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Unless there is a taker for Noah by deadline
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GoNyGoNyGo
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12/12/2017  7:52 AM
I am sorry but Kanter should not be traded. He has a player option for next year and he will stay. He is the heart of this team right now.
Yet another mistake by Dolan. When will it end?
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NardDogNation
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12/12/2017  10:44 AM
ekstarks94 wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
ekstarks94 wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
ekstarks94 wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
ekstarks94 wrote:Not trading Kanter unless he wants $$$$...which Perry will know beforehand...It says something that you have a player that takes pride in being a Knick...this is the whole reason for the culture change that Mills and Perry are embarking on...short of getting a top 5 or 101 pick I am not trading him...if you trade him it will be a salary match and you have to take some longterm dollars on.....for what a pick 15-30...no thanks...

So the fact that he can never play against the best teams in the league in the playoffs doesn't phase you? And you're willing to make a multi-year commitment to that?

What teams can he not play against...GS...who else...I would like to see Draymknd and KD try to box him out on the offensive glass

Basically any team that forces the tempo, can force switches and score from the perimeter at the big man spots....which is quickly becoming every team in the league. Against the Rockets, he averaged all of 9mpg in the playoffs as a result of his defensive shortcomings in those situations. And this is the guy that is suppose to be the future 5 man of this team? A guy that you can't play when it matters most?

The guy is not a plodder...is he first team defense no....but his offensive rebounding is elite and he muscle any small man 5.......Last year is a different chapter...if he was doing what he did in the playoffs last year we would be talking right now how good Willy looks next to KP and lamenting $35 mill in salaries at center sitting on the bench....and we would probably be 5-7 games under .500


What center..."attainable" ...would fit your 5 man?

You mean, any-and-everything that establishes a body of work for Kanter (and substantiates my point) is irrelevant? Why? Because none of what I said needed to involve "possibility" and conjecture to validate.

As much as I love Kanter's story and heart, I can't ignore what he's been and will be. The guy is a nice piece to have to get regular season wins but can't generate much value when it matters most. There is some utility in that kind of profile but let's not pretend it is something aspirational for a 5-man.

Look ......I'm not asking to play word with friends...I'm asking a simple question what is the better alternative next to KP that would be better.

This is the problem i see....what in your mind distinguishes a player as a foundational piece vs. someone on a one year rental? Talent is still talent...I read that he is only playing like this in a contract year....but there is also the remote possibility that this a good situation and he wants to be part of the future...

Again...What u are saying is that we do not need to invest in a player like this for myriad of reasons....I am asking without the word play .....what would be better???? if you have no one in mind just say it...if you have someone than throw it out there for debate....

We as a team do not have to match these "uptempo" teams player for player....we need pieces that fit our system and that actually work...we see evidence of that now....what more or else do you want.

Word with friends? I pointed to Kanter's 8-season career to justify my position. You pointed to +20 games he's played with the Knicks and did your best to ignore warts that made him expendable at his other destinations. That's all I've pointed out.

And now you seem to be moving the goalpost. This conversation was not about what/who is the best fit next to KP; it specifically was about Kanter's fit next to KP. But if you want to do that, I'll oblige.

I think the prototype for an ideal big next to Kristaps would be Draymond Green i.e. a Swiss-Army knife that can also make the hustle plays so that KP won't have to. But there is only one Draymond Green and we are not getting Draymond Green, which means we need to work free agency, the draft and player development to develop a guy with a similar skillset albeit as a poor man's version. If no one by that profile is attainable, I'm more than willing to continue to focus on developing Hernangomez at $1 million per season, in hopes of either making him a cog on this team or a trade asset. But burning resources on Kanter longterm seems like a fool's errand on par with David Lee, Eddy Curry, etc.

NardDogNation
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12/12/2017  10:45 AM
Bonn1997 wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:We should see what we can get for Kanter.

We simply have too much $ allocated at 5. Open up the cap space--see if we can get a pick and ending contract

Lee Kanter Noah and Oquinn should all be firmly on the block as of game 25--were not winning crp--were 1-8 on the road and -7 H away for games played.

GS puts cheap C in place and gets great results--so does SA. We cant have 45mm at the C.


KP needs a center that can score in the post and rebound like a fiend. Kanter checks a number of the boxes to maximize KP. Unless we can get Draymond Green somehow Kanter si the best we can do for now

...with Willy Hernangomez sitting on the bench, only being owed $2 million for this and next season? I disagree. I like Kanter but he is a misutilization of resources.

Hopefully that is an option he still has 55 or so games to prove it


How much would you pay Kanter? I think he'll get 80 to 100 mil.

Would you give him that though?

Bonn1997
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12/12/2017  10:51 AM
NardDogNation wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:We should see what we can get for Kanter.

We simply have too much $ allocated at 5. Open up the cap space--see if we can get a pick and ending contract

Lee Kanter Noah and Oquinn should all be firmly on the block as of game 25--were not winning crp--were 1-8 on the road and -7 H away for games played.

GS puts cheap C in place and gets great results--so does SA. We cant have 45mm at the C.


KP needs a center that can score in the post and rebound like a fiend. Kanter checks a number of the boxes to maximize KP. Unless we can get Draymond Green somehow Kanter si the best we can do for now

...with Willy Hernangomez sitting on the bench, only being owed $2 million for this and next season? I disagree. I like Kanter but he is a misutilization of resources.

Hopefully that is an option he still has 55 or so games to prove it


How much would you pay Kanter? I think he'll get 80 to 100 mil.

