jrodmc wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Vmart wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:Was anyone saying they didn't? Perry did a great job picking up Phils fumble.

It wasn’t a fumble it was “the holy roller”. Phil knew that the only way to get Melo to shuffle his feet with the no trade clause was to make it a big deal. Melo had a lot of people fooled including Phil. Hence the no trade.

Bull****. Phil did squat. Probably never even spoke to him except through the media. Perry came in and acted like a true GM and worked things out so that both parties can move on. And did so pretty quickly and efficiently. And as the thread states, did it with great return. Dolan did one thing right and fired the fool. That way Perry was able to stop a useless trade, reset and complete the trade that took place?

And Melo fooled people for 16 years. So well that he is guaranteed to be in the Hall of Fame.

Agree he should have not ever received a NTC at that stage in his career. But Phil was also the genius who thought Noah and Rose were the ones needed to surround him with.

Difference between having a real GM and an overpaid retired HOF coach. And Phil was also the genius shopping our unicorn because of a hard on over a missed exit meeting.

Yeah, and I sure hate the fooling Melo did the first three years of his tenure here. I love spending seasons doing the Phil-ly special; tank threads, watching the draft listings, wondering what unknown phenoms we're missing from the Euro leagues now that BRIGGS has been relegated to winning the Gamepicker...

KP maybe learned from Melo there on "standing up to mgmt" on the missed exit meeting. That plus the fact that Phil was butchering his role with the "we know what we're doing". Hope there are no more missed exit meetings from any players...NOW what would be the reason to?

Coach has the players' backs.
FO has Coach's back.

HofstraBBall wrote:

Vmart wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:Was anyone saying they didn't? Perry did a great job picking up Phils fumble.

It wasn’t a fumble it was “the holy roller”. Phil knew that the only way to get Melo to shuffle his feet with the no trade clause was to make it a big deal. Melo had a lot of people fooled including Phil. Hence the no trade.

Bull****. Phil did squat. Probably never even spoke to him except through the media. Perry came in and acted like a true GM and worked things out so that both parties can move on. And did so pretty quickly and efficiently. And as the thread states, did it with great return. Dolan did one thing right and fired the fool. That way Perry was able to stop a useless trade, reset and complete the trade that took place?

And Melo fooled people for 16 years. So well that he is guaranteed to be in the Hall of Fame.

Agree he should have not ever received a NTC at that stage in his career. But Phil was also the genius who thought Noah and Rose were the ones needed to surround him with.

Still got you fooled.

Nalod wrote:Phil is gone. Not everything he did was bad, or good. KP reaction to things and missing the meeting was bad. Phil's reaction was worse. He reacted like a coach scorned. A good GM would fire his coach as unicorns are not common. I thought Hornacek was OK but direction we in with Fiz better. And its way too early to even comment on Fiz. Things are in disarray.
My wife is on sabbatical leave catching up on life and has taken the task to clean out closets and basement. Its a mess. Pulling stuff out, sorting it thru makes a mess. In time we'll lighten up and reorganize. Maybe this is true of what Fiz is doing with this team.

You know why Phil was mad at KP. Probably because MJ, Kobe and Shaq showed up for theirs. Pat Ewing probably never missed one. This Unicorn of ours is feeling himself even before he has accomplished something. I get that its a players league and fans love players but respect the damn game and the process players are employees first.

Nalod wrote:Phil is gone. Not everything he did was bad, or good. KP reaction to things and missing the meeting was bad. Phil's reaction was worse. He reacted like a coach scorned. A good GM would fire his coach as unicorns are not common. I thought Hornacek was OK but direction we in with Fiz better. And its way too early to even comment on Fiz. Things are in disarray.
My wife is on sabbatical leave catching up on life and has taken the task to clean out closets and basement. Its a mess. Pulling stuff out, sorting it thru makes a mess. In time we'll lighten up and reorganize. Maybe this is true of what Fiz is doing with this team.

Biggest issue in my mind was that -- to use an NFL analogy -- Phil was best suited as a director of football operations akin to Coughlin with the Jags. He should have specified a philosophy and culture, hired GM and at least been involved with coach. To a large degree this is what he was "supposed" to be as President

The reality was different. Instead he acted as a GM when he wanted to (sometimes to bad effect), and zoned out when bored. Our plan was fine; our execution sucked

Maybe our history would have been completely different if Kerr didn't back out of verbal deal; maybe different if Phil hired a star GM who was a kindred spirit philosophically yet someone Phil respected enough that he would listen if the GM told him politely to stay out of something and catch a nap (like Rose and Noah dealings)

Experiment failed, but I'll have to admit that, for a while, I was in love with the romantic image that we would have an institutional culture starting from the G-league and working its way up; that we would play system ball valuing passing and defense, that we would build through draft and develop players.

