knicks1248 wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/tommybeer/status/1092992470328193024

Didn't watch the game, but 11-25 shooting is ugly. I'm missing a lot of context, but was it case where he was the only who could get off and the game dictated he throw up all kinds of crazy shots? Knox, Matthews and Dot also had putrid lines as well, so that very well could've been the case. How did Iso-Zo look next to DSJ?

He was 10-20 until around the 4th.

He is gonna be the featured player go to guy for the rest of the season as expected. Which is great in terms of building his value(just in case things happen).

We will have the rest of the season to evaluate him.

Which included a half court shot with half running out and 3 blocked shots. Weird how the same guys that touted a 5 and 5 game from Frank all of sudden have higher expectations for Smith?

What do you think will happen with frank, he is clearly expendable now.

First it was Burke, then Mudiay, Now DSJ, and their #1 target is Kyrie...

clearly I don't think they see frank as their future PG..

I know the knicks prefer to nab a first rounder if he's traded, but they way we shoot bricks, i would be looking at trying to get some shooters,

I think the Realistic case scenario for Frank, and I could be wrong, is he is comparable to a guy like Bobby Phil's was or more currently comparable to Courtney Lee. A very strong defender at the 1,2,3 spot who offensively plays the 3, who may be able to pop in 12-15 points per game. His upper level talent I think, is maybe Ron Harper, while at worst he is that pain in the ass defender that was on Memphis forever-his name escapes me-or a Bruce Bowen Anthony Roberson type

Yeah, we’d like more efficiency, more free throws, fewer shots, and we should be looking at TS% anyway.

It’s tough to get 25 shots up... this guy has no shortage in confidence. I’d imagine DSJ is at best plan C for starting PG next season (behind Kyrie and Kemba) but for now it makes our backcourt interesting. I guess I’d rather see him controlling the ball than Timmy...

technomaster wrote:For those that think 11/25 is a bad night, let’s put 44% fg% into perspective:
Looking at career fg%:
KP: .437
Donovan Mitchell: .43
Westbrook: .434
Harden: .443

Yeah, we’d like more efficiency, more free throws, fewer shots, and we should be looking at TS% anyway.

It’s tough to get 25 shots up... this guy has no shortage in confidence. I’d imagine DSJ is at best plan C for starting PG next season (behind Kyrie and Kemba) but for now it makes our backcourt interesting. I guess I’d rather see him controlling the ball than Timmy...

Perspective? All those guys except Harden play defense and make an actual impact on that side of the ball. Cherry picking one stat to make a comparison in a vacuum is how analyses go wrong

martin wrote:

technomaster wrote:For those that think 11/25 is a bad night, let’s put 44% fg% into perspective:
Looking at career fg%:
KP: .437
Donovan Mitchell: .43
Westbrook: .434
Harden: .443

Yeah, we’d like more efficiency, more free throws, fewer shots, and we should be looking at TS% anyway.

It’s tough to get 25 shots up... this guy has no shortage in confidence. I’d imagine DSJ is at best plan C for starting PG next season (behind Kyrie and Kemba) but for now it makes our backcourt interesting. I guess I’d rather see him controlling the ball than Timmy...

Why are we looking at FG%? This is the modern day NBA, look at eFG% and then get back to us. Or even TS%?

Disagree. Why do we need to use EFG% or TS% to gauge Smith? First, these measures were created to factor in 3 point shooting.(Something NO ONE is claiming Smith excells at) As it favors 3pt. shooters. Who can actually have a % higher than 100. Secondly, these shooting percentage stat categories are usually headed by PF, C or players that finish around the basket. Who take higher % shots. Take a look at the top 30 in each of these categories. How many PG's do we see on the list? 2 on TS%. 3 of EFG%. One is Curry (Pretty good 3pt. shooter) Two, Dj Augustine (Don't think anyone is pushing for him here) and the last is someone I guess the EEG%/TS% are really hoping we get in the off season. (Irving)

Still don't get the need to prove how bad this kid is with all these "Advanced Stats" same that were trying to convince fans or Franks value?

BigDaddyG wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

martin wrote:

technomaster wrote:For those that think 11/25 is a bad night, let’s put 44% fg% into perspective:
Looking at career fg%:
KP: .437
Donovan Mitchell: .43
Westbrook: .434
Harden: .443

Yeah, we’d like more efficiency, more free throws, fewer shots, and we should be looking at TS% anyway.

It’s tough to get 25 shots up... this guy has no shortage in confidence. I’d imagine DSJ is at best plan C for starting PG next season (behind Kyrie and Kemba) but for now it makes our backcourt interesting. I guess I’d rather see him controlling the ball than Timmy...

Why are we looking at FG%? This is the modern day NBA, look at eFG% and then get back to us. Or even TS%?