Would you give him that though?


I haven't made up my mind for sure. I want to give it about 6 more weeks. But I'm leaning about 80% in the direction of no.
NardDogNation
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12/12/2017  10:52 AM
GoNyGoNyGo wrote:I am sorry but Kanter should not be traded. He has a player option for next year and he will stay. He is the heart of this team right now.

The heart of a team that likely wouldn't even be in the playoffs if it started today? That doesn't seem to be saying much.

And don't tell me about injuries. The Spurs have missed their franchise player all season and yet are in the thick of things out West. Good teams perform well under the most strenous circumstances. We are not that and worst still, are not positioned to become that. Let Kanter walk, cut costs while recouping draft picks and focus on player development and the draft!

NardDogNation
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12/12/2017  11:32 AM
Bonn1997 wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:We should see what we can get for Kanter.

We simply have too much $ allocated at 5. Open up the cap space--see if we can get a pick and ending contract

Lee Kanter Noah and Oquinn should all be firmly on the block as of game 25--were not winning crp--were 1-8 on the road and -7 H away for games played.

GS puts cheap C in place and gets great results--so does SA. We cant have 45mm at the C.


KP needs a center that can score in the post and rebound like a fiend. Kanter checks a number of the boxes to maximize KP. Unless we can get Draymond Green somehow Kanter si the best we can do for now

...with Willy Hernangomez sitting on the bench, only being owed $2 million for this and next season? I disagree. I like Kanter but he is a misutilization of resources.

Hopefully that is an option he still has 55 or so games to prove it


How much would you pay Kanter? I think he'll get 80 to 100 mil.

Would you give him that though?


I haven't made up my mind for sure. I want to give it about 6 more weeks. But I'm leaning about 80% in the direction of no.

What would he have to demonstrate to warrant a $80-$100 million (presumably 4 year) contract, though?

Bonn1997
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12/12/2017  11:41 AM    LAST EDITED: 12/12/2017  11:42 AM
NardDogNation wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:We should see what we can get for Kanter.

We simply have too much $ allocated at 5. Open up the cap space--see if we can get a pick and ending contract

Lee Kanter Noah and Oquinn should all be firmly on the block as of game 25--were not winning crp--were 1-8 on the road and -7 H away for games played.

GS puts cheap C in place and gets great results--so does SA. We cant have 45mm at the C.


KP needs a center that can score in the post and rebound like a fiend. Kanter checks a number of the boxes to maximize KP. Unless we can get Draymond Green somehow Kanter si the best we can do for now

...with Willy Hernangomez sitting on the bench, only being owed $2 million for this and next season? I disagree. I like Kanter but he is a misutilization of resources.

Hopefully that is an option he still has 55 or so games to prove it


How much would you pay Kanter? I think he'll get 80 to 100 mil.

Would you give him that though?


I haven't made up my mind for sure. I want to give it about 6 more weeks. But I'm leaning about 80% in the direction of no.

What would he have to demonstrate to warrant a $80-$100 million (presumably 4 year) contract, though?


I'm not sure about his durability and I'm still concerned about his on/off #s (-6.3 per 48). Can he actually handle playing starter's minutes (not 25 mpg)? For $100 mil, you need to be a durable, full-time starter. Even then, will he bring $50 to 60 mil more productivity than KOQ plus Willy? (That's how much more I'm guessing he'll cost.) You have to compare that to KOQ playing center and us signing a $50 or 60 mil PG or SF. I'm expressing skepticism but I'm still unsure and open-minded.
NardDogNation
Posts: 26796
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12/12/2017  6:57 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/12/2017  7:00 PM
Bonn1997 wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:We should see what we can get for Kanter.

We simply have too much $ allocated at 5. Open up the cap space--see if we can get a pick and ending contract

Lee Kanter Noah and Oquinn should all be firmly on the block as of game 25--were not winning crp--were 1-8 on the road and -7 H away for games played.

GS puts cheap C in place and gets great results--so does SA. We cant have 45mm at the C.


KP needs a center that can score in the post and rebound like a fiend. Kanter checks a number of the boxes to maximize KP. Unless we can get Draymond Green somehow Kanter si the best we can do for now

...with Willy Hernangomez sitting on the bench, only being owed $2 million for this and next season? I disagree. I like Kanter but he is a misutilization of resources.

Hopefully that is an option he still has 55 or so games to prove it


How much would you pay Kanter? I think he'll get 80 to 100 mil.

Would you give him that though?


I haven't made up my mind for sure. I want to give it about 6 more weeks. But I'm leaning about 80% in the direction of no.

What would he have to demonstrate to warrant a $80-$100 million (presumably 4 year) contract, though?


I'm not sure about his durability and I'm still concerned about his on/off #s (-6.3 per 48). Can he actually handle playing starter's minutes (not 25 mpg)? For $100 mil, you need to be a durable, full-time starter. Even then, will he bring $50 to 60 mil more productivity than KOQ plus Willy? (That's how much more I'm guessing he'll cost.) You have to compare that to KOQ playing center and us signing a $50 or 60 mil PG or SF. I'm expressing skepticism but I'm still unsure and open-minded.

Even if he meets that criteria, I don't think he passes the Nene test i.e. someone who gets a new contract and becomes/remains a commodity that can be moved to another team as Nene was for JaVale McGee. Do you think there would be a market for him at that pricetag?

Unless there is a taker for Noah by deadline

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