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Gamethread: KP questionable tonight vs. Magic
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KnickDanger
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11/9/2017  3:46 PM
OldFan wrote:OldFan wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Even with the improved play of Jack and Frank, most teams have us beat in terms of PG's that can break down a defense and score. We also are weak at SF in terms of a versatile scoring threat. Any improvements in these areas will have a significant impact.
All of our guards are fairly similar so maybe that's why they have interest in Burke who is at least a change of pace. I can see him eventually getting the call up to see if he can be that change of pace spark plug type. He's not a big time player of course but sometimes just giving teams a different look can help. A smaller quicker and shiftier PG that is a scoring threat could round out the team a bit.
I'm much more interested in having more scoring from positions other than PG. I think our point guards are giving us more than expected. Their most important jobs are managing the offense, distributing the ball and playing defense. They're doing those things better than any point guards we've had in recent history.
Frank will get better at scoring over time but I can wait, he's showing great potential running the team and playing defense.
Our PGs are shooting 35 to 39%. It's awfully hard to win NBA games like that.

The main point is they run the offense and play defense. Which I think is more important for the PGs than scoring and more than we've gotten from our point guards in years.
Rose - could score, but did run the offense or play D.
Calderon - Tried to run the offense but could not score or play D.
Felton - Could not do much of anything.

We're over .500 getting no scoring from our starting 3 and inefficient scoring from our starting 2. If Lee can find a way to score and Timmy gets more efficient I think that's more important than getting scoring from the PGS.

Not saying they don't need to improve just that I'm happy with what we've gotten so far and I don't think the PG lack of scoring is our biggest problem. (And at least they aren't forcing it combined they take less then 10 shots per game.)

To be fair, Felton had his moments when he wasn't discovering all the fine cuisine New York has to offer. But I completely agree -- what I've wanted is a point guard in the mold of Jason Kidd (on the court) -- runs the offense, good instincts at setting up others, strong D including effort. And a leader. The ability to score is of course important, but not if it's all you do. I am very pleased with the Jack/Frank combo, especially as it seems it will get better, Frank in particular.

AUTOADVERT
fishmike
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11/9/2017  4:54 PM
KnickDanger wrote:
OldFan wrote:OldFan wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Even with the improved play of Jack and Frank, most teams have us beat in terms of PG's that can break down a defense and score. We also are weak at SF in terms of a versatile scoring threat. Any improvements in these areas will have a significant impact.
All of our guards are fairly similar so maybe that's why they have interest in Burke who is at least a change of pace. I can see him eventually getting the call up to see if he can be that change of pace spark plug type. He's not a big time player of course but sometimes just giving teams a different look can help. A smaller quicker and shiftier PG that is a scoring threat could round out the team a bit.
I'm much more interested in having more scoring from positions other than PG. I think our point guards are giving us more than expected. Their most important jobs are managing the offense, distributing the ball and playing defense. They're doing those things better than any point guards we've had in recent history.
Frank will get better at scoring over time but I can wait, he's showing great potential running the team and playing defense.
Our PGs are shooting 35 to 39%. It's awfully hard to win NBA games like that.

The main point is they run the offense and play defense. Which I think is more important for the PGs than scoring and more than we've gotten from our point guards in years.
Rose - could score, but did run the offense or play D.
Calderon - Tried to run the offense but could not score or play D.
Felton - Could not do much of anything.

We're over .500 getting no scoring from our starting 3 and inefficient scoring from our starting 2. If Lee can find a way to score and Timmy gets more efficient I think that's more important than getting scoring from the PGS.

Not saying they don't need to improve just that I'm happy with what we've gotten so far and I don't think the PG lack of scoring is our biggest problem. (And at least they aren't forcing it combined they take less then 10 shots per game.)

To be fair, Felton had his moments when he wasn't discovering all the fine cuisine New York has to offer. But I completely agree -- what I've wanted is a point guard in the mold of Jason Kidd (on the court) -- runs the offense, good instincts at setting up others, strong D including effort. And a leader. The ability to score is of course important, but not if it's all you do. I am very pleased with the Jack/Frank combo, especially as it seems it will get better, Frank in particular.

Frank's REAL value will be his ability to make others better. Frank is averaging 8pts, 9ast and 2.8 steals per 36 mins and he's playing defense at a very high level (dare I say all NBA?). I mean his defense impacts the game every night and he's 19. When KP dropped 15 straight it was Frank feeding him the ball. ALL this kid wants to do is play D, make plays for his teammates and not make mistakes.

