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Game Dread: 10:30 EST, ....Road trip blues and a game with the Warriors.....
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ScoreBot
1/24/2018  12:48 AM
FINAL
GSW 123 NYK 112
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Cartman718
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1/24/2018  12:52 AM
dwiley20 wrote:Noah got yanked and started screaming at the coaches...lol after like 2 minutes of play smh

thought he was screaming at ntilikina

Nixluva is posting triangle screen grabs, even when nobody asks - Fishmike. LOL So are we going to reference that thread like the bible now? "The thread of Wroten Page 14 post 9" - EnySpree
GustavBahler
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1/24/2018  9:56 AM
Well, the first half was fun, lol. Dont believe GS was coasting the first half. Kerr was calling a lot of time outs, probably more than he thought he would. Knicks really got after them. Kanter did a nice job of passing out of double teams.

I like that Frank is taking more chances, cant wait until the game is almost out of reach. At least he's trying.

I will be surprised if Beasley doesnt draw some decent offers. Would rather sign him (for the right price) Hard to find a player with his skill set, who isn't gettting major money. An MLE type deal would be a bargain, if this is what we would get.

Willy still cant play D

Thought we had a shot, but I think Hornacek relied on Jack too much in the first half. Might have been better to give some minutes to Baker or Burke.

I cant think of any Knick coach this century who has had his players setting more screens for each other. Never understood how one Knicks coach after another would ignore such an important part of the game.

martin
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1/24/2018  11:07 AM
GustavBahler wrote:Well, the first half was fun, lol. Dont believe GS was coasting the first half. Kerr was calling a lot of time outs, probably more than he thought he would. Knicks really got after them. Kanter did a nice job of passing out of double teams.

I like that Frank is taking more chances, cant wait until the game is almost out of reach. At least he's trying.

I will be surprised if Beasley doesnt draw some decent offers. Would rather sign him (for the right price) Hard to find a player with his skill set, who isn't gettting major money. An MLE type deal would be a bargain, if this is what we would get.

Willy still cant play D

Thought we had a shot, but I think Hornacek relied on Jack too much in the first half. Might have been better to give some minutes to Baker or Burke.

I cant think of any Knick coach this century who has had his players setting more screens for each other. Never understood how one Knicks coach after another would ignore such an important part of the game.

Didn't see the whole game and was only half watching but I recall 2 distinct plays in the first half: Shawn Livingston picking Willy and THJr on 2 different plays. Literally walked up to them in total open space (such that Willy and THJr could have easily side-stepped at a walking pace) and just stood behind them with his forearms up and checked them to a standstill without the player putting up a hint of fight to get around or even anticipate a pick. It was disgusting the lack of effort and anticipation. Willy and THJr's opponent got easy layups off of it.

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GustavBahler
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1/24/2018  11:19 AM
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Well, the first half was fun, lol. Dont believe GS was coasting the first half. Kerr was calling a lot of time outs, probably more than he thought he would. Knicks really got after them. Kanter did a nice job of passing out of double teams.

I like that Frank is taking more chances, cant wait until the game is almost out of reach. At least he's trying.

I will be surprised if Beasley doesnt draw some decent offers. Would rather sign him (for the right price) Hard to find a player with his skill set, who isn't gettting major money. An MLE type deal would be a bargain, if this is what we would get.

Willy still cant play D

Thought we had a shot, but I think Hornacek relied on Jack too much in the first half. Might have been better to give some minutes to Baker or Burke.

I cant think of any Knick coach this century who has had his players setting more screens for each other. Never understood how one Knicks coach after another would ignore such an important part of the game.

Didn't see the whole game and was only half watching but I recall 2 distinct plays in the first half: Shawn Livingston picking Willy and THJr on 2 different plays. Literally walked up to them in total open space (such that Willy and THJr could have easily side-stepped at a walking pace) and just stood behind them with his forearms up and checked them to a standstill without the player putting up a hint of fight to get around or even anticipate a pick. It was disgusting the lack of effort and anticipation. Willy and THJr's opponent got easy layups off of it.

Hardaway looked out if it at first. Looked a little nervous. His offense came around, dont know what the deal was on defense last night. He's been pretty good this season.

Willy just doesnt seem to care enough to play D with some attitude. Seeing more two way players coming from Europe these days. Willy is a throwback, as far as his attention to defense.

Hornacek getting players to set screens, help each other, is a big deal IMO. Agree they have to do a better job fighting through screens on D.

martin
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1/24/2018  11:22 AM
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Well, the first half was fun, lol. Dont believe GS was coasting the first half. Kerr was calling a lot of time outs, probably more than he thought he would. Knicks really got after them. Kanter did a nice job of passing out of double teams.

I like that Frank is taking more chances, cant wait until the game is almost out of reach. At least he's trying.

I will be surprised if Beasley doesnt draw some decent offers. Would rather sign him (for the right price) Hard to find a player with his skill set, who isn't gettting major money. An MLE type deal would be a bargain, if this is what we would get.

