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OKC v NYK: night and day
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Bonn1997
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11/8/2017  9:16 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/8/2017  9:19 AM
Bonn1997 wrote:It's early. The +57 point differential suggests OKC is playing much better than their record and playing at an elite level. The record is obviously bad though.

Another way of looking at it is they are 4-0 in games with a double-digit margin and 0-6 in games with a single-digit margin. Obviously that's not going to continue. That should tell you the record is odd and unlikely to be stable. I'd still predict 50 wins if you asked me right now.
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magicTs
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11/8/2017  9:24 AM
knicks1248 wrote:
Swishfm3 wrote:Knicks have, so far, exceeded my expectations but we ARE only 10 games into the season. I am trying to contain my excitement considering that we went 16-16 last year before the wheels fell off. Those of us who actually believe that OKC will continue to perform at this level is not being honest with themselves.

yeah, im trying to curb my excitement as well, because we were 500 or above the first 2 months of the last 2 seasons. I think the problem with okc is that they are top heavy and the bench is super suspect.

whooa--Frosty #s last night for their big 3

Melo-4-17
Pg13-4-16
WB -7-21

kp-8-13

I was at the Garden last night to witness our 2nd consecutive comeback. I had good seats in Section 7 right beside the Knicks bench and watched closely both the body language and team spirit that is continually evolving throughout our team. It was hugely encouraging to see. No sense that there are egos or primadonas just everyone pulling in he one direction. Regardless of the deficits we faced and mistakes that happened on both ends during the game there was this calm and upbeat air at each timeout and a steely determination we'd make the runs required as the game entered the clutch. And so it panned out again. There will clearly be plenty road bumps ahead but it's just fantastic to see a freshness, a belief, players having fun, camaraderie and of course the Garden lit up for the 2nd time in 3 nights. There is no better place to watch basketball on a night like that and the fans crave a team to get behind and root for. Success will come if we continue to do the things we are.

When I got home I watched the Knicks post game and then noticed the 2nd half of the OKC game was on so decided to see how that played out. Putting my Knicks love aside the contrast literally could not have been starker. They looked a mess against a 1-8 Kings team. Terrible body language, no continuity, no game plan, no movement, constant ISO ball, constant mid range jumpers, a flagrant then a technical for frustrated and unhappy looking players. Listen, they still have good players and I'm sure will work out some kinks but that roster with that balance and a player, in Melo, that kills team chemistry can't and won't win anything. His legs are shot, he has no lift, he can't drive to the basket and finish. Westbrook gives off the aura of a wtf have we got ourselves into and currently is a shadow of the player he was last season.

In summary the attitude and enthusiasm of the Knicks right now is in stark contrast to OKC.

knicks1248
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11/8/2017  9:26 AM
arkrud wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Swishfm3 wrote:Knicks have, so far, exceeded my expectations but we ARE only 10 games into the season. I am trying to contain my excitement considering that we went 16-16 last year before the wheels fell off. Those of us who actually believe that OKC will continue to perform at this level is not being honest with themselves.

yeah, im trying to curb my excitement as well, because we were 500 or above the first 2 months of the last 2 seasons. I think the problem with okc is that they are top heavy and the bench is super suspect.

whooa--Frosty #s last night for their big 3

Melo-4-17
Pg13-4-16
WB -7-21

kp-8-13

Wonder if Melo ever had 28 points on 13 shots...
KP looked really tired yesterday but still had major impact on the game on both ends.
KP personality alone makes teammates play on another level.
There are things that cannot be learned.
They just there or not.

I must admit, I did not think he was ready, and he actually has leadership skills that I didn't see in him at all..

I think it's really tough to play with a scoring pg who cares more about his #s, maybe that's why KD left, and if melo and pg13 end up bouncing out, we will all know why..

kP, is like steph curry, even though they get a lot of touches, they seem to never force anything

ES
jrodmc
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11/8/2017  9:28 AM
stanleybostitch wrote:
jrodmc wrote:
stanleybostitch wrote:Wonder if the OKC experiment will finally put to rest the stupid "you need three superstarts to win" thinking, and give way to "you need team players playing team ball to win" thinking.

Yes, please advise Golden State and LeQ-land of that fact at once. They may have missed the dazzling logic of your Melohate train 10 whole games into the season.

