace for contention if we will stick with the plan.

Totally reject the notion that only an elite PG can do this. Doesnt have to lead the team in scoring, but has to be a threat at the rim in crunch time. Be able to get to the line, because thats often where games are won. Frank ia not at the point where he can be that guy, nevermind consistently.

Please name a PG that is a threat at the rim in crunch time that is not an elite PG and can get to the line at will.

With the exception of your "at will" comment, just on this team over the last 3-4 years. Id say almost every PG who has come through here, with the exception of Frank and Baker, has shown the ability to get to the line in crunch time.

Most of them arent here anymore because they couldnt do it consistently, thats why they didnt make it as a long term starter. Lack of defense made it hard to keep some of them as a backup.

Frank got to the line for the first time last night. Can go literally weeks without taking a FT. You guys make it sound like its no big thing. Its a very big thing, when you're talking about a lead PG you want to contend with down the road.

My apologies to the "at will" comment. I thought that was implied. if that is the case then Frank is a threat at the rim like any other player. Now, can you quantify how much? Probably not but you can make your own assumptions. If you have the ball in your hand then you are a threat to take it to the rim. Question. When Frank has the ball...does the defender sag off? I have not seen anybody sag off Frank yet. That means Frank is a threat and the defense is still playing 5 on 5 and not the 4 on 5 people like to claim.

Frank got to the line for the first time last night. yes. he needs to do better. There are a lot of things he needs to get better at. To me this is all on the coach. Frank has shown that he can drive to the basket. Fizdale needs to take the ball away from Morris and Randle and trust that RJ and Frank can attack the basket.

Exactly, its easy to pick on Frank due to his past transgressions. But FIBA Frank showed he can close as have Under18 tourny Frank. He has yet to be trusted and groomed.

He can contribute and hope his production continues to grow

newyorknewyork wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

arkrud wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:Frank looked better, no doubt about that. Some of the shots he took, he wouldnt have in the past because he had just missed a shot seconds earlier. Kept firing away. In Frsnk's case, thats a good thing.

What I watched last night was a good backup, if Frank can sustain this level of performance. To be a full time starter, Id want to see him get to the line more, be able to go on runs when the rest of the team is putting up bricks, be able to pick up the slack. Dont believe Frank is there right now.

You are describing elite scoring PG.
Not every NBA team can get that.
Not rebuilding for sure as this will be a waste of his prime and waste of team money.
Once in blue moon this kind of PG can be a part of youth movement when came from the draft.
We did not draft PG in many years. So this is not about the Knicks.
Frank can start a couple of years until we will be good enough to trade for this kind of PG or better get him as FA.
Can be our final peace for contention if we will stick with the plan.

Totally reject the notion that only an elite PG can do this. Doesnt have to lead the team in scoring, but has to be a threat at the rim in crunch time. Be able to get to the line, because thats often where games are won. Frank ia not at the point where he can be that guy, nevermind consistently.

Please name a PG that is a threat at the rim in crunch time that is not an elite PG and can get to the line at will.

With the exception of your "at will" comment, just on this team over the last 3-4 years. Id say almost every PG who has come through here, with the exception of Frank and Baker, has shown the ability to get to the line in crunch time.

Most of them arent here anymore because they couldnt do it consistently, thats why they didnt make it as a long term starter. Lack of defense made it hard to keep some of them as a backup.

Frank got to the line for the first time last night. Can go literally weeks without taking a FT. You guys make it sound like its no big thing. Its a very big thing, when you're talking about a lead PG you want to contend with down the road.

My apologies to the "at will" comment. I thought that was implied. if that is the case then Frank is a threat at the rim like any other player. Now, can you quantify how much? Probably not but you can make your own assumptions. If you have the ball in your hand then you are a threat to take it to the rim. Question. When Frank has the ball...does the defender sag off? I have not seen anybody sag off Frank yet. That means Frank is a threat and the defense is still playing 5 on 5 and not the 4 on 5 people like to claim.

Frank got to the line for the first time last night. yes. he needs to do better. There are a lot of things he needs to get better at. To me this is all on the coach. Frank has shown that he can drive to the basket. Fizdale needs to take the ball away from Morris and Randle and trust that RJ and Frank can attack the basket.

Exactly, its easy to pick on Frank due to his past transgressions. But FIBA Frank showed he can close as have Under18 tourny Frank. He has yet to be trusted and groomed.

NBA Frank has to do a much better job of getting to the rim, or he isnt starter material. Cant attribute so few trips to the rim to just players sagging off him, doesnt have the ability to consistently beat guys off the dribble yet. Looks better this season, still looks like a backup, but a good one, if he can keep this up.

Offensively believe there is a lot more daylight between Frank and an elite scoring PG than is being suggested. Dont believe Frank should be penciled in as the future PG just yet. One good game isnt enough for me. Would have to see him play like this all season and get to the line regularly, like the average starting PG.