Willy still cant play D

Thought we had a shot, but I think Hornacek relied on Jack too much in the first half. Might have been better to give some minutes to Baker or Burke.

I cant think of any Knick coach this century who has had his players setting more screens for each other. Never understood how one Knicks coach after another would ignore such an important part of the game.

Didn't see the whole game and was only half watching but I recall 2 distinct plays in the first half: Shawn Livingston picking Willy and THJr on 2 different plays. Literally walked up to them in total open space (such that Willy and THJr could have easily side-stepped at a walking pace) and just stood behind them with his forearms up and checked them to a standstill without the player putting up a hint of fight to get around or even anticipate a pick. It was disgusting the lack of effort and anticipation. Willy and THJr's opponent got easy layups off of it.

Hardaway looked out if it at first. Looked a little nervous. His offense came around, dont know what the deal was on defense last night. He's been pretty good this season.

Willy just doesnt seem to care enough to play D with some attitude. Seeing more two way players coming from Europe these days. Willy is a throwback, as far as his attention to defense.

Hornacek getting players to set screens, help each other, is a big deal IMO. Agree they have to do a better job fighting through screens on D.

It's mind boggling to me that Willy doesn't play with enough effort and awareness especially because his playing time is limited. He should be playing like a man possessed.

His and Kanter's D are being exposed like no other.

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GustavBahler
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1/24/2018  11:26 AM
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Well, the first half was fun, lol. Dont believe GS was coasting the first half. Kerr was calling a lot of time outs, probably more than he thought he would. Knicks really got after them. Kanter did a nice job of passing out of double teams.

I like that Frank is taking more chances, cant wait until the game is almost out of reach. At least he's trying.

I will be surprised if Beasley doesnt draw some decent offers. Would rather sign him (for the right price) Hard to find a player with his skill set, who isn't gettting major money. An MLE type deal would be a bargain, if this is what we would get.

Willy still cant play D

Thought we had a shot, but I think Hornacek relied on Jack too much in the first half. Might have been better to give some minutes to Baker or Burke.

I cant think of any Knick coach this century who has had his players setting more screens for each other. Never understood how one Knicks coach after another would ignore such an important part of the game.

Didn't see the whole game and was only half watching but I recall 2 distinct plays in the first half: Shawn Livingston picking Willy and THJr on 2 different plays. Literally walked up to them in total open space (such that Willy and THJr could have easily side-stepped at a walking pace) and just stood behind them with his forearms up and checked them to a standstill without the player putting up a hint of fight to get around or even anticipate a pick. It was disgusting the lack of effort and anticipation. Willy and THJr's opponent got easy layups off of it.

Hardaway looked out if it at first. Looked a little nervous. His offense came around, dont know what the deal was on defense last night. He's been pretty good this season.

Willy just doesnt seem to care enough to play D with some attitude. Seeing more two way players coming from Europe these days. Willy is a throwback, as far as his attention to defense.

Hornacek getting players to set screens, help each other, is a big deal IMO. Agree they have to do a better job fighting through screens on D.

It's mind boggling to me that Willy doesn't play with enough effort and awareness especially because his playing time is limited. He should be playing like a man possessed.

His and Kanter's D are being exposed like no other.

As Ive said before, Willy acts like he is just happy to be here. Disagree about Kanter. I dont believe his defense is bad. He keeps his feet moving tries to stay in from of his man.

We have a an aging vet and a rookie PG, who are having trouble slowing people down. More work for the bigs.

martin
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1/24/2018  11:36 AM
GustavBahler wrote:As Ive said before, Willy acts like he is just happy to be here. Disagree about Kanter. I dont believe his defense is bad. He keeps his feet moving tries to stay in from of his man.

We have a an aging vet and a rookie PG, who are having trouble slowing people down. More work for the bigs.

I'm not as down as you are on Frank's D but let's start with a baseline that pretty much any decent guard can get past his guy through movement or pick or whatnot. Your team and especially your front line NEEDS to make sure they are helping out or at least be aware from a team perspective what and where they should be going.

Kanter does neither. And I don't think ANY player coming down the lane with Kanter firmly planted there (and without any other responsibility) would think twice about going right at him cause they know he can't do anything about it. And his court awareness as a weak side defender is just about zero. He has zero lift, which means zero intimidation as a big man; can't move his feet and position himself like Oak, so nothing there as well.

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GustavBahler
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1/24/2018  12:27 PM
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:As Ive said before, Willy acts like he is just happy to be here. Disagree about Kanter. I dont believe his defense is bad. He keeps his feet moving tries to stay in from of his man.

We have a an aging vet and a rookie PG, who are having trouble slowing people down. More work for the bigs.

I'm not as down as you are on Frank's D but let's start with a baseline that pretty much any decent guard can get past his guy through movement or pick or whatnot. Your team and especially your front line NEEDS to make sure they are helping out or at least be aware from a team perspective what and where they should be going.

