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After Game 5: What are the Knicks missing?
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Chandler
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10/30/2017  1:33 PM
fishmike wrote:
Chandler wrote:
EnySpree wrote:
fishmike wrote:Willy is untouchable. Unless its for Josh Jackson.

KP is a 4. Look at him scoring. And people wanted him banging against 5s? No. Please pretty please put your little stretch 4 on KP. I am really enjoying him drop 30 a game and look like he's having fun doing it.

This was the blueprint. Push the pace when you can. When you cant use our size. I love having 2 bigs on the floor. Yes there are times when it can be exploited but to do so you are conceding rebounds. We are huge up front and its showing on both sides of the ball. If we defend the perimeter we have a nice formula. I thought with better guard plan than last year we would see the win total go up from 31 to 35-38.

People wanted to tank. This team can make the playoffs.

I'm on board with everything except Willy. I think he's just the focal point of the Knicks future... i just feel with kanter, noah,koq and Kormet in the g league... where does Willy fit? We simply can't start him ahead of Kanter. He's not going to really improve what we are doing out there off the bench. The kid truly needs 30 minutes on his own team.... with that said we surely can pick up a legit 30 min stud at small fwd in exchange for Willy. I truly believe this is what we have to do to get better.

having the bigs play well is a nice problem to have. McHale came off the bench (behind Cedric Maxwell) for a number of years.

We need to balance the roster better. Too many bigs and too little depth particularly at the 3. Someone needs to be moved

Long term? We have 3 bigs.. Willy/KP/Kanter.

Why Noah expires Willy is due for his extension. Its going to be a glut. Why does Willy have to start? He can come off the bench. Willy has Gasol potential (pick one) and Im not giving that up unless its for a clear blue chip SF like Josh.

Let me put it this way. I view Willy as a player who was just taken with a top 5 pick and has shown great NBA potential already. If you are willing to move that you do so for equal value. I would only do it for a top flight prospect at the 3.

I think you can have 3 bigs on the team and thrive. That being said I also think KAnter's value will make him the guy to trade. He brings a lot but doesnt pass and Willy also sets a better pick. No need to rush. Be patient. Willy also.

I have no problem with this approach. Celts used to stress it's not who starts games but who finishes. I am really hoping Noah plays well too. Then Mills/Perry have to figure a way to move one or two bigs

DJMUSIC: Fisher talked a good game in Post game but aside from that Derek Fisher was ALL CHIT CHAT SH_t and produced nothing!
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fitzfarm
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10/30/2017  1:37 PM
Obviously people will point out the 3 spot, but I think Lee and McBuckets are doing a great job esp Lee Man he is playing physical and bringing a vet presents to our front court. I think its also giving him easier open looks, and allowing him to play up on his slower opponent on defense. Moving to the three looks like its the best thing that ever happened to lee.

A upgrade from mcbuckets for the back up 3 might be nice but its to early to tell,regardless every problem we have right now is a good problem to have we have multiple valuable players at every position. Again the addition of kanter and the subtraction of Melo has been magical to this team growing and creating a TEAM IDENITY.

This just goes to show what kinda poison impact a player like melo can have on todays NBA, if melo is still on this team, we are 0 and 5 with the papers seemingly destroying everyone but the culpret in MELO. This year is all about being thankful for getting rid of a untradable player, and seeing the rise of the great KP

BigDaddyG
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10/30/2017  1:43 PM
GoNyGoNyGo wrote:Moe Harkless.

That is the player they wanted and the type of player that they need. Size and length, D, and 3 point ability.

Exactly. Especially now that Lance appears cooked. We could probably use another veteran guard since Sessions might have hit the wall and Jack will probably drop dead if he continues at this pace. Hopefully Frank starts by the end of the season and Baker finds his J so this becomes a non-issue. I would also throw in "coach" as a need, but I guess I should give until All-Star break, at the very least.

Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
technomaster
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10/30/2017  2:03 PM
Given that we're committed to developing Frank over the long haul, the Jack/Ntilikina tandem seems perfect this season.

I think the easy opportunity is upgrading the SF position. At the moment we don't have a SF of the future at that position lined up - or a 3 and D player to play some adequate minutes. Seems as if the Knicks are hoping for McDermott to grow into that role, as he's the closest thing we have right now.

Kanter might be a less rounded player vs Willy, but he has an elite post up game (61% FG) that it clear to the coaching staff how they want to use him. His rebounding has been prodigious (almost 16 rpg per 36 mins) thus far. It's tough to argue for minutes for Willy when Kanter's been tremendously efficient.

