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FIBA world cup.......
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arkrud
Posts: 32217
Alba Posts: 7
Joined: 8/31/2005
Member: #995
USA
9/13/2019  10:49 AM
Nalod wrote:
arkrud wrote:
Nalod wrote:Certainly not cool how many players backed off. In some countries and cultures its a pride thing.
The Australians, Spanish, French, Argentine’s and others are a tight group. These guy are friends and have build bonds over the years. Marc Gasol played in the finals basically had only a month off. To play with his brother is a big deal over the years. Tony Parker played for years with them. I’m ok with players not going year in and year out.

Patriotism is not American thing our days. We are more into green...
Patriotism, flags, anthems, and all this things considered more divisive our days that uniting.
It is not an issue for nations you mentioned. Their patriotism is solid as rock for good or for worth.

True, "patriotism" is being weaponized of late. In the old cold war the "Soviet" vs "American" via hockey or basketball was more important and a source of national pride. Ideologies. The Olympics was the stage and it was every 4 years. Now we have so many competitions and pro leagues with international players participating. Back in the day Sabonis (dad) only played for the Soviet team. Not Euroleague. Going against our college players or "amateurs" was greater intrigue. Few underclass players came out early if any and it was very prestigious to represent in the Olympics. For many being a pro athlete was a stepping stone to other successful careers. Now its a source of Multigenerational wealth.

Given our diversity as a people we are not all just "American" we are culturally diverse. Canada and Israel are as well. For the most part teams from other countries are not as much. Argentines play for their country, Spanish for spain, French for France, etc etc.

USA losing does not make me feel a sense of national shame or loss. IN fact it might make winning more gradifying in the future. The rest of the world plays ball and its just a matter of numbers over time.

Our team is not consistent. This group was a sort of third level allstar group thrown together. Chemistry was not there. They did sacrifice their summer and time off and will likely get little but grief for not winning. not that anyone would have cared either had they won. Again, blame will be thrown about as to who backed out and who did not.

Europe is a collection of national states so the most of the world.
The last Empires like Russia, China, and Turkey are at the end of falling apart and breaking into nation-states too.
US was about the only exception in the world from this nation-sates building trend so far.
But the sports in US with majority of players of European descent still bind by national patriotism mindset.
That's why in NHL and Hockey in general patriotism still running high. In NBA and NFL not so much.
NFL and baseball are local attractions but Hockey and bbal became really international sports.
The self-realization and self-determination of nations is unavoidable and only can be stopped on specific territory by genocide or exile.
US nation is still building and will it be one or many is anyone guess. This process spans centuries so the result will come to be well after out time.
The notion that whole human kind will became one nation proved itself an utopia so far.
US was some hope to make this happened but this hope is falling apart in front of our eyes.


"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
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SupremeCommander
Posts: 33767
Alba Posts: 35
Joined: 4/28/2006
Member: #1127

9/13/2019  10:55 AM
arkrud wrote:
Nalod wrote:
arkrud wrote:
Nalod wrote:Certainly not cool how many players backed off. In some countries and cultures its a pride thing.
The Australians, Spanish, French, Argentine’s and others are a tight group. These guy are friends and have build bonds over the years. Marc Gasol played in the finals basically had only a month off. To play with his brother is a big deal over the years. Tony Parker played for years with them. I’m ok with players not going year in and year out.

Patriotism is not American thing our days. We are more into green...
Patriotism, flags, anthems, and all this things considered more divisive our days that uniting.
It is not an issue for nations you mentioned. Their patriotism is solid as rock for good or for worth.

True, "patriotism" is being weaponized of late. In the old cold war the "Soviet" vs "American" via hockey or basketball was more important and a source of national pride. Ideologies. The Olympics was the stage and it was every 4 years. Now we have so many competitions and pro leagues with international players participating. Back in the day Sabonis (dad) only played for the Soviet team. Not Euroleague. Going against our college players or "amateurs" was greater intrigue. Few underclass players came out early if any and it was very prestigious to represent in the Olympics. For many being a pro athlete was a stepping stone to other successful careers. Now its a source of Multigenerational wealth.

