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Durant getting tired of the media and the Knicks talk
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fishmike
Posts: 49000
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Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
4/9/2019  3:19 PM
today:
https://nypost.com/2019/04/09/nba-peers-agree-kevin-durant-is-coming-to-the-knicks/

In an extensive survey carried out by The Athletic over the last month, 69 of 109 players canvassed (63.3 percent) believe the Knicks will land free agency’s most coveted prize come July. The Warriors finished a distant second at 20.2 percent with the Nets, Clippers and Thunder also getting votes.

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Knixkik
Posts: 29911
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Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #11
USA
4/9/2019  3:27 PM
fishmike wrote:today:
https://nypost.com/2019/04/09/nba-peers-agree-kevin-durant-is-coming-to-the-knicks/

In an extensive survey carried out by The Athletic over the last month, 69 of 109 players canvassed (63.3 percent) believe the Knicks will land free agency’s most coveted prize come July. The Warriors finished a distant second at 20.2 percent with the Nets, Clippers and Thunder also getting votes.

All this stuff is both good and bad at the same time.

arkrud
Posts: 31575
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Member: #995
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4/9/2019  3:41 PM
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:Durant has been grumpy for years with media. Nothing new.
Bucher has a good angle. Not sure how accurate it is but he presnts a good opinion.
My take is Durant can handle it because he’ll handle expectations an understands the media even if annoying.
Bucher does mention Knicks but not NYC and were you choose to live is as important as where you work. Nets are also viable if NYC is desirable. they have the money, have more in place talent and a GM/coach tandem in place a bit more seasoned together.
It’s hard to ever say “Winning is not important” but how you get there might be.
Nalod wont project any more because time will tell ths story, not my predictions.

To me it depends on how Durant wants to play a part in building the team. If he makes Kyrie a condition of his signing, I would hope Perry/Mills take a step back. If they were to sign two year deals, like Durant/LeBron have both done in the past, that would give both sides more flexibility.
Maxing out Irving and all the risks that go with it (injury and chemistry wise) is a huge concession.

Would they get us a ring? Would be willing to bet on short term deals on Durant/Irving but not all those years. Especially if we draft Zion. Wouldn't want his team hamstrung with cap space used up by a player who cant stay healthy. Or we draft a PG to go along with DSjr. Durant could call next season a tryout between Morant and DSJr.

For all we know Durant hasn't made playing with Irving a priority. Besides, Kyrie might go through a long playoff slog in Boston, and start to bond with the team, which he hasn't seemed to do to this point. Anything can happen. Just dont want Perry/Mills to give away the store.for a very brief run.

ahhh... no its not because Kyrie is a max player. Its not really up for debate is it? I would certainly prefer Kawhi but Kyrie has the best handle in the game and shoots 40% from 3. I mean as a 1B next to KD as a 1A you really dont get much better than that. Huge concession? One might question the merits of maxing out only Kyrie, but along side KD? That is not a concession man

Dont you ahhh me! ha. The best ability is availability. How available will Kyrie be in the coming years? That is a legit question for a franchise that has been snakebit with expensive and frequently injured players.

there is no scenario that that has KD/KI singing here for FA that involves any concessions. He's 100% a max player. He's missed time but has not suffered any kind of career threatening injury. Durant has also missed time. Cant really factor for that. Kyrie isnt my favorite FA but you dont get to pick and choose, especially if that is the guy KD wants. I suspect (and hope) that KD drives who else comes and lets face it, any combo works. IF its get him a robin and that's Kyrie great. Kyrie has a lot to prove and I think if you get him this is the best time. 27-31 and go from there.

How do you feel about this next year:
Kyrie/Dotson/Zion/KD/Mitch
bench: DSJ, Frank, Trier, Knox

Handing out a max deal to another player because an FA wants him here is a big concession. Especially when that player has missed as many games as Irving has. He's had a rep for being injury prone going back to Duke. He's earned it. Would be concerned with Irving's injury issues, and his relationship with NY media. Both Durant and Irving are thin skinned in that dept. One would be enough.

As I said earlier, Perry/Mills should offer short term deals. Durant didnt want to commit long term to GS, with a much better squad. He's seen what LeBron has had to go through in a similar situation. They might be on board with a short deal given NY's track record.Hope Perry/Mills go for it. Doesnt work out we get our cap room back in a hurry.

its just not. Its like you havent been laid in 20 years and here comes a movie star with a fashion model and you think its a concession because its not two movie stars.

Irving is a max player. That is his market value. Are we really debating that?

If the movie star and the model run up your CC bill as well, takes 5 years to pay it off. The model is in rehab most of the time, and the movie star bails because its affecting her career. Maybe its better if one sets their sights a little lower, so to speak.

If Irving stays healthy, absolutely a max player. Problem is he doesnt stay healthy for very long.

and if you say something we can start having a conversation. Is Kyrie a max player? Are you gonna sit down with Kawhi and tell him he's a max player... IF he stays healthy? Can we only pick Zion IF he stays healthy? Otherwise its wise to take Ja I think.

I mean cmon... you saying you skip on KD because Kyrie doesnt deserve max? I am really curious here

His last 4 playoff runs, Irving has missed or failed to finish in half of them. He is a PG who relies on his burst to dominate. Giving a player like Kyrie a max deal, with all the knee surgeries, wear and tear, is very risky. Foolish to ignore the risk of handing out long term contracts to PGs with bad knees. Besides,teams dont normally win a ring when the PG has a max contract. Team gets spread too thin.

Haven't even gone into chemistry problems across 2 teams. You make it sound like Kyrie and Durant would be entering some kind of commitment not to bail if things dont work out. Durant? Of course he would.

Just because a player is skilled enough to be offered a max deal, doesnt necessarily mean that player is a good fit everywhere.

So no KD an no Kyrie for you. Too risky. Got it.

Myself I am great with signing them. We need elite talent. KD and Kyrie represent that and the best chance to win an actual title. If I have a chance to add KD/Kyrie for no cost but cap space that is a generational FA opportunity and you do that. No questions asked.

No doubt.
Lets say Kyrie will break down... and will not be a factor (not very likely but possible).
But KD will be already there... So what to not like.
If Kyrie is all broken then we get some cap relief... If he is missing many games we get youth to develop.
Of course we will go over the cap and by a lot.
But who cares... It;s Dolans money. And its some peanuts for him and MSG.

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
Uptown
Posts: 27524
Alba Posts: 3
Joined: 4/1/2008
Member: #1883

4/9/2019  7:27 PM
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:Durant has been grumpy for years with media. Nothing new.
Bucher has a good angle. Not sure how accurate it is but he presnts a good opinion.
My take is Durant can handle it because he’ll handle expectations an understands the media even if annoying.
Bucher does mention Knicks but not NYC and were you choose to live is as important as where you work. Nets are also viable if NYC is desirable. they have the money, have more in place talent and a GM/coach tandem in place a bit more seasoned together.
It’s hard to ever say “Winning is not important” but how you get there might be.
Nalod wont project any more because time will tell ths story, not my predictions.

To me it depends on how Durant wants to play a part in building the team. If he makes Kyrie a condition of his signing, I would hope Perry/Mills take a step back. If they were to sign two year deals, like Durant/LeBron have both done in the past, that would give both sides more flexibility.
Maxing out Irving and all the risks that go with it (injury and chemistry wise) is a huge concession.

Would they get us a ring? Would be willing to bet on short term deals on Durant/Irving but not all those years. Especially if we draft Zion. Wouldn't want his team hamstrung with cap space used up by a player who cant stay healthy. Or we draft a PG to go along with DSjr. Durant could call next season a tryout between Morant and DSJr.

For all we know Durant hasn't made playing with Irving a priority. Besides, Kyrie might go through a long playoff slog in Boston, and start to bond with the team, which he hasn't seemed to do to this point. Anything can happen. Just dont want Perry/Mills to give away the store.for a very brief run.

ahhh... no its not because Kyrie is a max player. Its not really up for debate is it? I would certainly prefer Kawhi but Kyrie has the best handle in the game and shoots 40% from 3. I mean as a 1B next to KD as a 1A you really dont get much better than that. Huge concession? One might question the merits of maxing out only Kyrie, but along side KD? That is not a concession man

Dont you ahhh me! ha. The best ability is availability. How available will Kyrie be in the coming years? That is a legit question for a franchise that has been snakebit with expensive and frequently injured players.

there is no scenario that that has KD/KI singing here for FA that involves any concessions. He's 100% a max player. He's missed time but has not suffered any kind of career threatening injury. Durant has also missed time. Cant really factor for that. Kyrie isnt my favorite FA but you dont get to pick and choose, especially if that is the guy KD wants. I suspect (and hope) that KD drives who else comes and lets face it, any combo works. IF its get him a robin and that's Kyrie great. Kyrie has a lot to prove and I think if you get him this is the best time. 27-31 and go from there.

How do you feel about this next year:
Kyrie/Dotson/Zion/KD/Mitch
bench: DSJ, Frank, Trier, Knox

Handing out a max deal to another player because an FA wants him here is a big concession. Especially when that player has missed as many games as Irving has. He's had a rep for being injury prone going back to Duke. He's earned it. Would be concerned with Irving's injury issues, and his relationship with NY media. Both Durant and Irving are thin skinned in that dept. One would be enough.

As I said earlier, Perry/Mills should offer short term deals. Durant didnt want to commit long term to GS, with a much better squad. He's seen what LeBron has had to go through in a similar situation. They might be on board with a short deal given NY's track record.Hope Perry/Mills go for it. Doesnt work out we get our cap room back in a hurry.

its just not. Its like you havent been laid in 20 years and here comes a movie star with a fashion model and you think its a concession because its not two movie stars.

Irving is a max player. That is his market value. Are we really debating that?

If the movie star and the model run up your CC bill as well, takes 5 years to pay it off. The model is in rehab most of the time, and the movie star bails because its affecting her career. Maybe its better if one sets their sights a little lower, so to speak.

If Irving stays healthy, absolutely a max player. Problem is he doesnt stay healthy for very long.

and if you say something we can start having a conversation. Is Kyrie a max player? Are you gonna sit down with Kawhi and tell him he's a max player... IF he stays healthy? Can we only pick Zion IF he stays healthy? Otherwise its wise to take Ja I think.

I mean cmon... you saying you skip on KD because Kyrie doesnt deserve max? I am really curious here

His last 4 playoff runs, Irving has missed or failed to finish in half of them. He is a PG who relies on his burst to dominate. Giving a player like Kyrie a max deal, with all the knee surgeries, wear and tear, is very risky. Foolish to ignore the risk of handing out long term contracts to PGs with bad knees. Besides,teams dont normally win a ring when the PG has a max contract. Team gets spread too thin.

Haven't even gone into chemistry problems across 2 teams. You make it sound like Kyrie and Durant would be entering some kind of commitment not to bail if things dont work out. Durant? Of course he would.

Just because a player is skilled enough to be offered a max deal, doesnt necessarily mean that player is a good fit everywhere.

So no KD an no Kyrie for you. Too risky. Got it.

Myself I am great with signing them. We need elite talent. KD and Kyrie represent that and the best chance to win an actual title. If I have a chance to add KD/Kyrie for no cost but cap space that is a generational FA opportunity and you do that. No questions asked.

+ 1000

“It’s much more about the perception of the organization,” Fizdale said. “What I think we’ve done together with Steve [Mills] and Scott [Perry], Mr. Dolan and myself an
GustavBahler
Posts: 35376
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186

4/9/2019  7:52 PM
Uptown wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:Durant has been grumpy for years with media. Nothing new.
Bucher has a good angle. Not sure how accurate it is but he presnts a good opinion.
My take is Durant can handle it because he’ll handle expectations an understands the media even if annoying.
Bucher does mention Knicks but not NYC and were you choose to live is as important as where you work. Nets are also viable if NYC is desirable. they have the money, have more in place talent and a GM/coach tandem in place a bit more seasoned together.
It’s hard to ever say “Winning is not important” but how you get there might be.
Nalod wont project any more because time will tell ths story, not my predictions.

To me it depends on how Durant wants to play a part in building the team. If he makes Kyrie a condition of his signing, I would hope Perry/Mills take a step back. If they were to sign two year deals, like Durant/LeBron have both done in the past, that would give both sides more flexibility.
Maxing out Irving and all the risks that go with it (injury and chemistry wise) is a huge concession.