This is ALL ABOUT THE EYE test. Frank's advanced stats and shooting is abysmal. Someone might check the box scorer to see how Monk did playing against Frank. They would laugh as Monk's #s were eye popping but who won? Who's skill was the most impactful when the game was on the line? Monk missed his look and Frank was keeping guards from penetrating and getting those octopus arms in passing lanes.

This is a different type of PG. He's got A LOT to work on. The kid is raw but he's helping the Knicks win games as a 19 year old rookie. I am hoping he's the Kirilenko of PGs. Fingers crossed. Lots to like!!!!

fishmike - Making UltimateKnicks great again
Knickoftime
Posts: 23205
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11/9/2017  4:57 PM
fishmike wrote:
KnickDanger wrote:
OldFan wrote:OldFan wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Even with the improved play of Jack and Frank, most teams have us beat in terms of PG's that can break down a defense and score. We also are weak at SF in terms of a versatile scoring threat. Any improvements in these areas will have a significant impact.
All of our guards are fairly similar so maybe that's why they have interest in Burke who is at least a change of pace. I can see him eventually getting the call up to see if he can be that change of pace spark plug type. He's not a big time player of course but sometimes just giving teams a different look can help. A smaller quicker and shiftier PG that is a scoring threat could round out the team a bit.
I'm much more interested in having more scoring from positions other than PG. I think our point guards are giving us more than expected. Their most important jobs are managing the offense, distributing the ball and playing defense. They're doing those things better than any point guards we've had in recent history.
Frank will get better at scoring over time but I can wait, he's showing great potential running the team and playing defense.
Our PGs are shooting 35 to 39%. It's awfully hard to win NBA games like that.

The main point is they run the offense and play defense. Which I think is more important for the PGs than scoring and more than we've gotten from our point guards in years.
Rose - could score, but did run the offense or play D.
Calderon - Tried to run the offense but could not score or play D.
Felton - Could not do much of anything.

We're over .500 getting no scoring from our starting 3 and inefficient scoring from our starting 2. If Lee can find a way to score and Timmy gets more efficient I think that's more important than getting scoring from the PGS.

Not saying they don't need to improve just that I'm happy with what we've gotten so far and I don't think the PG lack of scoring is our biggest problem. (And at least they aren't forcing it combined they take less then 10 shots per game.)

To be fair, Felton had his moments when he wasn't discovering all the fine cuisine New York has to offer. But I completely agree -- what I've wanted is a point guard in the mold of Jason Kidd (on the court) -- runs the offense, good instincts at setting up others, strong D including effort. And a leader. The ability to score is of course important, but not if it's all you do. I am very pleased with the Jack/Frank combo, especially as it seems it will get better, Frank in particular.

Frank's REAL value will be his ability to make others better. Frank is averaging 8pts, 9ast and 2.8 steals per 36 mins and he's playing defense at a very high level (dare I say all NBA?). I mean his defense impacts the game every night and he's 19. When KP dropped 15 straight it was Frank feeding him the ball. ALL this kid wants to do is play D, make plays for his teammates and not make mistakes.

This is ALL ABOUT THE EYE test. Frank's advanced stats and shooting is abysmal. Someone might check the box scorer to see how Monk did playing against Frank. They would laugh as Monk's #s were eye popping but who won? Who's skill was the most impactful when the game was on the line? Monk missed his look and Frank was keeping guards from penetrating and getting those octopus arms in passing lanes.

This is a different type of PG. He's got A LOT to work on. The kid is raw but he's helping the Knicks win games as a 19 year old rookie. I am hoping he's the Kirilenko of PGs. Fingers crossed. Lots to like!!!!

http://insider.espn.com/nba/hollinger/statistics/_/position/rookies/sort/assistRatio

http://insider.espn.com/nba/hollinger/statistics/_/position/pg/sort/assistRatio

BRIGGS
Posts: 49456
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11/9/2017  5:20 PM
fishmike wrote:
KnickDanger wrote:
OldFan wrote:OldFan wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Even with the improved play of Jack and Frank, most teams have us beat in terms of PG's that can break down a defense and score. We also are weak at SF in terms of a versatile scoring threat. Any improvements in these areas will have a significant impact.
All of our guards are fairly similar so maybe that's why they have interest in Burke who is at least a change of pace. I can see him eventually getting the call up to see if he can be that change of pace spark plug type. He's not a big time player of course but sometimes just giving teams a different look can help. A smaller quicker and shiftier PG that is a scoring threat could round out the team a bit.
I'm much more interested in having more scoring from positions other than PG. I think our point guards are giving us more than expected. Their most important jobs are managing the offense, distributing the ball and playing defense. They're doing those things better than any point guards we've had in recent history.
Frank will get better at scoring over time but I can wait, he's showing great potential running the team and playing defense.
Our PGs are shooting 35 to 39%. It's awfully hard to win NBA games like that.