Given our diversity as a people we are not all just "American" we are culturally diverse. Canada and Israel are as well. For the most part teams from other countries are not as much. Argentines play for their country, Spanish for spain, French for France, etc etc.

USA losing does not make me feel a sense of national shame or loss. IN fact it might make winning more gradifying in the future. The rest of the world plays ball and its just a matter of numbers over time.

Our team is not consistent. This group was a sort of third level allstar group thrown together. Chemistry was not there. They did sacrifice their summer and time off and will likely get little but grief for not winning. not that anyone would have cared either had they won. Again, blame will be thrown about as to who backed out and who did not.

Europe is a collection of national states so the most of the world.
The last Empires like Russia, China, and Turkey are at the end of falling apart and breaking into nation-states too.
US was about the only exception in the world from this nation-sates building trend so far.
But the sports in US with majority of players of European descent still bind by national patriotism mindset.
That's why in NHL and Hockey in general patriotism still running high. In NBA and NFL not so much.
NFL and baseball are local attractions but Hockey and bbal became really international sports.
The self-realization and self-determination of nations is unavoidable and only can be stopped on specific territory by genocide or exile.
US nation is still building and will it be one or many is anyone guess. This process spans centuries so the result will come to be well after out time.
The notion that whole human kind will became one nation proved itself an utopia so far.
US was some hope to make this happened but this hope is falling apart in front of our eyes.

you really don't know much about hockey. Hockey is as regionalized a spectacle as there can be. I'm a huge hockey fan and I can barely tell you anything about the sport outside of the Rangers, and maybe a little about the Devils and Islanders and the Caps (because my wife is a fan). The rest of the league? That's because hockey is effectively tribal, not some nation state builder or whatever fits your narrative. I say this knowing that I have contributed about 87% of the official Rangers thread content

Sambakick wrote: Gives a whole new meaning to "Jazz Hands"
martin
Posts: 67903
Alba Posts: 108
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #2
USA
9/13/2019  11:03 AM
BigDaddyG wrote:Frank finishes with 16...Our French Prince is growing into a French King lol

so weird that he was leading scorer for team too, tied with someone else

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BigDaddyG
Posts: 37419
Alba Posts: 9
Joined: 1/22/2010
Member: #3049

9/13/2019  12:20 PM
martin wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:Frank finishes with 16...Our French Prince is growing into a French King lol

so weird that he was leading scorer for team too, tied with someone else


Didn't see the game, but Fournier had 16 with crappy shooting. Fournier showed the parts of his game I hate. Love his attitude, but he gets in that THJ mindset where he doesn't realize he can contribute in other ways. The game threads criticized him for chucking away and looking off teammates. It also sounds like few plays were run for Frank. That is encouraging in regard to his aggressiveness.
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
Nalod
Posts: 68482
Alba Posts: 154
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
9/13/2019  1:23 PM
arkrud wrote:
Nalod wrote:
arkrud wrote:
Nalod wrote:Certainly not cool how many players backed off. In some countries and cultures its a pride thing.
The Australians, Spanish, French, Argentine’s and others are a tight group. These guy are friends and have build bonds over the years. Marc Gasol played in the finals basically had only a month off. To play with his brother is a big deal over the years. Tony Parker played for years with them. I’m ok with players not going year in and year out.

Patriotism is not American thing our days. We are more into green...
Patriotism, flags, anthems, and all this things considered more divisive our days that uniting.
It is not an issue for nations you mentioned. Their patriotism is solid as rock for good or for worth.

True, "patriotism" is being weaponized of late. In the old cold war the "Soviet" vs "American" via hockey or basketball was more important and a source of national pride. Ideologies. The Olympics was the stage and it was every 4 years. Now we have so many competitions and pro leagues with international players participating. Back in the day Sabonis (dad) only played for the Soviet team. Not Euroleague. Going against our college players or "amateurs" was greater intrigue. Few underclass players came out early if any and it was very prestigious to represent in the Olympics. For many being a pro athlete was a stepping stone to other successful careers. Now its a source of Multigenerational wealth.

Given our diversity as a people we are not all just "American" we are culturally diverse. Canada and Israel are as well. For the most part teams from other countries are not as much. Argentines play for their country, Spanish for spain, French for France, etc etc.