Would they get us a ring? Would be willing to bet on short term deals on Durant/Irving but not all those years. Especially if we draft Zion. Wouldn't want his team hamstrung with cap space used up by a player who cant stay healthy. Or we draft a PG to go along with DSjr. Durant could call next season a tryout between Morant and DSJr.

For all we know Durant hasn't made playing with Irving a priority. Besides, Kyrie might go through a long playoff slog in Boston, and start to bond with the team, which he hasn't seemed to do to this point. Anything can happen. Just dont want Perry/Mills to give away the store.for a very brief run.

ahhh... no its not because Kyrie is a max player. Its not really up for debate is it? I would certainly prefer Kawhi but Kyrie has the best handle in the game and shoots 40% from 3. I mean as a 1B next to KD as a 1A you really dont get much better than that. Huge concession? One might question the merits of maxing out only Kyrie, but along side KD? That is not a concession man

Dont you ahhh me! ha. The best ability is availability. How available will Kyrie be in the coming years? That is a legit question for a franchise that has been snakebit with expensive and frequently injured players.

there is no scenario that that has KD/KI singing here for FA that involves any concessions. He's 100% a max player. He's missed time but has not suffered any kind of career threatening injury. Durant has also missed time. Cant really factor for that. Kyrie isnt my favorite FA but you dont get to pick and choose, especially if that is the guy KD wants. I suspect (and hope) that KD drives who else comes and lets face it, any combo works. IF its get him a robin and that's Kyrie great. Kyrie has a lot to prove and I think if you get him this is the best time. 27-31 and go from there.

How do you feel about this next year:
Kyrie/Dotson/Zion/KD/Mitch
bench: DSJ, Frank, Trier, Knox

Handing out a max deal to another player because an FA wants him here is a big concession. Especially when that player has missed as many games as Irving has. He's had a rep for being injury prone going back to Duke. He's earned it. Would be concerned with Irving's injury issues, and his relationship with NY media. Both Durant and Irving are thin skinned in that dept. One would be enough.

As I said earlier, Perry/Mills should offer short term deals. Durant didnt want to commit long term to GS, with a much better squad. He's seen what LeBron has had to go through in a similar situation. They might be on board with a short deal given NY's track record.Hope Perry/Mills go for it. Doesnt work out we get our cap room back in a hurry.

its just not. Its like you havent been laid in 20 years and here comes a movie star with a fashion model and you think its a concession because its not two movie stars.

Irving is a max player. That is his market value. Are we really debating that?

If the movie star and the model run up your CC bill as well, takes 5 years to pay it off. The model is in rehab most of the time, and the movie star bails because its affecting her career. Maybe its better if one sets their sights a little lower, so to speak.

If Irving stays healthy, absolutely a max player. Problem is he doesnt stay healthy for very long.

and if you say something we can start having a conversation. Is Kyrie a max player? Are you gonna sit down with Kawhi and tell him he's a max player... IF he stays healthy? Can we only pick Zion IF he stays healthy? Otherwise its wise to take Ja I think.

I mean cmon... you saying you skip on KD because Kyrie doesnt deserve max? I am really curious here

His last 4 playoff runs, Irving has missed or failed to finish in half of them. He is a PG who relies on his burst to dominate. Giving a player like Kyrie a max deal, with all the knee surgeries, wear and tear, is very risky. Foolish to ignore the risk of handing out long term contracts to PGs with bad knees. Besides,teams dont normally win a ring when the PG has a max contract. Team gets spread too thin.

Haven't even gone into chemistry problems across 2 teams. You make it sound like Kyrie and Durant would be entering some kind of commitment not to bail if things dont work out. Durant? Of course he would.

Just because a player is skilled enough to be offered a max deal, doesnt necessarily mean that player is a good fit everywhere.

So no KD an no Kyrie for you. Too risky. Got it.

Myself I am great with signing them. We need elite talent. KD and Kyrie represent that and the best chance to win an actual title. If I have a chance to add KD/Kyrie for no cost but cap space that is a generational FA opportunity and you do that. No questions asked.

+ 1000

We would need some more quality veterans.(with playoff experience), at fire sale prices. Not sure we would make it out of the East, depending on how free agency plays out. Not without a deeper bench. That would mean flushing the youth movement as well. Doubt Durant/Irving want to wait on them to figure it out.

knicks1248
Posts: 38523
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 2/3/2004
Member: #582
4/10/2019  9:56 AM
GustavBahler wrote:
Uptown wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:Durant has been grumpy for years with media. Nothing new.
Bucher has a good angle. Not sure how accurate it is but he presnts a good opinion.
My take is Durant can handle it because he’ll handle expectations an understands the media even if annoying.
Bucher does mention Knicks but not NYC and were you choose to live is as important as where you work. Nets are also viable if NYC is desirable. they have the money, have more in place talent and a GM/coach tandem in place a bit more seasoned together.
It’s hard to ever say “Winning is not important” but how you get there might be.
Nalod wont project any more because time will tell ths story, not my predictions.

To me it depends on how Durant wants to play a part in building the team. If he makes Kyrie a condition of his signing, I would hope Perry/Mills take a step back. If they were to sign two year deals, like Durant/LeBron have both done in the past, that would give both sides more flexibility.
Maxing out Irving and all the risks that go with it (injury and chemistry wise) is a huge concession.

Would they get us a ring? Would be willing to bet on short term deals on Durant/Irving but not all those years. Especially if we draft Zion. Wouldn't want his team hamstrung with cap space used up by a player who cant stay healthy. Or we draft a PG to go along with DSjr. Durant could call next season a tryout between Morant and DSJr.

For all we know Durant hasn't made playing with Irving a priority. Besides, Kyrie might go through a long playoff slog in Boston, and start to bond with the team, which he hasn't seemed to do to this point. Anything can happen. Just dont want Perry/Mills to give away the store.for a very brief run.

ahhh... no its not because Kyrie is a max player. Its not really up for debate is it? I would certainly prefer Kawhi but Kyrie has the best handle in the game and shoots 40% from 3. I mean as a 1B next to KD as a 1A you really dont get much better than that. Huge concession? One might question the merits of maxing out only Kyrie, but along side KD? That is not a concession man

Dont you ahhh me! ha. The best ability is availability. How available will Kyrie be in the coming years? That is a legit question for a franchise that has been snakebit with expensive and frequently injured players.

there is no scenario that that has KD/KI singing here for FA that involves any concessions. He's 100% a max player. He's missed time but has not suffered any kind of career threatening injury. Durant has also missed time. Cant really factor for that. Kyrie isnt my favorite FA but you dont get to pick and choose, especially if that is the guy KD wants. I suspect (and hope) that KD drives who else comes and lets face it, any combo works. IF its get him a robin and that's Kyrie great. Kyrie has a lot to prove and I think if you get him this is the best time. 27-31 and go from there.

How do you feel about this next year:
Kyrie/Dotson/Zion/KD/Mitch
bench: DSJ, Frank, Trier, Knox

Handing out a max deal to another player because an FA wants him here is a big concession. Especially when that player has missed as many games as Irving has. He's had a rep for being injury prone going back to Duke. He's earned it. Would be concerned with Irving's injury issues, and his relationship with NY media. Both Durant and Irving are thin skinned in that dept. One would be enough.

As I said earlier, Perry/Mills should offer short term deals. Durant didnt want to commit long term to GS, with a much better squad. He's seen what LeBron has had to go through in a similar situation. They might be on board with a short deal given NY's track record.Hope Perry/Mills go for it. Doesnt work out we get our cap room back in a hurry.

its just not. Its like you havent been laid in 20 years and here comes a movie star with a fashion model and you think its a concession because its not two movie stars.

Irving is a max player. That is his market value. Are we really debating that?

If the movie star and the model run up your CC bill as well, takes 5 years to pay it off. The model is in rehab most of the time, and the movie star bails because its affecting her career. Maybe its better if one sets their sights a little lower, so to speak.

If Irving stays healthy, absolutely a max player. Problem is he doesnt stay healthy for very long.

and if you say something we can start having a conversation. Is Kyrie a max player? Are you gonna sit down with Kawhi and tell him he's a max player... IF he stays healthy? Can we only pick Zion IF he stays healthy? Otherwise its wise to take Ja I think.

I mean cmon... you saying you skip on KD because Kyrie doesnt deserve max? I am really curious here

His last 4 playoff runs, Irving has missed or failed to finish in half of them. He is a PG who relies on his burst to dominate. Giving a player like Kyrie a max deal, with all the knee surgeries, wear and tear, is very risky. Foolish to ignore the risk of handing out long term contracts to PGs with bad knees. Besides,teams dont normally win a ring when the PG has a max contract. Team gets spread too thin.

Haven't even gone into chemistry problems across 2 teams. You make it sound like Kyrie and Durant would be entering some kind of commitment not to bail if things dont work out. Durant? Of course he would.

Just because a player is skilled enough to be offered a max deal, doesnt necessarily mean that player is a good fit everywhere.

So no KD an no Kyrie for you. Too risky. Got it.

Myself I am great with signing them. We need elite talent. KD and Kyrie represent that and the best chance to win an actual title. If I have a chance to add KD/Kyrie for no cost but cap space that is a generational FA opportunity and you do that. No questions asked.

+ 1000

We would need some more quality veterans.(with playoff experience), at fire sale prices. Not sure we would make it out of the East, depending on how free agency plays out. Not without a deeper bench. That would mean flushing the youth movement as well. Doubt Durant/Irving want to wait on them to figure it out.

The youth movement was a dumb idea to begin with, especially when the coaching staff is just as young an in experience as the players they are coaching.

ES
fishmike
Posts: 49000
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
4/10/2019  10:04 AM
GustavBahler wrote:
Uptown wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:Durant has been grumpy for years with media. Nothing new.
Bucher has a good angle. Not sure how accurate it is but he presnts a good opinion.
My take is Durant can handle it because he’ll handle expectations an understands the media even if annoying.
Bucher does mention Knicks but not NYC and were you choose to live is as important as where you work. Nets are also viable if NYC is desirable. they have the money, have more in place talent and a GM/coach tandem in place a bit more seasoned together.
It’s hard to ever say “Winning is not important” but how you get there might be.
Nalod wont project any more because time will tell ths story, not my predictions.

To me it depends on how Durant wants to play a part in building the team. If he makes Kyrie a condition of his signing, I would hope Perry/Mills take a step back. If they were to sign two year deals, like Durant/LeBron have both done in the past, that would give both sides more flexibility.
Maxing out Irving and all the risks that go with it (injury and chemistry wise) is a huge concession.

Would they get us a ring? Would be willing to bet on short term deals on Durant/Irving but not all those years. Especially if we draft Zion. Wouldn't want his team hamstrung with cap space used up by a player who cant stay healthy. Or we draft a PG to go along with DSjr. Durant could call next season a tryout between Morant and DSJr.

For all we know Durant hasn't made playing with Irving a priority. Besides, Kyrie might go through a long playoff slog in Boston, and start to bond with the team, which he hasn't seemed to do to this point. Anything can happen. Just dont want Perry/Mills to give away the store.for a very brief run.

ahhh... no its not because Kyrie is a max player. Its not really up for debate is it? I would certainly prefer Kawhi but Kyrie has the best handle in the game and shoots 40% from 3. I mean as a 1B next to KD as a 1A you really dont get much better than that. Huge concession? One might question the merits of maxing out only Kyrie, but along side KD? That is not a concession man

Dont you ahhh me! ha. The best ability is availability. How available will Kyrie be in the coming years? That is a legit question for a franchise that has been snakebit with expensive and frequently injured players.

there is no scenario that that has KD/KI singing here for FA that involves any concessions. He's 100% a max player. He's missed time but has not suffered any kind of career threatening injury. Durant has also missed time. Cant really factor for that. Kyrie isnt my favorite FA but you dont get to pick and choose, especially if that is the guy KD wants. I suspect (and hope) that KD drives who else comes and lets face it, any combo works. IF its get him a robin and that's Kyrie great. Kyrie has a lot to prove and I think if you get him this is the best time. 27-31 and go from there.

How do you feel about this next year:
Kyrie/Dotson/Zion/KD/Mitch
bench: DSJ, Frank, Trier, Knox

Handing out a max deal to another player because an FA wants him here is a big concession. Especially when that player has missed as many games as Irving has. He's had a rep for being injury prone going back to Duke. He's earned it. Would be concerned with Irving's injury issues, and his relationship with NY media. Both Durant and Irving are thin skinned in that dept. One would be enough.

