So you have Horny, who knows there's a good chance he won't be back, and whose team is riding a long losing streak following the horrific injury to his franchise player losing him for the season, so he's compelled to continue to play all his veterans--who he believes gives him the best chance of winning-- in an attempt to amass as many wins as possible, in order to possibly save his job in the off-season (even though it's to the direct detriment of the long term success of the team in a) playing the youth and developing them (and evaluating them) and b) losing games--i.e. tanking-- helps the franchise get a much higher lottery selection in the draft this summer (and possibly another franchise type player).

We get mad at Horny, but he is not to blame. He is a coach and all he cares about is getting wins and maintaining his job security--especially if he doesn't have the endorsement from the new front office, which it appears he doesn't.

What needs to happen following the all-star break is for Perry and Mills to have a sit down with Jeff and let him know that he's no longer being evaluated on wins and losses for the rest of the season, but is being evaluated on how much he gets out of developing the young players on the roster in expanded roles. This edict has to come directly from the FO, in order for there to be a significant change in the coaches philosophy. They have to be on the same page as far as what they're trying to accomplish for the rest of the season.

I have a feeling this convo has not been had yet, since we're still seeing what we saw last night with Jack coming back in the game with 7 minutes to go and all the vet starters playing heavy minutes (and we're still losing).

I hope for the organization's sake it happens soon.

Jeff Hornacek reiterated following Wednesday night’s debacle defeat that he plans to feature the younger players after the All-Star break, specifically point guards Frank Ntilikina, Emmanuel Mudiay and Trey Burke. The hope is to set a new rotation during the practices next week. It’s an organizational decision that also symbolizes a concession to another playoff-less campaign.

“It’s probably all three of those young guys (playing more) — Frank, Emmanuel and Trey — and we’ll slide a couple of them in the two-guard spot,” the coach said. “Whether it’s Trey and Emmanuel or some combination of those guys — Emmanuel and Frank, as well.”

Management did nothing at the trade line to help him win, and the recent loss probably sealed his fate..can wait for mark

Perry is being very classy. He could have fired Horny 2 weeks ago. I think we all can say the writing is on the wall. Everyone is gonna be calling for Mark Jackson. We might actually get him, but I'd really like to take a look at Monty Williams... David Blatt might be a good look as far as playing style. David Fizdale might get a look.

SocraticBallin22 wrote:Here is the conundrum: Horny has no job security right now. He is the head coach of a team that overhauled their front office and management in the off-season, and he was was the outgoing regime's hire. There are no guarantees that he will be back next year. In fact, odds are that Mills and Perry will want to hire their own coach to lead their rebuilding efforts and youth development.

So you have Horny, who knows there's a good chance he won't be back, and whose team is riding a long losing streak following the horrific injury to his franchise player losing him for the season, so he's compelled to continue to play all his veterans--who he believes gives him the best chance of winning-- in an attempt to amass as many wins as possible, in order to possibly save his job in the off-season (even though it's to the direct detriment of the long term success of the team in a) playing the youth and developing them (and evaluating them) and b) losing games--i.e. tanking-- helps the franchise get a much higher lottery selection in the draft this summer (and possibly another franchise type player).

We get mad at Horny, but he is not to blame. He is a coach and all he cares about is getting wins and maintaining his job security--especially if he doesn't have the endorsement from the new front office, which it appears he doesn't.

What needs to happen following the all-star break is for Perry and Mills to have a sit down with Jeff and let him know that he's no longer being evaluated on wins and losses for the rest of the season, but is being evaluated on how much he gets out of developing the young players on the roster in expanded roles. This edict has to come directly from the FO, in order for there to be a significant change in the coaches philosophy. They have to be on the same page as far as what they're trying to accomplish for the rest of the season.

I have a feeling this convo has not been had yet, since we're still seeing what we saw last night with Jack coming back in the game with 7 minutes to go and all the vet starters playing heavy minutes (and we're still losing).

I hope for the organization's sake it happens soon.

Great post! From your keyboard to Yaweh's flaming bush - let it be a commandment!

We are a 30 win team which most predicted. IS that because of the roster or because of Jeff?