What to do with Willy, Willy seems like much more of a complementary player. Willy is basically a solid, prototypical center on offense, above average on a lot of skills, passing, rebounding, scoring. He'll put up numbers within the flow of the game and get some easy buckets by moving without the ball, but teams won't alter their game plans to stop him and doesn't create a defensive vacuum that creates better spacing for his teammates. His contract is a bargain and I can see him being a productive player elsewhere.

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Knickoftime
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10/30/2017  2:27 PM
technomaster wrote:What to do with Willy, Willy seems like much more of a complementary player. Willy is basically a solid, prototypical center on offense, above average on a lot of skills, passing, rebounding, scoring. He'll put up numbers within the flow of the game and get some easy buckets by moving without the ball, but teams won't alter their game plans to stop him and doesn't create a defensive vacuum that creates better spacing for his teammates. His contract is a bargain and I can see him being a productive player elsewhere.

Again the problem is his contract is such a bargain it has limited trade value to the Knicks. If putting him on the market by himself, all the Knicks could ask for back is some second rounder on a similar favorable contract, or draft pick. If the Knicks want back a more established player, they have to include other players.

EnySpree
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10/30/2017  2:29 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
technomaster wrote:What to do with Willy, Willy seems like much more of a complementary player. Willy is basically a solid, prototypical center on offense, above average on a lot of skills, passing, rebounding, scoring. He'll put up numbers within the flow of the game and get some easy buckets by moving without the ball, but teams won't alter their game plans to stop him and doesn't create a defensive vacuum that creates better spacing for his teammates. His contract is a bargain and I can see him being a productive player elsewhere.

Again the problem is his contract is such a bargain it has limited trade value to the Knicks. If putting him on the market by himself, all the Knicks could ask for back is some second rounder on a similar favorable contract, or draft pick. If the Knicks want back a more established player, they have to include other players.

Thank you captain obvious.

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Swishfm3
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10/30/2017  2:42 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
Swishfm3 wrote:
fishmike wrote:Willy is untouchable. Unless its for Josh Jackson.

What in the world has Hernangomez done to make him "untouchable" ?!

It would not surprise me one bit if we see Hernangomez attached to Noah, in a trade, in order to get his contract off the books. I just hope that when it does happen, it's not for garbage expiring contracts but actual players that help the team move forward.

On that note, what has Hernangomez done to warrant a team taking Noah just to get him?

Not a damn thing....You are absolutely right. So why are fans here afraid of trading him?

teamsport72
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10/30/2017  2:45 PM
Another "trade Willy" thread. So lame. They are not trading Willy. Nobody is trading KPs best friend who has a ceiling 10 times that of Kanter. Why this talk again, when Mills has said they are not trading Willy? They just trashed Cavs, let them play, stop this childish fluff.
EnySpree
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10/30/2017  3:19 PM
teamsport72 wrote:Another "trade Willy" thread. So lame. They are not trading Willy. Nobody is trading KPs best friend who has a ceiling 10 times that of Kanter. Why this talk again, when Mills has said they are not trading Willy? They just trashed Cavs, let them play, stop this childish fluff.

You did realize this is a internet forum

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Knickoftime
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10/30/2017  3:32 PM
Swishfm3 wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
Swishfm3 wrote:
fishmike wrote:Willy is untouchable. Unless its for Josh Jackson.

What in the world has Hernangomez done to make him "untouchable" ?!

It would not surprise me one bit if we see Hernangomez attached to Noah, in a trade, in order to get his contract off the books. I just hope that when it does happen, it's not for garbage expiring contracts but actual players that help the team move forward.

On that note, what has Hernangomez done to warrant a team taking Noah just to get him?

Not a damn thing....You are absolutely right. So why are fans here afraid of trading him?

I'm not sure afraid is the right word, but the answer your question is no reason to. His upside far outpaces his cost.

newyorker4ever
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10/30/2017  4:18 PM
EnySpree wrote:
fishmike wrote:Willy is untouchable. Unless its for Josh Jackson.

KP is a 4. Look at him scoring. And people wanted him banging against 5s? No. Please pretty please put your little stretch 4 on KP. I am really enjoying him drop 30 a game and look like he's having fun doing it.

This was the blueprint. Push the pace when you can. When you cant use our size. I love having 2 bigs on the floor. Yes there are times when it can be exploited but to do so you are conceding rebounds. We are huge up front and its showing on both sides of the ball. If we defend the perimeter we have a nice formula. I thought with better guard plan than last year we would see the win total go up from 31 to 35-38.

People wanted to tank. This team can make the playoffs.