As I said earlier, Perry/Mills should offer short term deals. Durant didnt want to commit long term to GS, with a much better squad. He's seen what LeBron has had to go through in a similar situation. They might be on board with a short deal given NY's track record.Hope Perry/Mills go for it. Doesnt work out we get our cap room back in a hurry.

its just not. Its like you havent been laid in 20 years and here comes a movie star with a fashion model and you think its a concession because its not two movie stars.

Irving is a max player. That is his market value. Are we really debating that?

If the movie star and the model run up your CC bill as well, takes 5 years to pay it off. The model is in rehab most of the time, and the movie star bails because its affecting her career. Maybe its better if one sets their sights a little lower, so to speak.

If Irving stays healthy, absolutely a max player. Problem is he doesnt stay healthy for very long.

and if you say something we can start having a conversation. Is Kyrie a max player? Are you gonna sit down with Kawhi and tell him he's a max player... IF he stays healthy? Can we only pick Zion IF he stays healthy? Otherwise its wise to take Ja I think.

I mean cmon... you saying you skip on KD because Kyrie doesnt deserve max? I am really curious here

His last 4 playoff runs, Irving has missed or failed to finish in half of them. He is a PG who relies on his burst to dominate. Giving a player like Kyrie a max deal, with all the knee surgeries, wear and tear, is very risky. Foolish to ignore the risk of handing out long term contracts to PGs with bad knees. Besides,teams dont normally win a ring when the PG has a max contract. Team gets spread too thin.

Haven't even gone into chemistry problems across 2 teams. You make it sound like Kyrie and Durant would be entering some kind of commitment not to bail if things dont work out. Durant? Of course he would.

Just because a player is skilled enough to be offered a max deal, doesnt necessarily mean that player is a good fit everywhere.

So no KD an no Kyrie for you. Too risky. Got it.

Myself I am great with signing them. We need elite talent. KD and Kyrie represent that and the best chance to win an actual title. If I have a chance to add KD/Kyrie for no cost but cap space that is a generational FA opportunity and you do that. No questions asked.

+ 1000

We would need some more quality veterans.(with playoff experience), at fire sale prices. Not sure we would make it out of the East, depending on how free agency plays out. Not without a deeper bench. That would mean flushing the youth movement as well. Doubt Durant/Irving want to wait on them to figure it out.

lots of assumptions there. The roster is not as bare as one would think. There are a few things to also consider, starting with the influx of veteran FAs who will love to play at MSG late in their career in meaningful games.

Jordan seems like a great fit. Tyson Chandler also comes to mind. If KD/Kyrie come and god forbid we draft a blue chip player the NY KNicks will be a real draw.

GustavBahler
Posts: 35376
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186

4/10/2019  10:39 AM
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Uptown wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:Durant has been grumpy for years with media. Nothing new.
Bucher has a good angle. Not sure how accurate it is but he presnts a good opinion.
My take is Durant can handle it because he’ll handle expectations an understands the media even if annoying.
Bucher does mention Knicks but not NYC and were you choose to live is as important as where you work. Nets are also viable if NYC is desirable. they have the money, have more in place talent and a GM/coach tandem in place a bit more seasoned together.
It’s hard to ever say “Winning is not important” but how you get there might be.
Nalod wont project any more because time will tell ths story, not my predictions.

To me it depends on how Durant wants to play a part in building the team. If he makes Kyrie a condition of his signing, I would hope Perry/Mills take a step back. If they were to sign two year deals, like Durant/LeBron have both done in the past, that would give both sides more flexibility.
Maxing out Irving and all the risks that go with it (injury and chemistry wise) is a huge concession.

Would they get us a ring? Would be willing to bet on short term deals on Durant/Irving but not all those years. Especially if we draft Zion. Wouldn't want his team hamstrung with cap space used up by a player who cant stay healthy. Or we draft a PG to go along with DSjr. Durant could call next season a tryout between Morant and DSJr.

For all we know Durant hasn't made playing with Irving a priority. Besides, Kyrie might go through a long playoff slog in Boston, and start to bond with the team, which he hasn't seemed to do to this point. Anything can happen. Just dont want Perry/Mills to give away the store.for a very brief run.

ahhh... no its not because Kyrie is a max player. Its not really up for debate is it? I would certainly prefer Kawhi but Kyrie has the best handle in the game and shoots 40% from 3. I mean as a 1B next to KD as a 1A you really dont get much better than that. Huge concession? One might question the merits of maxing out only Kyrie, but along side KD? That is not a concession man

Dont you ahhh me! ha. The best ability is availability. How available will Kyrie be in the coming years? That is a legit question for a franchise that has been snakebit with expensive and frequently injured players.

there is no scenario that that has KD/KI singing here for FA that involves any concessions. He's 100% a max player. He's missed time but has not suffered any kind of career threatening injury. Durant has also missed time. Cant really factor for that. Kyrie isnt my favorite FA but you dont get to pick and choose, especially if that is the guy KD wants. I suspect (and hope) that KD drives who else comes and lets face it, any combo works. IF its get him a robin and that's Kyrie great. Kyrie has a lot to prove and I think if you get him this is the best time. 27-31 and go from there.

How do you feel about this next year:
Kyrie/Dotson/Zion/KD/Mitch
bench: DSJ, Frank, Trier, Knox

Handing out a max deal to another player because an FA wants him here is a big concession. Especially when that player has missed as many games as Irving has. He's had a rep for being injury prone going back to Duke. He's earned it. Would be concerned with Irving's injury issues, and his relationship with NY media. Both Durant and Irving are thin skinned in that dept. One would be enough.

As I said earlier, Perry/Mills should offer short term deals. Durant didnt want to commit long term to GS, with a much better squad. He's seen what LeBron has had to go through in a similar situation. They might be on board with a short deal given NY's track record.Hope Perry/Mills go for it. Doesnt work out we get our cap room back in a hurry.

its just not. Its like you havent been laid in 20 years and here comes a movie star with a fashion model and you think its a concession because its not two movie stars.

Irving is a max player. That is his market value. Are we really debating that?

If the movie star and the model run up your CC bill as well, takes 5 years to pay it off. The model is in rehab most of the time, and the movie star bails because its affecting her career. Maybe its better if one sets their sights a little lower, so to speak.

If Irving stays healthy, absolutely a max player. Problem is he doesnt stay healthy for very long.

and if you say something we can start having a conversation. Is Kyrie a max player? Are you gonna sit down with Kawhi and tell him he's a max player... IF he stays healthy? Can we only pick Zion IF he stays healthy? Otherwise its wise to take Ja I think.

I mean cmon... you saying you skip on KD because Kyrie doesnt deserve max? I am really curious here

His last 4 playoff runs, Irving has missed or failed to finish in half of them. He is a PG who relies on his burst to dominate. Giving a player like Kyrie a max deal, with all the knee surgeries, wear and tear, is very risky. Foolish to ignore the risk of handing out long term contracts to PGs with bad knees. Besides,teams dont normally win a ring when the PG has a max contract. Team gets spread too thin.

Haven't even gone into chemistry problems across 2 teams. You make it sound like Kyrie and Durant would be entering some kind of commitment not to bail if things dont work out. Durant? Of course he would.

Just because a player is skilled enough to be offered a max deal, doesnt necessarily mean that player is a good fit everywhere.

So no KD an no Kyrie for you. Too risky. Got it.

Myself I am great with signing them. We need elite talent. KD and Kyrie represent that and the best chance to win an actual title. If I have a chance to add KD/Kyrie for no cost but cap space that is a generational FA opportunity and you do that. No questions asked.

+ 1000

We would need some more quality veterans.(with playoff experience), at fire sale prices. Not sure we would make it out of the East, depending on how free agency plays out. Not without a deeper bench. That would mean flushing the youth movement as well. Doubt Durant/Irving want to wait on them to figure it out.

lots of assumptions there. The roster is not as bare as one would think. There are a few things to also consider, starting with the influx of veteran FAs who will love to play at MSG late in their career in meaningful games.

Jordan seems like a great fit. Tyson Chandler also comes to mind. If KD/Kyrie come and god forbid we draft a blue chip player the NY KNicks will be a real draw.

Not talking about their skill level, its their lack of playoff experience. Guessing Irving/Durant would want more vets who have been there. For Irving and Durant to get us a ring, we would need one more elite player IMO. Our own "Big 3".

Would Durant/Irving structure their contracts to make it easier? (Allanfan? ) Dont know. Might depend on the FA.

If we are going for broke, want to see a team built that can do more than make a respectable run.

I wouldn't count on more than a couple of good playoff runs from Durant and Irving, as a tandem. My guess before injuries start to assert themselves more. One or both of them. If we could get that third star, Id be more enthusiastic about our chances.

knicks1248
Posts: 38523
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 2/3/2004
Member: #582
4/10/2019  10:53 AM
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Uptown wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:Durant has been grumpy for years with media. Nothing new.
Bucher has a good angle. Not sure how accurate it is but he presnts a good opinion.
My take is Durant can handle it because he’ll handle expectations an understands the media even if annoying.
Bucher does mention Knicks but not NYC and were you choose to live is as important as where you work. Nets are also viable if NYC is desirable. they have the money, have more in place talent and a GM/coach tandem in place a bit more seasoned together.
It’s hard to ever say “Winning is not important” but how you get there might be.
Nalod wont project any more because time will tell ths story, not my predictions.

To me it depends on how Durant wants to play a part in building the team. If he makes Kyrie a condition of his signing, I would hope Perry/Mills take a step back. If they were to sign two year deals, like Durant/LeBron have both done in the past, that would give both sides more flexibility.
Maxing out Irving and all the risks that go with it (injury and chemistry wise) is a huge concession.

Would they get us a ring? Would be willing to bet on short term deals on Durant/Irving but not all those years. Especially if we draft Zion. Wouldn't want his team hamstrung with cap space used up by a player who cant stay healthy. Or we draft a PG to go along with DSjr. Durant could call next season a tryout between Morant and DSJr.

For all we know Durant hasn't made playing with Irving a priority. Besides, Kyrie might go through a long playoff slog in Boston, and start to bond with the team, which he hasn't seemed to do to this point. Anything can happen. Just dont want Perry/Mills to give away the store.for a very brief run.

ahhh... no its not because Kyrie is a max player. Its not really up for debate is it? I would certainly prefer Kawhi but Kyrie has the best handle in the game and shoots 40% from 3. I mean as a 1B next to KD as a 1A you really dont get much better than that. Huge concession? One might question the merits of maxing out only Kyrie, but along side KD? That is not a concession man

Dont you ahhh me! ha. The best ability is availability. How available will Kyrie be in the coming years? That is a legit question for a franchise that has been snakebit with expensive and frequently injured players.

there is no scenario that that has KD/KI singing here for FA that involves any concessions. He's 100% a max player. He's missed time but has not suffered any kind of career threatening injury. Durant has also missed time. Cant really factor for that. Kyrie isnt my favorite FA but you dont get to pick and choose, especially if that is the guy KD wants. I suspect (and hope) that KD drives who else comes and lets face it, any combo works. IF its get him a robin and that's Kyrie great. Kyrie has a lot to prove and I think if you get him this is the best time. 27-31 and go from there.

How do you feel about this next year:
Kyrie/Dotson/Zion/KD/Mitch
bench: DSJ, Frank, Trier, Knox

Handing out a max deal to another player because an FA wants him here is a big concession. Especially when that player has missed as many games as Irving has. He's had a rep for being injury prone going back to Duke. He's earned it. Would be concerned with Irving's injury issues, and his relationship with NY media. Both Durant and Irving are thin skinned in that dept. One would be enough.

As I said earlier, Perry/Mills should offer short term deals. Durant didnt want to commit long term to GS, with a much better squad. He's seen what LeBron has had to go through in a similar situation. They might be on board with a short deal given NY's track record.Hope Perry/Mills go for it. Doesnt work out we get our cap room back in a hurry.

its just not. Its like you havent been laid in 20 years and here comes a movie star with a fashion model and you think its a concession because its not two movie stars.

Irving is a max player. That is his market value. Are we really debating that?

If the movie star and the model run up your CC bill as well, takes 5 years to pay it off. The model is in rehab most of the time, and the movie star bails because its affecting her career. Maybe its better if one sets their sights a little lower, so to speak.

If Irving stays healthy, absolutely a max player. Problem is he doesnt stay healthy for very long.

and if you say something we can start having a conversation. Is Kyrie a max player? Are you gonna sit down with Kawhi and tell him he's a max player... IF he stays healthy? Can we only pick Zion IF he stays healthy? Otherwise its wise to take Ja I think.

