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Frank haters can suck it
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Nalod
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10/10/2018  8:19 AM
He's a basketball player, not a geometric figure.
Knicks1248: 1. Dolan should be more involved! 2. Why would any knick fan want pick 8, when that spot has a history of producing marginal NBA taken. (He prefers pick 9th instead)
AUTOADVERT
StarksEwing1
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10/10/2018  8:58 AM
knicks1248 wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
wargames wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
Ira wrote:Frank has improved, but he still has a way to go on offense. But he's a hard worker and a smart player, so he should continue to improve offensively, while playing very good d.
Of Course. Thats a very fair assessment. We all know his defense is his biggest strength and the offense will take some time to blossom. The reason i have been happy since the SL is because he looks much more aggresive, not passing up shots,and even taking it to the hoop. He still such a young kid but with more experience things should start to get easier for him

you really think it takes 164 games to get through to someone.

I watch frank every single time he is giving the ball to bring up court, after a make or miss, 99 out of 99 times he is giving the ball up as soon as he passes half court.

Were talking over 500 possessions, and you want me to believe he is going to grow out of doing that, he has blown more fast break opportunities than any player i have seen in the NBA in the last 5 yrs. Fiz has already ruled him out of playing PG or starting, he will bring him off the bench as a 2 or 3.

I fully understand your train of thought and your optimism, but ask yourself this, Is frank the kind of player you acquire in a speed ball attack system?

If fiz is the coach and you had to redo the draft would still take frank over DSJ?

Yes he would. This has been confirmed. I love when you argue with your alternative facts. You so silly!
his track record for being right isnt too good lol. Also says "you CANT rebuild through the draft and its better to trade picks for guys like butler even though ,99 percent of fans know that is stupid

you can't build through the draft ALONE, the suns, kings, and magic have proven that. You draft, trade, and sign FA..that's how you build. Anything else your just putting all your eggs in one basket

You still have to draft the right player, which is harder than you would care to admit

I NEVER said it was easy. I also NEVER said that you shouldnt sign free agents. However the core has to be through the draft. Hell even before KD went to Golden State they were a champion BECAUSE of the draft. Look at Philly now. They are loaded with young talent and already made a big step forward BECAUSE of the draft.

They have picks that are NBA ready despite the injuries that held them back. They also drafted players that fit their system. You think phil would have drafted KNOX..Hell NO, in his first press conference he said he was looking for players who can jump out the building.

would you trade frank for the spurs 1st rnd pick and another player?

I would see what they would be willing to give up for frank and Lee, they are pretty desperate at this point

How do you know Phil wouldnt of picked Knox? He did pick KP. Obviously I know thats a big reason you dont like frank. Also as much as you are begging for it the Knicks arent trading Frank. So you might as well prepare yourself that next year out of the 3 ,guards he is the only lock to be here

Dude cmon on man

“We know what we want, and we are interested in developing that and turning away from just say this guy can jump out of the gym, this guy can do a triple-double game or dunk the ball,’’ Jackson said. “That is not what we are interested in. We are interested in skill players that know how to play together in team form.”

That's more so the frank type than Knox

You know damn well that this current regime/coach would not have drafted frank so cut it out.

We drafted a suppose pg at #8 and are still searching for a better one.

There's a few of you on here that wouldn't trade frank for labron or durant. I have no problem keeping him, just not at the position you would like

Knox wouldn't fit the skilled team player mold?

The trend during the Phil era when it came to draft picks was he will take the player who had superior physical size/length with largest boom or bust potential. Knox workout over Bridges was supposedly pretty epic and dominant from skill shown to physicality. Would have been hard for any GM/Prez witnessing to pass him up after that.

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19711837/knicks-1st-rounder-frank-ntilikina-draws-rave-reviews-phil-jackson

This was Phil's first interview after selecting Frank. Not once did he mention him for any position. At the time of the draft we didn't sign Tim Hardaway Jr and Phil was looking to dump Melo. So at the time of the draft we had no PG, SG, SF, or Center of the future (Unless you considered KP that).

"We like the size of this young man, we like his aptitude for the game, athleticism, actually the ability to incorporate himself in a winning type of a situation," Jackson said shortly after the Knicks took Ntilikina with their first-round pick.

"Top-10 picks are all really young guys," Jackson said. "You have to understand that when you go in the draft these particular years. ... We know this is a project-type of atmosphere where we have to build a player that is going to develop. We hope he jumps out and helps our team this year."

"It was a pick that we had to think about and argue about as a staff and discuss merits," Jackson said.

"A lot, it has a lot to do with it," Jackson said. "He's up court playing full-court defense. He's aggressive. He likes to do that. He thinks that's a big part of who he is."