Kanter does neither. And I don't think ANY player coming down the lane with Kanter firmly planted there (and without any other responsibility) would think twice about going right at him cause they know he can't do anything about it. And his court awareness as a weak side defender is just about zero. He has zero lift, which means zero intimidation as a big man; can't move his feet and position himself like Oak, so nothing there as well.

Im not down on Frank's ability on D, but he is still a rookie, and his D isnt as good as it was early on. As for Kanter, agree that his help defense needs...help. Man D however is where I disagree. Its better than you make it out to be IMO.

No one can stop good PGs altogether, but some are better at slowing them down, than others. I dont have the numbers, but I wouldn't be surprised if our PGs were ranked low in that dept. Makes it harder on the bigs.

Im more patient with players who put in the effort, but for whatever the reason isnt doing everything they need to in all aspects of the defense. Kanter is always moving his feet, puts in the effort, his
defense isnt as bad as I heard it was in OKC. Definitely room for improvement though.

fishmike
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1/24/2018  12:31 PM
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Well, the first half was fun, lol. Dont believe GS was coasting the first half. Kerr was calling a lot of time outs, probably more than he thought he would. Knicks really got after them. Kanter did a nice job of passing out of double teams.

I like that Frank is taking more chances, cant wait until the game is almost out of reach. At least he's trying.

I will be surprised if Beasley doesnt draw some decent offers. Would rather sign him (for the right price) Hard to find a player with his skill set, who isn't gettting major money. An MLE type deal would be a bargain, if this is what we would get.

Willy still cant play D

Thought we had a shot, but I think Hornacek relied on Jack too much in the first half. Might have been better to give some minutes to Baker or Burke.

I cant think of any Knick coach this century who has had his players setting more screens for each other. Never understood how one Knicks coach after another would ignore such an important part of the game.

Didn't see the whole game and was only half watching but I recall 2 distinct plays in the first half: Shawn Livingston picking Willy and THJr on 2 different plays. Literally walked up to them in total open space (such that Willy and THJr could have easily side-stepped at a walking pace) and just stood behind them with his forearms up and checked them to a standstill without the player putting up a hint of fight to get around or even anticipate a pick. It was disgusting the lack of effort and anticipation. Willy and THJr's opponent got easy layups off of it.

Hardaway looked out if it at first. Looked a little nervous. His offense came around, dont know what the deal was on defense last night. He's been pretty good this season.

Willy just doesnt seem to care enough to play D with some attitude. Seeing more two way players coming from Europe these days. Willy is a throwback, as far as his attention to defense.

Hornacek getting players to set screens, help each other, is a big deal IMO. Agree they have to do a better job fighting through screens on D.

It's mind boggling to me that Willy doesn't play with enough effort and awareness especially because his playing time is limited. He should be playing like a man possessed.

His and Kanter's D are being exposed like no other.

As Ive said before, Willy acts like he is just happy to be here. Disagree about Kanter. I dont believe his defense is bad. He keeps his feet moving tries to stay in from of his man.

We have a an aging vet and a rookie PG, who are having trouble slowing people down. More work for the bigs.

its bad. He tries hard on m2m with mixed results. He still get caught nightly not coming out to challenge jumpers. If you have a guy who shoots 3s like Lopez and Kanter is guarding him you can count on 5-6 open looks a night.

Kanter has improved but over all its been bad. Zero help defense. Zero rim protection. Great on the boards.

GustavBahler
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1/24/2018  12:42 PM
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Well, the first half was fun, lol. Dont believe GS was coasting the first half. Kerr was calling a lot of time outs, probably more than he thought he would. Knicks really got after them. Kanter did a nice job of passing out of double teams.

I like that Frank is taking more chances, cant wait until the game is almost out of reach. At least he's trying.

I will be surprised if Beasley doesnt draw some decent offers. Would rather sign him (for the right price) Hard to find a player with his skill set, who isn't gettting major money. An MLE type deal would be a bargain, if this is what we would get.

Willy still cant play D

Thought we had a shot, but I think Hornacek relied on Jack too much in the first half. Might have been better to give some minutes to Baker or Burke.

I cant think of any Knick coach this century who has had his players setting more screens for each other. Never understood how one Knicks coach after another would ignore such an important part of the game.

Didn't see the whole game and was only half watching but I recall 2 distinct plays in the first half: Shawn Livingston picking Willy and THJr on 2 different plays. Literally walked up to them in total open space (such that Willy and THJr could have easily side-stepped at a walking pace) and just stood behind them with his forearms up and checked them to a standstill without the player putting up a hint of fight to get around or even anticipate a pick. It was disgusting the lack of effort and anticipation. Willy and THJr's opponent got easy layups off of it.

Hardaway looked out if it at first. Looked a little nervous. His offense came around, dont know what the deal was on defense last night. He's been pretty good this season.

Willy just doesnt seem to care enough to play D with some attitude. Seeing more two way players coming from Europe these days. Willy is a throwback, as far as his attention to defense.

Hornacek getting players to set screens, help each other, is a big deal IMO. Agree they have to do a better job fighting through screens on D.

