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Desperation mode
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Vmart
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6/16/2019  12:13 PM
We are getting to the point where the Knicks will get desperate. This is where it all goes wrong for the Knicks. Zion is gone, AD is off the table, KD is damaged goods, KT is damaged as well. What is Left Khawhi and Kyrie. Kyrie is entertaining the Nets and Khawhi most likely heads for LAnor stays put.

This where the Knicks desperation starts to kick in and they make moves for lower tier superstars and max them out. The Knicks need not get desperate and max players out that are not deserving of it. They need to avoid any signing of this sort and they should just stay the course with youth movement. If they are going after 2nd tier players then no way they should offer any max deals.

They get into massive trouble when they make decisions based on pure desperation.

AUTOADVERT
smackeddog
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6/16/2019  12:16 PM

We're in good hands

BigDaddyG
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6/16/2019  12:20 PM
I think the fact that we didn't go all in on AD shows we're not desperate. The picks and conditions the Lakers gave up to Pelicans in the AD trade showed desperation. We'll see how the rest of the off season goes, but Perry has played a cool hand since he arrived.
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
Vmart
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6/16/2019  12:22 PM
smackeddog wrote:

We're in good hands

Let’s see how it goes. Its a nice line to say after striking out on a deviation from the rebuilding plan.

CrushAlot
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6/16/2019  12:31 PM
Great article from the home page.
https://www.postingandtoasting.com/2019/6/16/18679305/the-knicks-wont-sign-or-trade-for-a-star-this-june-you-should-feel-good-about-that
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
MS
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6/16/2019  12:43 PM
The guys that gave Ron Baker $10MM and $72MM to THJR will not deviate from the plan. I feel a lot better knowing we have his sound judgement guiding the franchise forward.
CrushAlot
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6/16/2019  12:52 PM
MS wrote:The guys that gave Ron Baker $10MM and $72MM to THJR will not deviate from the plan. I feel a lot better knowing we have his sound judgement guiding the franchise forward.
Any concerns since Perry has been in place?
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
StarksEwing1
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6/16/2019  1:15 PM
They wont get desperate. Perry is smart. Im sure he knows Knicks history when it comes to getting desperate...that's why he passed on Davis. JUST STAY THE COURSE. Continue to use the draft to build. Take back a contract or two to get more picks. If we do well in free agency great but if we dont we stick with rebuilding
MS
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6/16/2019  1:20 PM
The KP trade is was a gamble. Again, KP had his issues.

But if we go into this season and continue to rebuild, DSJR and a couple of pics wasn’t that big of haul. Don’t really care if KP threatened to go back to Europe.

If we don’t use our cap space I just don’t love the perception it paints.

I’m a little worried we don’t take Barrett and trade down.

StarksEwing1
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6/16/2019  1:26 PM
MS wrote:The KP trade is was a gamble. Again, KP had his issues.

But if we go into this season and continue to rebuild, DSJR and a couple of pics wasn’t that big of haul. Don’t really care if KP threatened to go back to Europe.

If we don’t use our cap space I just don’t love the perception it paints.

I’m a little worried we don’t take Barrett and trade down.

It wasnt a gamble. The guy didnt want to be here. Despite how great KP thinks he is nobody was offering a haul for him. We got a pretty good return considering his issues/injuries. We could always use cap space to acquire more picks thanks to that trade
Knicksfan
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6/16/2019  5:56 PM
MS wrote:The KP trade is was a gamble. Again, KP had his issues.

But if we go into this season and continue to rebuild, DSJR and a couple of pics wasn’t that big of haul. Don’t really care if KP threatened to go back to Europe.

If we don’t use our cap space I just don’t love the perception it paints.

I’m a little worried we don’t take Barrett and trade down.

So let’s just use the cap space because. Nice

Knicks_Fan
CrushAlot
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6/16/2019  7:06 PM
MS wrote:The KP trade is was a gamble. Again, KP had his issues.

But if we go into this season and continue to rebuild, DSJR and a couple of pics wasn’t that big of haul. Don’t really care if KP threatened to go back to Europe.

If we don’t use our cap space I just don’t love the perception it paints.

I’m a little worried we don’t take Barrett and trade down.