"The reality is, we have to grow a team together," said Jackson, who would prefer to trade veteran Carmelo Anthony this summer. "One of the things that I thought about was my own experience and the Knicks' experience when they had success in the late '60s and early '70s, where five or six players were all within one, two years experience in the NBA. Different time. College matriculated out into the NBA. I think we have to start growing our own kids."

They took a player who they liked his foundation and wanted to develop his game.

Excellent Post Newyork. You along the rest of us are presenting facts BUT I guess he just believes what he wants to believe

That is an excellent point, I remember after that draft arguing on a different forum how Frank was a Nic Batum player (and maybe here too) who would be great at SG due his handle, but the next (current) knick regime came in during FA and paid a SG which meant either they force Frank to be a PG or they admit to the fact that in spite having a ton of holes on the roster all they did was create a SG glut.

To make matters worse (or better) Frank looks like a NBA player so they can't just say welp we were right in signing Timmy, they got to find minutes for both. So then the Frank at PG experiment started and here we are.

The best course would be for the knicks to get a PG in FA, put Timmy next to him at SG (to have a two ballhandler backcourt) and let Timmy come off the bench to score buckets to his hearts content. That however is an ideal world where egos and snarky reporters don't exist to stir the pot and make Drama.

Frank was drafted to be a point guard. Mills was a part of that draft and then signed Tim. I agree that Frank might be better served playing the 2 and acting as a secondary ball handler. I think if you are going to argue regime change you get into the area where some say Frank was drafted to be a triangle point guard by the previous regime.

Exactly,You draft according to the system your running, so if Mills(who had very little say)Scott, and Fiz had basically no say in the draft of frank, and running nothing close to a triangle, how is he a good fit?

Some just feel like we're going to make him fit, we're going to squeeze the triangle into that circle.

Kinda getting tired of this "he is a triangle player" bs. I also love how you make these crazy assumptions like fizdale is "stuck" with him. The organization and fiz have had had nothing but good things to say about him and his future. So once again the front office,coach,and most fans are behind him and he is is apart of this young core....get over it
knicks1248
Posts: 37636
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10/10/2018  9:09 AM
StarksEwing1 wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
wargames wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
Ira wrote:Frank has improved, but he still has a way to go on offense. But he's a hard worker and a smart player, so he should continue to improve offensively, while playing very good d.
Of Course. Thats a very fair assessment. We all know his defense is his biggest strength and the offense will take some time to blossom. The reason i have been happy since the SL is because he looks much more aggresive, not passing up shots,and even taking it to the hoop. He still such a young kid but with more experience things should start to get easier for him

you really think it takes 164 games to get through to someone.

I watch frank every single time he is giving the ball to bring up court, after a make or miss, 99 out of 99 times he is giving the ball up as soon as he passes half court.

Were talking over 500 possessions, and you want me to believe he is going to grow out of doing that, he has blown more fast break opportunities than any player i have seen in the NBA in the last 5 yrs. Fiz has already ruled him out of playing PG or starting, he will bring him off the bench as a 2 or 3.

I fully understand your train of thought and your optimism, but ask yourself this, Is frank the kind of player you acquire in a speed ball attack system?

If fiz is the coach and you had to redo the draft would still take frank over DSJ?

Yes he would. This has been confirmed. I love when you argue with your alternative facts. You so silly!
his track record for being right isnt too good lol. Also says "you CANT rebuild through the draft and its better to trade picks for guys like butler even though ,99 percent of fans know that is stupid

you can't build through the draft ALONE, the suns, kings, and magic have proven that. You draft, trade, and sign FA..that's how you build. Anything else your just putting all your eggs in one basket

You still have to draft the right player, which is harder than you would care to admit

I NEVER said it was easy. I also NEVER said that you shouldnt sign free agents. However the core has to be through the draft. Hell even before KD went to Golden State they were a champion BECAUSE of the draft. Look at Philly now. They are loaded with young talent and already made a big step forward BECAUSE of the draft.

They have picks that are NBA ready despite the injuries that held them back. They also drafted players that fit their system. You think phil would have drafted KNOX..Hell NO, in his first press conference he said he was looking for players who can jump out the building.

would you trade frank for the spurs 1st rnd pick and another player?

I would see what they would be willing to give up for frank and Lee, they are pretty desperate at this point

How do you know Phil wouldnt of picked Knox? He did pick KP. Obviously I know thats a big reason you dont like frank. Also as much as you are begging for it the Knicks arent trading Frank. So you might as well prepare yourself that next year out of the 3 ,guards he is the only lock to be here

Dude cmon on man

“We know what we want, and we are interested in developing that and turning away from just say this guy can jump out of the gym, this guy can do a triple-double game or dunk the ball,’’ Jackson said. “That is not what we are interested in. We are interested in skill players that know how to play together in team form.”