I mean cmon... you saying you skip on KD because Kyrie doesnt deserve max? I am really curious here

His last 4 playoff runs, Irving has missed or failed to finish in half of them. He is a PG who relies on his burst to dominate. Giving a player like Kyrie a max deal, with all the knee surgeries, wear and tear, is very risky. Foolish to ignore the risk of handing out long term contracts to PGs with bad knees. Besides,teams dont normally win a ring when the PG has a max contract. Team gets spread too thin.

Haven't even gone into chemistry problems across 2 teams. You make it sound like Kyrie and Durant would be entering some kind of commitment not to bail if things dont work out. Durant? Of course he would.

Just because a player is skilled enough to be offered a max deal, doesnt necessarily mean that player is a good fit everywhere.

So no KD an no Kyrie for you. Too risky. Got it.

Myself I am great with signing them. We need elite talent. KD and Kyrie represent that and the best chance to win an actual title. If I have a chance to add KD/Kyrie for no cost but cap space that is a generational FA opportunity and you do that. No questions asked.

+ 1000

We would need some more quality veterans.(with playoff experience), at fire sale prices. Not sure we would make it out of the East, depending on how free agency plays out. Not without a deeper bench. That would mean flushing the youth movement as well. Doubt Durant/Irving want to wait on them to figure it out.

lots of assumptions there. The roster is not as bare as one would think. There are a few things to also consider, starting with the influx of veteran FAs who will love to play at MSG late in their career in meaningful games.

Jordan seems like a great fit. Tyson Chandler also comes to mind. If KD/Kyrie come and god forbid we draft a blue chip player the NY KNicks will be a real draw.

Not talking about their skill level, its their lack of playoff experience. Guessing Irving/Durant would want more vets who have been there. For Irving and Durant to get us a ring, we would need one more elite player IMO. Our own "Big 3".

Would Durant/Irving structure their contracts to make it easier? (Allanfan? ) Dont know. Might depend on the FA.

If we are going for broke, want to see a team built that can do more than make a respectable run.

I wouldn't count on more than a couple of good playoff runs from Durant and Irving, as a tandem. My guess before injuries start to assert themselves more. One or both of them. If we could get that third star, Id be more enthusiastic about our chances.

Injuries can happen to anyone at anytime, not to mention most of you were willing to give KP the max with major fatigue and injury issues..

Do you really think KD or Kyrie is more interested in $$ or winning and brand?

ES
fishmike
Posts: 49000
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
4/10/2019  11:16 AM
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Uptown wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:Durant has been grumpy for years with media. Nothing new.
Bucher has a good angle. Not sure how accurate it is but he presnts a good opinion.
My take is Durant can handle it because he’ll handle expectations an understands the media even if annoying.
Bucher does mention Knicks but not NYC and were you choose to live is as important as where you work. Nets are also viable if NYC is desirable. they have the money, have more in place talent and a GM/coach tandem in place a bit more seasoned together.
It’s hard to ever say “Winning is not important” but how you get there might be.
Nalod wont project any more because time will tell ths story, not my predictions.

To me it depends on how Durant wants to play a part in building the team. If he makes Kyrie a condition of his signing, I would hope Perry/Mills take a step back. If they were to sign two year deals, like Durant/LeBron have both done in the past, that would give both sides more flexibility.
Maxing out Irving and all the risks that go with it (injury and chemistry wise) is a huge concession.

Would they get us a ring? Would be willing to bet on short term deals on Durant/Irving but not all those years. Especially if we draft Zion. Wouldn't want his team hamstrung with cap space used up by a player who cant stay healthy. Or we draft a PG to go along with DSjr. Durant could call next season a tryout between Morant and DSJr.

For all we know Durant hasn't made playing with Irving a priority. Besides, Kyrie might go through a long playoff slog in Boston, and start to bond with the team, which he hasn't seemed to do to this point. Anything can happen. Just dont want Perry/Mills to give away the store.for a very brief run.

ahhh... no its not because Kyrie is a max player. Its not really up for debate is it? I would certainly prefer Kawhi but Kyrie has the best handle in the game and shoots 40% from 3. I mean as a 1B next to KD as a 1A you really dont get much better than that. Huge concession? One might question the merits of maxing out only Kyrie, but along side KD? That is not a concession man

Dont you ahhh me! ha. The best ability is availability. How available will Kyrie be in the coming years? That is a legit question for a franchise that has been snakebit with expensive and frequently injured players.

there is no scenario that that has KD/KI singing here for FA that involves any concessions. He's 100% a max player. He's missed time but has not suffered any kind of career threatening injury. Durant has also missed time. Cant really factor for that. Kyrie isnt my favorite FA but you dont get to pick and choose, especially if that is the guy KD wants. I suspect (and hope) that KD drives who else comes and lets face it, any combo works. IF its get him a robin and that's Kyrie great. Kyrie has a lot to prove and I think if you get him this is the best time. 27-31 and go from there.

How do you feel about this next year:
Kyrie/Dotson/Zion/KD/Mitch
bench: DSJ, Frank, Trier, Knox

Handing out a max deal to another player because an FA wants him here is a big concession. Especially when that player has missed as many games as Irving has. He's had a rep for being injury prone going back to Duke. He's earned it. Would be concerned with Irving's injury issues, and his relationship with NY media. Both Durant and Irving are thin skinned in that dept. One would be enough.

As I said earlier, Perry/Mills should offer short term deals. Durant didnt want to commit long term to GS, with a much better squad. He's seen what LeBron has had to go through in a similar situation. They might be on board with a short deal given NY's track record.Hope Perry/Mills go for it. Doesnt work out we get our cap room back in a hurry.

its just not. Its like you havent been laid in 20 years and here comes a movie star with a fashion model and you think its a concession because its not two movie stars.

Irving is a max player. That is his market value. Are we really debating that?

If the movie star and the model run up your CC bill as well, takes 5 years to pay it off. The model is in rehab most of the time, and the movie star bails because its affecting her career. Maybe its better if one sets their sights a little lower, so to speak.

If Irving stays healthy, absolutely a max player. Problem is he doesnt stay healthy for very long.

and if you say something we can start having a conversation. Is Kyrie a max player? Are you gonna sit down with Kawhi and tell him he's a max player... IF he stays healthy? Can we only pick Zion IF he stays healthy? Otherwise its wise to take Ja I think.

I mean cmon... you saying you skip on KD because Kyrie doesnt deserve max? I am really curious here

His last 4 playoff runs, Irving has missed or failed to finish in half of them. He is a PG who relies on his burst to dominate. Giving a player like Kyrie a max deal, with all the knee surgeries, wear and tear, is very risky. Foolish to ignore the risk of handing out long term contracts to PGs with bad knees. Besides,teams dont normally win a ring when the PG has a max contract. Team gets spread too thin.

Haven't even gone into chemistry problems across 2 teams. You make it sound like Kyrie and Durant would be entering some kind of commitment not to bail if things dont work out. Durant? Of course he would.

Just because a player is skilled enough to be offered a max deal, doesnt necessarily mean that player is a good fit everywhere.

So no KD an no Kyrie for you. Too risky. Got it.

Myself I am great with signing them. We need elite talent. KD and Kyrie represent that and the best chance to win an actual title. If I have a chance to add KD/Kyrie for no cost but cap space that is a generational FA opportunity and you do that. No questions asked.

+ 1000

We would need some more quality veterans.(with playoff experience), at fire sale prices. Not sure we would make it out of the East, depending on how free agency plays out. Not without a deeper bench. That would mean flushing the youth movement as well. Doubt Durant/Irving want to wait on them to figure it out.

lots of assumptions there. The roster is not as bare as one would think. There are a few things to also consider, starting with the influx of veteran FAs who will love to play at MSG late in their career in meaningful games.

Jordan seems like a great fit. Tyson Chandler also comes to mind. If KD/Kyrie come and god forbid we draft a blue chip player the NY KNicks will be a real draw.

Not talking about their skill level, its their lack of playoff experience. Guessing Irving/Durant would want more vets who have been there. For Irving and Durant to get us a ring, we would need one more elite player IMO. Our own "Big 3".

Would Durant/Irving structure their contracts to make it easier? (Allanfan? ) Dont know. Might depend on the FA.

If we are going for broke, want to see a team built that can do more than make a respectable run.

I wouldn't count on more than a couple of good playoff runs from Durant and Irving, as a tandem. My guess before injuries start to assert themselves more. One or both of them. If we could get that third star, Id be more enthusiastic about our chances.

well we have a top 5 pick. We have some prospect on the actual roster. I think if you add 2 of the top 10 players in the league you are getting more than a couple good playoff runs as your guess indicates. My guess is a finals, a couple conference finals and a 2nd round exit while the guys figure things out or someone is hurt.

The Dallas picks are a real coupe as they allow us to attach assets to a get a player in a fire sale without killing our own future.

When asked to be primary scorers and defend NBA stars guys like Trier, Knox, Dotson, Frank have had moments but not been ready. Asking them to be role players and I think they look very different. Dotson/Trier will look great at SG when Irving is the PG and Durant is on the floor. People have forgotten how talent improves everything. Last time we saw this was with Melo

GustavBahler
Posts: 35376
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186

4/10/2019  11:45 AM
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Uptown wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:Durant has been grumpy for years with media. Nothing new.
Bucher has a good angle. Not sure how accurate it is but he presnts a good opinion.
My take is Durant can handle it because he’ll handle expectations an understands the media even if annoying.
Bucher does mention Knicks but not NYC and were you choose to live is as important as where you work. Nets are also viable if NYC is desirable. they have the money, have more in place talent and a GM/coach tandem in place a bit more seasoned together.
It’s hard to ever say “Winning is not important” but how you get there might be.
Nalod wont project any more because time will tell ths story, not my predictions.

To me it depends on how Durant wants to play a part in building the team. If he makes Kyrie a condition of his signing, I would hope Perry/Mills take a step back. If they were to sign two year deals, like Durant/LeBron have both done in the past, that would give both sides more flexibility.
Maxing out Irving and all the risks that go with it (injury and chemistry wise) is a huge concession.

Would they get us a ring? Would be willing to bet on short term deals on Durant/Irving but not all those years. Especially if we draft Zion. Wouldn't want his team hamstrung with cap space used up by a player who cant stay healthy. Or we draft a PG to go along with DSjr. Durant could call next season a tryout between Morant and DSJr.

For all we know Durant hasn't made playing with Irving a priority. Besides, Kyrie might go through a long playoff slog in Boston, and start to bond with the team, which he hasn't seemed to do to this point. Anything can happen. Just dont want Perry/Mills to give away the store.for a very brief run.

ahhh... no its not because Kyrie is a max player. Its not really up for debate is it? I would certainly prefer Kawhi but Kyrie has the best handle in the game and shoots 40% from 3. I mean as a 1B next to KD as a 1A you really dont get much better than that. Huge concession? One might question the merits of maxing out only Kyrie, but along side KD? That is not a concession man

Dont you ahhh me! ha. The best ability is availability. How available will Kyrie be in the coming years? That is a legit question for a franchise that has been snakebit with expensive and frequently injured players.

there is no scenario that that has KD/KI singing here for FA that involves any concessions. He's 100% a max player. He's missed time but has not suffered any kind of career threatening injury. Durant has also missed time. Cant really factor for that. Kyrie isnt my favorite FA but you dont get to pick and choose, especially if that is the guy KD wants. I suspect (and hope) that KD drives who else comes and lets face it, any combo works. IF its get him a robin and that's Kyrie great. Kyrie has a lot to prove and I think if you get him this is the best time. 27-31 and go from there.

How do you feel about this next year:
Kyrie/Dotson/Zion/KD/Mitch
bench: DSJ, Frank, Trier, Knox

Handing out a max deal to another player because an FA wants him here is a big concession. Especially when that player has missed as many games as Irving has. He's had a rep for being injury prone going back to Duke. He's earned it. Would be concerned with Irving's injury issues, and his relationship with NY media. Both Durant and Irving are thin skinned in that dept. One would be enough.

As I said earlier, Perry/Mills should offer short term deals. Durant didnt want to commit long term to GS, with a much better squad. He's seen what LeBron has had to go through in a similar situation. They might be on board with a short deal given NY's track record.Hope Perry/Mills go for it. Doesnt work out we get our cap room back in a hurry.

its just not. Its like you havent been laid in 20 years and here comes a movie star with a fashion model and you think its a concession because its not two movie stars.

Irving is a max player. That is his market value. Are we really debating that?