Knicks have made significant improvement on defense from last year as well.

Jeff has been fine. This will come down to how the FO works with him and like him. I like him a lot. He's not creampuff. He gets into it with these guys. We need a strong voice. A Sloan type.

fishmike wrote:One thing I think is silly is the assumption that coaches want to win at all costs because of their record. You cant tell me anyone who is evaluating Jeff's performance here or anywhere is only looking at W/L. Did players get better? Did the team improve?
KP took becomes and AS
Lee is having a career year
Kanter is having a career year
THjr is having a career year
Beasley is having his best season in many years
Jack made a comeback and was a meaningful contributor and was clearly a better choice that Sessions.
KOQ is at career highs

We are a 30 win team which most predicted. IS that because of the roster or because of Jeff?

Knicks have made significant improvement on defense from last year as well.

Jeff has been fine. This will come down to how the FO works with him and like him. I like him a lot. He's not creampuff. He gets into it with these guys. We need a strong voice. A Sloan type.

These are all excellent points and I totally agree. The problem I have with Hornacek is his development of Frank, Dotson and the like. Then again if he did play the youngins more then the players you mentioned would not have career years.

knicks1248 wrote:

SocraticBallin22 wrote:Here is the conundrum: Horny has no job security right now. He is the head coach of a team that overhauled their front office and management in the off-season, and he was was the outgoing regime's hire. There are no guarantees that he will be back next year. In fact, odds are that Mills and Perry will want to hire their own coach to lead their rebuilding efforts and youth development.

So you have Horny, who knows there's a good chance he won't be back, and whose team is riding a long losing streak following the horrific injury to his franchise player losing him for the season, so he's compelled to continue to play all his veterans--who he believes gives him the best chance of winning-- in an attempt to amass as many wins as possible, in order to possibly save his job in the off-season (even though it's to the direct detriment of the long term success of the team in a) playing the youth and developing them (and evaluating them) and b) losing games--i.e. tanking-- helps the franchise get a much higher lottery selection in the draft this summer (and possibly another franchise type player).

We get mad at Horny, but he is not to blame. He is a coach and all he cares about is getting wins and maintaining his job security--especially if he doesn't have the endorsement from the new front office, which it appears he doesn't.

What needs to happen following the all-star break is for Perry and Mills to have a sit down with Jeff and let him know that he's no longer being evaluated on wins and losses for the rest of the season, but is being evaluated on how much he gets out of developing the young players on the roster in expanded roles. This edict has to come directly from the FO, in order for there to be a significant change in the coaches philosophy. They have to be on the same page as far as what they're trying to accomplish for the rest of the season.

I have a feeling this convo has not been had yet, since we're still seeing what we saw last night with Jack coming back in the game with 7 minutes to go and all the vet starters playing heavy minutes (and we're still losing).

I hope for the organization's sake it happens soon.

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BY
STEFAN BONDY

Jeff Hornacek reiterated following Wednesday night’s debacle defeat that he plans to feature the younger players after the All-Star break, specifically point guards Frank Ntilikina, Emmanuel Mudiay and Trey Burke. The hope is to set a new rotation during the practices next week. It’s an organizational decision that also symbolizes a concession to another playoff-less campaign.

“It’s probably all three of those young guys (playing more) — Frank, Emmanuel and Trey — and we’ll slide a couple of them in the two-guard spot,” the coach said. “Whether it’s Trey and Emmanuel or some combination of those guys — Emmanuel and Frank, as well.”

There's no reason to keep him,

It’s unclear if the New York Knicks will be exploring their options at head coach this offseason, but one report indicates if they do, they already might have their replacement picked out.

Frank Isola of the New York Daily News reported Thursday that sources indicated to him that the Knicks will look at Mark Jackson if they decide that Jeff Hornacek is not the man to lead the team going forward.

Though there isn’t a clear indication that Hornacek is indeed on his way out, Isola said some NBA sources pointed to Jackson waiting in the wings should changes be made.

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But Hornacek himself is said to understand that his time with the Knicks could be short if improvements are not made.