That's more so the frank type than Knox

You know damn well that this current regime/coach would not have drafted frank so cut it out.

We drafted a suppose pg at #8 and are still searching for a better one.

There's a few of you on here that wouldn't trade frank for labron or durant. I have no problem keeping him, just not at the position you would like

Knox wouldn't fit the skilled team player mold?

The trend during the Phil era when it came to draft picks was he will take the player who had superior physical size/length with largest boom or bust potential. Knox workout over Bridges was supposedly pretty epic and dominant from skill shown to physicality. Would have been hard for any GM/Prez witnessing to pass him up after that.

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19711837/knicks-1st-rounder-frank-ntilikina-draws-rave-reviews-phil-jackson

This was Phil's first interview after selecting Frank. Not once did he mention him for any position. At the time of the draft we didn't sign Tim Hardaway Jr and Phil was looking to dump Melo. So at the time of the draft we had no PG, SG, SF, or Center of the future (Unless you considered KP that).

"We like the size of this young man, we like his aptitude for the game, athleticism, actually the ability to incorporate himself in a winning type of a situation," Jackson said shortly after the Knicks took Ntilikina with their first-round pick.

"Top-10 picks are all really young guys," Jackson said. "You have to understand that when you go in the draft these particular years. ... We know this is a project-type of atmosphere where we have to build a player that is going to develop. We hope he jumps out and helps our team this year."

"It was a pick that we had to think about and argue about as a staff and discuss merits," Jackson said.

"A lot, it has a lot to do with it," Jackson said. "He's up court playing full-court defense. He's aggressive. He likes to do that. He thinks that's a big part of who he is."

"The reality is, we have to grow a team together," said Jackson, who would prefer to trade veteran Carmelo Anthony this summer. "One of the things that I thought about was my own experience and the Knicks' experience when they had success in the late '60s and early '70s, where five or six players were all within one, two years experience in the NBA. Different time. College matriculated out into the NBA. I think we have to start growing our own kids."

They took a player who they liked his foundation and wanted to develop his game.

Excellent Post Newyork. You along the rest of us are presenting facts BUT I guess he just believes what he wants to believe

That is an excellent point, I remember after that draft arguing on a different forum how Frank was a Nic Batum player (and maybe here too) who would be great at SG due his handle, but the next (current) knick regime came in during FA and paid a SG which meant either they force Frank to be a PG or they admit to the fact that in spite having a ton of holes on the roster all they did was create a SG glut.

To make matters worse (or better) Frank looks like a NBA player so they can't just say welp we were right in signing Timmy, they got to find minutes for both. So then the Frank at PG experiment started and here we are.

The best course would be for the knicks to get a PG in FA, put Timmy next to him at SG (to have a two ballhandler backcourt) and let Timmy come off the bench to score buckets to his hearts content. That however is an ideal world where egos and snarky reporters don't exist to stir the pot and make Drama.

Frank was drafted to be a point guard. Mills was a part of that draft and then signed Tim. I agree that Frank might be better served playing the 2 and acting as a secondary ball handler. I think if you are going to argue regime change you get into the area where some say Frank was drafted to be a triangle point guard by the previous regime.

Exactly,You draft according to the system your running, so if Mills(who had very little say)Scott, and Fiz had basically no say in the draft of frank, and running nothing close to a triangle, how is he a good fit?

Some just feel like we're going to make him fit, we're going to squeeze the triangle into that circle.

Kinda getting tired of this "he is a triangle player" bs. I also love how you make these crazy assumptions like fizdale is "stuck" with him. The organization and fiz have had had nothing but good things to say about him and his future. So once again the front office,coach,and most fans are behind him and he is is apart of this young core....get over it

ok

ES
meloshouldgo
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10/10/2018  10:11 AM
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
Ira wrote:Frank has improved, but he still has a way to go on offense. But he's a hard worker and a smart player, so he should continue to improve offensively, while playing very good d.
Of Course. Thats a very fair assessment. We all know his defense is his biggest strength and the offense will take some time to blossom. The reason i have been happy since the SL is because he looks much more aggresive, not passing up shots,and even taking it to the hoop. He still such a young kid but with more experience things should start to get easier for him

you really think it takes 164 games to get through to someone.

I watch frank every single time he is giving the ball to bring up court, after a make or miss, 99 out of 99 times he is giving the ball up as soon as he passes half court.

Did you do the math on how many games it's taken Trey Burke to understand he needs to play defense. Or how many more games it will take? DSJ? you still crying over that?

I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only try to make them think - Socrates
newyorknewyork
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10/10/2018  10:13 AM

Got this from realgm.