If the movie star and the model run up your CC bill as well, takes 5 years to pay it off. The model is in rehab most of the time, and the movie star bails because its affecting her career. Maybe its better if one sets their sights a little lower, so to speak.

If Irving stays healthy, absolutely a max player. Problem is he doesnt stay healthy for very long.

and if you say something we can start having a conversation. Is Kyrie a max player? Are you gonna sit down with Kawhi and tell him he's a max player... IF he stays healthy? Can we only pick Zion IF he stays healthy? Otherwise its wise to take Ja I think.

I mean cmon... you saying you skip on KD because Kyrie doesnt deserve max? I am really curious here

His last 4 playoff runs, Irving has missed or failed to finish in half of them. He is a PG who relies on his burst to dominate. Giving a player like Kyrie a max deal, with all the knee surgeries, wear and tear, is very risky. Foolish to ignore the risk of handing out long term contracts to PGs with bad knees. Besides,teams dont normally win a ring when the PG has a max contract. Team gets spread too thin.

Haven't even gone into chemistry problems across 2 teams. You make it sound like Kyrie and Durant would be entering some kind of commitment not to bail if things dont work out. Durant? Of course he would.

Just because a player is skilled enough to be offered a max deal, doesnt necessarily mean that player is a good fit everywhere.

So no KD an no Kyrie for you. Too risky. Got it.

Myself I am great with signing them. We need elite talent. KD and Kyrie represent that and the best chance to win an actual title. If I have a chance to add KD/Kyrie for no cost but cap space that is a generational FA opportunity and you do that. No questions asked.

+ 1000

We would need some more quality veterans.(with playoff experience), at fire sale prices. Not sure we would make it out of the East, depending on how free agency plays out. Not without a deeper bench. That would mean flushing the youth movement as well. Doubt Durant/Irving want to wait on them to figure it out.

lots of assumptions there. The roster is not as bare as one would think. There are a few things to also consider, starting with the influx of veteran FAs who will love to play at MSG late in their career in meaningful games.

Jordan seems like a great fit. Tyson Chandler also comes to mind. If KD/Kyrie come and god forbid we draft a blue chip player the NY KNicks will be a real draw.

Not talking about their skill level, its their lack of playoff experience. Guessing Irving/Durant would want more vets who have been there. For Irving and Durant to get us a ring, we would need one more elite player IMO. Our own "Big 3".

Would Durant/Irving structure their contracts to make it easier? (Allanfan? ) Dont know. Might depend on the FA.

If we are going for broke, want to see a team built that can do more than make a respectable run.

I wouldn't count on more than a couple of good playoff runs from Durant and Irving, as a tandem. My guess before injuries start to assert themselves more. One or both of them. If we could get that third star, Id be more enthusiastic about our chances.

well we have a top 5 pick. We have some prospect on the actual roster. I think if you add 2 of the top 10 players in the league you are getting more than a couple good playoff runs as your guess indicates. My guess is a finals, a couple conference finals and a 2nd round exit while the guys figure things out or someone is hurt.

The Dallas picks are a real coupe as they allow us to attach assets to a get a player in a fire sale without killing our own future.

When asked to be primary scorers and defend NBA stars guys like Trier, Knox, Dotson, Frank have had moments but not been ready. Asking them to be role players and I think they look very different. Dotson/Trier will look great at SG when Irving is the PG and Durant is on the floor. People have forgotten how talent improves everything. Last time we saw this was with Melo

Wouldn't count on all our young players becoming defensive stoppers that fast. This would still be a young team. If Irving or Durant start missing games, having another elite player would go a long way towards keeping things going. Thats how you get past just a couple of good seasons. An insurance policy. Thats how most championships have been won lately. None of them maxed out a PG.

martin
Posts: 48271
Alba Posts: 106
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #2
USA
4/10/2019  11:57 AM
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Uptown wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:Durant has been grumpy for years with media. Nothing new.
Bucher has a good angle. Not sure how accurate it is but he presnts a good opinion.
My take is Durant can handle it because he’ll handle expectations an understands the media even if annoying.
Bucher does mention Knicks but not NYC and were you choose to live is as important as where you work. Nets are also viable if NYC is desirable. they have the money, have more in place talent and a GM/coach tandem in place a bit more seasoned together.
It’s hard to ever say “Winning is not important” but how you get there might be.
Nalod wont project any more because time will tell ths story, not my predictions.

To me it depends on how Durant wants to play a part in building the team. If he makes Kyrie a condition of his signing, I would hope Perry/Mills take a step back. If they were to sign two year deals, like Durant/LeBron have both done in the past, that would give both sides more flexibility.
Maxing out Irving and all the risks that go with it (injury and chemistry wise) is a huge concession.

Would they get us a ring? Would be willing to bet on short term deals on Durant/Irving but not all those years. Especially if we draft Zion. Wouldn't want his team hamstrung with cap space used up by a player who cant stay healthy. Or we draft a PG to go along with DSjr. Durant could call next season a tryout between Morant and DSJr.

For all we know Durant hasn't made playing with Irving a priority. Besides, Kyrie might go through a long playoff slog in Boston, and start to bond with the team, which he hasn't seemed to do to this point. Anything can happen. Just dont want Perry/Mills to give away the store.for a very brief run.

ahhh... no its not because Kyrie is a max player. Its not really up for debate is it? I would certainly prefer Kawhi but Kyrie has the best handle in the game and shoots 40% from 3. I mean as a 1B next to KD as a 1A you really dont get much better than that. Huge concession? One might question the merits of maxing out only Kyrie, but along side KD? That is not a concession man

Dont you ahhh me! ha. The best ability is availability. How available will Kyrie be in the coming years? That is a legit question for a franchise that has been snakebit with expensive and frequently injured players.

there is no scenario that that has KD/KI singing here for FA that involves any concessions. He's 100% a max player. He's missed time but has not suffered any kind of career threatening injury. Durant has also missed time. Cant really factor for that. Kyrie isnt my favorite FA but you dont get to pick and choose, especially if that is the guy KD wants. I suspect (and hope) that KD drives who else comes and lets face it, any combo works. IF its get him a robin and that's Kyrie great. Kyrie has a lot to prove and I think if you get him this is the best time. 27-31 and go from there.

How do you feel about this next year:
Kyrie/Dotson/Zion/KD/Mitch
bench: DSJ, Frank, Trier, Knox

Handing out a max deal to another player because an FA wants him here is a big concession. Especially when that player has missed as many games as Irving has. He's had a rep for being injury prone going back to Duke. He's earned it. Would be concerned with Irving's injury issues, and his relationship with NY media. Both Durant and Irving are thin skinned in that dept. One would be enough.

As I said earlier, Perry/Mills should offer short term deals. Durant didnt want to commit long term to GS, with a much better squad. He's seen what LeBron has had to go through in a similar situation. They might be on board with a short deal given NY's track record.Hope Perry/Mills go for it. Doesnt work out we get our cap room back in a hurry.

its just not. Its like you havent been laid in 20 years and here comes a movie star with a fashion model and you think its a concession because its not two movie stars.

Irving is a max player. That is his market value. Are we really debating that?

If the movie star and the model run up your CC bill as well, takes 5 years to pay it off. The model is in rehab most of the time, and the movie star bails because its affecting her career. Maybe its better if one sets their sights a little lower, so to speak.

If Irving stays healthy, absolutely a max player. Problem is he doesnt stay healthy for very long.

and if you say something we can start having a conversation. Is Kyrie a max player? Are you gonna sit down with Kawhi and tell him he's a max player... IF he stays healthy? Can we only pick Zion IF he stays healthy? Otherwise its wise to take Ja I think.

I mean cmon... you saying you skip on KD because Kyrie doesnt deserve max? I am really curious here

His last 4 playoff runs, Irving has missed or failed to finish in half of them. He is a PG who relies on his burst to dominate. Giving a player like Kyrie a max deal, with all the knee surgeries, wear and tear, is very risky. Foolish to ignore the risk of handing out long term contracts to PGs with bad knees. Besides,teams dont normally win a ring when the PG has a max contract. Team gets spread too thin.

Haven't even gone into chemistry problems across 2 teams. You make it sound like Kyrie and Durant would be entering some kind of commitment not to bail if things dont work out. Durant? Of course he would.

Just because a player is skilled enough to be offered a max deal, doesnt necessarily mean that player is a good fit everywhere.

So no KD an no Kyrie for you. Too risky. Got it.

Myself I am great with signing them. We need elite talent. KD and Kyrie represent that and the best chance to win an actual title. If I have a chance to add KD/Kyrie for no cost but cap space that is a generational FA opportunity and you do that. No questions asked.

+ 1000

We would need some more quality veterans.(with playoff experience), at fire sale prices. Not sure we would make it out of the East, depending on how free agency plays out. Not without a deeper bench. That would mean flushing the youth movement as well. Doubt Durant/Irving want to wait on them to figure it out.

lots of assumptions there. The roster is not as bare as one would think. There are a few things to also consider, starting with the influx of veteran FAs who will love to play at MSG late in their career in meaningful games.

Jordan seems like a great fit. Tyson Chandler also comes to mind. If KD/Kyrie come and god forbid we draft a blue chip player the NY KNicks will be a real draw.

Not talking about their skill level, its their lack of playoff experience. Guessing Irving/Durant would want more vets who have been there. For Irving and Durant to get us a ring, we would need one more elite player IMO. Our own "Big 3".

Would Durant/Irving structure their contracts to make it easier? (Allanfan? ) Dont know. Might depend on the FA.

If we are going for broke, want to see a team built that can do more than make a respectable run.

I wouldn't count on more than a couple of good playoff runs from Durant and Irving, as a tandem. My guess before injuries start to assert themselves more. One or both of them. If we could get that third star, Id be more enthusiastic about our chances.

well we have a top 5 pick. We have some prospect on the actual roster. I think if you add 2 of the top 10 players in the league you are getting more than a couple good playoff runs as your guess indicates. My guess is a finals, a couple conference finals and a 2nd round exit while the guys figure things out or someone is hurt.

The Dallas picks are a real coupe as they allow us to attach assets to a get a player in a fire sale without killing our own future.

When asked to be primary scorers and defend NBA stars guys like Trier, Knox, Dotson, Frank have had moments but not been ready. Asking them to be role players and I think they look very different. Dotson/Trier will look great at SG when Irving is the PG and Durant is on the floor. People have forgotten how talent improves everything. Last time we saw this was with Melo

Wouldn't count on all our young players becoming defensive stoppers that fast. This would still be a young team. If Irving or Durant start missing games, having another elite player would go a long way towards keeping things going. Thats how you get past just a couple of good seasons. An insurance policy. Thats how most championships have been won lately. None of them maxed out a PG.

? GS and Cleveland have won the last 4.... with maxed out PGs in Curry and Kyrie in 3 of those and Curry will most likely add another this year. Realistically Houston has 2 maxed out PGs. Maybe I don't understand what this is

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fishmike
Posts: 49000
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
4/10/2019  12:23 PM
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Uptown wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:Durant has been grumpy for years with media. Nothing new.
Bucher has a good angle. Not sure how accurate it is but he presnts a good opinion.
My take is Durant can handle it because he’ll handle expectations an understands the media even if annoying.
Bucher does mention Knicks but not NYC and were you choose to live is as important as where you work. Nets are also viable if NYC is desirable. they have the money, have more in place talent and a GM/coach tandem in place a bit more seasoned together.
It’s hard to ever say “Winning is not important” but how you get there might be.
Nalod wont project any more because time will tell ths story, not my predictions.

To me it depends on how Durant wants to play a part in building the team. If he makes Kyrie a condition of his signing, I would hope Perry/Mills take a step back. If they were to sign two year deals, like Durant/LeBron have both done in the past, that would give both sides more flexibility.
Maxing out Irving and all the risks that go with it (injury and chemistry wise) is a huge concession.

Would they get us a ring? Would be willing to bet on short term deals on Durant/Irving but not all those years. Especially if we draft Zion. Wouldn't want his team hamstrung with cap space used up by a player who cant stay healthy. Or we draft a PG to go along with DSjr. Durant could call next season a tryout between Morant and DSJr.