Now we're watching YMCA ball on steroids. Can anyone honestly say what our identity is on offense or defense -- other than that our players are hungry and compete hard

Vmart wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Vmart wrote:

Nalod wrote:Phil is gone. Not everything he did was bad, or good. KP reaction to things and missing the meeting was bad. Phil's reaction was worse. He reacted like a coach scorned. A good GM would fire his coach as unicorns are not common. I thought Hornacek was OK but direction we in with Fiz better. And its way too early to even comment on Fiz. Things are in disarray.
My wife is on sabbatical leave catching up on life and has taken the task to clean out closets and basement. Its a mess. Pulling stuff out, sorting it thru makes a mess. In time we'll lighten up and reorganize. Maybe this is true of what Fiz is doing with this team.

You know why Phil was mad at KP. Probably because MJ, Kobe and Shaq showed up for theirs. Pat Ewing probably never missed one. This Unicorn of ours is feeling himself even before he has accomplished something. I get that its a players league and fans love players but respect the damn game and the process players are employees first.

Shaq didn't show up for his and it was with Phil.

Your comparing Shaq to KP. One who has championships to someone who hasn’t made an all star game.

jrodmc wrote:

Vmart wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Vmart wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:Was anyone saying they didn't? Perry did a great job picking up Phils fumble.

It wasn’t a fumble it was “the holy roller”. Phil knew that the only way to get Melo to shuffle his feet with the no trade clause was to make it a big deal. Melo had a lot of people fooled including Phil. Hence the no trade.

Bull****. Phil did squat. Probably never even spoke to him except through the media. Perry came in and acted like a true GM and worked things out so that both parties can move on. And did so pretty quickly and efficiently. And as the thread states, did it with great return. Dolan did one thing right and fired the fool. That way Perry was able to stop a useless trade, reset and complete the trade that took place?

And Melo fooled people for 16 years. So well that he is guaranteed to be in the Hall of Fame.

Agree he should have not ever received a NTC at that stage in his career. But Phil was also the genius who thought Noah and Rose were the ones needed to surround him with.

Difference between having a real GM and an overpaid retired HOF coach. And Phil was also the genius shopping our unicorn because of a hard on over a missed exit meeting.

Yeah, and I sure hate the fooling Melo did the first three years of his tenure here. I love spending seasons doing the Phil-ly special; tank threads, watching the draft listings, wondering what unknown phenoms we're missing from the Euro leagues now that BRIGGS has been relegated to winning the Gamepicker...

Go and kiss Melo’s rings. You treating one of the all time winning coach as if he knows nothing. The man who helped the Knicks to their title. Hi and look up why Melo didn’t last in OKC and lasted only a handful of games in Houston.

Go look up how many playoff games we played under the all time greatest coach turned million a month Prez, and then stroke that pic of Phil's feet again while wearing your Albany Patroons tshirt. Nobody's talking about Melo's current career now but you.
Having a nice conversation with yourself?

And if the guy who helped us win a chip 40 years ago is such a smart FO guy, explain the Noah contract, and Melo's NTC. Oh wait, that's right, what was I thinking?, he's the greatest college player from Montana too.

Can't touch Phil and his 11 rings. Can't win without stars but lots of coach's have failed in the pursuit. Phil the exec had a good idea but executed it badly. Results speak loud. KP made a bad decision but look what it did. He changed the front office and in time the coach.
DRose does still have game left. It was his health that was in question and really it cost us little. Noah was a bad one. no denying that. Knicks got lucky and drafted KP. Did not trade the pick or get cute there.
I thought Fisher was a good concept. Kerr was his first choice. Kerr had never coached but he was more mature, had GM experience and that really helped. Fisher was not the solid person we thought he was. Phil hires were all former players like himself. That itself was telling.
Im not defending Phil but trying to put balance on it. He was not suited for the role and he thought as a coach and not as team president. That's over simplifying it but the truth is what it is.

Simple fact is the team then and now is devoid of experienced talent and the turnstile player movement does not build culture. At least for the time being we have a FO that built for player development and a coach juggling minutes to provide opportunities. a quarter of the season in Fiz has given everyone a chance. Its not perfect and we all knew there would be some that won't survive the audition. Because frank was picked 8th it places a higher expectation. Drafting is treacherous place. Dennis smith is good, but small. Monk? Mitchell is the one that got a way. There are always one that gets away. But we make it up with Trier and Robinson.

Would have been better if he took the job more as a clean up and set up. Falling into the pressure of trying to win now due to getting attacked for his record was a set back for the team.