Looks like our triangle that nobody runs anymore pg has a lot of teams interested in him. But y would that be? What is it about this triangle specific player that has teams interested. I cant put my finger on it?

Not only that, but the Knicks haven't had any interest in trading him. Despite a regime change. Y would they want this triangle player when there is no more triangle?

It don't make no sense?

StarksEwing1
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10/10/2018  10:21 AM
newyorknewyork wrote:

Got this from realgm.

Looks like our triangle that nobody runs anymore pg has a lot of teams interested in him. But y would that be? What is it about this triangle specific player that has teams interested. I cant put my finger on it?

Not only that, but the Knicks haven't had any interest in trading him. Despite a regime change. Y would they want this triangle player when there is no more triangle?

It don't make no sense?

there you have it.
technomaster
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10/10/2018  10:55 AM
meloshouldgo wrote:Did you do the math on how many games it's taken Trey Burke to understand he needs to play defense. Or how many more games it will take? DSJ? you still crying over that?

It's a bit of a trap in life, really. People get so fixated on trying to address their weaknesses rather than maximizing their strengths. He's never going to be a Ntilikina or Marcus Smart or Roberson or Trevor Ariza and earn $10m+/yr based on his defensive awesomeness.


Burke can be a very solid starting PG that averages 15ppg/8apg/1.5spg/48%fg/35%ft that occasionally carries the team with his scoring. He needs to be a high usage guy to be successful. If you limit his game and don't let him push the offense, he basically becomes a marginal NBA player because his defense can't carry his minutes. Burke (rightly so) has accepted that while he'll try to do what he can on D, but his calling card to being a successful NBA player is making opponent pay with his offense. I don't think buddy is going to be an elite defender. Ever.

Frank, however, is really young and has tremendous upside. While he's already looking like an elite defender, he has higher offensive upside than Trevor Ariza's best year. While his pure PG skills may ultimately be average, those same skills are above average (or even elite) for a SG or SF.
Basically when he's done with his rookie contract, he'll probably be a $15m/yr+ player at minimum.

Kevin Dolorico | "That was two, two from the heart." - John Starks
knicks1248
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10/10/2018  11:30 AM
StarksEwing1 wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:

Got this from realgm.

Looks like our triangle that nobody runs anymore pg has a lot of teams interested in him. But y would that be? What is it about this triangle specific player that has teams interested. I cant put my finger on it?

Not only that, but the Knicks haven't had any interest in trading him. Despite a regime change. Y would they want this triangle player when there is no more triangle?

It don't make no sense?

there you have it.

When your being offered 2nd round picks and longer contracts, basically pure trash in return of course your going to Hang up the phone just like they did with offers for KOQ, Lee, Noah, THJ.

Besides I never said trade frank, I said if there's was an opportunity to get a better player that fits or a higher pick they should entertain it.

ES
newyorknewyork
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10/10/2018  11:52 AM
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:

Got this from realgm.

Looks like our triangle that nobody runs anymore pg has a lot of teams interested in him. But y would that be? What is it about this triangle specific player that has teams interested. I cant put my finger on it?

Not only that, but the Knicks haven't had any interest in trading him. Despite a regime change. Y would they want this triangle player when there is no more triangle?

It don't make no sense?

there you have it.

When your being offered 2nd round picks and longer contracts, basically pure trash in return of course your going to Hang up the phone just like they did with offers for KOQ, Lee, Noah, THJ.

Besides I never said trade frank, I said if there's was an opportunity to get a better player that fits or a higher pick they should entertain it.

So you after the Knicks spent a lottery pick on Frank. A team a few months later are gonna call up offering a 2nd round pick. Knowing that they would get hung up on a lose credibility in negotiations.

Then you go on to compare him to Noah, KOQ, Lee and Tim as if they offered the same circumstance in terms of age, pay or potential. Brilliant!

Nalod
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10/10/2018  11:59 AM
StarksEwing1 wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:

Got this from realgm.

Looks like our triangle that nobody runs anymore pg has a lot of teams interested in him. But y would that be? What is it about this triangle specific player that has teams interested. I cant put my finger on it?

Not only that, but the Knicks haven't had any interest in trading him. Despite a regime change. Y would they want this triangle player when there is no more triangle?

It don't make no sense?

there you have it.

Remember, there are three sides to every story.
(Triangle reference)

Knicks1248: 1. Dolan should be more involved! 2. Why would any knick fan want pick 8, when that spot has a history of producing marginal NBA taken. (He prefers pick 9th instead)
Nalod
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10/10/2018  12:02 PM
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:

Got this from realgm.