It's mind boggling to me that Willy doesn't play with enough effort and awareness especially because his playing time is limited. He should be playing like a man possessed.

His and Kanter's D are being exposed like no other.

As Ive said before, Willy acts like he is just happy to be here. Disagree about Kanter. I dont believe his defense is bad. He keeps his feet moving tries to stay in from of his man.

We have a an aging vet and a rookie PG, who are having trouble slowing people down. More work for the bigs.

its bad. He tries hard on m2m with mixed results. He still get caught nightly not coming out to challenge jumpers. If you have a guy who shoots 3s like Lopez and Kanter is guarding him you can count on 5-6 open looks a night.

Kanter has improved but over all its been bad. Zero help defense. Zero rim protection. Great on the boards.

If you mean blocks when you say "rim protection" no, thats been all KP. But he can stay in front of his man and force him into a bad shot. Until I see better perimeter D from the backcourt, I dont believe Kanter's D is bad enough for the Knicks to pass on making an offer. Not with the other things he brings to the table.

Kanter is 25, team defense can be taught, and Kanter seems willing to learn.

nixluva
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1/24/2018  2:03 PM
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:As Ive said before, Willy acts like he is just happy to be here. Disagree about Kanter. I dont believe his defense is bad. He keeps his feet moving tries to stay in from of his man.

We have a an aging vet and a rookie PG, who are having trouble slowing people down. More work for the bigs.

I'm not as down as you are on Frank's D but let's start with a baseline that pretty much any decent guard can get past his guy through movement or pick or whatnot. Your team and especially your front line NEEDS to make sure they are helping out or at least be aware from a team perspective what and where they should be going.

Kanter does neither. And I don't think ANY player coming down the lane with Kanter firmly planted there (and without any other responsibility) would think twice about going right at him cause they know he can't do anything about it. And his court awareness as a weak side defender is just about zero. He has zero lift, which means zero intimidation as a big man; can't move his feet and position himself like Oak, so nothing there as well.

Im not down on Frank's ability on D, but he is still a rookie, and his D isnt as good as it was early on. As for Kanter, agree that his help defense needs...help. Man D however is where I disagree. Its better than you make it out to be IMO.

No one can stop good PGs altogether, but some are better at slowing them down, than others. I dont have the numbers, but I wouldn't be surprised if our PGs were ranked low in that dept. Makes it harder on the bigs.

Im more patient with players who put in the effort, but for whatever the reason isnt doing everything they need to in all aspects of the defense. Kanter is always moving his feet, puts in the effort, his
defense isnt as bad as I heard it was in OKC. Definitely room for improvement though.

Frank's D is still very good. Sure he's going to have ups and downs but overall he's a STUD in training on D. He's NEVER played this much against such a high level of talent which is why ROOKIES tend to struggle. Thing is he's still showing much more than the typical 19 yr old rookie on D. Frank's D is the LEAST of our worries.

I've seen enough of Kanter. I believe Perry has as well. He can't anchor a Defense. He's only so, so as a team defender and can't protect the rim. It's going to be imperative that Perry upgrades the PF/C spots with more Length, Athletic ability and Rim Protection. We need defenders that can cover more ground quickly. We need players that can play above the rim as well. Skilled but also athletic.

fishmike
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1/24/2018  2:32 PM
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Well, the first half was fun, lol. Dont believe GS was coasting the first half. Kerr was calling a lot of time outs, probably more than he thought he would. Knicks really got after them. Kanter did a nice job of passing out of double teams.

I like that Frank is taking more chances, cant wait until the game is almost out of reach. At least he's trying.

I will be surprised if Beasley doesnt draw some decent offers. Would rather sign him (for the right price) Hard to find a player with his skill set, who isn't gettting major money. An MLE type deal would be a bargain, if this is what we would get.

Willy still cant play D

Thought we had a shot, but I think Hornacek relied on Jack too much in the first half. Might have been better to give some minutes to Baker or Burke.

I cant think of any Knick coach this century who has had his players setting more screens for each other. Never understood how one Knicks coach after another would ignore such an important part of the game.

Didn't see the whole game and was only half watching but I recall 2 distinct plays in the first half: Shawn Livingston picking Willy and THJr on 2 different plays. Literally walked up to them in total open space (such that Willy and THJr could have easily side-stepped at a walking pace) and just stood behind them with his forearms up and checked them to a standstill without the player putting up a hint of fight to get around or even anticipate a pick. It was disgusting the lack of effort and anticipation. Willy and THJr's opponent got easy layups off of it.

Hardaway looked out if it at first. Looked a little nervous. His offense came around, dont know what the deal was on defense last night. He's been pretty good this season.

Willy just doesnt seem to care enough to play D with some attitude. Seeing more two way players coming from Europe these days. Willy is a throwback, as far as his attention to defense.

Hornacek getting players to set screens, help each other, is a big deal IMO. Agree they have to do a better job fighting through screens on D.