The main point is they run the offense and play defense. Which I think is more important for the PGs than scoring and more than we've gotten from our point guards in years.
Rose - could score, but did run the offense or play D.
Calderon - Tried to run the offense but could not score or play D.
Felton - Could not do much of anything.

We're over .500 getting no scoring from our starting 3 and inefficient scoring from our starting 2. If Lee can find a way to score and Timmy gets more efficient I think that's more important than getting scoring from the PGS.

Not saying they don't need to improve just that I'm happy with what we've gotten so far and I don't think the PG lack of scoring is our biggest problem. (And at least they aren't forcing it combined they take less then 10 shots per game.)

To be fair, Felton had his moments when he wasn't discovering all the fine cuisine New York has to offer. But I completely agree -- what I've wanted is a point guard in the mold of Jason Kidd (on the court) -- runs the offense, good instincts at setting up others, strong D including effort. And a leader. The ability to score is of course important, but not if it's all you do. I am very pleased with the Jack/Frank combo, especially as it seems it will get better, Frank in particular.

Frank's REAL value will be his ability to make others better. Frank is averaging 8pts, 9ast and 2.8 steals per 36 mins and he's playing defense at a very high level (dare I say all NBA?). I mean his defense impacts the game every night and he's 19. When KP dropped 15 straight it was Frank feeding him the ball. ALL this kid wants to do is play D, make plays for his teammates and not make mistakes.

This is ALL ABOUT THE EYE test. Frank's advanced stats and shooting is abysmal. Someone might check the box scorer to see how Monk did playing against Frank. They would laugh as Monk's #s were eye popping but who won? Who's skill was the most impactful when the game was on the line? Monk missed his look and Frank was keeping guards from penetrating and getting those octopus arms in passing lanes.

This is a different type of PG. He's got A LOT to work on. The kid is raw but he's helping the Knicks win games as a 19 year old rookie. I am hoping he's the Kirilenko of PGs. Fingers crossed. Lots to like!!!!


When Westchester plays home and we are off--they should send Frank in with the sole purpose of practicing a much more aggressive offensive first mentality. Its not just pass--its pass shoot dribble. If he the shot take it if there is a better shot pass it if there is a lane drive it. Hes young and indecisive--he needs a little more free flow--playing 40 minutes unencumbered will help development. Heck Lonzo Ball needs development--he needs the D league to right his game shot. Its hard to do it in the pro games--because you cant keep going 4-15 in the nba.
martin
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11/9/2017  5:36 PM
BRIGGS wrote:
fishmike wrote:
KnickDanger wrote:
OldFan wrote:OldFan wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Even with the improved play of Jack and Frank, most teams have us beat in terms of PG's that can break down a defense and score. We also are weak at SF in terms of a versatile scoring threat. Any improvements in these areas will have a significant impact.
All of our guards are fairly similar so maybe that's why they have interest in Burke who is at least a change of pace. I can see him eventually getting the call up to see if he can be that change of pace spark plug type. He's not a big time player of course but sometimes just giving teams a different look can help. A smaller quicker and shiftier PG that is a scoring threat could round out the team a bit.
I'm much more interested in having more scoring from positions other than PG. I think our point guards are giving us more than expected. Their most important jobs are managing the offense, distributing the ball and playing defense. They're doing those things better than any point guards we've had in recent history.
Frank will get better at scoring over time but I can wait, he's showing great potential running the team and playing defense.
Our PGs are shooting 35 to 39%. It's awfully hard to win NBA games like that.

The main point is they run the offense and play defense. Which I think is more important for the PGs than scoring and more than we've gotten from our point guards in years.
Rose - could score, but did run the offense or play D.
Calderon - Tried to run the offense but could not score or play D.
Felton - Could not do much of anything.

We're over .500 getting no scoring from our starting 3 and inefficient scoring from our starting 2. If Lee can find a way to score and Timmy gets more efficient I think that's more important than getting scoring from the PGS.