If you don’t use the cap space because the guy you wanted ruptured his Achilles I would think the perception would be that you were being smart with your assets. I think there is a good chance Durant needs a recovery year like HeywRx before he gets back to form. That means the Knicks would be tying up a ton of cap for two years to have Durant when he is going into his 33 and 34. There are always opportunities that come up for teams that have cap space and picks. Doing something for perception sake would be the wrong move in my opinion.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
arkrud
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6/16/2019  7:54 PM
Win now fans are entering the desperation mode... And will stay there for a while.
The winning is far far away for the Knics... and a lot of dirty work...
Finally something interesting first time in last 20 years.
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
GustavBahler
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6/16/2019  8:07 PM
Vmart wrote:
smackeddog wrote:

We're in good hands

Let’s see how it goes. Its a nice line to say after striking out on a deviation from the rebuilding plan.

How so? They didnt want to give up too many building blocks, only enough to get Davis. Im glad that NO passed, still dont believe it was a mortgaging the future kind of offer. Still competitive, could call it due diligence.

The Lakers made a mortgaging the future offer and the Pelicans gladly accepted. Perry/Mills tried, but not too hard.

lurts
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6/16/2019  9:39 PM
Isn't there a team out there who will send us a Jared Jeffries with one year left on his contract--along with a pick?
markvmc
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6/16/2019  9:48 PM
lurts wrote:Isn't there a team out there who will send us a Jared Jeffries with one year left on his contract--along with a pick?

Nope. Can't trade with yourself.

TripleThreat
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6/16/2019  10:37 PM
Vmart wrote:We are getting to the point where the Knicks will get desperate. This is where it all goes wrong for the Knicks. Zion is gone, AD is off the table, KD is damaged goods, KT is damaged as well. What is Left Khawhi and Kyrie. Kyrie is entertaining the Nets and Khawhi most likely heads for LAnor stays put.

This where the Knicks desperation starts to kick in and they make moves for lower tier superstars and max them out. The Knicks need not get desperate and max players out that are not deserving of it. They need to avoid any signing of this sort and they should just stay the course with youth movement. If they are going after 2nd tier players then no way they should offer any max deals.

They get into massive trouble when they make decisions based on pure desperation.


Three things

1) Knicks need to get to the salary floor. Having the most cap space is nice in one way, but brings some issues in another.

2) John Wall is the real threat. Wizards badly want to dump that contract and the Knicks are in a prime position to absorb him. Do I think it's a good move? No, but I can see the open pathways that would make it happen.

3) The pathway that seems likely is absorbing bad contracts for picks attached. Finding a DeMarre Carroll situation is unlikely ( Give NardDog credit, he made a good call last offseason about absorbing Carroll for a pick and even some usefulness. Good job, NardDog) but maybe there is some opportunity there.

"Should have paid Lin and rid ourselves of Melo. Lin makes every team better." - HofstraBBall 11/12/2018
fwk00
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6/16/2019  10:49 PM
TripleThreat wrote:
Vmart wrote:We are getting to the point where the Knicks will get desperate. This is where it all goes wrong for the Knicks. Zion is gone, AD is off the table, KD is damaged goods, KT is damaged as well. What is Left Khawhi and Kyrie. Kyrie is entertaining the Nets and Khawhi most likely heads for LAnor stays put.

This where the Knicks desperation starts to kick in and they make moves for lower tier superstars and max them out. The Knicks need not get desperate and max players out that are not deserving of it. They need to avoid any signing of this sort and they should just stay the course with youth movement. If they are going after 2nd tier players then no way they should offer any max deals.

They get into massive trouble when they make decisions based on pure desperation.


Three things

1) Knicks need to get to the salary floor. Having the most cap space is nice in one way, but brings some issues in another.

2) John Wall is the real threat. Wizards badly want to dump that contract and the Knicks are in a prime position to absorb him. Do I think it's a good move? No, but I can see the open pathways that would make it happen.

3) The pathway that seems likely is absorbing bad contracts for picks attached. Finding a DeMarre Carroll situation is unlikely ( Give NardDog credit, he made a good call last offseason about absorbing Carroll for a pick and even some usefulness. Good job, NardDog) but maybe there is some opportunity there.

The problem with players like Wall is the length of commitment and the likelihood of any positive contribution.

I think a strategy that nets a better result might be to shadow teams who cannot afford all of their assets and are in danger of losing a contributing but not critical member of their team. Favors in Utah for example.

He'd be a great addition to the Knicks.