The point is that mixing "superstars" is not a successful plan. OKC is currently showing that. I'm sure they'll work it out and make it to playoffs, but they'll only get there if they start playing team ball. Can they do that? Jury out.

And this is more a shadenfreude thread than a melohate thread. But so far we are seeing that TEAM concepts work better than ISO dominant approaxh.

It's ok to love the way we're playing and feel a little justified in believing that Clyde-style team ball is what the NYK needed to bring us back to relevance.

1) Jury is still out on your "point" and will remain out until someone other than a 3 starphucque team wins the chip. Hasn't happened in recent memory, unless you count 2011's Dirk Lightning in a bottle team. GS would have been the great exception, but sorry, Durant going to GS overqualifies them as a starphucqued team. LeQ does nothing but starphucque.

2) I love the way we are playing and winning. It's a great mix of one suddenly incredible transcendent star and a bunch of varied parts, especially in the backcourt. I mean, 400-year old Jarrett Jack and a 19 year old French first rounder? Crazy stuff man. Jury is still out on your TEAM concept as well, should said Unicorn go down. Can't fault KP for shooting alot and not passing when he's shooting at a 50% clip. This isn't the 70's Knicks yet.

3) Hate versus glee at another's misfortune. Semantics.

You guys spend a lot of time commenting on the internet?
newyorker4ever
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11/8/2017  9:33 AM
Swishfm3 wrote:Knicks have, so far, exceeded my expectations but we ARE only 10 games into the season. I am trying to contain my excitement considering that we went 16-16 last year before the wheels fell off. Those of us who actually believe that OKC will continue to perform at this level is not being honest with themselves.

It's fun watching these Knicks play right now but be careful with thinking this will last. I hope it does but i don't think it will. We have a big test coming starting with Orlando who's playing well right now and then we finish out Nov with a tough schedule. We have Toronto twice, Clev, Houston, Utah/ Portland, LA Clips and finish Nov with Miami so i'll be really interested in seeing what our record is Dec 1st. Even if it doesn't last i'm alright with it cause we're still a couple pieces away from where we want to be and this unit is gonna come together more throughout this season. It's a young team of guys that all seem to like each other and like playing with each other and free agents are seeing what's going on. The excitement is back in the Garden and opposing players are seeing it and the ones that we play in the Garden are hearing it so all of this is gonna help us in free agency and KP is such a likable player that free agents will once again have their eyes open when considering the Knicks in free agency.

Good days are ahead for the New York Knicks.

GustavBahler
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11/8/2017  10:24 AM
Westbrook came off a season where he carried the team offensively. Now he has two All-Stars to play with. Donovan is a smart guy (NYer) going to be some growing pains for OKC, wouldn't count them out just yet.

I didnt hate the deal, was very relieved Melo wasnt traded for a bag of chips, or for long term, cap killing, contracts. That made it a good deal as far as Im concerned, right there.

arkrud
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11/8/2017  10:39 AM
newyorker4ever wrote:
Swishfm3 wrote:Knicks have, so far, exceeded my expectations but we ARE only 10 games into the season. I am trying to contain my excitement considering that we went 16-16 last year before the wheels fell off. Those of us who actually believe that OKC will continue to perform at this level is not being honest with themselves.

It's fun watching these Knicks play right now but be careful with thinking this will last. I hope it does but i don't think it will. We have a big test coming starting with Orlando who's playing well right now and then we finish out Nov with a tough schedule. We have Toronto twice, Clev, Houston, Utah/ Portland, LA Clips and finish Nov with Miami so i'll be really interested in seeing what our record is Dec 1st. Even if it doesn't last i'm alright with it cause we're still a couple pieces away from where we want to be and this unit is gonna come together more throughout this season. It's a young team of guys that all seem to like each other and like playing with each other and free agents are seeing what's going on. The excitement is back in the Garden and opposing players are seeing it and the ones that we play in the Garden are hearing it so all of this is gonna help us in free agency and KP is such a likable player that free agents will once again have their eyes open when considering the Knicks in free agency.

Good days are ahead for the New York Knicks.