Not saying they don't need to improve just that I'm happy with what we've gotten so far and I don't think the PG lack of scoring is our biggest problem. (And at least they aren't forcing it combined they take less then 10 shots per game.)

To be fair, Felton had his moments when he wasn't discovering all the fine cuisine New York has to offer. But I completely agree -- what I've wanted is a point guard in the mold of Jason Kidd (on the court) -- runs the offense, good instincts at setting up others, strong D including effort. And a leader. The ability to score is of course important, but not if it's all you do. I am very pleased with the Jack/Frank combo, especially as it seems it will get better, Frank in particular.

Frank's REAL value will be his ability to make others better. Frank is averaging 8pts, 9ast and 2.8 steals per 36 mins and he's playing defense at a very high level (dare I say all NBA?). I mean his defense impacts the game every night and he's 19. When KP dropped 15 straight it was Frank feeding him the ball. ALL this kid wants to do is play D, make plays for his teammates and not make mistakes.

This is ALL ABOUT THE EYE test. Frank's advanced stats and shooting is abysmal. Someone might check the box scorer to see how Monk did playing against Frank. They would laugh as Monk's #s were eye popping but who won? Who's skill was the most impactful when the game was on the line? Monk missed his look and Frank was keeping guards from penetrating and getting those octopus arms in passing lanes.

This is a different type of PG. He's got A LOT to work on. The kid is raw but he's helping the Knicks win games as a 19 year old rookie. I am hoping he's the Kirilenko of PGs. Fingers crossed. Lots to like!!!!


When Westchester plays home and we are off--they should send Frank in with the sole purpose of practicing a much more aggressive offensive first mentality. Its not just pass--its pass shoot dribble. If he the shot take it if there is a better shot pass it if there is a lane drive it. Hes young and indecisive--he needs a little more free flow--playing 40 minutes unencumbered will help development. Heck Lonzo Ball needs development--he needs the D league to right his game shot. Its hard to do it in the pro games--because you cant keep going 4-15 in the nba.

guys that can't get minutes in an NBA game should get D league time as appropriate. Frank is getting game minutes and that's the best place to learn.

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Knickoftime
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11/9/2017  5:41 PM
BRIGGS wrote:
fishmike wrote:
KnickDanger wrote:
OldFan wrote:OldFan wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Even with the improved play of Jack and Frank, most teams have us beat in terms of PG's that can break down a defense and score. We also are weak at SF in terms of a versatile scoring threat. Any improvements in these areas will have a significant impact.
All of our guards are fairly similar so maybe that's why they have interest in Burke who is at least a change of pace. I can see him eventually getting the call up to see if he can be that change of pace spark plug type. He's not a big time player of course but sometimes just giving teams a different look can help. A smaller quicker and shiftier PG that is a scoring threat could round out the team a bit.
I'm much more interested in having more scoring from positions other than PG. I think our point guards are giving us more than expected. Their most important jobs are managing the offense, distributing the ball and playing defense. They're doing those things better than any point guards we've had in recent history.
Frank will get better at scoring over time but I can wait, he's showing great potential running the team and playing defense.
Our PGs are shooting 35 to 39%. It's awfully hard to win NBA games like that.

The main point is they run the offense and play defense. Which I think is more important for the PGs than scoring and more than we've gotten from our point guards in years.
Rose - could score, but did run the offense or play D.
Calderon - Tried to run the offense but could not score or play D.
Felton - Could not do much of anything.

We're over .500 getting no scoring from our starting 3 and inefficient scoring from our starting 2. If Lee can find a way to score and Timmy gets more efficient I think that's more important than getting scoring from the PGS.

Not saying they don't need to improve just that I'm happy with what we've gotten so far and I don't think the PG lack of scoring is our biggest problem. (And at least they aren't forcing it combined they take less then 10 shots per game.)

To be fair, Felton had his moments when he wasn't discovering all the fine cuisine New York has to offer. But I completely agree -- what I've wanted is a point guard in the mold of Jason Kidd (on the court) -- runs the offense, good instincts at setting up others, strong D including effort. And a leader. The ability to score is of course important, but not if it's all you do. I am very pleased with the Jack/Frank combo, especially as it seems it will get better, Frank in particular.

Frank's REAL value will be his ability to make others better. Frank is averaging 8pts, 9ast and 2.8 steals per 36 mins and he's playing defense at a very high level (dare I say all NBA?). I mean his defense impacts the game every night and he's 19. When KP dropped 15 straight it was Frank feeding him the ball. ALL this kid wants to do is play D, make plays for his teammates and not make mistakes.