Looks like our triangle that nobody runs anymore pg has a lot of teams interested in him. But y would that be? What is it about this triangle specific player that has teams interested. I cant put my finger on it?

Not only that, but the Knicks haven't had any interest in trading him. Despite a regime change. Y would they want this triangle player when there is no more triangle?

It don't make no sense?

there you have it.

When your being offered 2nd round picks and longer contracts, basically pure trash in return of course your going to Hang up the phone just like they did with offers for KOQ, Lee, Noah, THJ.

Besides I never said trade frank, I said if there's was an opportunity to get a better player that fits or a higher pick they should entertain it.

You never said trade Frank. You never answered the point of disrespect you think the media has on your time zone mistake.

own up Rainman.

Knicks1248: 1. Dolan should be more involved! 2. Why would any knick fan want pick 8, when that spot has a history of producing marginal NBA taken. (He prefers pick 9th instead)
StarksEwing1
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10/10/2018  12:50 PM    LAST EDITED: 10/10/2018  12:57 PM
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:

Got this from realgm.

Looks like our triangle that nobody runs anymore pg has a lot of teams interested in him. But y would that be? What is it about this triangle specific player that has teams interested. I cant put my finger on it?

Not only that, but the Knicks haven't had any interest in trading him. Despite a regime change. Y would they want this triangle player when there is no more triangle?

It don't make no sense?

there you have it.

When your being offered 2nd round picks and longer contracts, basically pure trash in return of course your going to Hang up the phone just like they did with offers for KOQ, Lee, Noah, THJ.

Besides I never said trade frank, I said if there's was an opportunity to get a better player that fits or a higher pick they should entertain it.

You are really starting to make yourself look foolish. If you honestly think that a team was just offering a **** return for frank then you are really lost.
VDesai
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10/10/2018  1:26 PM
Idiots who liked the Mo Taylor trade man up!!!
newyorknewyork
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10/10/2018  1:48 PM
StarksEwing1 wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:

Got this from realgm.

Looks like our triangle that nobody runs anymore pg has a lot of teams interested in him. But y would that be? What is it about this triangle specific player that has teams interested. I cant put my finger on it?

Not only that, but the Knicks haven't had any interest in trading him. Despite a regime change. Y would they want this triangle player when there is no more triangle?

It don't make no sense?

there you have it.

When your being offered 2nd round picks and longer contracts, basically pure trash in return of course your going to Hang up the phone just like they did with offers for KOQ, Lee, Noah, THJ.

Besides I never said trade frank, I said if there's was an opportunity to get a better player that fits or a higher pick they should entertain it.

You are really starting to make yourself look foolish. If you honestly think that a team was just offering a **** return for frank then you are really lost.

He knows better. He just went on a little emotional tantrum since Frank triggers these emotions for some reason. Then he will play victim.

The deals negotiated were probably when Knicks tried to dump Noah or Lee and teams would demand Frank be apart of the deal to take on the players contract. Or if the Knicks seeked out a stud player doing due diligence. That team would ask for Frank as part of any deal to aquire said player. Those would be the most logcial scenarios.

knicks1248
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10/10/2018  2:21 PM    LAST EDITED: 10/10/2018  2:21 PM
StarksEwing1 wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:

Got this from realgm.

Looks like our triangle that nobody runs anymore pg has a lot of teams interested in him. But y would that be? What is it about this triangle specific player that has teams interested. I cant put my finger on it?

Not only that, but the Knicks haven't had any interest in trading him. Despite a regime change. Y would they want this triangle player when there is no more triangle?

It don't make no sense?

there you have it.

When your being offered 2nd round picks and longer contracts, basically pure trash in return of course your going to Hang up the phone just like they did with offers for KOQ, Lee, Noah, THJ.

Besides I never said trade frank, I said if there's was an opportunity to get a better player that fits or a higher pick they should entertain it.

You are really starting to make yourself look foolish. If you honestly think that a team was just offering a **** return for frank then you are really lost.

seriously I like the kid but he is the only draft pick we have had in 15 yrs with a projected minus win pct

ESTIMATED WINS ADDED AVERAGE

Out of every pick we had, Frank is the worse on this list and KP and D Lee are the best since 2003. Now I'm not sure what goes into these stats, but he is the only player in RED

http://www.draftexpress.com/clubhouse/Knicks-3/draft-picks-and-trades

ES
StarksEwing1
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10/10/2018  2:41 PM    LAST EDITED: 10/10/2018  2:42 PM
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:

Got this from realgm.

Looks like our triangle that nobody runs anymore pg has a lot of teams interested in him. But y would that be? What is it about this triangle specific player that has teams interested. I cant put my finger on it?

Not only that, but the Knicks haven't had any interest in trading him. Despite a regime change. Y would they want this triangle player when there is no more triangle?