Hornacek knows how the game works. In theory, he was not hired by Mills or Perry and without a strong allegiance to the front office he is therefore vulnerable. Maybe that’s why two coaches from different staffs told me they keep hearing Jackson’s name floated out as a possible successor when and if the Knicks were to make a change. Even Doc Rivers’ name is making the rounds even though he is under contract with the Los Angeles Clippers.

That speculation could be based on nothing more than the Knicks’ history of hiring and firing head coaches the way the current White House administration discards staff members. But it’s out there.

It’s tough to know what this speculation is worth given we don’t know how the Knicks will do in the second half of the season, but the message is clear: The next few months for the Knicks are not simply a team on autopilot. What happens on the court will almost certainly impact who is running things in New York in the future.

NYKBocker wrote:

fishmike wrote:One thing I think is silly is the assumption that coaches want to win at all costs because of their record. You cant tell me anyone who is evaluating Jeff's performance here or anywhere is only looking at W/L. Did players get better? Did the team improve?
KP took becomes and AS
Lee is having a career year
Kanter is having a career year
THjr is having a career year
Beasley is having his best season in many years
Jack made a comeback and was a meaningful contributor and was clearly a better choice that Sessions.
KOQ is at career highs

We are a 30 win team which most predicted. IS that because of the roster or because of Jeff?

Knicks have made significant improvement on defense from last year as well.

Jeff has been fine. This will come down to how the FO works with him and like him. I like him a lot. He's not creampuff. He gets into it with these guys. We need a strong voice. A Sloan type.

These are all excellent points and I totally agree. The problem I have with Hornacek is his development of Frank, Dotson and the like. Then again if he did play the youngins more then the players you mentioned would not have career years.

those guys got more minutes and touches since they weren't playing with any ball dominating players, no rose, no melo, no westbrook.. Kanter and THJ went from bench players to starters, I like beasely, don't know if it was mills or perry, but that was a solid pick up..

NYKBocker wrote:Would really love JVG

You know that's very interesting. Jvg still wants to coach. What's weird is her actually led a us a team to a gold medal last summer in a Americas tournament that nobody knew was going on. The NBA didn't even broadcast it. I could see him taking the job. He's a coach that fits everything Mills says he wants. Jvg is a nut. He's like Spolstra. He's working just as hard as the players doing his due diligence. Something to really take a hard look at.

EnySpree wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

fishmike wrote:One thing I think is silly is the assumption that coaches want to win at all costs because of their record. You cant tell me anyone who is evaluating Jeff's performance here or anywhere is only looking at W/L. Did players get better? Did the team improve?
KP took becomes and AS
Lee is having a career year
Kanter is having a career year
THjr is having a career year
Beasley is having his best season in many years
Jack made a comeback and was a meaningful contributor and was clearly a better choice that Sessions.
KOQ is at career highs

We are a 30 win team which most predicted. IS that because of the roster or because of Jeff?

Knicks have made significant improvement on defense from last year as well.

Jeff has been fine. This will come down to how the FO works with him and like him. I like him a lot. He's not creampuff. He gets into it with these guys. We need a strong voice. A Sloan type.

These are all excellent points and I totally agree. The problem I have with Hornacek is his development of Frank, Dotson and the like. Then again if he did play the youngins more then the players you mentioned would not have career years.

The idea of development is warped if you believe giving them more minutes is all there is to developing a player. Rookies need to learn to work hard in practice. They can't expect to play at all. They have to earn it.

Perry quietly traded Willy because Willy was telling the media he had personal goals he gaff for his own career. That's a cancer. You can't have a guy like that on the team. He exiled Noah and never made any waves about it. Noah deserved that. Now quietly Perry traded for Mudiay to give Frank a wake up call. Burke is a prideful guy too. That's what I call developing a player. You want to play and we want you to get better. Now here's your competition, let's see who really wants to play. Fucking great stuff.

I see your point, however playing Jack extended minutes doesn't help anything. Playing Kanter and KOQ over Willy was fine and honestly I would have done the same. My only gripe is Jack getting extended minutes. Both Frank and Trey seems to have been doing what is asked of them. Nixluva has made some excellent points about getting Frank in situations that would put him in a better position to succeed but Horny has not done that.