This is ALL ABOUT THE EYE test. Frank's advanced stats and shooting is abysmal. Someone might check the box scorer to see how Monk did playing against Frank. They would laugh as Monk's #s were eye popping but who won? Who's skill was the most impactful when the game was on the line? Monk missed his look and Frank was keeping guards from penetrating and getting those octopus arms in passing lanes.

This is a different type of PG. He's got A LOT to work on. The kid is raw but he's helping the Knicks win games as a 19 year old rookie. I am hoping he's the Kirilenko of PGs. Fingers crossed. Lots to like!!!!


When Westchester plays home and we are off--they should send Frank in with the sole purpose of practicing a much more aggressive offensive first mentality. Its not just pass--its pass shoot dribble. If he the shot take it if there is a better shot pass it if there is a lane drive it. Hes young and indecisive--he needs a little more free flow--playing 40 minutes unencumbered will help development. Heck Lonzo Ball needs development--he needs the D league to right his game shot. Its hard to do it in the pro games--because you cant keep going 4-15 in the nba.

He is 100% no doubt about it not physically ready for nba basketball-- the end

Nothing against him but most 19 years old in any sport aren't physically ready. His body isn't ready to get hit by guys who are bigger stronger faster

'Hey I have an idea, let's have him play 40 min games on off days.'

CrushAlot
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11/9/2017  5:43 PM
fishmike wrote:
KnickDanger wrote:
OldFan wrote:OldFan wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Even with the improved play of Jack and Frank, most teams have us beat in terms of PG's that can break down a defense and score. We also are weak at SF in terms of a versatile scoring threat. Any improvements in these areas will have a significant impact.
All of our guards are fairly similar so maybe that's why they have interest in Burke who is at least a change of pace. I can see him eventually getting the call up to see if he can be that change of pace spark plug type. He's not a big time player of course but sometimes just giving teams a different look can help. A smaller quicker and shiftier PG that is a scoring threat could round out the team a bit.
I'm much more interested in having more scoring from positions other than PG. I think our point guards are giving us more than expected. Their most important jobs are managing the offense, distributing the ball and playing defense. They're doing those things better than any point guards we've had in recent history.
Frank will get better at scoring over time but I can wait, he's showing great potential running the team and playing defense.
Our PGs are shooting 35 to 39%. It's awfully hard to win NBA games like that.

The main point is they run the offense and play defense. Which I think is more important for the PGs than scoring and more than we've gotten from our point guards in years.
Rose - could score, but did run the offense or play D.
Calderon - Tried to run the offense but could not score or play D.
Felton - Could not do much of anything.

We're over .500 getting no scoring from our starting 3 and inefficient scoring from our starting 2. If Lee can find a way to score and Timmy gets more efficient I think that's more important than getting scoring from the PGS.

Not saying they don't need to improve just that I'm happy with what we've gotten so far and I don't think the PG lack of scoring is our biggest problem. (And at least they aren't forcing it combined they take less then 10 shots per game.)

To be fair, Felton had his moments when he wasn't discovering all the fine cuisine New York has to offer. But I completely agree -- what I've wanted is a point guard in the mold of Jason Kidd (on the court) -- runs the offense, good instincts at setting up others, strong D including effort. And a leader. The ability to score is of course important, but not if it's all you do. I am very pleased with the Jack/Frank combo, especially as it seems it will get better, Frank in particular.

Frank's REAL value will be his ability to make others better. Frank is averaging 8pts, 9ast and 2.8 steals per 36 mins and he's playing defense at a very high level (dare I say all NBA?). I mean his defense impacts the game every night and he's 19. When KP dropped 15 straight it was Frank feeding him the ball. ALL this kid wants to do is play D, make plays for his teammates and not make mistakes.

This is ALL ABOUT THE EYE test. Frank's advanced stats and shooting is abysmal. Someone might check the box scorer to see how Monk did playing against Frank. They would laugh as Monk's #s were eye popping but who won? Who's skill was the most impactful when the game was on the line? Monk missed his look and Frank was keeping guards from penetrating and getting those octopus arms in passing lanes.

This is a different type of PG. He's got A LOT to work on. The kid is raw but he's helping the Knicks win games as a 19 year old rookie. I am hoping he's the Kirilenko of PGs. Fingers crossed. Lots to like!!!!