For all we know Durant hasn't made playing with Irving a priority. Besides, Kyrie might go through a long playoff slog in Boston, and start to bond with the team, which he hasn't seemed to do to this point. Anything can happen. Just dont want Perry/Mills to give away the store.for a very brief run.

ahhh... no its not because Kyrie is a max player. Its not really up for debate is it? I would certainly prefer Kawhi but Kyrie has the best handle in the game and shoots 40% from 3. I mean as a 1B next to KD as a 1A you really dont get much better than that. Huge concession? One might question the merits of maxing out only Kyrie, but along side KD? That is not a concession man

Dont you ahhh me! ha. The best ability is availability. How available will Kyrie be in the coming years? That is a legit question for a franchise that has been snakebit with expensive and frequently injured players.

there is no scenario that that has KD/KI singing here for FA that involves any concessions. He's 100% a max player. He's missed time but has not suffered any kind of career threatening injury. Durant has also missed time. Cant really factor for that. Kyrie isnt my favorite FA but you dont get to pick and choose, especially if that is the guy KD wants. I suspect (and hope) that KD drives who else comes and lets face it, any combo works. IF its get him a robin and that's Kyrie great. Kyrie has a lot to prove and I think if you get him this is the best time. 27-31 and go from there.

How do you feel about this next year:
Kyrie/Dotson/Zion/KD/Mitch
bench: DSJ, Frank, Trier, Knox

Handing out a max deal to another player because an FA wants him here is a big concession. Especially when that player has missed as many games as Irving has. He's had a rep for being injury prone going back to Duke. He's earned it. Would be concerned with Irving's injury issues, and his relationship with NY media. Both Durant and Irving are thin skinned in that dept. One would be enough.

As I said earlier, Perry/Mills should offer short term deals. Durant didnt want to commit long term to GS, with a much better squad. He's seen what LeBron has had to go through in a similar situation. They might be on board with a short deal given NY's track record.Hope Perry/Mills go for it. Doesnt work out we get our cap room back in a hurry.

its just not. Its like you havent been laid in 20 years and here comes a movie star with a fashion model and you think its a concession because its not two movie stars.

Irving is a max player. That is his market value. Are we really debating that?

If the movie star and the model run up your CC bill as well, takes 5 years to pay it off. The model is in rehab most of the time, and the movie star bails because its affecting her career. Maybe its better if one sets their sights a little lower, so to speak.

If Irving stays healthy, absolutely a max player. Problem is he doesnt stay healthy for very long.

and if you say something we can start having a conversation. Is Kyrie a max player? Are you gonna sit down with Kawhi and tell him he's a max player... IF he stays healthy? Can we only pick Zion IF he stays healthy? Otherwise its wise to take Ja I think.

I mean cmon... you saying you skip on KD because Kyrie doesnt deserve max? I am really curious here

His last 4 playoff runs, Irving has missed or failed to finish in half of them. He is a PG who relies on his burst to dominate. Giving a player like Kyrie a max deal, with all the knee surgeries, wear and tear, is very risky. Foolish to ignore the risk of handing out long term contracts to PGs with bad knees. Besides,teams dont normally win a ring when the PG has a max contract. Team gets spread too thin.

Haven't even gone into chemistry problems across 2 teams. You make it sound like Kyrie and Durant would be entering some kind of commitment not to bail if things dont work out. Durant? Of course he would.

Just because a player is skilled enough to be offered a max deal, doesnt necessarily mean that player is a good fit everywhere.

So no KD an no Kyrie for you. Too risky. Got it.

Myself I am great with signing them. We need elite talent. KD and Kyrie represent that and the best chance to win an actual title. If I have a chance to add KD/Kyrie for no cost but cap space that is a generational FA opportunity and you do that. No questions asked.

+ 1000

We would need some more quality veterans.(with playoff experience), at fire sale prices. Not sure we would make it out of the East, depending on how free agency plays out. Not without a deeper bench. That would mean flushing the youth movement as well. Doubt Durant/Irving want to wait on them to figure it out.

lots of assumptions there. The roster is not as bare as one would think. There are a few things to also consider, starting with the influx of veteran FAs who will love to play at MSG late in their career in meaningful games.

Jordan seems like a great fit. Tyson Chandler also comes to mind. If KD/Kyrie come and god forbid we draft a blue chip player the NY KNicks will be a real draw.

Not talking about their skill level, its their lack of playoff experience. Guessing Irving/Durant would want more vets who have been there. For Irving and Durant to get us a ring, we would need one more elite player IMO. Our own "Big 3".

Would Durant/Irving structure their contracts to make it easier? (Allanfan? ) Dont know. Might depend on the FA.

If we are going for broke, want to see a team built that can do more than make a respectable run.

I wouldn't count on more than a couple of good playoff runs from Durant and Irving, as a tandem. My guess before injuries start to assert themselves more. One or both of them. If we could get that third star, Id be more enthusiastic about our chances.

well we have a top 5 pick. We have some prospect on the actual roster. I think if you add 2 of the top 10 players in the league you are getting more than a couple good playoff runs as your guess indicates. My guess is a finals, a couple conference finals and a 2nd round exit while the guys figure things out or someone is hurt.

The Dallas picks are a real coupe as they allow us to attach assets to a get a player in a fire sale without killing our own future.

When asked to be primary scorers and defend NBA stars guys like Trier, Knox, Dotson, Frank have had moments but not been ready. Asking them to be role players and I think they look very different. Dotson/Trier will look great at SG when Irving is the PG and Durant is on the floor. People have forgotten how talent improves everything. Last time we saw this was with Melo

Wouldn't count on all our young players becoming defensive stoppers that fast. This would still be a young team. If Irving or Durant start missing games, having another elite player would go a long way towards keeping things going. Thats how you get past just a couple of good seasons. An insurance policy. Thats how most championships have been won lately. None of them maxed out a PG.

? GS and Cleveland have won the last 4.... with maxed out PGs in Curry and Kyrie in 3 of those and Curry will most likely add another this year. Realistically Houston has 2 maxed out PGs. Maybe I don't understand what this is

I am not sure either. A 3rd star WOULD be nice. So would a 4th and a 5th. Are didnt win 20 games and we are talking about ideal pathways to a title.

The idea is a sustainable model. We have two elite players, hopefully Mitch is our Ben Wallace and a legit DPOY. Those are your 3 stars. Hopefully we can draft one this year. Hopefully we can use the 7 picks over the next 5 years to get one either from drafting or a trade. Regardless this is a the position to be in. Young roster, 2 established all NBA guys in their prime and all your future assets.

GustavBahler
Posts: 35376
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186

4/10/2019  12:24 PM
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Uptown wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:Durant has been grumpy for years with media. Nothing new.
Bucher has a good angle. Not sure how accurate it is but he presnts a good opinion.
My take is Durant can handle it because he’ll handle expectations an understands the media even if annoying.
Bucher does mention Knicks but not NYC and were you choose to live is as important as where you work. Nets are also viable if NYC is desirable. they have the money, have more in place talent and a GM/coach tandem in place a bit more seasoned together.
It’s hard to ever say “Winning is not important” but how you get there might be.
Nalod wont project any more because time will tell ths story, not my predictions.

To me it depends on how Durant wants to play a part in building the team. If he makes Kyrie a condition of his signing, I would hope Perry/Mills take a step back. If they were to sign two year deals, like Durant/LeBron have both done in the past, that would give both sides more flexibility.
Maxing out Irving and all the risks that go with it (injury and chemistry wise) is a huge concession.

Would they get us a ring? Would be willing to bet on short term deals on Durant/Irving but not all those years. Especially if we draft Zion. Wouldn't want his team hamstrung with cap space used up by a player who cant stay healthy. Or we draft a PG to go along with DSjr. Durant could call next season a tryout between Morant and DSJr.

For all we know Durant hasn't made playing with Irving a priority. Besides, Kyrie might go through a long playoff slog in Boston, and start to bond with the team, which he hasn't seemed to do to this point. Anything can happen. Just dont want Perry/Mills to give away the store.for a very brief run.

ahhh... no its not because Kyrie is a max player. Its not really up for debate is it? I would certainly prefer Kawhi but Kyrie has the best handle in the game and shoots 40% from 3. I mean as a 1B next to KD as a 1A you really dont get much better than that. Huge concession? One might question the merits of maxing out only Kyrie, but along side KD? That is not a concession man

Dont you ahhh me! ha. The best ability is availability. How available will Kyrie be in the coming years? That is a legit question for a franchise that has been snakebit with expensive and frequently injured players.

there is no scenario that that has KD/KI singing here for FA that involves any concessions. He's 100% a max player. He's missed time but has not suffered any kind of career threatening injury. Durant has also missed time. Cant really factor for that. Kyrie isnt my favorite FA but you dont get to pick and choose, especially if that is the guy KD wants. I suspect (and hope) that KD drives who else comes and lets face it, any combo works. IF its get him a robin and that's Kyrie great. Kyrie has a lot to prove and I think if you get him this is the best time. 27-31 and go from there.

How do you feel about this next year:
Kyrie/Dotson/Zion/KD/Mitch
bench: DSJ, Frank, Trier, Knox

Handing out a max deal to another player because an FA wants him here is a big concession. Especially when that player has missed as many games as Irving has. He's had a rep for being injury prone going back to Duke. He's earned it. Would be concerned with Irving's injury issues, and his relationship with NY media. Both Durant and Irving are thin skinned in that dept. One would be enough.

As I said earlier, Perry/Mills should offer short term deals. Durant didnt want to commit long term to GS, with a much better squad. He's seen what LeBron has had to go through in a similar situation. They might be on board with a short deal given NY's track record.Hope Perry/Mills go for it. Doesnt work out we get our cap room back in a hurry.

its just not. Its like you havent been laid in 20 years and here comes a movie star with a fashion model and you think its a concession because its not two movie stars.

Irving is a max player. That is his market value. Are we really debating that?

If the movie star and the model run up your CC bill as well, takes 5 years to pay it off. The model is in rehab most of the time, and the movie star bails because its affecting her career. Maybe its better if one sets their sights a little lower, so to speak.

If Irving stays healthy, absolutely a max player. Problem is he doesnt stay healthy for very long.

and if you say something we can start having a conversation. Is Kyrie a max player? Are you gonna sit down with Kawhi and tell him he's a max player... IF he stays healthy? Can we only pick Zion IF he stays healthy? Otherwise its wise to take Ja I think.

I mean cmon... you saying you skip on KD because Kyrie doesnt deserve max? I am really curious here

His last 4 playoff runs, Irving has missed or failed to finish in half of them. He is a PG who relies on his burst to dominate. Giving a player like Kyrie a max deal, with all the knee surgeries, wear and tear, is very risky. Foolish to ignore the risk of handing out long term contracts to PGs with bad knees. Besides,teams dont normally win a ring when the PG has a max contract. Team gets spread too thin.

Haven't even gone into chemistry problems across 2 teams. You make it sound like Kyrie and Durant would be entering some kind of commitment not to bail if things dont work out. Durant? Of course he would.

Just because a player is skilled enough to be offered a max deal, doesnt necessarily mean that player is a good fit everywhere.

So no KD an no Kyrie for you. Too risky. Got it.

Myself I am great with signing them. We need elite talent. KD and Kyrie represent that and the best chance to win an actual title. If I have a chance to add KD/Kyrie for no cost but cap space that is a generational FA opportunity and you do that. No questions asked.

+ 1000

We would need some more quality veterans.(with playoff experience), at fire sale prices. Not sure we would make it out of the East, depending on how free agency plays out. Not without a deeper bench. That would mean flushing the youth movement as well. Doubt Durant/Irving want to wait on them to figure it out.

lots of assumptions there. The roster is not as bare as one would think. There are a few things to also consider, starting with the influx of veteran FAs who will love to play at MSG late in their career in meaningful games.

Jordan seems like a great fit. Tyson Chandler also comes to mind. If KD/Kyrie come and god forbid we draft a blue chip player the NY KNicks will be a real draw.

Not talking about their skill level, its their lack of playoff experience. Guessing Irving/Durant would want more vets who have been there. For Irving and Durant to get us a ring, we would need one more elite player IMO. Our own "Big 3".

Would Durant/Irving structure their contracts to make it easier? (Allanfan? ) Dont know. Might depend on the FA.

If we are going for broke, want to see a team built that can do more than make a respectable run.

I wouldn't count on more than a couple of good playoff runs from Durant and Irving, as a tandem. My guess before injuries start to assert themselves more. One or both of them. If we could get that third star, Id be more enthusiastic about our chances.

well we have a top 5 pick. We have some prospect on the actual roster. I think if you add 2 of the top 10 players in the league you are getting more than a couple good playoff runs as your guess indicates. My guess is a finals, a couple conference finals and a 2nd round exit while the guys figure things out or someone is hurt.

The Dallas picks are a real coupe as they allow us to attach assets to a get a player in a fire sale without killing our own future.