It don't make no sense?

there you have it.

When your being offered 2nd round picks and longer contracts, basically pure trash in return of course your going to Hang up the phone just like they did with offers for KOQ, Lee, Noah, THJ.

Besides I never said trade frank, I said if there's was an opportunity to get a better player that fits or a higher pick they should entertain it.

You are really starting to make yourself look foolish. If you honestly think that a team was just offering a **** return for frank then you are really lost.

seriously I like the kid but he is the only draft pick we have had in 15 yrs with a projected minus win pct

ESTIMATED WINS ADDED AVERAGE

Out of every pick we had, Frank is the worse on this list and KP and D Lee are the best since 2003. Now I'm not sure what goes into these stats, but he is the only player in RED

http://www.draftexpress.com/clubhouse/Knicks-3/draft-picks-and-trades

Your big line is “I like the Kid BUT” lol. Dude just honest. You aren’t a fan of the kid d,hated the draft pick,and don’t want him on the team.
Nalod
Posts: 56032
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Member: #508
USA
10/10/2018  3:13 PM
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:

Got this from realgm.

Looks like our triangle that nobody runs anymore pg has a lot of teams interested in him. But y would that be? What is it about this triangle specific player that has teams interested. I cant put my finger on it?

Not only that, but the Knicks haven't had any interest in trading him. Despite a regime change. Y would they want this triangle player when there is no more triangle?

It don't make no sense?

there you have it.

When your being offered 2nd round picks and longer contracts, basically pure trash in return of course your going to Hang up the phone just like they did with offers for KOQ, Lee, Noah, THJ.

Besides I never said trade frank, I said if there's was an opportunity to get a better player that fits or a higher pick they should entertain it.

You are really starting to make yourself look foolish. If you honestly think that a team was just offering a **** return for frank then you are really lost.

seriously I like the kid but he is the only draft pick we have had in 15 yrs with a projected minus win pct

ESTIMATED WINS ADDED AVERAGE

Out of every pick we had, Frank is the worse on this list and KP and D Lee are the best since 2003. Now I'm not sure what goes into these stats, but he is the only player in RED

http://www.draftexpress.com/clubhouse/Knicks-3/draft-picks-and-trades

Your not only stupid, your lazy. At least your not color blind.

From John Hollinger:

EWA = Estimated Wins Added is Value Added divided by 30, giving the estimated number of wins a player adds to a team’s season total above what a "replacement player" would produce.

BTW, how does one quantify this number? You don't understand it but you use it? Who did he replace?
Since the rookies don't have a rating, and Frank's scoring average is not high, is it that simple?
Don't use stuff you don't understand.

Knicks1248: 1. Dolan should be more involved! 2. Why would any knick fan want pick 8, when that spot has a history of producing marginal NBA taken. (He prefers pick 9th instead)
StarksEwing1
Posts: 30535
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10/10/2018  3:42 PM
Nalod wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:

Got this from realgm.

Looks like our triangle that nobody runs anymore pg has a lot of teams interested in him. But y would that be? What is it about this triangle specific player that has teams interested. I cant put my finger on it?

Not only that, but the Knicks haven't had any interest in trading him. Despite a regime change. Y would they want this triangle player when there is no more triangle?

It don't make no sense?

there you have it.

When your being offered 2nd round picks and longer contracts, basically pure trash in return of course your going to Hang up the phone just like they did with offers for KOQ, Lee, Noah, THJ.

Besides I never said trade frank, I said if there's was an opportunity to get a better player that fits or a higher pick they should entertain it.

You are really starting to make yourself look foolish. If you honestly think that a team was just offering a **** return for frank then you are really lost.

seriously I like the kid but he is the only draft pick we have had in 15 yrs with a projected minus win pct

ESTIMATED WINS ADDED AVERAGE

Out of every pick we had, Frank is the worse on this list and KP and D Lee are the best since 2003. Now I'm not sure what goes into these stats, but he is the only player in RED

http://www.draftexpress.com/clubhouse/Knicks-3/draft-picks-and-trades

Your not only stupid, your lazy. At least your not color blind.

From John Hollinger:

EWA = Estimated Wins Added is Value Added divided by 30, giving the estimated number of wins a player adds to a team’s season total above what a "replacement player" would produce.

BTW, how does one quantify this number? You don't understand it but you use it? Who did he replace?
Since the rookies don't have a rating, and Frank's scoring average is not high, is it that simple?
Don't use stuff you don't understand.