It's mind boggling to me that Willy doesn't play with enough effort and awareness especially because his playing time is limited. He should be playing like a man possessed.

His and Kanter's D are being exposed like no other.

As Ive said before, Willy acts like he is just happy to be here. Disagree about Kanter. I dont believe his defense is bad. He keeps his feet moving tries to stay in from of his man.

We have a an aging vet and a rookie PG, who are having trouble slowing people down. More work for the bigs.

its bad. He tries hard on m2m with mixed results. He still get caught nightly not coming out to challenge jumpers. If you have a guy who shoots 3s like Lopez and Kanter is guarding him you can count on 5-6 open looks a night.

Kanter has improved but over all its been bad. Zero help defense. Zero rim protection. Great on the boards.

If you mean blocks when you say "rim protection" no, thats been all KP. But he can stay in front of his man and force him into a bad shot. Until I see better perimeter D from the backcourt, I dont believe Kanter's D is bad enough for the Knicks to pass on making an offer. Not with the other things he brings to the table.

Kanter is 25, team defense can be taught, and Kanter seems willing to learn.

but he's been playing at this level for awhile and really hasnt.
Look at what opposing centers shoot vs. Kanter: http://www.82games.com/1718/17NYK19.HTM (.625)
vs. last year (as a bench player)
http://www.82games.com/1617/16OKC18.HTM (.533)

That .625 is a real eye sore... and Kanter fails the eye test. Zaza scored 13pts on 5-6 shooting in limited minutes last night.
Lopez had 14 points in 14 minutes and shot 4-6 from downtown

Feels like whoever Kanter goes against ends up with bloated numbers

Zebo13
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1/24/2018  3:52 PM
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Well, the first half was fun, lol. Dont believe GS was coasting the first half. Kerr was calling a lot of time outs, probably more than he thought he would. Knicks really got after them. Kanter did a nice job of passing out of double teams.

I like that Frank is taking more chances, cant wait until the game is almost out of reach. At least he's trying.

I will be surprised if Beasley doesnt draw some decent offers. Would rather sign him (for the right price) Hard to find a player with his skill set, who isn't gettting major money. An MLE type deal would be a bargain, if this is what we would get.

Willy still cant play D

Thought we had a shot, but I think Hornacek relied on Jack too much in the first half. Might have been better to give some minutes to Baker or Burke.

I cant think of any Knick coach this century who has had his players setting more screens for each other. Never understood how one Knicks coach after another would ignore such an important part of the game.

Didn't see the whole game and was only half watching but I recall 2 distinct plays in the first half: Shawn Livingston picking Willy and THJr on 2 different plays. Literally walked up to them in total open space (such that Willy and THJr could have easily side-stepped at a walking pace) and just stood behind them with his forearms up and checked them to a standstill without the player putting up a hint of fight to get around or even anticipate a pick. It was disgusting the lack of effort and anticipation. Willy and THJr's opponent got easy layups off of it.

Hardaway looked out if it at first. Looked a little nervous. His offense came around, dont know what the deal was on defense last night. He's been pretty good this season.

Willy just doesnt seem to care enough to play D with some attitude. Seeing more two way players coming from Europe these days. Willy is a throwback, as far as his attention to defense.

Hornacek getting players to set screens, help each other, is a big deal IMO. Agree they have to do a better job fighting through screens on D.

It's mind boggling to me that Willy doesn't play with enough effort and awareness especially because his playing time is limited. He should be playing like a man possessed.

His and Kanter's D are being exposed like no other.

As Ive said before, Willy acts like he is just happy to be here. Disagree about Kanter. I dont believe his defense is bad. He keeps his feet moving tries to stay in from of his man.

We have a an aging vet and a rookie PG, who are having trouble slowing people down. More work for the bigs.

its bad. He tries hard on m2m with mixed results. He still get caught nightly not coming out to challenge jumpers. If you have a guy who shoots 3s like Lopez and Kanter is guarding him you can count on 5-6 open looks a night.

Kanter has improved but over all its been bad. Zero help defense. Zero rim protection. Great on the boards.

If you mean blocks when you say "rim protection" no, thats been all KP. But he can stay in front of his man and force him into a bad shot. Until I see better perimeter D from the backcourt, I dont believe Kanter's D is bad enough for the Knicks to pass on making an offer. Not with the other things he brings to the table.

Kanter is 25, team defense can be taught, and Kanter seems willing to learn.

but he's been playing at this level for awhile and really hasnt.
Look at what opposing centers shoot vs. Kanter: http://www.82games.com/1718/17NYK19.HTM (.625)
vs. last year (as a bench player)
http://www.82games.com/1617/16OKC18.HTM (.533)

That .625 is a real eye sore... and Kanter fails the eye test. Zaza scored 13pts on 5-6 shooting in limited minutes last night.
Lopez had 14 points in 14 minutes and shot 4-6 from downtown

Feels like whoever Kanter goes against ends up with bloated numbers

Agree 100%. Whoever is their starting C has career games vs Kanter. His inside scoring and OREB’s are nice but are not worth the trade off at all. Every point he scores he gives up at least the same on the other end. Not good.

fishmike
Posts: 48582
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1/24/2018  5:00 PM
Zebo13 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Well, the first half was fun, lol. Dont believe GS was coasting the first half. Kerr was calling a lot of time outs, probably more than he thought he would. Knicks really got after them. Kanter did a nice job of passing out of double teams.

