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Panos
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10/28/2017  11:27 PM
...why the Knicks agreed to pay Baker $8mm per year with a player option?
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BigRedDog
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10/28/2017  11:51 PM
Hornachek is really his father. Cant u see the resemblence?
Caseloads
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10/29/2017  12:28 AM
The knicks play their players well. Good for them. Doesn't affect the cap and actually prevents the knicks from other cap blunders and terrible moves.
TripleThreat
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10/29/2017  3:28 AM
Panos wrote:...why the Knicks agreed to pay Baker $8mm per year with a player option?

Baker is not making 8 million AAV, he's making 8 million total IF he opts in next season, through his player option.

Guaranteed Money Versus Limited Obligation

The good thing about fringe players, truly back of the roster guys and UDFAs is you can get them often with little to no financial commitment and cut them loose if needed without a massive cap hit. The flip side to that is if they work out/pan out then the team often had limited options in keeping said player, as said player will hit the open market and start to garner interest in line with actual market approximation.

Generally if you want a fringe player to sign multiple years and be subject to team options, you have to give him some kind of guaranteed money. Can you see how critical it is for a fringe guy to know X amount will hit the bank no matter what?

When the Knicks FIRST signed Baker, they could have signed him for more than the rest of the season and incorporation some team option years. Of course, that meant ponying up some guaranteed money of some kind, which would create a cap charge.

You have to weigh out the math here. Odds are, fringe guys won't make an impact. You start putting in guaranteed money across the board for all these guys, your cap will be hell on Earth. It's more viable to operate with little commitment and see how the player reacts to the market forces around him.

Since you came on this board you have been way off in regards to trade value. - Briggs 7/28/2015
Nalod
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USA
10/29/2017  11:35 AM
Baker plays system ball, does what the coach asks him to do.
Not a bad contract. Sometimes guys with more talent have motivations beyond being a “Glue guy”.
Anger sells, don't buy!
nykshaknbake
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10/29/2017  12:41 PM
Turns the ball over a bunch, can't shoot. Hustles. You could just sign a player from the D league for the minimum, but 4 million doesn't get u a whole lot anyway. The player option is the part that really doesn't make sense. So if he's the diamond in the rough Steve Mills thought he was signing(haha), he'll be gone or demand a bigger contract.
nixluva
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10/29/2017  12:46 PM
nykshaknbake wrote:Turns the ball over a bunch, can't shoot. Hustles. You could just sign a player from the D league for the minimum, but 4 million doesn't get u a whole lot anyway. The player option is the part that really doesn't make sense. So if he's the diamond in the rough Steve Mills thought he was signing(haha), he'll be gone or demand a bigger contract.

A 3 game Stretch is NOT how you judge a young player! Baker averaged 1.1 turnovers last year. Despite his poor scoring Baker has made the Knicks better when on the court than when he’s off. He’s a ROLE player and a good team guy. Gotta give him time to get going.

nykshaknbake
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10/29/2017  12:50 PM
He couldn't shoot last year either. What did you think of the player option?
nixluva
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10/29/2017  12:57 PM
nykshaknbake wrote:He couldn't shoot last year either. What did you think of the player option?

The Knicks seem to be trying to throw a little cash the way of player Agents to build some good will. Agents notice things like this when considering destinations for their clients. Baker’s contract is the LEAST of the Knicks issues!

Baker will get his game going this season. I’m not really worried about his scoring. He’s here to be groomed as a key role player. He’s a good team player and as I said the Knicks performed better when he’s been on the court. When his individual game gets going he’ll be even more impactful.

reub
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10/29/2017  1:27 PM
Has the best plus/minus on the team and is averaging 8 assists per 36 minutes. He steals the ball and disrupts passes. By the end of the year you'll know why he's here. $4 mill per year is 2.5% of the team's salary budget.
Caseloads
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10/29/2017  2:41 PM
continuity. hustle. good locker room (won't go against management or the coach). defense. intensity. insurance at both guard spots in case of injury. development. knows the system.
WaltLongmire
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10/29/2017  2:48 PM
As an early supporter of Baker last, I have to admit I've been disappointed with him so far.

