Cartman718 wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:Is that a yes?

You think a 29 win team a year ago has added enough talent to win 44-45 games?

Or... they may just not be that talented.

yes thats a yes on the first question.. on the 44 45 wins...since when did an 8th seed in the east win 44-45 games. gtfoh.

2015-16.

Last year Wizards won 43.

Marv wrote:heat check

all the posts in this thread and no one is acknowledging Marv's sweet sweet addition

Knickoftime wrote:

Cartman718 wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:This will be a key match to win, and boost the team's enthusiasm. Otherwise we may slide into moral victories mode. We are supposedly keeping the same lineup to start. Let's see what they can do.

This is what Fiz said I think in an interview that he'd keep the same lineup for 1 more game and then tweak it if necessary. Hopefully that tweak involves mario and dotson into the starting lineup and lance to bench.

between frank, dot, mario, thjr, i think there's enough people to bring the ball up the floor and this also fits in with fiz's whoever gets the ball first brings it up mantra.

there's a part of me hoping for a loss to force fiz's hand into a lineup change. if we win big tonight, he may not tweak it, which is desperately required.

If the Knicks win big, they'll be 2-3 with positve scoring differential, with two of those three losses being against two of the best teams in the east.

Why would they desperately require a line-up change?

CrushAlot wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

Cartman718 wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:This will be a key match to win, and boost the team's enthusiasm. Otherwise we may slide into moral victories mode. We are supposedly keeping the same lineup to start. Let's see what they can do.

This is what Fiz said I think in an interview that he'd keep the same lineup for 1 more game and then tweak it if necessary. Hopefully that tweak involves mario and dotson into the starting lineup and lance to bench.

between frank, dot, mario, thjr, i think there's enough people to bring the ball up the floor and this also fits in with fiz's whoever gets the ball first brings it up mantra.

there's a part of me hoping for a loss to force fiz's hand into a lineup change. if we win big tonight, he may not tweak it, which is desperately required.

If the Knicks win big, they'll be 2-3 with positve scoring differential, with two of those three losses being against two of the best teams in the east.

Why would they desperately require a line-up change?

The KNicks are getting 9 pts and 5 rebounds from their starting forwards combined. That puts a lot of offensive burden on the other three starters. The rebounding is also a concern. I think Fiz switches things up soon. Lee or Dotson are both good defensive players that bring something on offense as well. Switching one of those guys into the starting line up for Lance or Frank is what I think probably happens. I also think Knox will end up being a starter at some point but his injury pushed that back. Mario maybe in play as a starter in place of Lance or Frank as well.

My point is I don't think giving Dotson starter minutes is going to transform this team into something more than it is.

These Knicks are going to live and die by their 11-12 rotations players, and most nights that'll mean die.

They aren't going to bleed 10-15 extra wins out of rotations/minutes.

On October 24, 2018, Fiz can pick five names out of a hat to be on the court at tip-off for all i care.

As I say, if people are going to live and die by micro-second guessing every time the Knicks keep it close against a more talented team than they are but come up a few points short, man it's going to be a long year.

StarksEwing1 wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

Cartman718 wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:This will be a key match to win, and boost the team's enthusiasm. Otherwise we may slide into moral victories mode. We are supposedly keeping the same lineup to start. Let's see what they can do.

This is what Fiz said I think in an interview that he'd keep the same lineup for 1 more game and then tweak it if necessary. Hopefully that tweak involves mario and dotson into the starting lineup and lance to bench.

between frank, dot, mario, thjr, i think there's enough people to bring the ball up the floor and this also fits in with fiz's whoever gets the ball first brings it up mantra.

there's a part of me hoping for a loss to force fiz's hand into a lineup change. if we win big tonight, he may not tweak it, which is desperately required.

If the Knicks win big, they'll be 2-3 with positve scoring differential, with two of those three losses being against two of the best teams in the east.

Why would they desperately require a line-up change?