I'm on board with everything except Willy. I think he's just the focal point of the Knicks future... i just feel with kanter, noah,koq and Kormet in the g league... where does Willy fit? We simply can't start him ahead of Kanter. He's not going to really improve what we are doing out there off the bench. The kid truly needs 30 minutes on his own team.... with that said we surely can pick up a legit 30 min stud at small fwd in exchange for Willy. I truly believe this is what we have to do to get better.

But if we trade KOQ, which is what's looking most likely to happen and Kanter does not opt into his 2018/19 contract which some don't think he will then we'll be left with J.Noah and KP as our big men if we trade Willy to.

newyorker4ever
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10/30/2017  4:23 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
EnySpree wrote:with that said we surely can pick up a legit 30 min stud at small fwd in exchange for Willy.

Not alone you can't. Knicks are over the cap and Hernangomez makes $1.3m. Nobody but second rounders makes that kind of money.

In order to get legit small forward you're seeking you have to send out much more salary, which really alters the equation.

We should try to trade for W.Chandler to bring him back home. He hasn't gotten off to a great start for Denver but he always has a solid season and plays both ends of the floor.

martin
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10/30/2017  4:23 PM
newyorker4ever wrote:
EnySpree wrote:
fishmike wrote:Willy is untouchable. Unless its for Josh Jackson.

KP is a 4. Look at him scoring. And people wanted him banging against 5s? No. Please pretty please put your little stretch 4 on KP. I am really enjoying him drop 30 a game and look like he's having fun doing it.

This was the blueprint. Push the pace when you can. When you cant use our size. I love having 2 bigs on the floor. Yes there are times when it can be exploited but to do so you are conceding rebounds. We are huge up front and its showing on both sides of the ball. If we defend the perimeter we have a nice formula. I thought with better guard plan than last year we would see the win total go up from 31 to 35-38.

People wanted to tank. This team can make the playoffs.

I'm on board with everything except Willy. I think he's just the focal point of the Knicks future... i just feel with kanter, noah,koq and Kormet in the g league... where does Willy fit? We simply can't start him ahead of Kanter. He's not going to really improve what we are doing out there off the bench. The kid truly needs 30 minutes on his own team.... with that said we surely can pick up a legit 30 min stud at small fwd in exchange for Willy. I truly believe this is what we have to do to get better.

But if we trade KOQ, which is what's looking most likely to happen and Kanter does not opt into his 2018/19 contract which some don't think he will then we'll be left with J.Noah and KP as our big men if we trade Willy to.

An then you have plenty of cap space to go after a lot of super dudes like Boogie, LeBron, DeAndre.

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newyorker4ever
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10/30/2017  4:37 PM
martin wrote:
newyorker4ever wrote:
EnySpree wrote:
fishmike wrote:Willy is untouchable. Unless its for Josh Jackson.

KP is a 4. Look at him scoring. And people wanted him banging against 5s? No. Please pretty please put your little stretch 4 on KP. I am really enjoying him drop 30 a game and look like he's having fun doing it.

This was the blueprint. Push the pace when you can. When you cant use our size. I love having 2 bigs on the floor. Yes there are times when it can be exploited but to do so you are conceding rebounds. We are huge up front and its showing on both sides of the ball. If we defend the perimeter we have a nice formula. I thought with better guard plan than last year we would see the win total go up from 31 to 35-38.

People wanted to tank. This team can make the playoffs.

I'm on board with everything except Willy. I think he's just the focal point of the Knicks future... i just feel with kanter, noah,koq and Kormet in the g league... where does Willy fit? We simply can't start him ahead of Kanter. He's not going to really improve what we are doing out there off the bench. The kid truly needs 30 minutes on his own team.... with that said we surely can pick up a legit 30 min stud at small fwd in exchange for Willy. I truly believe this is what we have to do to get better.

But if we trade KOQ, which is what's looking most likely to happen and Kanter does not opt into his 2018/19 contract which some don't think he will then we'll be left with J.Noah and KP as our big men if we trade Willy to.

An then you have plenty of cap space to go after a lot of super dudes like Boogie, LeBron, DeAndre.


This 2018 draft is rich in centers as well. I know most all of us have our eyes on Doncic or Porter but what if the end up wanting a better defensive type center to play next to KP like a Bagley, Ayton, Bamba? I myself am locked in on K.Knox right now if we don't end up in the top 5 or M.Bridges.

StarksEwing1
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10/30/2017  5:00 PM
newyorker4ever wrote:
EnySpree wrote:
fishmike wrote:Willy is untouchable. Unless its for Josh Jackson.

KP is a 4. Look at him scoring. And people wanted him banging against 5s? No. Please pretty please put your little stretch 4 on KP. I am really enjoying him drop 30 a game and look like he's having fun doing it.