Honestly I dont know why I even bother with that guy. If he wont at least be upfront with his dissatisfaction with Frank and his selection then he should at least present credible facts to justifywhy frank doesnt fit in our future plan. I mean everyone else seems to be fair,objective, but still excited that frank is apart of the future. So either knicks 1248 knows more than all of us and the knicks organization or maybe he should reassess what he is saying
knicks1248
Posts: 37636
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 2/3/2004
Member: #582
10/10/2018  4:41 PM
StarksEwing1 wrote:
Nalod wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:

Got this from realgm.

Looks like our triangle that nobody runs anymore pg has a lot of teams interested in him. But y would that be? What is it about this triangle specific player that has teams interested. I cant put my finger on it?

Not only that, but the Knicks haven't had any interest in trading him. Despite a regime change. Y would they want this triangle player when there is no more triangle?

It don't make no sense?

there you have it.

When your being offered 2nd round picks and longer contracts, basically pure trash in return of course your going to Hang up the phone just like they did with offers for KOQ, Lee, Noah, THJ.

Besides I never said trade frank, I said if there's was an opportunity to get a better player that fits or a higher pick they should entertain it.

You are really starting to make yourself look foolish. If you honestly think that a team was just offering a **** return for frank then you are really lost.

seriously I like the kid but he is the only draft pick we have had in 15 yrs with a projected minus win pct

ESTIMATED WINS ADDED AVERAGE

Out of every pick we had, Frank is the worse on this list and KP and D Lee are the best since 2003. Now I'm not sure what goes into these stats, but he is the only player in RED

http://www.draftexpress.com/clubhouse/Knicks-3/draft-picks-and-trades

Your not only stupid, your lazy. At least your not color blind.

From John Hollinger:

EWA = Estimated Wins Added is Value Added divided by 30, giving the estimated number of wins a player adds to a team’s season total above what a "replacement player" would produce.

BTW, how does one quantify this number? You don't understand it but you use it? Who did he replace?
Since the rookies don't have a rating, and Frank's scoring average is not high, is it that simple?
Don't use stuff you don't understand.

Honestly I dont know why I even bother with that guy. If he wont at least be upfront with his dissatisfaction with Frank and his selection then he should at least present credible facts to justifywhy frank doesnt fit in our future plan. I mean everyone else seems to be fair,objective, but still excited that frank is apart of the future. So either knicks 1248 knows more than all of us and the knicks organization or maybe he should reassess what he is saying

you 2 sound like you have wet dreams about this kid...lol

You more obsess than Nix was about the triangle

Nolad, most of the time your not even worth responding to your such a narrow mind bafoon.

ES
CrushAlot
Posts: 57065
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Member: #452
USA
10/10/2018  5:02 PM
StarksEwing1 wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
wargames wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
StarksEwing1 wrote:
Ira wrote:Frank has improved, but he still has a way to go on offense. But he's a hard worker and a smart player, so he should continue to improve offensively, while playing very good d.
Of Course. Thats a very fair assessment. We all know his defense is his biggest strength and the offense will take some time to blossom. The reason i have been happy since the SL is because he looks much more aggresive, not passing up shots,and even taking it to the hoop. He still such a young kid but with more experience things should start to get easier for him

you really think it takes 164 games to get through to someone.

I watch frank every single time he is giving the ball to bring up court, after a make or miss, 99 out of 99 times he is giving the ball up as soon as he passes half court.

Were talking over 500 possessions, and you want me to believe he is going to grow out of doing that, he has blown more fast break opportunities than any player i have seen in the NBA in the last 5 yrs. Fiz has already ruled him out of playing PG or starting, he will bring him off the bench as a 2 or 3.

I fully understand your train of thought and your optimism, but ask yourself this, Is frank the kind of player you acquire in a speed ball attack system?

If fiz is the coach and you had to redo the draft would still take frank over DSJ?

Yes he would. This has been confirmed. I love when you argue with your alternative facts. You so silly!
his track record for being right isnt too good lol. Also says "you CANT rebuild through the draft and its better to trade picks for guys like butler even though ,99 percent of fans know that is stupid

you can't build through the draft ALONE, the suns, kings, and magic have proven that. You draft, trade, and sign FA..that's how you build. Anything else your just putting all your eggs in one basket

You still have to draft the right player, which is harder than you would care to admit

I NEVER said it was easy. I also NEVER said that you shouldnt sign free agents. However the core has to be through the draft. Hell even before KD went to Golden State they were a champion BECAUSE of the draft. Look at Philly now. They are loaded with young talent and already made a big step forward BECAUSE of the draft.

They have picks that are NBA ready despite the injuries that held them back. They also drafted players that fit their system. You think phil would have drafted KNOX..Hell NO, in his first press conference he said he was looking for players who can jump out the building.

would you trade frank for the spurs 1st rnd pick and another player?