The KNicks are getting 9 pts and 5 rebounds from their starting forwards combined. That puts a lot of offensive burden on the other three starters. The rebounding is also a concern. I think Fiz switches things up soon. Lee or Dotson are both good defensive players that bring something on offense as well. Switching one of those guys into the starting line up for Lance or Frank is what I think probably happens. I also think Knox will end up being a starter at some point but his injury pushed that back. Mario maybe in play as a starter in place of Lance or Frank as well.

My point is I don't think giving Dotson starter minutes is going to transform this team into something more than it is.

These Knicks are going to live and die by their 11-12 rotations players, and most nights that'll mean die.

They aren't going to bleed 10-15 extra wins out of rotations/minutes.

On October 24, 2018, Fiz can pick five names out of a hat to be on the court at tip-off for all i care.

As I say, if people are going to live and die by micro-second guessing every time the Knicks keep it close against a more talented team than they are but come up a few points short, man it's going to be a long year.

Great Post Man. Ive also seen times where a player produces off the bench then are inserted into starting and dont do as well. I havent agreed with everything fizdale has done but I trust his judgment

I'm not even bothering to agree or disagree with Fiz. Wake me up in January.

I want Dot and Trier and Nitilikina and Robinson and Knox and Vonleh and Burke to get burn because that's the point of the season.

But I also know PT doesn't mean the same thing as development. Sometimes development means putting guys on the floor with other guys that they can achieve positive things with. So Kanter, Thomas, hezonja and Hardaway are going to get their burn too.

The point is its been a week. This is mad scientist laboratory time.

Not playoff push time.

CrushAlot wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

Cartman718 wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:This will be a key match to win, and boost the team's enthusiasm. Otherwise we may slide into moral victories mode. We are supposedly keeping the same lineup to start. Let's see what they can do.

This is what Fiz said I think in an interview that he'd keep the same lineup for 1 more game and then tweak it if necessary. Hopefully that tweak involves mario and dotson into the starting lineup and lance to bench.

between frank, dot, mario, thjr, i think there's enough people to bring the ball up the floor and this also fits in with fiz's whoever gets the ball first brings it up mantra.

there's a part of me hoping for a loss to force fiz's hand into a lineup change. if we win big tonight, he may not tweak it, which is desperately required.

If the Knicks win big, they'll be 2-3 with positve scoring differential, with two of those three losses being against two of the best teams in the east.

Why would they desperately require a line-up change?

The KNicks are getting 9 pts and 5 rebounds from their starting forwards combined. That puts a lot of offensive burden on the other three starters. The rebounding is also a concern. I think Fiz switches things up soon. Lee or Dotson are both good defensive players that bring something on offense as well. Switching one of those guys into the starting line up for Lance or Frank is what I think probably happens. I also think Knox will end up being a starter at some point but his injury pushed that back. Mario maybe in play as a starter in place of Lance or Frank as well.

My point is I don't think giving Dotson starter minutes is going to transform this team into something more than it is.

These Knicks are going to live and die by their 11-12 rotations players, and most nights that'll mean die.

They aren't going to bleed 10-15 extra wins out of rotations/minutes.

On October 24, 2018, Fiz can pick five names out of a hat to be on the court at tip-off for all i care.

As I say, if people are going to live and die by micro-second guessing every time the Knicks keep it close against a more talented team than they are but come up a few points short, man it's going to be a long year.

I am not micro-second guessing. I don't think you can have two players in your starting line up that give you almost nothing on offense. Frank and Lance bring defense but Lee and Dotson give you that with offense. I think there are some groupings that don't work on offense (i.e. Lance, Frank, Mudiay, Baker, Mitch). I also think you give up too much on defense if you go with a line up of Burke, Tim, Knox, Mario, Kanter but of the two I prefer the latter. I am not sure what a player needs to do to get out of the starting line up if offense and rebounding are not considered an important part of the game. Not even talking about drawing fouls and getting to the free throw line. Again, I don't think both guys need to go but one does unless something changes. Frank's numbers are similar to last year. Lance's shooting percentages are at or near career lows so that might improve. Not sure but I didn't expect an argument to the idea that 9 and 5 combined from your starting forwards means something needs to change.