Disagree. Why do we need to use EFG% or TS% to gauge Smith? First, these measures were created to factor in 3 point shooting.(Something NO ONE is claiming Smith excells at) As it favors 3pt. shooters. Who can actually have a % higher than 100. Secondly, these shooting percentage stat categories are usually headed by PF, C or players that finish around the basket. Who take higher % shots. Take a look at the top 30 in each of these categories. How many PG's do we see on the list? 2 on TS%. 3 of EFG%. One is Curry (Pretty good 3pt. shooter) Two, Dj Augustine (Don't think anyone is pushing for him here) and the last is someone I guess the EEG%/TS% are really hoping we get in the off season. (Irving)

Still don't get the need to prove how bad this kid is with all these "Advanced Stats" same that were trying to convince fans or Franks value?

11-25 for 25 points is bad for a PG, Center, PF, SF, whatever. I agree that you can look at this stats raw. The flow of the game, teammates, time on the team...those all need to be considered as well. You start to worry if it becomes a trend.

Agree that consistent games in which he goes 11 for 25 games is a bad trend. Which btw included 3 bad shots and had a half court shot with the half ending. So he took 3 bad shots? Not so bad. Point of post was to comment on how some on here are putting this kid under the microscope. Yet seem to excuse other players faults just because they match up to with their preferred style of play. Guess that's fair as everyone should have a style of player they like. But lets not make it seem like that's not what all this is about. The kids is young. Needs to get a consistent shot and has to continue to work on his defense. But he is incredibly quick, has more skill and confidence than most on the team and is not exactly our max salary player. Don't need any stats to see that.

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/knickfilmschool/status/1093709370045669376

HofstraBBall wrote:

martin wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

martin wrote:

technomaster wrote:For those that think 11/25 is a bad night, let’s put 44% fg% into perspective:
Looking at career fg%:
KP: .437
Donovan Mitchell: .43
Westbrook: .434
Harden: .443

Yeah, we’d like more efficiency, more free throws, fewer shots, and we should be looking at TS% anyway.

It’s tough to get 25 shots up... this guy has no shortage in confidence. I’d imagine DSJ is at best plan C for starting PG next season (behind Kyrie and Kemba) but for now it makes our backcourt interesting. I guess I’d rather see him controlling the ball than Timmy...

Why are we looking at FG%? This is the modern day NBA, look at eFG% and then get back to us. Or even TS%?

Disagree. Why do we need to use EFG% or TS% to gauge Smith? First, these measures were created to factor in 3 point shooting.(Something NO ONE is claiming Smith excells at) As it favors 3pt. shooters. Who can actually have a % higher than 100. Secondly, these shooting percentage stat categories are usually headed by PF, C or players that finish around the basket. Who take higher % shots. Take a look at the top 30 in each of these categories. How many PG's do we see on the list? 2 on TS%. 3 of EFG%. One is Curry (Pretty good 3pt. shooter) Two, Dj Augustine (Don't think anyone is pushing for him here) and the last is someone I guess the EEG%/TS% are really hoping we get in the off season. (Irving)

Still don't get the need to prove how bad this kid is with all these "Advanced Stats" same that were trying to convince fans or Franks value?

because otherwise you are comparing apples to oranges. techno just compared career FG% for DJ and the likes of Harden.

If you like that comparison, have at it. The above was not a deep look into DS, you missed the point entirely and brought up something else

Thats fair. Agree with you that comparing his FG% with other positions, best in the league does not speak positively or negatively about his play. Maintaining my point about EFG% in that regard.

In terms of better ways to gauge DSJR or PG's, my point, feel you have to look at more important variables. I have coached PG's that are great spot up shooters but cannot stay in the position due to their inabilty to push tempo, manage turnovers or get into the paint and create shots for others. Some cant take the pressure and complexity of the PG position. For me, if qe are to talk about how well Smith is doing we have to take that into account. Managing a game, turnovers and his ability to ignite an offense is more important than how many clicks better his shot is than others. IMO.

You have a pg that can shoot?! Send them my way, please. We're playing in the HS regional finals tom against our rivals....I could use a knock down shooter

Uptown wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

martin wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

martin wrote:

technomaster wrote:For those that think 11/25 is a bad night, let’s put 44% fg% into perspective:
Looking at career fg%:
KP: .437
Donovan Mitchell: .43
Westbrook: .434
Harden: .443

Yeah, we’d like more efficiency, more free throws, fewer shots, and we should be looking at TS% anyway.

It’s tough to get 25 shots up... this guy has no shortage in confidence. I’d imagine DSJ is at best plan C for starting PG next season (behind Kyrie and Kemba) but for now it makes our backcourt interesting. I guess I’d rather see him controlling the ball than Timmy...