I like that Frank is taking more chances, cant wait until the game is almost out of reach. At least he's trying.

I will be surprised if Beasley doesnt draw some decent offers. Would rather sign him (for the right price) Hard to find a player with his skill set, who isn't gettting major money. An MLE type deal would be a bargain, if this is what we would get.

Willy still cant play D

Thought we had a shot, but I think Hornacek relied on Jack too much in the first half. Might have been better to give some minutes to Baker or Burke.

I cant think of any Knick coach this century who has had his players setting more screens for each other. Never understood how one Knicks coach after another would ignore such an important part of the game.

Didn't see the whole game and was only half watching but I recall 2 distinct plays in the first half: Shawn Livingston picking Willy and THJr on 2 different plays. Literally walked up to them in total open space (such that Willy and THJr could have easily side-stepped at a walking pace) and just stood behind them with his forearms up and checked them to a standstill without the player putting up a hint of fight to get around or even anticipate a pick. It was disgusting the lack of effort and anticipation. Willy and THJr's opponent got easy layups off of it.

Hardaway looked out if it at first. Looked a little nervous. His offense came around, dont know what the deal was on defense last night. He's been pretty good this season.

Willy just doesnt seem to care enough to play D with some attitude. Seeing more two way players coming from Europe these days. Willy is a throwback, as far as his attention to defense.

Hornacek getting players to set screens, help each other, is a big deal IMO. Agree they have to do a better job fighting through screens on D.

It's mind boggling to me that Willy doesn't play with enough effort and awareness especially because his playing time is limited. He should be playing like a man possessed.

His and Kanter's D are being exposed like no other.

As Ive said before, Willy acts like he is just happy to be here. Disagree about Kanter. I dont believe his defense is bad. He keeps his feet moving tries to stay in from of his man.

We have a an aging vet and a rookie PG, who are having trouble slowing people down. More work for the bigs.

its bad. He tries hard on m2m with mixed results. He still get caught nightly not coming out to challenge jumpers. If you have a guy who shoots 3s like Lopez and Kanter is guarding him you can count on 5-6 open looks a night.

Kanter has improved but over all its been bad. Zero help defense. Zero rim protection. Great on the boards.

If you mean blocks when you say "rim protection" no, thats been all KP. But he can stay in front of his man and force him into a bad shot. Until I see better perimeter D from the backcourt, I dont believe Kanter's D is bad enough for the Knicks to pass on making an offer. Not with the other things he brings to the table.

Kanter is 25, team defense can be taught, and Kanter seems willing to learn.

but he's been playing at this level for awhile and really hasnt.
Look at what opposing centers shoot vs. Kanter: http://www.82games.com/1718/17NYK19.HTM (.625)
vs. last year (as a bench player)
http://www.82games.com/1617/16OKC18.HTM (.533)

That .625 is a real eye sore... and Kanter fails the eye test. Zaza scored 13pts on 5-6 shooting in limited minutes last night.
Lopez had 14 points in 14 minutes and shot 4-6 from downtown

Feels like whoever Kanter goes against ends up with bloated numbers

Agree 100%. Whoever is their starting C has career games vs Kanter. His inside scoring and OREB’s are nice but are not worth the trade off at all. Every point he scores he gives up at least the same on the other end. Not good.

When its Embiid and Boogie its one thing. Those guys are gonna get their numbers. When Zaza is getting buckets its bad. When BroPez is shooting 4-6 from downtown and each one is a wide open look its bad.

I like Kanter a lot. He can def play a role but I doubt he would take that here. He's best suited for the 2nd unit where he can feast on the boards, gobble up easy buckets and you get him out of there before his defense hurts. Would he take a bench role? Do we want to pay him to be a bench player? Hard to see that playing out after starting the first half here with some success

Going up vs. other team's starters is a problem.

GustavBahler
Posts: 34104
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1/24/2018  5:22 PM
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Well, the first half was fun, lol. Dont believe GS was coasting the first half. Kerr was calling a lot of time outs, probably more than he thought he would. Knicks really got after them. Kanter did a nice job of passing out of double teams.

I like that Frank is taking more chances, cant wait until the game is almost out of reach. At least he's trying.

I will be surprised if Beasley doesnt draw some decent offers. Would rather sign him (for the right price) Hard to find a player with his skill set, who isn't gettting major money. An MLE type deal would be a bargain, if this is what we would get.

Willy still cant play D

Thought we had a shot, but I think Hornacek relied on Jack too much in the first half. Might have been better to give some minutes to Baker or Burke.

I cant think of any Knick coach this century who has had his players setting more screens for each other. Never understood how one Knicks coach after another would ignore such an important part of the game.