Loses will come for sure. And Orlando game is always lock to be a loss.
It is not about we win or lose he games. It is about how we do it.
Team is learning to keep the lead and to come back.
We are still need to learn how to dominate and contend and this will take time and more moves.
Fans started to panic right after the start of the season and now are getting to high.
Its fine - that what fans are all about.
If organization contrary will continue steady heady team building process we will have success regardless of consequences and inevitable variance of pro sport.

He can teach them to meditate... but no one can control even his own mind...
GoNyGoNyGo
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11/8/2017  10:54 AM
If this continues for the Thunder, people will see who the problem is. I turned on the game last night after the Knicks and I saw Melo doing the same crap he did here. Doesn't close out, stands on offense waiting for the ball, misses cutters (actually the other 4 guys stand still when he gets the ball). It wont take long for OKC fans to want him out too.


Glad he is gone because NY is reaping the benefits! The team is believing in each other and the system.

Yet another mistake by Dolan. When will it end?
martin
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11/8/2017  10:56 AM
magicTs wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Swishfm3 wrote:Knicks have, so far, exceeded my expectations but we ARE only 10 games into the season. I am trying to contain my excitement considering that we went 16-16 last year before the wheels fell off. Those of us who actually believe that OKC will continue to perform at this level is not being honest with themselves.

yeah, im trying to curb my excitement as well, because we were 500 or above the first 2 months of the last 2 seasons. I think the problem with okc is that they are top heavy and the bench is super suspect.

whooa--Frosty #s last night for their big 3

Melo-4-17
Pg13-4-16
WB -7-21

kp-8-13

I was at the Garden last night to witness our 2nd consecutive comeback. I had good seats in Section 7 right beside the Knicks bench and watched closely both the body language and team spirit that is continually evolving throughout our team. It was hugely encouraging to see. No sense that there are egos or primadonas just everyone pulling in he one direction. Regardless of the deficits we faced and mistakes that happened on both ends during the game there was this calm and upbeat air at each timeout and a steely determination we'd make the runs required as the game entered the clutch. And so it panned out again. There will clearly be plenty road bumps ahead but it's just fantastic to see a freshness, a belief, players having fun, camaraderie and of course the Garden lit up for the 2nd time in 3 nights. There is no better place to watch basketball on a night like that and the fans crave a team to get behind and root for. Success will come if we continue to do the things we are.

When I got home I watched the Knicks post game and then noticed the 2nd half of the OKC game was on so decided to see how that played out. Putting my Knicks love aside the contrast literally could not have been starker. They looked a mess against a 1-8 Kings team. Terrible body language, no continuity, no game plan, no movement, constant ISO ball, constant mid range jumpers, a flagrant then a technical for frustrated and unhappy looking players. Listen, they still have good players and I'm sure will work out some kinks but that roster with that balance and a player, in Melo, that kills team chemistry can't and won't win anything. His legs are shot, he has no lift, he can't drive to the basket and finish. Westbrook gives off the aura of a wtf have we got ourselves into and currently is a shadow of the player he was last season.

In summary the attitude and enthusiasm of the Knicks right now is in stark contrast to OKC.

awesome stuff, always like hearing from fans who are at the games.

It's incredible to me to see how much Melo has fallen off and is declining, you could see it last year: against some not so good defenders, all isolated and one-on-one, Melo couldn't get past them, he has zero burst of speed. Dude can barely dunk any more. I wonder if that patella injury set him back that much or if just age and mileage has taken over.

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newyorknewyork
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11/8/2017  11:15 AM
magicTs wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Swishfm3 wrote:Knicks have, so far, exceeded my expectations but we ARE only 10 games into the season. I am trying to contain my excitement considering that we went 16-16 last year before the wheels fell off. Those of us who actually believe that OKC will continue to perform at this level is not being honest with themselves.

yeah, im trying to curb my excitement as well, because we were 500 or above the first 2 months of the last 2 seasons. I think the problem with okc is that they are top heavy and the bench is super suspect.

whooa--Frosty #s last night for their big 3

Melo-4-17
Pg13-4-16
WB -7-21

kp-8-13

I was at the Garden last night to witness our 2nd consecutive comeback. I had good seats in Section 7 right beside the Knicks bench and watched closely both the body language and team spirit that is continually evolving throughout our team. It was hugely encouraging to see. No sense that there are egos or primadonas just everyone pulling in he one direction. Regardless of the deficits we faced and mistakes that happened on both ends during the game there was this calm and upbeat air at each timeout and a steely determination we'd make the runs required as the game entered the clutch. And so it panned out again. There will clearly be plenty road bumps ahead but it's just fantastic to see a freshness, a belief, players having fun, camaraderie and of course the Garden lit up for the 2nd time in 3 nights. There is no better place to watch basketball on a night like that and the fans crave a team to get behind and root for. Success will come if we continue to do the things we are.