I am happy with Frank but Monk was pretty impressive to watch. He can handle the point which was the big question and he is an incredible scorer. You get that just from watching the game no box score needed. Monk with that shot as a starting point guard has a 12 year career in the nba with a good chance that he is a star. I have no idea how Monk has played in other games as I haven't watched Charlotte before last night but he was impressive against the Knicks.
I think we know what we're doing..... Phil Jackson
Knickoftime
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11/9/2017  5:54 PM
teamsport72
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11/9/2017  6:52 PM
BRIGGS wrote:
fishmike wrote:
KnickDanger wrote:
OldFan wrote:OldFan wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Even with the improved play of Jack and Frank, most teams have us beat in terms of PG's that can break down a defense and score. We also are weak at SF in terms of a versatile scoring threat. Any improvements in these areas will have a significant impact.
All of our guards are fairly similar so maybe that's why they have interest in Burke who is at least a change of pace. I can see him eventually getting the call up to see if he can be that change of pace spark plug type. He's not a big time player of course but sometimes just giving teams a different look can help. A smaller quicker and shiftier PG that is a scoring threat could round out the team a bit.
I'm much more interested in having more scoring from positions other than PG. I think our point guards are giving us more than expected. Their most important jobs are managing the offense, distributing the ball and playing defense. They're doing those things better than any point guards we've had in recent history.
Frank will get better at scoring over time but I can wait, he's showing great potential running the team and playing defense.
Our PGs are shooting 35 to 39%. It's awfully hard to win NBA games like that.

The main point is they run the offense and play defense. Which I think is more important for the PGs than scoring and more than we've gotten from our point guards in years.
Rose - could score, but did run the offense or play D.
Calderon - Tried to run the offense but could not score or play D.
Felton - Could not do much of anything.

We're over .500 getting no scoring from our starting 3 and inefficient scoring from our starting 2. If Lee can find a way to score and Timmy gets more efficient I think that's more important than getting scoring from the PGS.

Not saying they don't need to improve just that I'm happy with what we've gotten so far and I don't think the PG lack of scoring is our biggest problem. (And at least they aren't forcing it combined they take less then 10 shots per game.)

To be fair, Felton had his moments when he wasn't discovering all the fine cuisine New York has to offer. But I completely agree -- what I've wanted is a point guard in the mold of Jason Kidd (on the court) -- runs the offense, good instincts at setting up others, strong D including effort. And a leader. The ability to score is of course important, but not if it's all you do. I am very pleased with the Jack/Frank combo, especially as it seems it will get better, Frank in particular.

Frank's REAL value will be his ability to make others better. Frank is averaging 8pts, 9ast and 2.8 steals per 36 mins and he's playing defense at a very high level (dare I say all NBA?). I mean his defense impacts the game every night and he's 19. When KP dropped 15 straight it was Frank feeding him the ball. ALL this kid wants to do is play D, make plays for his teammates and not make mistakes.

This is ALL ABOUT THE EYE test. Frank's advanced stats and shooting is abysmal. Someone might check the box scorer to see how Monk did playing against Frank. They would laugh as Monk's #s were eye popping but who won? Who's skill was the most impactful when the game was on the line? Monk missed his look and Frank was keeping guards from penetrating and getting those octopus arms in passing lanes.

This is a different type of PG. He's got A LOT to work on. The kid is raw but he's helping the Knicks win games as a 19 year old rookie. I am hoping he's the Kirilenko of PGs. Fingers crossed. Lots to like!!!!


When Westchester plays home and we are off--they should send Frank in with the sole purpose of practicing a much more aggressive offensive first mentality. Its not just pass--its pass shoot dribble. If he the shot take it if there is a better shot pass it if there is a lane drive it. Hes young and indecisive--he needs a little more free flow--playing 40 minutes unencumbered will help development. Heck Lonzo Ball needs development--he needs the D league to right his game shot. Its hard to do it in the pro games--because you cant keep going 4-15 in the nba.