In his defense...he missed a lot of playing time during pre-season because of his ankle, and as far as I can recall, we never had much info thrown our way about the nature of the injury- so maybe it was worse than we know.

On the other hand, I have not seen an improvement in his shooting. Is this because of the injury, or is the shooter we saw last year the real Baker?

I would also note that he became a PG in the Triangle, which is not a PG heavy offense. Is he capable of being a PG, a position he didn't play in college, in a regular NBA offense?

Still feel that his shooting is the most disquieting thing. If it is an ankle thing...time will tell. If not, he won't get much court time, especially if Frank shows progress.

EnySpree: Can we agree to agree not to mention Phil Jackson and triangle for the rest of our lives?
reub
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10/29/2017  3:22 PM
His salary is 2.5% of our budget.
NYKBocker
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10/29/2017  4:04 PM
If you are a stats guy then you will never like a player like Baker. Bakers contract at $4M per season for 2 years does not affect anything but it shows freeagents that this organization will pay you for hardwork
franco12
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10/29/2017  5:25 PM
would he be on an NBA roster, if not ours?
Cartman718
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10/29/2017  9:32 PM
baker relegated to far end of the bench as soon as ntilikina is healthy. even in garbage last 2 mins, jeff put ntilikina and dotson out there not baker.
Nixluva is posting triangle screen grabs, even when nobody asks - Fishmike. LOL So are we going to reference that thread like the bible now? "The thread of Wroten Page 14 post 9" - EnySpree
Andrew
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10/29/2017  9:34 PM
Cartman718 wrote:baker relegated to far end of the bench as soon as ntilikina is healthy. even in garbage last 2 mins, jeff put ntilikina and dotson out there not baker.

Baker didnt dress

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WaltLongmire
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10/29/2017  10:31 PM
Andrew wrote:
Cartman718 wrote:baker relegated to far end of the bench as soon as ntilikina is healthy. even in garbage last 2 mins, jeff put ntilikina and dotson out there not baker.

Baker didnt dress


Unless he is injured...I'd like him to get 30+ MPG in the G league at some point...he needs playing time.
EnySpree: Can we agree to agree not to mention Phil Jackson and triangle for the rest of our lives?
CrushAlot
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10/29/2017  10:36 PM
WaltLongmire wrote:
Andrew wrote:
Cartman718 wrote:baker relegated to far end of the bench as soon as ntilikina is healthy. even in garbage last 2 mins, jeff put ntilikina and dotson out there not baker.

Baker didnt dress


Unless he is injured...I'd like him to get 30+ MPG in the G league at some point...he needs playing time.

I think he is hurt. Ankle?
I think we know what we're doing..... Phil Jackson
TripleThreat
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10/29/2017  11:49 PM
NYKBocker wrote:If you are a stats guy then you will never like a player like Baker. Bakers contract at $4M per season for 2 years does not affect anything but it shows freeagents that this organization will pay you for hardwork

Unfortunately that's a type of statement often pushed by media pundits, if only to try to maintain open avenue with their sources in the various front offices around the league.

Players go for max money, max AAV, max years and/or best chance to win.

No free agent will say , "Dude, I'm going to pass up the most money and most years because Team X did this three season ago for Player A and Player B!"

Ring chasers, guys like David West, or guys like Mike Bibby giving up money to go to a contender, that's a different animal. Those guys have made their core money in the league already.

And ESPECIALLY fringe guys, those guys just want guaranteed money. They don't know how long they are going to play, so any chance to lock in some security, they do.

Sometimes the team, like the Heat the past few years, do it, because the market is thin and they don't have a ton of other options. They stick to guys who are established in their system and are known quantities. It's framed as "loyalty" because it sounds good. But kid yourself not, both sides are as ruthless as the rules allow them to be.

Since you came on this board you have been way off in regards to trade value. - Briggs 7/28/2015
Someone remind me

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