CrushAlot wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

Cartman718 wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:This will be a key match to win, and boost the team's enthusiasm. Otherwise we may slide into moral victories mode. We are supposedly keeping the same lineup to start. Let's see what they can do.

This is what Fiz said I think in an interview that he'd keep the same lineup for 1 more game and then tweak it if necessary. Hopefully that tweak involves mario and dotson into the starting lineup and lance to bench.

between frank, dot, mario, thjr, i think there's enough people to bring the ball up the floor and this also fits in with fiz's whoever gets the ball first brings it up mantra.

there's a part of me hoping for a loss to force fiz's hand into a lineup change. if we win big tonight, he may not tweak it, which is desperately required.

If the Knicks win big, they'll be 2-3 with positve scoring differential, with two of those three losses being against two of the best teams in the east.

Why would they desperately require a line-up change?

The KNicks are getting 9 pts and 5 rebounds from their starting forwards combined. That puts a lot of offensive burden on the other three starters. The rebounding is also a concern. I think Fiz switches things up soon. Lee or Dotson are both good defensive players that bring something on offense as well. Switching one of those guys into the starting line up for Lance or Frank is what I think probably happens. I also think Knox will end up being a starter at some point but his injury pushed that back. Mario maybe in play as a starter in place of Lance or Frank as well.

My point is I don't think giving Dotson starter minutes is going to transform this team into something more than it is.

These Knicks are going to live and die by their 11-12 rotations players, and most nights that'll mean die.

They aren't going to bleed 10-15 extra wins out of rotations/minutes.

On October 24, 2018, Fiz can pick five names out of a hat to be on the court at tip-off for all i care.

As I say, if people are going to live and die by micro-second guessing every time the Knicks keep it close against a more talented team than they are but come up a few points short, man it's going to be a long year.

I am not micro-second guessing. I don't think you can have two players in your starting line up that give you almost nothing on offense. Frank and Lance bring defense but Lee and Dotson give you that with offense. I think there are some groupings that don't work on offense (i.e. Lance, Frank, Mudiay, Baker, Mitch). I also think you give up too much on defense if you go with a line up of Burke, Tim, Knox, Mario, Kanter but of the two I prefer the latter. I am not sure what a player needs to do to get out of the starting line up if offense and rebounding are not considered an important part of the game. Not even talking about drawing fouls and getting to the free throw line. Again, I don't think both guys need to go but one does unless something changes. Frank's numbers are similar to last year. Lance's shooting percentages are at or near career lows so that might improve. Not sure but I didn't expect an argument to the idea that 9 and 5 combined from your starting forwards means something needs to change.

Its 4 games into the season. If you yank guys after such a small sample size that could have a negative effect too. This season is more about the kids

The coach is evaluating after five games and is considering a line up change. In my opinion one of Frank or Lance needs to come out of the starting line up. I think there is also a risk of a negative effect on the rest of the team. How do you say you keep what you kill and have Dotson on the bench behind Lance and Frank?

CrushAlot wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

Cartman718 wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:This will be a key match to win, and boost the team's enthusiasm. Otherwise we may slide into moral victories mode. We are supposedly keeping the same lineup to start. Let's see what they can do.

This is what Fiz said I think in an interview that he'd keep the same lineup for 1 more game and then tweak it if necessary. Hopefully that tweak involves mario and dotson into the starting lineup and lance to bench.

between frank, dot, mario, thjr, i think there's enough people to bring the ball up the floor and this also fits in with fiz's whoever gets the ball first brings it up mantra.

there's a part of me hoping for a loss to force fiz's hand into a lineup change. if we win big tonight, he may not tweak it, which is desperately required.

If the Knicks win big, they'll be 2-3 with positve scoring differential, with two of those three losses being against two of the best teams in the east.

Why would they desperately require a line-up change?