This was the blueprint. Push the pace when you can. When you cant use our size. I love having 2 bigs on the floor. Yes there are times when it can be exploited but to do so you are conceding rebounds. We are huge up front and its showing on both sides of the ball. If we defend the perimeter we have a nice formula. I thought with better guard plan than last year we would see the win total go up from 31 to 35-38.

People wanted to tank. This team can make the playoffs.

I'm on board with everything except Willy. I think he's just the focal point of the Knicks future... i just feel with kanter, noah,koq and Kormet in the g league... where does Willy fit? We simply can't start him ahead of Kanter. He's not going to really improve what we are doing out there off the bench. The kid truly needs 30 minutes on his own team.... with that said we surely can pick up a legit 30 min stud at small fwd in exchange for Willy. I truly believe this is what we have to do to get better.

But if we trade KOQ, which is what's looking most likely to happen and Kanter does not opt into his 2018/19 contract which some don't think he will then we'll be left with J.Noah and KP as our big men if we trade Willy to.

this 100 percent
CrushAlot
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10/30/2017  5:04 PM
newyorker4ever wrote:
EnySpree wrote:
fishmike wrote:Willy is untouchable. Unless its for Josh Jackson.

KP is a 4. Look at him scoring. And people wanted him banging against 5s? No. Please pretty please put your little stretch 4 on KP. I am really enjoying him drop 30 a game and look like he's having fun doing it.

This was the blueprint. Push the pace when you can. When you cant use our size. I love having 2 bigs on the floor. Yes there are times when it can be exploited but to do so you are conceding rebounds. We are huge up front and its showing on both sides of the ball. If we defend the perimeter we have a nice formula. I thought with better guard plan than last year we would see the win total go up from 31 to 35-38.

People wanted to tank. This team can make the playoffs.

I'm on board with everything except Willy. I think he's just the focal point of the Knicks future... i just feel with kanter, noah,koq and Kormet in the g league... where does Willy fit? We simply can't start him ahead of Kanter. He's not going to really improve what we are doing out there off the bench. The kid truly needs 30 minutes on his own team.... with that said we surely can pick up a legit 30 min stud at small fwd in exchange for Willy. I truly believe this is what we have to do to get better.

But if we trade KOQ, which is what's looking most likely to happen and Kanter does not opt into his 2018/19 contract which some don't think he will then we'll be left with J.Noah and KP as our big men if we trade Willy to.


I think he opts in. He is playing great but I don't think he gets a deal that tops what he is signed for.
I think we know what we're doing..... Phil Jackson
Paris907
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10/30/2017  10:16 PM
EnySpree wrote:
teamsport72 wrote:Another "trade Willy" thread. So lame. They are not trading Willy. Nobody is trading KPs best friend who has a ceiling 10 times that of Kanter. Why this talk again, when Mills has said they are not trading Willy? They just trashed Cavs, let them play, stop this childish fluff.

You did realize this is a internet forum


Noah is the wild card. We know what we will get with Kanter. Porous D and he will Be his strong inside game self which compliments KP nicely. Yet it’s about D. I like Deandre Ayers, Porter and Begley. Porter would resolve our 3 dilemma. Cleveland has a pick and may want Kanter and Lee or OQuinn. I’d take that pick in a NY minute for Kanter and Lee and we would need to take back a contract.

This would ensure we pick up talent and keep our pick as well. Or throw our pick in for Their pick.

TPercy
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10/30/2017  10:24 PM
Swishfm3 wrote:
fishmike wrote:Willy is untouchable. Unless its for Josh Jackson.

What in the world has Hernangomez done to make him "untouchable" ?!

Knicks need to use Kanter or Hernangomez has trade leverage to improve other positions like SF or PG...and I think one of these two will be gone by seasons end.

It would not surprise me one bit if we see Hernangomez attached to Noah, in a trade, in order to get his contract off the books. I just hope that when it does happen, it's not for garbage expiring contracts but actual players that help the team move forward.


Did you like not watch last season....the season where NBA politics aside he should have won rookie of the year? Or does that not count now that we have a shiny new toy?
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Jmpasq
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10/30/2017  11:20 PM
a SF, a scoring guard off the bench, a backup true 4
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EnySpree
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10/30/2017  11:43 PM
Jmpasq wrote:a SF, a scoring guard off the bench, a backup true 4

Beasley and McDermott played nice minutes against Denver. With Lee, THJr, Frank and Jack... the guard position is filled. Dotson though he didn't score gave us some spunk in his quick stint

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After Game 5: What are the Knicks missing?

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