When asked to be primary scorers and defend NBA stars guys like Trier, Knox, Dotson, Frank have had moments but not been ready. Asking them to be role players and I think they look very different. Dotson/Trier will look great at SG when Irving is the PG and Durant is on the floor. People have forgotten how talent improves everything. Last time we saw this was with Melo

Wouldn't count on all our young players becoming defensive stoppers that fast. This would still be a young team. If Irving or Durant start missing games, having another elite player would go a long way towards keeping things going. Thats how you get past just a couple of good seasons. An insurance policy. Thats how most championships have been won lately. None of them maxed out a PG.

? GS and Cleveland have won the last 4.... with maxed out PGs in Curry and Kyrie in 3 of those and Curry will most likely add another this year. Realistically Houston has 2 maxed out PGs. Maybe I don't understand what this is

My bad, misstated some info from an article a while back. Easier if I post it. My point remains about spending too much of the cap on a PG. Yes, one of the exceptions was Irving, and LeBron playing a lot of PG. Why I would be for a LeBron/Kyrie reunion in NY. Lets Kyrie play off the ball. James is one of the best PGs of all time.


https://www.theringer.com/platform/amp/2016/9/22/16077298/2017-nba-draft-point-guards-markelle-fultz-dennis-smith-jr-ef66c2bf3653

The influx of distributors is notable considering one understated reality of the market: the cost of starting point guards. The league’s last 25 champions had starting point guards with an average salary accounting for only 11.3 percent of that year’s cap. That’s the equivalent of $10.6 million (or, nearly, Austin Rivers’s 2016–17 salary) under this season’s enormous $94.1 million salary cap. Only two of the championship point guards have accounted for slightly over 20 percent of a cap (Tony Parker in 2014 and Irving in 2016), and only Parker was the highest-paid player on his team. Instead of splurging on star free-agent point guards, general managers of Finals winners have typically leaned on young 1s (Rajon Rondo, B.J. Armstrong, early-’00s Parker) or PGs on inexpensive deals (Derek Fisher, Mario Chalmers, Avery Johnson), paying the spared funds to stars at different positions and key role players.
fishmike
Posts: 49000
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USA
4/10/2019  12:31 PM
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Uptown wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:Durant has been grumpy for years with media. Nothing new.
Bucher has a good angle. Not sure how accurate it is but he presnts a good opinion.
My take is Durant can handle it because he’ll handle expectations an understands the media even if annoying.
Bucher does mention Knicks but not NYC and were you choose to live is as important as where you work. Nets are also viable if NYC is desirable. they have the money, have more in place talent and a GM/coach tandem in place a bit more seasoned together.
It’s hard to ever say “Winning is not important” but how you get there might be.
Nalod wont project any more because time will tell ths story, not my predictions.

To me it depends on how Durant wants to play a part in building the team. If he makes Kyrie a condition of his signing, I would hope Perry/Mills take a step back. If they were to sign two year deals, like Durant/LeBron have both done in the past, that would give both sides more flexibility.
Maxing out Irving and all the risks that go with it (injury and chemistry wise) is a huge concession.

Would they get us a ring? Would be willing to bet on short term deals on Durant/Irving but not all those years. Especially if we draft Zion. Wouldn't want his team hamstrung with cap space used up by a player who cant stay healthy. Or we draft a PG to go along with DSjr. Durant could call next season a tryout between Morant and DSJr.

For all we know Durant hasn't made playing with Irving a priority. Besides, Kyrie might go through a long playoff slog in Boston, and start to bond with the team, which he hasn't seemed to do to this point. Anything can happen. Just dont want Perry/Mills to give away the store.for a very brief run.

ahhh... no its not because Kyrie is a max player. Its not really up for debate is it? I would certainly prefer Kawhi but Kyrie has the best handle in the game and shoots 40% from 3. I mean as a 1B next to KD as a 1A you really dont get much better than that. Huge concession? One might question the merits of maxing out only Kyrie, but along side KD? That is not a concession man

Dont you ahhh me! ha. The best ability is availability. How available will Kyrie be in the coming years? That is a legit question for a franchise that has been snakebit with expensive and frequently injured players.

there is no scenario that that has KD/KI singing here for FA that involves any concessions. He's 100% a max player. He's missed time but has not suffered any kind of career threatening injury. Durant has also missed time. Cant really factor for that. Kyrie isnt my favorite FA but you dont get to pick and choose, especially if that is the guy KD wants. I suspect (and hope) that KD drives who else comes and lets face it, any combo works. IF its get him a robin and that's Kyrie great. Kyrie has a lot to prove and I think if you get him this is the best time. 27-31 and go from there.

How do you feel about this next year:
Kyrie/Dotson/Zion/KD/Mitch
bench: DSJ, Frank, Trier, Knox

Handing out a max deal to another player because an FA wants him here is a big concession. Especially when that player has missed as many games as Irving has. He's had a rep for being injury prone going back to Duke. He's earned it. Would be concerned with Irving's injury issues, and his relationship with NY media. Both Durant and Irving are thin skinned in that dept. One would be enough.

As I said earlier, Perry/Mills should offer short term deals. Durant didnt want to commit long term to GS, with a much better squad. He's seen what LeBron has had to go through in a similar situation. They might be on board with a short deal given NY's track record.Hope Perry/Mills go for it. Doesnt work out we get our cap room back in a hurry.

its just not. Its like you havent been laid in 20 years and here comes a movie star with a fashion model and you think its a concession because its not two movie stars.

Irving is a max player. That is his market value. Are we really debating that?

If the movie star and the model run up your CC bill as well, takes 5 years to pay it off. The model is in rehab most of the time, and the movie star bails because its affecting her career. Maybe its better if one sets their sights a little lower, so to speak.

If Irving stays healthy, absolutely a max player. Problem is he doesnt stay healthy for very long.

and if you say something we can start having a conversation. Is Kyrie a max player? Are you gonna sit down with Kawhi and tell him he's a max player... IF he stays healthy? Can we only pick Zion IF he stays healthy? Otherwise its wise to take Ja I think.

I mean cmon... you saying you skip on KD because Kyrie doesnt deserve max? I am really curious here

His last 4 playoff runs, Irving has missed or failed to finish in half of them. He is a PG who relies on his burst to dominate. Giving a player like Kyrie a max deal, with all the knee surgeries, wear and tear, is very risky. Foolish to ignore the risk of handing out long term contracts to PGs with bad knees. Besides,teams dont normally win a ring when the PG has a max contract. Team gets spread too thin.

Haven't even gone into chemistry problems across 2 teams. You make it sound like Kyrie and Durant would be entering some kind of commitment not to bail if things dont work out. Durant? Of course he would.

Just because a player is skilled enough to be offered a max deal, doesnt necessarily mean that player is a good fit everywhere.

So no KD an no Kyrie for you. Too risky. Got it.

Myself I am great with signing them. We need elite talent. KD and Kyrie represent that and the best chance to win an actual title. If I have a chance to add KD/Kyrie for no cost but cap space that is a generational FA opportunity and you do that. No questions asked.

+ 1000

We would need some more quality veterans.(with playoff experience), at fire sale prices. Not sure we would make it out of the East, depending on how free agency plays out. Not without a deeper bench. That would mean flushing the youth movement as well. Doubt Durant/Irving want to wait on them to figure it out.

lots of assumptions there. The roster is not as bare as one would think. There are a few things to also consider, starting with the influx of veteran FAs who will love to play at MSG late in their career in meaningful games.

Jordan seems like a great fit. Tyson Chandler also comes to mind. If KD/Kyrie come and god forbid we draft a blue chip player the NY KNicks will be a real draw.

Not talking about their skill level, its their lack of playoff experience. Guessing Irving/Durant would want more vets who have been there. For Irving and Durant to get us a ring, we would need one more elite player IMO. Our own "Big 3".

Would Durant/Irving structure their contracts to make it easier? (Allanfan? ) Dont know. Might depend on the FA.

If we are going for broke, want to see a team built that can do more than make a respectable run.

I wouldn't count on more than a couple of good playoff runs from Durant and Irving, as a tandem. My guess before injuries start to assert themselves more. One or both of them. If we could get that third star, Id be more enthusiastic about our chances.

well we have a top 5 pick. We have some prospect on the actual roster. I think if you add 2 of the top 10 players in the league you are getting more than a couple good playoff runs as your guess indicates. My guess is a finals, a couple conference finals and a 2nd round exit while the guys figure things out or someone is hurt.

The Dallas picks are a real coupe as they allow us to attach assets to a get a player in a fire sale without killing our own future.

When asked to be primary scorers and defend NBA stars guys like Trier, Knox, Dotson, Frank have had moments but not been ready. Asking them to be role players and I think they look very different. Dotson/Trier will look great at SG when Irving is the PG and Durant is on the floor. People have forgotten how talent improves everything. Last time we saw this was with Melo

Wouldn't count on all our young players becoming defensive stoppers that fast. This would still be a young team. If Irving or Durant start missing games, having another elite player would go a long way towards keeping things going. Thats how you get past just a couple of good seasons. An insurance policy. Thats how most championships have been won lately. None of them maxed out a PG.

? GS and Cleveland have won the last 4.... with maxed out PGs in Curry and Kyrie in 3 of those and Curry will most likely add another this year. Realistically Houston has 2 maxed out PGs. Maybe I don't understand what this is

My bad, misstated some info from an article a while back. Easier if I post it. My point remains about spending too much of the cap on a PG. Yes, one of the exceptions was Irving, and LeBron playing a lot of PG. Why I would be for a LeBron/Kyrie reunion in NY. Lets Kyrie play off the ball. James is one of the best PGs of all time.


https://www.theringer.com/platform/amp/2016/9/22/16077298/2017-nba-draft-point-guards-markelle-fultz-dennis-smith-jr-ef66c2bf3653

The influx of distributors is notable considering one understated reality of the market: the cost of starting point guards. The league’s last 25 champions had starting point guards with an average salary accounting for only 11.3 percent of that year’s cap. That’s the equivalent of $10.6 million (or, nearly, Austin Rivers’s 2016–17 salary) under this season’s enormous $94.1 million salary cap. Only two of the championship point guards have accounted for slightly over 20 percent of a cap (Tony Parker in 2014 and Irving in 2016), and only Parker was the highest-paid player on his team. Instead of splurging on star free-agent point guards, general managers of Finals winners have typically leaned on young 1s (Rajon Rondo, B.J. Armstrong, early-’00s Parker) or PGs on inexpensive deals (Derek Fisher, Mario Chalmers, Avery Johnson), paying the spared funds to stars at different positions and key role players.
thats fantasy land. Lebron isnt available. There is really no way to quantify not giving Irving the max, unless he was the only guy. Even they you probably add him for value but as a 2nd guy? Pa-lease. Puts us immediately in the 45-50 win zone or more. Things are easier to decide when the wins start coming.
GustavBahler
Posts: 35376
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4/10/2019  12:55 PM
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Uptown wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:Durant has been grumpy for years with media. Nothing new.
Bucher has a good angle. Not sure how accurate it is but he presnts a good opinion.
My take is Durant can handle it because he’ll handle expectations an understands the media even if annoying.
Bucher does mention Knicks but not NYC and were you choose to live is as important as where you work. Nets are also viable if NYC is desirable. they have the money, have more in place talent and a GM/coach tandem in place a bit more seasoned together.
It’s hard to ever say “Winning is not important” but how you get there might be.
Nalod wont project any more because time will tell ths story, not my predictions.

To me it depends on how Durant wants to play a part in building the team. If he makes Kyrie a condition of his signing, I would hope Perry/Mills take a step back. If they were to sign two year deals, like Durant/LeBron have both done in the past, that would give both sides more flexibility.
Maxing out Irving and all the risks that go with it (injury and chemistry wise) is a huge concession.

Would they get us a ring? Would be willing to bet on short term deals on Durant/Irving but not all those years. Especially if we draft Zion. Wouldn't want his team hamstrung with cap space used up by a player who cant stay healthy. Or we draft a PG to go along with DSjr. Durant could call next season a tryout between Morant and DSJr.