What exactly is the history with sending top 10 picks to the D-league? Do they usually come back more motivated and improved? How about Porzingis to the D-league, to work on his passing numbers?

fishmike
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11/9/2017  7:15 PM
CrushAlot wrote:
fishmike wrote:
KnickDanger wrote:
OldFan wrote:OldFan wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Even with the improved play of Jack and Frank, most teams have us beat in terms of PG's that can break down a defense and score. We also are weak at SF in terms of a versatile scoring threat. Any improvements in these areas will have a significant impact.
All of our guards are fairly similar so maybe that's why they have interest in Burke who is at least a change of pace. I can see him eventually getting the call up to see if he can be that change of pace spark plug type. He's not a big time player of course but sometimes just giving teams a different look can help. A smaller quicker and shiftier PG that is a scoring threat could round out the team a bit.
I'm much more interested in having more scoring from positions other than PG. I think our point guards are giving us more than expected. Their most important jobs are managing the offense, distributing the ball and playing defense. They're doing those things better than any point guards we've had in recent history.
Frank will get better at scoring over time but I can wait, he's showing great potential running the team and playing defense.
Our PGs are shooting 35 to 39%. It's awfully hard to win NBA games like that.

The main point is they run the offense and play defense. Which I think is more important for the PGs than scoring and more than we've gotten from our point guards in years.
Rose - could score, but did run the offense or play D.
Calderon - Tried to run the offense but could not score or play D.
Felton - Could not do much of anything.

We're over .500 getting no scoring from our starting 3 and inefficient scoring from our starting 2. If Lee can find a way to score and Timmy gets more efficient I think that's more important than getting scoring from the PGS.

Not saying they don't need to improve just that I'm happy with what we've gotten so far and I don't think the PG lack of scoring is our biggest problem. (And at least they aren't forcing it combined they take less then 10 shots per game.)

To be fair, Felton had his moments when he wasn't discovering all the fine cuisine New York has to offer. But I completely agree -- what I've wanted is a point guard in the mold of Jason Kidd (on the court) -- runs the offense, good instincts at setting up others, strong D including effort. And a leader. The ability to score is of course important, but not if it's all you do. I am very pleased with the Jack/Frank combo, especially as it seems it will get better, Frank in particular.

Frank's REAL value will be his ability to make others better. Frank is averaging 8pts, 9ast and 2.8 steals per 36 mins and he's playing defense at a very high level (dare I say all NBA?). I mean his defense impacts the game every night and he's 19. When KP dropped 15 straight it was Frank feeding him the ball. ALL this kid wants to do is play D, make plays for his teammates and not make mistakes.

This is ALL ABOUT THE EYE test. Frank's advanced stats and shooting is abysmal. Someone might check the box scorer to see how Monk did playing against Frank. They would laugh as Monk's #s were eye popping but who won? Who's skill was the most impactful when the game was on the line? Monk missed his look and Frank was keeping guards from penetrating and getting those octopus arms in passing lanes.

This is a different type of PG. He's got A LOT to work on. The kid is raw but he's helping the Knicks win games as a 19 year old rookie. I am hoping he's the Kirilenko of PGs. Fingers crossed. Lots to like!!!!

I am happy with Frank but Monk was pretty impressive to watch. He can handle the point which was the big question and he is an incredible scorer. You get that just from watching the game no box score needed. Monk with that shot as a starting point guard has a 12 year career in the nba with a good chance that he is a star. I have no idea how Monk has played in other games as I haven't watched Charlotte before last night but he was impressive against the Knicks.
I would have been happy with Monk. I think he's the closest thing to Steph Curry since Steph Curry. Ideally you know what kind of player you need to make a guy like Monk really effective? Frank Ntilikina. Seriously.

I was good with us taking Monk/Mitchell/Frank/DSjr. My honest feeling was I have some faith in our scouting, and I was going to be pumped by the prospect of any of those 4 (thinking we got a good one). We figured to have a shot at 3 of those 4. So I really didnt have a pony in this race. I started "the case for Dennis Smith Jr." thread.

Right now Frank is 4th in assist% behind NBA super stars. His defense is a lightning rod. I mean as great as Monk looks I have seen Eddie House do exactly the same thing Monk did last night. Score a load of points and not much else. Again... Monk was impressive. What Frank brings is better IMO. Think about how coveted a piece Frank is, especially next to KP. A PG who shuts down opposing penetration, a PG who fuels the offense with tons of assists, a PG who is an ALL NBA defender and can slow down elite players and stifle good ones. Frank isnt there yet... not quite but after only a handful of games we see it, both eyes and stats. Im great rolling with that. I mean look how smart he is. After 40 games we may have a more lovable version of Rondo. After 4 years???? He might facial hair!