Didn't see the whole game and was only half watching but I recall 2 distinct plays in the first half: Shawn Livingston picking Willy and THJr on 2 different plays. Literally walked up to them in total open space (such that Willy and THJr could have easily side-stepped at a walking pace) and just stood behind them with his forearms up and checked them to a standstill without the player putting up a hint of fight to get around or even anticipate a pick. It was disgusting the lack of effort and anticipation. Willy and THJr's opponent got easy layups off of it.

Hardaway looked out if it at first. Looked a little nervous. His offense came around, dont know what the deal was on defense last night. He's been pretty good this season.

Willy just doesnt seem to care enough to play D with some attitude. Seeing more two way players coming from Europe these days. Willy is a throwback, as far as his attention to defense.

Hornacek getting players to set screens, help each other, is a big deal IMO. Agree they have to do a better job fighting through screens on D.

It's mind boggling to me that Willy doesn't play with enough effort and awareness especially because his playing time is limited. He should be playing like a man possessed.

His and Kanter's D are being exposed like no other.

As Ive said before, Willy acts like he is just happy to be here. Disagree about Kanter. I dont believe his defense is bad. He keeps his feet moving tries to stay in from of his man.

We have a an aging vet and a rookie PG, who are having trouble slowing people down. More work for the bigs.

its bad. He tries hard on m2m with mixed results. He still get caught nightly not coming out to challenge jumpers. If you have a guy who shoots 3s like Lopez and Kanter is guarding him you can count on 5-6 open looks a night.

Kanter has improved but over all its been bad. Zero help defense. Zero rim protection. Great on the boards.

If you mean blocks when you say "rim protection" no, thats been all KP. But he can stay in front of his man and force him into a bad shot. Until I see better perimeter D from the backcourt, I dont believe Kanter's D is bad enough for the Knicks to pass on making an offer. Not with the other things he brings to the table.

Kanter is 25, team defense can be taught, and Kanter seems willing to learn.

but he's been playing at this level for awhile and really hasnt.
Look at what opposing centers shoot vs. Kanter: http://www.82games.com/1718/17NYK19.HTM (.625)
vs. last year (as a bench player)
http://www.82games.com/1617/16OKC18.HTM (.533)

That .625 is a real eye sore... and Kanter fails the eye test. Zaza scored 13pts on 5-6 shooting in limited minutes last night.
Lopez had 14 points in 14 minutes and shot 4-6 from downtown

Feels like whoever Kanter goes against ends up with bloated numbers

Kanter has abused many good defensive bigs as well. Lopez can put good numbers up on elite defenders, nevermind Kanter. Saw that in NY.

Again, Lopez wasnt good enough. Kanter isnt good enough. Its like we have to have the best center in the league, or no one at all. Not buying that Kanter is incapable of improving on D.

Zebo13
Posts: 20376
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1/24/2018  5:43 PM
fishmike wrote:
Zebo13 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
fishmike wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Well, the first half was fun, lol. Dont believe GS was coasting the first half. Kerr was calling a lot of time outs, probably more than he thought he would. Knicks really got after them. Kanter did a nice job of passing out of double teams.

I like that Frank is taking more chances, cant wait until the game is almost out of reach. At least he's trying.

I will be surprised if Beasley doesnt draw some decent offers. Would rather sign him (for the right price) Hard to find a player with his skill set, who isn't gettting major money. An MLE type deal would be a bargain, if this is what we would get.

Willy still cant play D

Thought we had a shot, but I think Hornacek relied on Jack too much in the first half. Might have been better to give some minutes to Baker or Burke.

I cant think of any Knick coach this century who has had his players setting more screens for each other. Never understood how one Knicks coach after another would ignore such an important part of the game.

Didn't see the whole game and was only half watching but I recall 2 distinct plays in the first half: Shawn Livingston picking Willy and THJr on 2 different plays. Literally walked up to them in total open space (such that Willy and THJr could have easily side-stepped at a walking pace) and just stood behind them with his forearms up and checked them to a standstill without the player putting up a hint of fight to get around or even anticipate a pick. It was disgusting the lack of effort and anticipation. Willy and THJr's opponent got easy layups off of it.

Hardaway looked out if it at first. Looked a little nervous. His offense came around, dont know what the deal was on defense last night. He's been pretty good this season.

Willy just doesnt seem to care enough to play D with some attitude. Seeing more two way players coming from Europe these days. Willy is a throwback, as far as his attention to defense.

Hornacek getting players to set screens, help each other, is a big deal IMO. Agree they have to do a better job fighting through screens on D.

It's mind boggling to me that Willy doesn't play with enough effort and awareness especially because his playing time is limited. He should be playing like a man possessed.

His and Kanter's D are being exposed like no other.

As Ive said before, Willy acts like he is just happy to be here. Disagree about Kanter. I dont believe his defense is bad. He keeps his feet moving tries to stay in from of his man.