For all we know Durant hasn't made playing with Irving a priority. Besides, Kyrie might go through a long playoff slog in Boston, and start to bond with the team, which he hasn't seemed to do to this point. Anything can happen. Just dont want Perry/Mills to give away the store.for a very brief run.

ahhh... no its not because Kyrie is a max player. Its not really up for debate is it? I would certainly prefer Kawhi but Kyrie has the best handle in the game and shoots 40% from 3. I mean as a 1B next to KD as a 1A you really dont get much better than that. Huge concession? One might question the merits of maxing out only Kyrie, but along side KD? That is not a concession man

Dont you ahhh me! ha. The best ability is availability. How available will Kyrie be in the coming years? That is a legit question for a franchise that has been snakebit with expensive and frequently injured players.

there is no scenario that that has KD/KI singing here for FA that involves any concessions. He's 100% a max player. He's missed time but has not suffered any kind of career threatening injury. Durant has also missed time. Cant really factor for that. Kyrie isnt my favorite FA but you dont get to pick and choose, especially if that is the guy KD wants. I suspect (and hope) that KD drives who else comes and lets face it, any combo works. IF its get him a robin and that's Kyrie great. Kyrie has a lot to prove and I think if you get him this is the best time. 27-31 and go from there.

How do you feel about this next year:
Kyrie/Dotson/Zion/KD/Mitch
bench: DSJ, Frank, Trier, Knox

Handing out a max deal to another player because an FA wants him here is a big concession. Especially when that player has missed as many games as Irving has. He's had a rep for being injury prone going back to Duke. He's earned it. Would be concerned with Irving's injury issues, and his relationship with NY media. Both Durant and Irving are thin skinned in that dept. One would be enough.

As I said earlier, Perry/Mills should offer short term deals. Durant didnt want to commit long term to GS, with a much better squad. He's seen what LeBron has had to go through in a similar situation. They might be on board with a short deal given NY's track record.Hope Perry/Mills go for it. Doesnt work out we get our cap room back in a hurry.

its just not. Its like you havent been laid in 20 years and here comes a movie star with a fashion model and you think its a concession because its not two movie stars.

Irving is a max player. That is his market value. Are we really debating that?

If the movie star and the model run up your CC bill as well, takes 5 years to pay it off. The model is in rehab most of the time, and the movie star bails because its affecting her career. Maybe its better if one sets their sights a little lower, so to speak.

If Irving stays healthy, absolutely a max player. Problem is he doesnt stay healthy for very long.

and if you say something we can start having a conversation. Is Kyrie a max player? Are you gonna sit down with Kawhi and tell him he's a max player... IF he stays healthy? Can we only pick Zion IF he stays healthy? Otherwise its wise to take Ja I think.

I mean cmon... you saying you skip on KD because Kyrie doesnt deserve max? I am really curious here

His last 4 playoff runs, Irving has missed or failed to finish in half of them. He is a PG who relies on his burst to dominate. Giving a player like Kyrie a max deal, with all the knee surgeries, wear and tear, is very risky. Foolish to ignore the risk of handing out long term contracts to PGs with bad knees. Besides,teams dont normally win a ring when the PG has a max contract. Team gets spread too thin.

Haven't even gone into chemistry problems across 2 teams. You make it sound like Kyrie and Durant would be entering some kind of commitment not to bail if things dont work out. Durant? Of course he would.

Just because a player is skilled enough to be offered a max deal, doesnt necessarily mean that player is a good fit everywhere.

So no KD an no Kyrie for you. Too risky. Got it.

Myself I am great with signing them. We need elite talent. KD and Kyrie represent that and the best chance to win an actual title. If I have a chance to add KD/Kyrie for no cost but cap space that is a generational FA opportunity and you do that. No questions asked.

+ 1000

We would need some more quality veterans.(with playoff experience), at fire sale prices. Not sure we would make it out of the East, depending on how free agency plays out. Not without a deeper bench. That would mean flushing the youth movement as well. Doubt Durant/Irving want to wait on them to figure it out.

lots of assumptions there. The roster is not as bare as one would think. There are a few things to also consider, starting with the influx of veteran FAs who will love to play at MSG late in their career in meaningful games.

Jordan seems like a great fit. Tyson Chandler also comes to mind. If KD/Kyrie come and god forbid we draft a blue chip player the NY KNicks will be a real draw.

Not talking about their skill level, its their lack of playoff experience. Guessing Irving/Durant would want more vets who have been there. For Irving and Durant to get us a ring, we would need one more elite player IMO. Our own "Big 3".

Would Durant/Irving structure their contracts to make it easier? (Allanfan? ) Dont know. Might depend on the FA.

If we are going for broke, want to see a team built that can do more than make a respectable run.

I wouldn't count on more than a couple of good playoff runs from Durant and Irving, as a tandem. My guess before injuries start to assert themselves more. One or both of them. If we could get that third star, Id be more enthusiastic about our chances.

well we have a top 5 pick. We have some prospect on the actual roster. I think if you add 2 of the top 10 players in the league you are getting more than a couple good playoff runs as your guess indicates. My guess is a finals, a couple conference finals and a 2nd round exit while the guys figure things out or someone is hurt.

The Dallas picks are a real coupe as they allow us to attach assets to a get a player in a fire sale without killing our own future.

When asked to be primary scorers and defend NBA stars guys like Trier, Knox, Dotson, Frank have had moments but not been ready. Asking them to be role players and I think they look very different. Dotson/Trier will look great at SG when Irving is the PG and Durant is on the floor. People have forgotten how talent improves everything. Last time we saw this was with Melo

Wouldn't count on all our young players becoming defensive stoppers that fast. This would still be a young team. If Irving or Durant start missing games, having another elite player would go a long way towards keeping things going. Thats how you get past just a couple of good seasons. An insurance policy. Thats how most championships have been won lately. None of them maxed out a PG.

? GS and Cleveland have won the last 4.... with maxed out PGs in Curry and Kyrie in 3 of those and Curry will most likely add another this year. Realistically Houston has 2 maxed out PGs. Maybe I don't understand what this is

My bad, misstated some info from an article a while back. Easier if I post it. My point remains about spending too much of the cap on a PG. Yes, one of the exceptions was Irving, and LeBron playing a lot of PG. Why I would be for a LeBron/Kyrie reunion in NY. Lets Kyrie play off the ball. James is one of the best PGs of all time.


https://www.theringer.com/platform/amp/2016/9/22/16077298/2017-nba-draft-point-guards-markelle-fultz-dennis-smith-jr-ef66c2bf3653

The influx of distributors is notable considering one understated reality of the market: the cost of starting point guards. The league’s last 25 champions had starting point guards with an average salary accounting for only 11.3 percent of that year’s cap. That’s the equivalent of $10.6 million (or, nearly, Austin Rivers’s 2016–17 salary) under this season’s enormous $94.1 million salary cap. Only two of the championship point guards have accounted for slightly over 20 percent of a cap (Tony Parker in 2014 and Irving in 2016), and only Parker was the highest-paid player on his team. Instead of splurging on star free-agent point guards, general managers of Finals winners have typically leaned on young 1s (Rajon Rondo, B.J. Armstrong, early-’00s Parker) or PGs on inexpensive deals (Derek Fisher, Mario Chalmers, Avery Johnson), paying the spared funds to stars at different positions and key role players.
thats fantasy land. Lebron isnt available. There is really no way to quantify not giving Irving the max, unless he was the only guy. Even they you probably add him for value but as a 2nd guy? Pa-lease. Puts us immediately in the 45-50 win zone or more. Things are easier to decide when the wins start coming.

"Pa-lease"? Pshaw.. Had that coming, making me go old school now.They said Jared Jefferies coming back to the Knicks was fantasyland..Not saying Lebron will be available for sure.Depends on how mgmt responds to LeBron's demands. And the draft.

Anyway, my point is that overpaying a PG has been historically a bad idea. The outliers having maybe the GOAT on one team, and maybe the GOAT coach on another one. Would rather improve our odds.

HappinessJones
Posts: 20001
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Joined: 4/10/2019
Member: #8748

4/10/2019  1:06 PM
GustavBahler wrote:To me it depends on how Durant wants to play a part in building the team. If he makes Kyrie a condition of his signing, I would hope Perry/Mills take a step back. If they were to sign two year deals, like Durant/LeBron have both done in the past, that would give both sides more flexibility.
Maxing out Irving and all the risks that go with it (injury and chemistry wise) is a huge concession.

You're posing this as a negotiation and its not. Not really. To have a negotiation you have to be willing to walk away. YOU might be willing to do so, but I don't think any NBA executive would.

You're talking about a scenario where KD & Kyrie want to be here together. For us to say "sorry, pass" would immediately rocket to #1 on the list of giant GM fails. Add to that the fact that said GM would be signing us up for an extended rebuild during which he'd be hearing every single day that we passed on franchise players for more losing seasons. It's career suicide. Even if it pans out three years down the road, the current management team won't be around, and the speculation of what could have been will never end.

If they want to come here together, there is zero chance we say pass.

Since they have many many choices and damn well know the Knicks aren't going to pass, we might as well just ask them what they want. KD is craving respect. Fine. Start by just asking him what he and Kyrie want. If its two years, then that's what it is. To put on the pretense we have some kind of leverage is a mistake. You don't want to start a relationship by posturing and then folding. You never get that credibility back.

I'd rather have four years with that duo, this young core, and six picks over those four years.

Nalod
Posts: 57129
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USA
4/10/2019  1:21 PM
We won't be on the presentation. Durants agent has enough forsight to pave the interest for both sides.
As fans we tend to not value our players properly. Time and space also matters. What is Knox value in another year. Not Tatum like, but this kid might start to show enough to warrant a premium in return to a team rebuilding. What would Griffith look like if Detroit reboots? Not next year, the year after.
Durant and Kyrie likely would know and understand contention won't happen over night. What if DSjr with a year of Kyrie really starts to look good off the bench. Teams will want that. Frank if not traded can do what he does but now avg. 12pts a game.
And what if our pick this year is better than another year of knicks1248 droning on and on.
Knox has developed nice. He could be a great player or a great trading asset.
Maybe.
You or I don't have to see it, but Durants and Kyries people do.
Where the team is and where it can go are not the same. The past is not even relevant.
You don't show a fool a job half done!
knicks1248
Posts: 38523
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Joined: 2/3/2004
Member: #582
4/10/2019  1:41 PM
Nalod wrote:We won't be on the presentation. Durants agent has enough forsight to pave the interest for both sides.
As fans we tend to not value our players properly. Time and space also matters. What is Knox value in another year. Not Tatum like, but this kid might start to show enough to warrant a premium in return to a team rebuilding. What would Griffith look like if Detroit reboots? Not next year, the year after.
Durant and Kyrie likely would know and understand contention won't happen over night. What if DSjr with a year of Kyrie really starts to look good off the bench. Teams will want that. Frank if not traded can do what he does but now avg. 12pts a game.
And what if our pick this year is better than another year of knicks1248 droning on and on.
Knox has developed nice. He could be a great player or a great trading asset.
Maybe.
You or I don't have to see it, but Durants and Kyries people do.
Where the team is and where it can go are not the same. The past is not even relevant.

I seriously doubt the knicks keep frank, knox, and DSJ, one of them will be traded for either cap space, a draft pick or veteran

ES
GustavBahler
Posts: 35376
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186

4/10/2019  1:48 PM    LAST EDITED: 4/10/2019  1:50 PM
Nalod wrote:We won't be on the presentation. Durants agent has enough forsight to pave the interest for both sides.
As fans we tend to not value our players properly. Time and space also matters. What is Knox value in another year. Not Tatum like, but this kid might start to show enough to warrant a premium in return to a team rebuilding. What would Griffith look like if Detroit reboots? Not next year, the year after.
Durant and Kyrie likely would know and understand contention won't happen over night. What if DSjr with a year of Kyrie really starts to look good off the bench. Teams will want that. Frank if not traded can do what he does but now avg. 12pts a game.
And what if our pick this year is better than another year of knicks1248 droning on and on.
Knox has developed nice. He could be a great player or a great trading asset.
Maybe.
You or I don't have to see it, but Durants and Kyries people do.
Where the team is and where it can go are not the same. The past is not even relevant.

We've overvalued our picks as well. Channing Frye aka Tim Duncan. So few of our first round picks have panned out. The ones that did werent here long. Believe we hold the record for futility, in that dept. Forget the actual stat, something about their career numbers.

I see two of the most media sensitive players in the league, in the media capitol of the world. One of them has missed part or all of every other playoff run going into this year's playoffs. Kyrie gets hurt again, the debate will probably be over. Like I said. If we brought them here, would like to see a third star with playoff experience. Make a strong run, right out of the gate. Wade took the hit for Miami, Dirk in Dallas, Timmy in SA. Not unheard of. They were the franchise player, someone would have to play that role here.

Durant getting tired of the media and the Knicks talk

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