fishmike - Making UltimateKnicks great again
CrushAlot
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11/9/2017  7:15 PM
teamsport72 wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
fishmike wrote:
KnickDanger wrote:
OldFan wrote:OldFan wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Even with the improved play of Jack and Frank, most teams have us beat in terms of PG's that can break down a defense and score. We also are weak at SF in terms of a versatile scoring threat. Any improvements in these areas will have a significant impact.
All of our guards are fairly similar so maybe that's why they have interest in Burke who is at least a change of pace. I can see him eventually getting the call up to see if he can be that change of pace spark plug type. He's not a big time player of course but sometimes just giving teams a different look can help. A smaller quicker and shiftier PG that is a scoring threat could round out the team a bit.
I'm much more interested in having more scoring from positions other than PG. I think our point guards are giving us more than expected. Their most important jobs are managing the offense, distributing the ball and playing defense. They're doing those things better than any point guards we've had in recent history.
Frank will get better at scoring over time but I can wait, he's showing great potential running the team and playing defense.
Our PGs are shooting 35 to 39%. It's awfully hard to win NBA games like that.

The main point is they run the offense and play defense. Which I think is more important for the PGs than scoring and more than we've gotten from our point guards in years.
Rose - could score, but did run the offense or play D.
Calderon - Tried to run the offense but could not score or play D.
Felton - Could not do much of anything.

We're over .500 getting no scoring from our starting 3 and inefficient scoring from our starting 2. If Lee can find a way to score and Timmy gets more efficient I think that's more important than getting scoring from the PGS.

Not saying they don't need to improve just that I'm happy with what we've gotten so far and I don't think the PG lack of scoring is our biggest problem. (And at least they aren't forcing it combined they take less then 10 shots per game.)

To be fair, Felton had his moments when he wasn't discovering all the fine cuisine New York has to offer. But I completely agree -- what I've wanted is a point guard in the mold of Jason Kidd (on the court) -- runs the offense, good instincts at setting up others, strong D including effort. And a leader. The ability to score is of course important, but not if it's all you do. I am very pleased with the Jack/Frank combo, especially as it seems it will get better, Frank in particular.

Frank's REAL value will be his ability to make others better. Frank is averaging 8pts, 9ast and 2.8 steals per 36 mins and he's playing defense at a very high level (dare I say all NBA?). I mean his defense impacts the game every night and he's 19. When KP dropped 15 straight it was Frank feeding him the ball. ALL this kid wants to do is play D, make plays for his teammates and not make mistakes.

This is ALL ABOUT THE EYE test. Frank's advanced stats and shooting is abysmal. Someone might check the box scorer to see how Monk did playing against Frank. They would laugh as Monk's #s were eye popping but who won? Who's skill was the most impactful when the game was on the line? Monk missed his look and Frank was keeping guards from penetrating and getting those octopus arms in passing lanes.

This is a different type of PG. He's got A LOT to work on. The kid is raw but he's helping the Knicks win games as a 19 year old rookie. I am hoping he's the Kirilenko of PGs. Fingers crossed. Lots to like!!!!


When Westchester plays home and we are off--they should send Frank in with the sole purpose of practicing a much more aggressive offensive first mentality. Its not just pass--its pass shoot dribble. If he the shot take it if there is a better shot pass it if there is a lane drive it. Hes young and indecisive--he needs a little more free flow--playing 40 minutes unencumbered will help development. Heck Lonzo Ball needs development--he needs the D league to right his game shot. Its hard to do it in the pro games--because you cant keep going 4-15 in the nba.

What exactly is the history with sending top 10 picks to the D-league? Do they usually come back more motivated and improved? How about Porzingis to the D-league, to work on his passing numbers?


It certainly helped Hardaway. Not a top ten pick but I believe he made the all rookie team. His d league time was in his sophomore season.
I think we know what we're doing..... Phil Jackson
fishmike
Posts: 47712
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11/9/2017  7:18 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
2.8 steals aint bad either.
fishmike - Making UltimateKnicks great again
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11/10/2017  10:59 AM
fishmike wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
2.8 steals aint bad either.

right

and his assists seems so natural and fluid

He also has a lot of room to grow, as he develops moves, pocket passes, alley oops in the lane.

couldn't be happier for him; his trajectory is a little like KP's in that his arrival was treated with skepticism (if not boos) and he, like KP, is turning those boos into cheers!!

DJMUSIC: Fisher talked a good game in Post game but aside from that Derek Fisher was ALL CHIT CHAT SH_t and produced nothing!
Gamethread: KP questionable tonight vs. Magic

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