USA losing does not make me feel a sense of national shame or loss. IN fact it might make winning more gradifying in the future. The rest of the world plays ball and its just a matter of numbers over time.

Our team is not consistent. This group was a sort of third level allstar group thrown together. Chemistry was not there. They did sacrifice their summer and time off and will likely get little but grief for not winning. not that anyone would have cared either had they won. Again, blame will be thrown about as to who backed out and who did not.

Europe is a collection of national states so the most of the world.
The last Empires like Russia, China, and Turkey are at the end of falling apart and breaking into nation-states too.
US was about the only exception in the world from this nation-sates building trend so far.
But the sports in US with majority of players of European descent still bind by national patriotism mindset.
That's why in NHL and Hockey in general patriotism still running high. In NBA and NFL not so much.
NFL and baseball are local attractions but Hockey and bbal became really international sports.
The self-realization and self-determination of nations is unavoidable and only can be stopped on specific territory by genocide or exile.
US nation is still building and will it be one or many is anyone guess. This process spans centuries so the result will come to be well after out time.
The notion that whole human kind will became one nation proved itself an utopia so far.
US was some hope to make this happened but this hope is falling apart in front of our eyes.

Whoa, we talking hoop!!!

Soccer is a good example of "Tribalism" in sports. very territorial. NHL is not a mainstream sport but strife with intensity globally. TV viewership is not strong on a national basis bit fans in home cities are very into their team and attendance is quite robust. Basketball is a global phenom and the days of our dominance might not be over but as we have come to find out its not automatic we win.

I was in Chile a few years ago when they won the Copa Americana. That's a south American competition among contries. The country stopped to watch that game and danced in the streets when they won. Not world cup, just a regional tournament! But pride runs deep.

Nalod
Posts: 68482
Alba Posts: 154
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
9/13/2019  1:25 PM
SupremeCommander wrote:
arkrud wrote:
Nalod wrote:
arkrud wrote:
Nalod wrote:Certainly not cool how many players backed off. In some countries and cultures its a pride thing.
The Australians, Spanish, French, Argentine’s and others are a tight group. These guy are friends and have build bonds over the years. Marc Gasol played in the finals basically had only a month off. To play with his brother is a big deal over the years. Tony Parker played for years with them. I’m ok with players not going year in and year out.

Patriotism is not American thing our days. We are more into green...
Patriotism, flags, anthems, and all this things considered more divisive our days that uniting.
It is not an issue for nations you mentioned. Their patriotism is solid as rock for good or for worth.

True, "patriotism" is being weaponized of late. In the old cold war the "Soviet" vs "American" via hockey or basketball was more important and a source of national pride. Ideologies. The Olympics was the stage and it was every 4 years. Now we have so many competitions and pro leagues with international players participating. Back in the day Sabonis (dad) only played for the Soviet team. Not Euroleague. Going against our college players or "amateurs" was greater intrigue. Few underclass players came out early if any and it was very prestigious to represent in the Olympics. For many being a pro athlete was a stepping stone to other successful careers. Now its a source of Multigenerational wealth.

Given our diversity as a people we are not all just "American" we are culturally diverse. Canada and Israel are as well. For the most part teams from other countries are not as much. Argentines play for their country, Spanish for spain, French for France, etc etc.

USA losing does not make me feel a sense of national shame or loss. IN fact it might make winning more gradifying in the future. The rest of the world plays ball and its just a matter of numbers over time.

Our team is not consistent. This group was a sort of third level allstar group thrown together. Chemistry was not there. They did sacrifice their summer and time off and will likely get little but grief for not winning. not that anyone would have cared either had they won. Again, blame will be thrown about as to who backed out and who did not.