Why are we looking at FG%? This is the modern day NBA, look at eFG% and then get back to us. Or even TS%?

Disagree. Why do we need to use EFG% or TS% to gauge Smith? First, these measures were created to factor in 3 point shooting.(Something NO ONE is claiming Smith excells at) As it favors 3pt. shooters. Who can actually have a % higher than 100. Secondly, these shooting percentage stat categories are usually headed by PF, C or players that finish around the basket. Who take higher % shots. Take a look at the top 30 in each of these categories. How many PG's do we see on the list? 2 on TS%. 3 of EFG%. One is Curry (Pretty good 3pt. shooter) Two, Dj Augustine (Don't think anyone is pushing for him here) and the last is someone I guess the EEG%/TS% are really hoping we get in the off season. (Irving)

Still don't get the need to prove how bad this kid is with all these "Advanced Stats" same that were trying to convince fans or Franks value?

because otherwise you are comparing apples to oranges. techno just compared career FG% for DJ and the likes of Harden.

If you like that comparison, have at it. The above was not a deep look into DS, you missed the point entirely and brought up something else

Thats fair. Agree with you that comparing his FG% with other positions, best in the league does not speak positively or negatively about his play. Maintaining my point about EFG% in that regard.

In terms of better ways to gauge DSJR or PG's, my point, feel you have to look at more important variables. I have coached PG's that are great spot up shooters but cannot stay in the position due to their inabilty to push tempo, manage turnovers or get into the paint and create shots for others. Some cant take the pressure and complexity of the PG position. For me, if qe are to talk about how well Smith is doing we have to take that into account. Managing a game, turnovers and his ability to ignite an offense is more important than how many clicks better his shot is than others. IMO.

You have a pg that can shoot?! Send them my way, please. We're playing in the HS regional finals tom against our rivals....I could use a knock down shooter

Think he may be too old for high school. Lol

Thats awesome! Lots of luck to you and your team.

HofstraBBall wrote:

Uptown wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

martin wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

martin wrote:

technomaster wrote:For those that think 11/25 is a bad night, let’s put 44% fg% into perspective:
Looking at career fg%:
KP: .437
Donovan Mitchell: .43
Westbrook: .434
Harden: .443

Yeah, we’d like more efficiency, more free throws, fewer shots, and we should be looking at TS% anyway.

It’s tough to get 25 shots up... this guy has no shortage in confidence. I’d imagine DSJ is at best plan C for starting PG next season (behind Kyrie and Kemba) but for now it makes our backcourt interesting. I guess I’d rather see him controlling the ball than Timmy...

Why are we looking at FG%? This is the modern day NBA, look at eFG% and then get back to us. Or even TS%?

Disagree. Why do we need to use EFG% or TS% to gauge Smith? First, these measures were created to factor in 3 point shooting.(Something NO ONE is claiming Smith excells at) As it favors 3pt. shooters. Who can actually have a % higher than 100. Secondly, these shooting percentage stat categories are usually headed by PF, C or players that finish around the basket. Who take higher % shots. Take a look at the top 30 in each of these categories. How many PG's do we see on the list? 2 on TS%. 3 of EFG%. One is Curry (Pretty good 3pt. shooter) Two, Dj Augustine (Don't think anyone is pushing for him here) and the last is someone I guess the EEG%/TS% are really hoping we get in the off season. (Irving)

Still don't get the need to prove how bad this kid is with all these "Advanced Stats" same that were trying to convince fans or Franks value?

because otherwise you are comparing apples to oranges. techno just compared career FG% for DJ and the likes of Harden.

If you like that comparison, have at it. The above was not a deep look into DS, you missed the point entirely and brought up something else

Thats fair. Agree with you that comparing his FG% with other positions, best in the league does not speak positively or negatively about his play. Maintaining my point about EFG% in that regard.

In terms of better ways to gauge DSJR or PG's, my point, feel you have to look at more important variables. I have coached PG's that are great spot up shooters but cannot stay in the position due to their inabilty to push tempo, manage turnovers or get into the paint and create shots for others. Some cant take the pressure and complexity of the PG position. For me, if qe are to talk about how well Smith is doing we have to take that into account. Managing a game, turnovers and his ability to ignite an offense is more important than how many clicks better his shot is than others. IMO.

You have a pg that can shoot?! Send them my way, please. We're playing in the HS regional finals tom against our rivals....I could use a knock down shooter

Think he may be too old for high school. Lol

Thats awesome! Lots of luck to you and your team.

Thanks

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/tommybeer/status/1094067627721404416

31 points on 15 shots. Now we can criticize his poor ft shooting (11/19!) as costing us the game. Not that we wanted to win.

After seeing Trier’s skills at putting the ball in the hoop, it seems as if DSJ can do that too. DSJ looks like legit lottery talent.