We have a an aging vet and a rookie PG, who are having trouble slowing people down. More work for the bigs.

its bad. He tries hard on m2m with mixed results. He still get caught nightly not coming out to challenge jumpers. If you have a guy who shoots 3s like Lopez and Kanter is guarding him you can count on 5-6 open looks a night.

Kanter has improved but over all its been bad. Zero help defense. Zero rim protection. Great on the boards.

If you mean blocks when you say "rim protection" no, thats been all KP. But he can stay in front of his man and force him into a bad shot. Until I see better perimeter D from the backcourt, I dont believe Kanter's D is bad enough for the Knicks to pass on making an offer. Not with the other things he brings to the table.

Kanter is 25, team defense can be taught, and Kanter seems willing to learn.

but he's been playing at this level for awhile and really hasnt.
Look at what opposing centers shoot vs. Kanter: http://www.82games.com/1718/17NYK19.HTM (.625)
vs. last year (as a bench player)
http://www.82games.com/1617/16OKC18.HTM (.533)

That .625 is a real eye sore... and Kanter fails the eye test. Zaza scored 13pts on 5-6 shooting in limited minutes last night.
Lopez had 14 points in 14 minutes and shot 4-6 from downtown

Feels like whoever Kanter goes against ends up with bloated numbers

Agree 100%. Whoever is their starting C has career games vs Kanter. His inside scoring and OREB’s are nice but are not worth the trade off at all. Every point he scores he gives up at least the same on the other end. Not good.

When its Embiid and Boogie its one thing. Those guys are gonna get their numbers. When Zaza is getting buckets its bad. When BroPez is shooting 4-6 from downtown and each one is a wide open look its bad.

I like Kanter a lot. He can def play a role but I doubt he would take that here. He's best suited for the 2nd unit where he can feast on the boards, gobble up easy buckets and you get him out of there before his defense hurts. Would he take a bench role? Do we want to pay him to be a bench player? Hard to see that playing out after starting the first half here with some success

Going up vs. other team's starters is a problem.

He actually does ok against big name centers it seems. Steps up to the challenge and they just try and take him man to man. It’s guys like Vucevic dropping 30 that I have a problem with, which comes back to his awful team D.

martin
Posts: 47288
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1/24/2018  7:23 PM
I remember Kanter having about 1 or 2 really good games this year where he stood out as integral to the win... offensively. I don't remember 1 defensive game where I came away seeing Kanter and thinking, man that was nice. Not one.
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CrushAlot
Posts: 56400
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Joined: 7/25/2003
Member: #452
USA
1/24/2018  8:56 PM
Cartman718 wrote:
dwiley20 wrote:Noah got yanked and started screaming at the coaches...lol after like 2 minutes of play smh

thought he was screaming at ntilikina

Watching it now. He did yell at Ntilikina. I didn't see him yelling at the coaches but he might have. He looked good. Not sure why he didn't get more minutes v
You playTrey Burke... Wally Szcerbiak
CrushAlot
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1/24/2018  9:12 PM
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Well, the first half was fun, lol. Dont believe GS was coasting the first half. Kerr was calling a lot of time outs, probably more than he thought he would. Knicks really got after them. Kanter did a nice job of passing out of double teams.

I like that Frank is taking more chances, cant wait until the game is almost out of reach. At least he's trying.

I will be surprised if Beasley doesnt draw some decent offers. Would rather sign him (for the right price) Hard to find a player with his skill set, who isn't gettting major money. An MLE type deal would be a bargain, if this is what we would get.

Willy still cant play D

Thought we had a shot, but I think Hornacek relied on Jack too much in the first half. Might have been better to give some minutes to Baker or Burke.

I cant think of any Knick coach this century who has had his players setting more screens for each other. Never understood how one Knicks coach after another would ignore such an important part of the game.

Didn't see the whole game and was only half watching but I recall 2 distinct plays in the first half: Shawn Livingston picking Willy and THJr on 2 different plays. Literally walked up to them in total open space (such that Willy and THJr could have easily side-stepped at a walking pace) and just stood behind them with his forearms up and checked them to a standstill without the player putting up a hint of fight to get around or even anticipate a pick. It was disgusting the lack of effort and anticipation. Willy and THJr's opponent got easy layups off of it.

Hardaway looked out if it at first. Looked a little nervous. His offense came around, dont know what the deal was on defense last night. He's been pretty good this season.

Willy just doesnt seem to care enough to play D with some attitude. Seeing more two way players coming from Europe these days. Willy is a throwback, as far as his attention to defense.

Hornacek getting players to set screens, help each other, is a big deal IMO. Agree they have to do a better job fighting through screens on D.

It's mind boggling to me that Willy doesn't play with enough effort and awareness especially because his playing time is limited. He should be playing like a man possessed.

His and Kanter's D are being exposed like no other.

And Noah was going all out, looked good and got pulled. Not sure what was up with that. The outcome was pretty much decided. Hope it didn't have anything to do with him calling out Frank on d.
You playTrey Burke... Wally Szcerbiak
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