Europe is a collection of national states so the most of the world.
The last Empires like Russia, China, and Turkey are at the end of falling apart and breaking into nation-states too.
US was about the only exception in the world from this nation-sates building trend so far.
But the sports in US with majority of players of European descent still bind by national patriotism mindset.
That's why in NHL and Hockey in general patriotism still running high. In NBA and NFL not so much.
NFL and baseball are local attractions but Hockey and bbal became really international sports.
The self-realization and self-determination of nations is unavoidable and only can be stopped on specific territory by genocide or exile.
US nation is still building and will it be one or many is anyone guess. This process spans centuries so the result will come to be well after out time.
The notion that whole human kind will became one nation proved itself an utopia so far.
US was some hope to make this happened but this hope is falling apart in front of our eyes.

you really don't know much about hockey. Hockey is as regionalized a spectacle as there can be. I'm a huge hockey fan and I can barely tell you anything about the sport outside of the Rangers, and maybe a little about the Devils and Islanders and the Caps (because my wife is a fan). The rest of the league? That's because hockey is effectively tribal, not some nation state builder or whatever fits your narrative. I say this knowing that I have contributed about 87% of the official Rangers thread content



To those that play ice hockey its a cult!!!
arkrud
Posts: 32217
Alba Posts: 7
Joined: 8/31/2005
Member: #995
USA
9/14/2019  6:41 PM
Nalod wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
arkrud wrote:
Nalod wrote:
arkrud wrote:
Nalod wrote:Certainly not cool how many players backed off. In some countries and cultures its a pride thing.
The Australians, Spanish, French, Argentine’s and others are a tight group. These guy are friends and have build bonds over the years. Marc Gasol played in the finals basically had only a month off. To play with his brother is a big deal over the years. Tony Parker played for years with them. I’m ok with players not going year in and year out.

Patriotism is not American thing our days. We are more into green...
Patriotism, flags, anthems, and all this things considered more divisive our days that uniting.
It is not an issue for nations you mentioned. Their patriotism is solid as rock for good or for worth.

True, "patriotism" is being weaponized of late. In the old cold war the "Soviet" vs "American" via hockey or basketball was more important and a source of national pride. Ideologies. The Olympics was the stage and it was every 4 years. Now we have so many competitions and pro leagues with international players participating. Back in the day Sabonis (dad) only played for the Soviet team. Not Euroleague. Going against our college players or "amateurs" was greater intrigue. Few underclass players came out early if any and it was very prestigious to represent in the Olympics. For many being a pro athlete was a stepping stone to other successful careers. Now its a source of Multigenerational wealth.

Given our diversity as a people we are not all just "American" we are culturally diverse. Canada and Israel are as well. For the most part teams from other countries are not as much. Argentines play for their country, Spanish for spain, French for France, etc etc.

USA losing does not make me feel a sense of national shame or loss. IN fact it might make winning more gradifying in the future. The rest of the world plays ball and its just a matter of numbers over time.

Our team is not consistent. This group was a sort of third level allstar group thrown together. Chemistry was not there. They did sacrifice their summer and time off and will likely get little but grief for not winning. not that anyone would have cared either had they won. Again, blame will be thrown about as to who backed out and who did not.

Europe is a collection of national states so the most of the world.
The last Empires like Russia, China, and Turkey are at the end of falling apart and breaking into nation-states too.
US was about the only exception in the world from this nation-sates building trend so far.
But the sports in US with majority of players of European descent still bind by national patriotism mindset.
That's why in NHL and Hockey in general patriotism still running high. In NBA and NFL not so much.
NFL and baseball are local attractions but Hockey and bbal became really international sports.
The self-realization and self-determination of nations is unavoidable and only can be stopped on specific territory by genocide or exile.
US nation is still building and will it be one or many is anyone guess. This process spans centuries so the result will come to be well after out time.
The notion that whole human kind will became one nation proved itself an utopia so far.
US was some hope to make this happened but this hope is falling apart in front of our eyes.

you really don't know much about hockey. Hockey is as regionalized a spectacle as there can be. I'm a huge hockey fan and I can barely tell you anything about the sport outside of the Rangers, and maybe a little about the Devils and Islanders and the Caps (because my wife is a fan). The rest of the league? That's because hockey is effectively tribal, not some nation state builder or whatever fits your narrative. I say this knowing that I have contributed about 87% of the official Rangers thread content



To those that play ice hockey its a cult!!!

In Europe its both tribal cult and source of national pride.
It was even a matter of Supper powers competition between US and Soviets.
Remember the US Oly team which beat Russian supper-team. It was a patriotic blast.
I am talking more about National Hockey teams that NHL or European leagues.