I would see what they would be willing to give up for frank and Lee, they are pretty desperate at this point

How do you know Phil wouldnt of picked Knox? He did pick KP. Obviously I know thats a big reason you dont like frank. Also as much as you are begging for it the Knicks arent trading Frank. So you might as well prepare yourself that next year out of the 3 ,guards he is the only lock to be here

Dude cmon on man

“We know what we want, and we are interested in developing that and turning away from just say this guy can jump out of the gym, this guy can do a triple-double game or dunk the ball,’’ Jackson said. “That is not what we are interested in. We are interested in skill players that know how to play together in team form.”

That's more so the frank type than Knox

You know damn well that this current regime/coach would not have drafted frank so cut it out.

We drafted a suppose pg at #8 and are still searching for a better one.

There's a few of you on here that wouldn't trade frank for labron or durant. I have no problem keeping him, just not at the position you would like

Knox wouldn't fit the skilled team player mold?

The trend during the Phil era when it came to draft picks was he will take the player who had superior physical size/length with largest boom or bust potential. Knox workout over Bridges was supposedly pretty epic and dominant from skill shown to physicality. Would have been hard for any GM/Prez witnessing to pass him up after that.

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19711837/knicks-1st-rounder-frank-ntilikina-draws-rave-reviews-phil-jackson

This was Phil's first interview after selecting Frank. Not once did he mention him for any position. At the time of the draft we didn't sign Tim Hardaway Jr and Phil was looking to dump Melo. So at the time of the draft we had no PG, SG, SF, or Center of the future (Unless you considered KP that).

"We like the size of this young man, we like his aptitude for the game, athleticism, actually the ability to incorporate himself in a winning type of a situation," Jackson said shortly after the Knicks took Ntilikina with their first-round pick.

"Top-10 picks are all really young guys," Jackson said. "You have to understand that when you go in the draft these particular years. ... We know this is a project-type of atmosphere where we have to build a player that is going to develop. We hope he jumps out and helps our team this year."

"It was a pick that we had to think about and argue about as a staff and discuss merits," Jackson said.

"A lot, it has a lot to do with it," Jackson said. "He's up court playing full-court defense. He's aggressive. He likes to do that. He thinks that's a big part of who he is."

"The reality is, we have to grow a team together," said Jackson, who would prefer to trade veteran Carmelo Anthony this summer. "One of the things that I thought about was my own experience and the Knicks' experience when they had success in the late '60s and early '70s, where five or six players were all within one, two years experience in the NBA. Different time. College matriculated out into the NBA. I think we have to start growing our own kids."

They took a player who they liked his foundation and wanted to develop his game.

Excellent Post Newyork. You along the rest of us are presenting facts BUT I guess he just believes what he wants to believe

That is an excellent point, I remember after that draft arguing on a different forum how Frank was a Nic Batum player (and maybe here too) who would be great at SG due his handle, but the next (current) knick regime came in during FA and paid a SG which meant either they force Frank to be a PG or they admit to the fact that in spite having a ton of holes on the roster all they did was create a SG glut.

To make matters worse (or better) Frank looks like a NBA player so they can't just say welp we were right in signing Timmy, they got to find minutes for both. So then the Frank at PG experiment started and here we are.

The best course would be for the knicks to get a PG in FA, put Timmy next to him at SG (to have a two ballhandler backcourt) and let Timmy come off the bench to score buckets to his hearts content. That however is an ideal world where egos and snarky reporters don't exist to stir the pot and make Drama.

Frank was drafted to be a point guard. Mills was a part of that draft and then signed Tim. I agree that Frank might be better served playing the 2 and acting as a secondary ball handler. I think if you are going to argue regime change you get into the area where some say Frank was drafted to be a triangle point guard by the previous regime.

Exactly,You draft according to the system your running, so if Mills(who had very little say)Scott, and Fiz had basically no say in the draft of frank, and running nothing close to a triangle, how is he a good fit?

Some just feel like we're going to make him fit, we're going to squeeze the triangle into that circle.

Kinda getting tired of this "he is a triangle player" bs. I also love how you make these crazy assumptions like fizdale is "stuck" with him. The organization and fiz have had had nothing but good things to say about him and his future. So once again the front office,coach,and most fans are behind him and he is is apart of this young core....get over it
the triangle thing was brought up because a poster said Frank was drafted as a 2 guard but had to play the point because Mills signed Tim. Frank was drafted to play point guard by a pres who wanted to run the triangle. Frank's best position maybe as a secondary ball handler. When he plays the point, the offense does slow down and Fiz wants to play uptempo. Fiz saying he doesn't want to assign a label like point guard to him is awesome because at this point it isn't his best position.
You playTrey Burke... Wally Szcerbiak
Frank haters can suck it

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