Griffin in Detroit is another example of a player highly paid on an under-performing team. Maybe they'd wrap a FRP in with Griffin for the taking just to fiscally right their ship.

smackeddog
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6/17/2019  4:11 AM
TripleThreat wrote:
Vmart wrote:We are getting to the point where the Knicks will get desperate. This is where it all goes wrong for the Knicks. Zion is gone, AD is off the table, KD is damaged goods, KT is damaged as well. What is Left Khawhi and Kyrie. Kyrie is entertaining the Nets and Khawhi most likely heads for LAnor stays put.

This where the Knicks desperation starts to kick in and they make moves for lower tier superstars and max them out. The Knicks need not get desperate and max players out that are not deserving of it. They need to avoid any signing of this sort and they should just stay the course with youth movement. If they are going after 2nd tier players then no way they should offer any max deals.

They get into massive trouble when they make decisions based on pure desperation.


Three things

1) Knicks need to get to the salary floor. Having the most cap space is nice in one way, but brings some issues in another.

2) John Wall is the real threat. Wizards badly want to dump that contract and the Knicks are in a prime position to absorb him. Do I think it's a good move? No, but I can see the open pathways that would make it happen.

3) The pathway that seems likely is absorbing bad contracts for picks attached. Finding a DeMarre Carroll situation is unlikely ( Give NardDog credit, he made a good call last offseason about absorbing Carroll for a pick and even some usefulness. Good job, NardDog) but maybe there is some opportunity there.

We don't have to get to the salary floor, all that happens if we don't is the money get's divided up between the players on our roster, which would be nice for Mitch- he's drastically underpaid.

TripleThreat
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6/17/2019  6:36 AM
smackeddog wrote:
TripleThreat wrote:
Vmart wrote:We are getting to the point where the Knicks will get desperate. This is where it all goes wrong for the Knicks. Zion is gone, AD is off the table, KD is damaged goods, KT is damaged as well. What is Left Khawhi and Kyrie. Kyrie is entertaining the Nets and Khawhi most likely heads for LAnor stays put.

This where the Knicks desperation starts to kick in and they make moves for lower tier superstars and max them out. The Knicks need not get desperate and max players out that are not deserving of it. They need to avoid any signing of this sort and they should just stay the course with youth movement. If they are going after 2nd tier players then no way they should offer any max deals.

They get into massive trouble when they make decisions based on pure desperation.


Three things

1) Knicks need to get to the salary floor. Having the most cap space is nice in one way, but brings some issues in another.

2) John Wall is the real threat. Wizards badly want to dump that contract and the Knicks are in a prime position to absorb him. Do I think it's a good move? No, but I can see the open pathways that would make it happen.

3) The pathway that seems likely is absorbing bad contracts for picks attached. Finding a DeMarre Carroll situation is unlikely ( Give NardDog credit, he made a good call last offseason about absorbing Carroll for a pick and even some usefulness. Good job, NardDog) but maybe there is some opportunity there.

We don't have to get to the salary floor, all that happens if we don't is the money get's divided up between the players on our roster, which would be nice for Mitch- he's drastically underpaid.


Technically you don't need to get to the salary floor if you go to the letter of the law in the CBA

However, after the fallout of Sam Hinkie and the 76ers, if you actually do it, your franchise is ****ed. The league administration will **** you. The NBAPA and agents don't like teams doing it because it's a form of inflationary control on salaries in general.

How the league administration can **** you over

1) Reduced nationally televised game schedule

2) More back to backs and ****ty scheduling in the future

3) No chance at ever hosting league events or an All Star game

4) Refs will be ordered to **** your team over more than before

5) League will **** with any brand support you get that they also have ties to in some fashion

6) If you are in the draft lottery, the rigging will **** you over more than before

7) Any small infraction will merit the worst possible response allowed by the league

8) No general league protection from the media ( The league buries a **** load of dirt that if it made the press, would make people's eyes bleed from the **** that people in the league do that would piss off the public)

You can do it, go below the salary floor, but prepare to be horse****ed.

It's like when you start a new job and the boss says "I have an open door policy, talk to me about anything" Who actually does that ****? Do it, see what happens to you. Be the new guy and rock the boat, and see what the **** happens to you.

Also cap space unused, you don't get a credit for it. Dead cap space is under utilizing a valuable asset base. It's burning out the Zinger trade value for nothing. It doesn't mean to sign a bad deal, but you need to find a way to use the space somehow.

"Should have paid Lin and rid ourselves of Melo. Lin makes every team better." - HofstraBBall 11/12/2018
Desperation mode

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