When I got home I watched the Knicks post game and then noticed the 2nd half of the OKC game was on so decided to see how that played out. Putting my Knicks love aside the contrast literally could not have been starker. They looked a mess against a 1-8 Kings team. Terrible body language, no continuity, no game plan, no movement, constant ISO ball, constant mid range jumpers, a flagrant then a technical for frustrated and unhappy looking players. Listen, they still have good players and I'm sure will work out some kinks but that roster with that balance and a player, in Melo, that kills team chemistry can't and won't win anything. His legs are shot, he has no lift, he can't drive to the basket and finish. Westbrook gives off the aura of a wtf have we got ourselves into and currently is a shadow of the player he was last season.

In summary the attitude and enthusiasm of the Knicks right now is in stark contrast to OKC.

But they don't run the triangle? How is that possible?

I feel they will figure it out. Haven't watched to many of their games. Figured the roles would be self explanatory though. With Melo as the stretch 4. Russ and Adams PNR all day. With Russ feeding George and Melo open 3s. When Russ is resting set up a 2 man game with George and Melo.

George and Melo both can be FAs in the off season though if things don't work themselves out.

TripleThreat
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11/8/2017  4:15 PM
stanleybostitch wrote:the Thunder lacks anything remotely close to a plan on offense. The spacing is non-existent, the system hasn’t matched the personnel, and no one looks comfortable executing a set.


Russell Westbrook recently signed a massive 10 year deal with Nike.

Think it was total coincidence that he won MVP? (Not saying he's not a great player, he really is a great player, just in very specific ways)

Watching OKC, last season, it was clear, the entire focus was on stat padding RW at all costs. Even to the detriment to free flowing team basketball. Even to the detriment of fundamentals.

Look at Presti's situation. He risks very much of having George, Melo and WB walk on him, leaving him with Steven Adams as his best player. WB leaves, he's gonna get fired. Which shows the high risk move for trading for George and Melo ( granted he did not give up a ton, but he lost massive depth)

The roster is top heavy. Look at the depth. Roberson can't score. Patrick Patterson, Jerami Grant and Ray Felton are the best reserves.

I think they'll do better as the season rolls a long, but they need guys on vet minimum contracts who can help them. A Bogut type. Guys who get bought out and are looking for a contender.

Since you came on this board you have been way off in regards to trade value. - Briggs 7/28/2015
CrushAlot
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11/8/2017  5:32 PM
Bonn1997 wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:It's early. The +57 point differential suggests OKC is playing much better than their record and playing at an elite level. The record is obviously bad though.

Another way of looking at it is they are 4-0 in games with a double-digit margin and 0-6 in games with a single-digit margin. Obviously that's not going to continue. That should tell you the record is odd and unlikely to be stable. I'd still predict 50 wins if you asked me right now.
They had the #2 ranked defense not long ago. Not sure if that changed. I think they work things out. Glad Melo is in the West. I think Perry/Mills did very well in a compromised position. Kanter has been awesome since day 1 and McDermott has been playing great. With the Bulls pick the deal was a good one.
I think we know what we're doing..... Phil Jackson
newyorknewyork
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11/8/2017  6:00 PM    LAST EDITED: 11/8/2017  6:01 PM
TripleThreat wrote:
stanleybostitch wrote:the Thunder lacks anything remotely close to a plan on offense. The spacing is non-existent, the system hasn’t matched the personnel, and no one looks comfortable executing a set.


Russell Westbrook recently signed a massive 10 year deal with Nike.

Think it was total coincidence that he won MVP? (Not saying he's not a great player, he really is a great player, just in very specific ways)

Watching OKC, last season, it was clear, the entire focus was on stat padding RW at all costs. Even to the detriment to free flowing team basketball. Even to the detriment of fundamentals.