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
ramtour420
Posts: 25910
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 3/19/2007
Member: #1388
Russian Federation
9/14/2019  7:44 PM    LAST EDITED: 9/14/2019  7:45 PM

Frank killing it!!!! That silky jumper at 3:41 !!!

Everything you have ever wanted is on the other side of fear- George Adair
GustavBahler
Posts: 41138
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186

9/14/2019  7:52 PM
SupremeCommander wrote:
arkrud wrote:
Nalod wrote:
arkrud wrote:
Nalod wrote:Certainly not cool how many players backed off. In some countries and cultures its a pride thing.
The Australians, Spanish, French, Argentine’s and others are a tight group. These guy are friends and have build bonds over the years. Marc Gasol played in the finals basically had only a month off. To play with his brother is a big deal over the years. Tony Parker played for years with them. I’m ok with players not going year in and year out.

Patriotism is not American thing our days. We are more into green...
Patriotism, flags, anthems, and all this things considered more divisive our days that uniting.
It is not an issue for nations you mentioned. Their patriotism is solid as rock for good or for worth.

True, "patriotism" is being weaponized of late. In the old cold war the "Soviet" vs "American" via hockey or basketball was more important and a source of national pride. Ideologies. The Olympics was the stage and it was every 4 years. Now we have so many competitions and pro leagues with international players participating. Back in the day Sabonis (dad) only played for the Soviet team. Not Euroleague. Going against our college players or "amateurs" was greater intrigue. Few underclass players came out early if any and it was very prestigious to represent in the Olympics. For many being a pro athlete was a stepping stone to other successful careers. Now its a source of Multigenerational wealth.

Given our diversity as a people we are not all just "American" we are culturally diverse. Canada and Israel are as well. For the most part teams from other countries are not as much. Argentines play for their country, Spanish for spain, French for France, etc etc.

USA losing does not make me feel a sense of national shame or loss. IN fact it might make winning more gradifying in the future. The rest of the world plays ball and its just a matter of numbers over time.

Our team is not consistent. This group was a sort of third level allstar group thrown together. Chemistry was not there. They did sacrifice their summer and time off and will likely get little but grief for not winning. not that anyone would have cared either had they won. Again, blame will be thrown about as to who backed out and who did not.

Europe is a collection of national states so the most of the world.
The last Empires like Russia, China, and Turkey are at the end of falling apart and breaking into nation-states too.
US was about the only exception in the world from this nation-sates building trend so far.
But the sports in US with majority of players of European descent still bind by national patriotism mindset.
That's why in NHL and Hockey in general patriotism still running high. In NBA and NFL not so much.
NFL and baseball are local attractions but Hockey and bbal became really international sports.
The self-realization and self-determination of nations is unavoidable and only can be stopped on specific territory by genocide or exile.
US nation is still building and will it be one or many is anyone guess. This process spans centuries so the result will come to be well after out time.
The notion that whole human kind will became one nation proved itself an utopia so far.
US was some hope to make this happened but this hope is falling apart in front of our eyes.

you really don't know much about hockey. Hockey is as regionalized a spectacle as there can be. I'm a huge hockey fan and I can barely tell you anything about the sport outside of the Rangers, and maybe a little about the Devils and Islanders and the Caps (because my wife is a fan). The rest of the league? That's because hockey is effectively tribal, not some nation state builder or whatever fits your narrative. I say this knowing that I have contributed about 87% of the official Rangers thread content

Was a diehard Rangers fan from childhood until Keenan left. Had a feeling it was going to be FUBAR from there on, and I was still getting over the Knicks in the 94' Finals. Gravitated more to football after I left NYC.