The KNicks are getting 9 pts and 5 rebounds from their starting forwards combined. That puts a lot of offensive burden on the other three starters. The rebounding is also a concern. I think Fiz switches things up soon. Lee or Dotson are both good defensive players that bring something on offense as well. Switching one of those guys into the starting line up for Lance or Frank is what I think probably happens. I also think Knox will end up being a starter at some point but his injury pushed that back. Mario maybe in play as a starter in place of Lance or Frank as well.

My point is I don't think giving Dotson starter minutes is going to transform this team into something more than it is.

These Knicks are going to live and die by their 11-12 rotations players, and most nights that'll mean die.

They aren't going to bleed 10-15 extra wins out of rotations/minutes.

On October 24, 2018, Fiz can pick five names out of a hat to be on the court at tip-off for all i care.

As I say, if people are going to live and die by micro-second guessing every time the Knicks keep it close against a more talented team than they are but come up a few points short, man it's going to be a long year.

I am not micro-second guessing. I don't think you can have two players in your starting line up that give you almost nothing on offense. Frank and Lance bring defense but Lee and Dotson give you that with offense. I think there are some groupings that don't work on offense (i.e. Lance, Frank, Mudiay, Baker, Mitch). I also think you give up too much on defense if you go with a line up of Burke, Tim, Knox, Mario, Kanter but of the two I prefer the latter. I am not sure what a player needs to do to get out of the starting line up if offense and rebounding are not considered an important part of the game. Not even talking about drawing fouls and getting to the free throw line. Again, I don't think both guys need to go but one does unless something changes. Frank's numbers are similar to last year. Lance's shooting percentages are at or near career lows so that might improve. Not sure but I didn't expect an argument to the idea that 9 and 5 combined from your starting forwards means something needs to change.

Its 4 games into the season. If you yank guys after such a small sample size that could have a negative effect too. This season is more about the kids

The coach is evaluating after five games and is considering a line up change. In my opinion one of Frank or Lance needs to come out of the starting line up. I think there is also a risk of a negative effect on the rest of the team. How do you say you keep what you kill and have Dotson on the bench behind Lance and Frank?

My point is I'm prepared for Fizdale to mix and match just to see what's what until Christmas decorations go on clearance at CVS.

Not because if Thomas is still in the starting line-up they might lose to Golden State.

Just ain't going there before Halloween.

I think Dotson had 32 mins the other night. He was playing well and Fiz clearly recognized and responded.

What difference does it make when they get their first min?

CrushAlot wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:I am not micro-second guessing. I don't think you can have two players in your starting line up that give you almost nothing on offense.

Knicks has been competitive in each of the 4 games they've played. Seems to be working fine.

I came into this season expecting a 30 win-ish team. I'm not changing those expectations because I think if they ahd the right starting line-up they could be 2-2 or 3-1.

I more give them credit for being competitive, which means I don't think changes need to be made for any other reason than what the season is about, assessing what they got.

I think there are some groupings that don't work on offense (i.e. Lance, Frank, Mudiay, Baker, Mitch). I also think you give up too much on defense if you go with a line up of Burke, Tim, Knox, Mario, Kanter but of the two I prefer the latter.

I think the Knicks are who they are based on their roster, which is a below average NBA basbetball team.

I don't think they're different teams depending on how you group them.

Again, I don't think both guys need to go but one does unless something changes.

Why does it need to change? They've been competitive, which is as much as we can ask for.

Frank's numbers are similar to last year. Lance's shooting percentages are at or near career lows so that might improve.

In 4 games.

Not sure but I didn't expect an argument to the idea that 9 and 5 combined from your starting forwards means something needs to change.

Forget the reasons why something needs to change, what's the point of the changes?

You think they're competing for a playoff berth?

I am not saying guys won't get their same minutes. I am saying that the combination of having two players in the starting line up that barely contribute on offense isn't working. Give Lance his 20 minutes or Frank his 30 minutes. I am saying that your starting forwards should not average 9 pts and 5 rebs between them. Mix it up.

What isn't working about it?

Because they lost by 2 points at Brooklyn and to Boston that means it isn't working?