Look at Presti's situation. He risks very much of having George, Melo and WB walk on him, leaving him with Steven Adams as his best player. WB leaves, he's gonna get fired. Which shows the high risk move for trading for George and Melo ( granted he did not give up a ton, but he lost massive depth)

The roster is top heavy. Look at the depth. Roberson can't score. Patrick Patterson, Jerami Grant and Ray Felton are the best reserves.

I think they'll do better as the season rolls a long, but they need guys on vet minimum contracts who can help them. A Bogut type. Guys who get bought out and are looking for a contender.

Russ signed an extension already. If George and Melo leave they fall back on Russ and Adams and may have cap space for one FA. Have to depend on the development of Ferg.

Presti getting fired would be a horrible decision. The risk were well worth it given what they gave up. And they still would have the flexibility to recover.

stanleybostitch
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11/9/2017  3:32 AM
newyorknewyork wrote:
TripleThreat wrote:
stanleybostitch wrote:the Thunder lacks anything remotely close to a plan on offense. The spacing is non-existent, the system hasn’t matched the personnel, and no one looks comfortable executing a set.


Russell Westbrook recently signed a massive 10 year deal with Nike.

Think it was total coincidence that he won MVP? (Not saying he's not a great player, he really is a great player, just in very specific ways)

Watching OKC, last season, it was clear, the entire focus was on stat padding RW at all costs. Even to the detriment to free flowing team basketball. Even to the detriment of fundamentals.

Look at Presti's situation. He risks very much of having George, Melo and WB walk on him, leaving him with Steven Adams as his best player. WB leaves, he's gonna get fired. Which shows the high risk move for trading for George and Melo ( granted he did not give up a ton, but he lost massive depth)

The roster is top heavy. Look at the depth. Roberson can't score. Patrick Patterson, Jerami Grant and Ray Felton are the best reserves.

I think they'll do better as the season rolls a long, but they need guys on vet minimum contracts who can help them. A Bogut type. Guys who get bought out and are looking for a contender.

Russ signed an extension already. If George and Melo leave they fall back on Russ and Adams and may have cap space for one FA. Have to depend on the development of Ferg.

Presti getting fired would be a horrible decision. The risk were well worth it given what they gave up. And they still would have the flexibility to recover.

For all the good press Presti gets, I'm surprised he starphucked so hard. Have to think the team would be better with a Westbrook-PG-Kanter core with Dougie coming off the bench, rather than the current lineup they have.

Patience with the rebuild, keep all the picks, no starphucks, and team-first attitude. Marinate a couple years and we're playing like the '72 team. Championship here we come!
meloshouldgo
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11/9/2017  6:46 AM
stanleybostitch wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
TripleThreat wrote:
stanleybostitch wrote:the Thunder lacks anything remotely close to a plan on offense. The spacing is non-existent, the system hasn’t matched the personnel, and no one looks comfortable executing a set.


Russell Westbrook recently signed a massive 10 year deal with Nike.

Think it was total coincidence that he won MVP? (Not saying he's not a great player, he really is a great player, just in very specific ways)

Watching OKC, last season, it was clear, the entire focus was on stat padding RW at all costs. Even to the detriment to free flowing team basketball. Even to the detriment of fundamentals.

Look at Presti's situation. He risks very much of having George, Melo and WB walk on him, leaving him with Steven Adams as his best player. WB leaves, he's gonna get fired. Which shows the high risk move for trading for George and Melo ( granted he did not give up a ton, but he lost massive depth)

The roster is top heavy. Look at the depth. Roberson can't score. Patrick Patterson, Jerami Grant and Ray Felton are the best reserves.

I think they'll do better as the season rolls a long, but they need guys on vet minimum contracts who can help them. A Bogut type. Guys who get bought out and are looking for a contender.

Russ signed an extension already. If George and Melo leave they fall back on Russ and Adams and may have cap space for one FA. Have to depend on the development of Ferg.

Presti getting fired would be a horrible decision. The risk were well worth it given what they gave up. And they still would have the flexibility to recover.

For all the good press Presti gets, I'm surprised he starphucked so hard. Have to think the team would be better with a Westbrook-PG-Kanter core with Dougie coming off the bench, rather than the current lineup they have.