In high school a late friend of mine's Dad had 3 row red seats for the Rangers 79-80 season. That huge brawl that they got into with the Bruins, took place dead center where my friend's season tickets where. In some weird twist of fate, that was the only regular season game we missed. Was a trip watching it on TV knowing that. It was a great season, the team looked like they stepped out of central casting. All these very different types of players, making it work. Ulf Nilsson was my favorite player back then. Getting old, mostly Knicks now.

arkrud
Posts: 32217
Alba Posts: 7
Joined: 8/31/2005
Member: #995
USA
9/14/2019  10:55 PM    LAST EDITED: 9/14/2019  10:55 PM
GustavBahler wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
arkrud wrote:
Nalod wrote:
arkrud wrote:
Nalod wrote:Certainly not cool how many players backed off. In some countries and cultures its a pride thing.
The Australians, Spanish, French, Argentine’s and others are a tight group. These guy are friends and have build bonds over the years. Marc Gasol played in the finals basically had only a month off. To play with his brother is a big deal over the years. Tony Parker played for years with them. I’m ok with players not going year in and year out.

Patriotism is not American thing our days. We are more into green...
Patriotism, flags, anthems, and all this things considered more divisive our days that uniting.
It is not an issue for nations you mentioned. Their patriotism is solid as rock for good or for worth.

True, "patriotism" is being weaponized of late. In the old cold war the "Soviet" vs "American" via hockey or basketball was more important and a source of national pride. Ideologies. The Olympics was the stage and it was every 4 years. Now we have so many competitions and pro leagues with international players participating. Back in the day Sabonis (dad) only played for the Soviet team. Not Euroleague. Going against our college players or "amateurs" was greater intrigue. Few underclass players came out early if any and it was very prestigious to represent in the Olympics. For many being a pro athlete was a stepping stone to other successful careers. Now its a source of Multigenerational wealth.

Given our diversity as a people we are not all just "American" we are culturally diverse. Canada and Israel are as well. For the most part teams from other countries are not as much. Argentines play for their country, Spanish for spain, French for France, etc etc.

USA losing does not make me feel a sense of national shame or loss. IN fact it might make winning more gradifying in the future. The rest of the world plays ball and its just a matter of numbers over time.

Our team is not consistent. This group was a sort of third level allstar group thrown together. Chemistry was not there. They did sacrifice their summer and time off and will likely get little but grief for not winning. not that anyone would have cared either had they won. Again, blame will be thrown about as to who backed out and who did not.

Europe is a collection of national states so the most of the world.
The last Empires like Russia, China, and Turkey are at the end of falling apart and breaking into nation-states too.
US was about the only exception in the world from this nation-sates building trend so far.
But the sports in US with majority of players of European descent still bind by national patriotism mindset.
That's why in NHL and Hockey in general patriotism still running high. In NBA and NFL not so much.
NFL and baseball are local attractions but Hockey and bbal became really international sports.
The self-realization and self-determination of nations is unavoidable and only can be stopped on specific territory by genocide or exile.
US nation is still building and will it be one or many is anyone guess. This process spans centuries so the result will come to be well after out time.
The notion that whole human kind will became one nation proved itself an utopia so far.
US was some hope to make this happened but this hope is falling apart in front of our eyes.

you really don't know much about hockey. Hockey is as regionalized a spectacle as there can be. I'm a huge hockey fan and I can barely tell you anything about the sport outside of the Rangers, and maybe a little about the Devils and Islanders and the Caps (because my wife is a fan). The rest of the league? That's because hockey is effectively tribal, not some nation state builder or whatever fits your narrative. I say this knowing that I have contributed about 87% of the official Rangers thread content

Was a diehard Rangers fan from childhood until Keenan left. Had a feeling it was going to be FUBAR from there on, and I was still getting over the Knicks in the 94' Finals. Gravitated more to football after I left NYC.

In high school a late friend of mine's Dad had 3 row red seats for the Rangers 79-80 season. That huge brawl that they got into with the Bruins, took place dead center where my friend's season tickets where. In some weird twist of fate, that was the only regular season game we missed. Was a trip watching it on TV knowing that. It was a great season, the team looked like they stepped out of central casting. All these very different types of players, making it work. Ulf Nilsson was my favorite player back then. Getting old, mostly Knicks now.

I would start to pay attention.
Organization is on the up-trend.
This year roster is probably most promising young group in NHL.
The organisation itself, scouting, coaching group, and all is very solid.
Huge influence of alumni from champ team of 90th.
Should be a lot of fan. Hopefully the same for the Knicks.
Looks like both organizations are on similar timeline and are doing right things.

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
FIBA world cup.......

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