I don't get it either. They had a good team last year. Westbrook's selfishness had eclipsed Oladipo's game. He is showing to be one of the better two guards in the league. Sabonis is a talented young big. Kanter is a bull and Doug a capable bench scorer. They starfukked when they didn't need to. This whole 3 star players bull**** is gonna catch up to Presti. They are pathetic and disjointed on offense and their defense has fallen apart because they have Melo standing around and watching. With Westbrook and Adams they should have looked for three point shooters and defensive wings. They got two iso players instead, that can't shoot efficiently, won't pass and one doesn't play a lick of defense.

The only things that trickle down are wages and horse shit
Paris907
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11/9/2017  7:03 AM
When we discussed OKC last night, a knowledgeable bud of mine pointed out that not only are Melo and PG “rentals” but they are both on questionable legs. Sure, PG is what 29? But he’s in 10 years and had a major injury. Perhaps no longer that Paul George. Melo to me just doesn’t shoot as he did. He’s 3rd fiddle on a team that has 2 ISO Stars and he and his brand just cant bring it.
meloshouldgo
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11/9/2017  7:28 AM
They had a good team built around Westbrook, who is a not someone that can deliver a championship because of his attitude. Now they have all these "multiple time all stars" and no team. Their main problem was Westbrook. Now its Westbrook and Melo and George. Meanwhile Oladipo is showing up to be one of the better two guards on the game. Kanter is bull, Sabonis a gifted you big and Doug a capable bench scorer. Even after seeing Golden State most teams took the wrong message. Having multiple all stars does not equal success. Unselfish team basketball does but it needs great players buy into a system.

OKC has all stars and no system and definitely no buy in. All the chatter is about when they can opt out and leave.

The only things that trickle down are wages and horse shit
newyorknewyork
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11/9/2017  11:40 AM
stanleybostitch wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
TripleThreat wrote:
stanleybostitch wrote:the Thunder lacks anything remotely close to a plan on offense. The spacing is non-existent, the system hasn’t matched the personnel, and no one looks comfortable executing a set.


Russell Westbrook recently signed a massive 10 year deal with Nike.

Think it was total coincidence that he won MVP? (Not saying he's not a great player, he really is a great player, just in very specific ways)

Watching OKC, last season, it was clear, the entire focus was on stat padding RW at all costs. Even to the detriment to free flowing team basketball. Even to the detriment of fundamentals.

Look at Presti's situation. He risks very much of having George, Melo and WB walk on him, leaving him with Steven Adams as his best player. WB leaves, he's gonna get fired. Which shows the high risk move for trading for George and Melo ( granted he did not give up a ton, but he lost massive depth)

The roster is top heavy. Look at the depth. Roberson can't score. Patrick Patterson, Jerami Grant and Ray Felton are the best reserves.

I think they'll do better as the season rolls a long, but they need guys on vet minimum contracts who can help them. A Bogut type. Guys who get bought out and are looking for a contender.

Russ signed an extension already. If George and Melo leave they fall back on Russ and Adams and may have cap space for one FA. Have to depend on the development of Ferg.

Presti getting fired would be a horrible decision. The risk were well worth it given what they gave up. And they still would have the flexibility to recover.

For all the good press Presti gets, I'm surprised he starphucked so hard. Have to think the team would be better with a Westbrook-PG-Kanter core with Dougie coming off the bench, rather than the current lineup they have.

He took a gamble. There is no doubt in my mind he ends up restocking assets if it doesn't work out.

NYKBocker
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11/9/2017  11:57 AM
Gudris wrote:I said this before, Melo is great buddy, but terrible team leader, he is like energy vampire, he sucks out energy from teammates and nobody are playing good basketball

So you are saying he is a succubus?

nixluva
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11/9/2017  12:49 PM
Really don’t care if OKC ever figures things out. This was a desperation move in a stacked Conference that I suppose they had to take. The Arms Race our West is insane.

Meanwhile the direction the Knicks took was the right approach for the franchise. It doesn’t matter if the Knicks sustain this success or not. What matters is the Effort and Growth. This team needed to play this out so they can evaluate the young talent and assess what they need to add to this roster to improve. This has been valuable information already. It’s a clear WIN for the Knicks.

OKC v NYK: night and day

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