jskinny35 wrote:Just to stir the pot... would KP for 2 solid young players make sense? Instead of 1 unicorn we get 2 quality young players to add to our talentless pool? Not sure we should do it, but trying to make the point that everyone is available at a price. Should we put all our eggs in his basket or spread them out? The PHX one would make me strongly consider it...

KP for J.Jackson and M.Chriss?

KP for Zach LaVine and Lauri M and future pick?

KP and player for Harrison Barnes and Nerlens Noel?

Just to stir the pot, what if you won Powerball and Jessica Beal decided to leave JT for you?

Knickoftime wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

jskinny35 wrote:Just to stir the pot... would KP for 2 solid young players make sense? Instead of 1 unicorn we get 2 quality young players to add to our talentless pool? Not sure we should do it, but trying to make the point that everyone is available at a price. Should we put all our eggs in his basket or spread them out? The PHX one would make me strongly consider it...

KP for J.Jackson and M.Chriss?

KP for Zach LaVine and Lauri M and future pick?

KP and player for Harrison Barnes and Nerlens Noel?

To answer someone's previous question, the reason this is a topic today because he's coming off of a bad game. There's 79 games to play and 22-yo KP's third season. I think it's only logical to defer this entire topic until June.

Or the rest of us can have fun talking about it and you can just include yourself in June?? As i said, i love KP and am his biggest fan and have been since we drafted him but the Knicks as a franchise comes first for me and i think with the right return for KP we could put together a better young team but it has to be the right return or i obviously wouldn't make the trade. I have no problem keeping KP and re-signing him but KP does come with some negatives about him and his game and i'm not sure he's the #1 piece on a championship team. He's easily a #2 piece just not a #1 piece IMO. The injury concerns are there for a kid as tall and lanky as he is, i don't see much of an inside game from him because he's still not strong enough to go up against these bigger guys, he's too slow top guard most PF's and too weak to guard the centers. There's no way that these things can't be concerns for any of you guys cause they're all realistic concerns.

If the question is, should the next trade KP if they're guaranteed to get a better return, the answer is of course yes. There really is a much a of discussion to be had about that, is there?

What the return might be and IF it will be better than KP seems to be the subject ripe for discussion.

And on that note, you just punched a LOT of holes in KP's game. So the better question is why are you expecting this huge return despite all the red flags you think are realistic concerns.

This reads to me like a classic message board argument that we all know his flaws, other teams don't, so we'll get a king's ransom and laugh all the way to the bank while KP never becomes that superstar the other team expects him to be.

How some fans do not understand that the biggest flaw of the concept of trading, your newly declared, franchise player is not that a better return may be had but rather that a change of direction, after just 4 games, is dysfunction at its highest form.

HofstraBBall wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

jskinny35 wrote:Just to stir the pot... would KP for 2 solid young players make sense? Instead of 1 unicorn we get 2 quality young players to add to our talentless pool? Not sure we should do it, but trying to make the point that everyone is available at a price. Should we put all our eggs in his basket or spread them out? The PHX one would make me strongly consider it...

KP for J.Jackson and M.Chriss?

KP for Zach LaVine and Lauri M and future pick?

KP and player for Harrison Barnes and Nerlens Noel?

To answer someone's previous question, the reason this is a topic today because he's coming off of a bad game. There's 79 games to play and 22-yo KP's third season. I think it's only logical to defer this entire topic until June.

Or the rest of us can have fun talking about it and you can just include yourself in June?? As i said, i love KP and am his biggest fan and have been since we drafted him but the Knicks as a franchise comes first for me and i think with the right return for KP we could put together a better young team but it has to be the right return or i obviously wouldn't make the trade. I have no problem keeping KP and re-signing him but KP does come with some negatives about him and his game and i'm not sure he's the #1 piece on a championship team. He's easily a #2 piece just not a #1 piece IMO. The injury concerns are there for a kid as tall and lanky as he is, i don't see much of an inside game from him because he's still not strong enough to go up against these bigger guys, he's too slow top guard most PF's and too weak to guard the centers. There's no way that these things can't be concerns for any of you guys cause they're all realistic concerns.

If the question is, should the next trade KP if they're guaranteed to get a better return, the answer is of course yes. There really is a much a of discussion to be had about that, is there?

What the return might be and IF it will be better than KP seems to be the subject ripe for discussion.

And on that note, you just punched a LOT of holes in KP's game. So the better question is why are you expecting this huge return despite all the red flags you think are realistic concerns.

This reads to me like a classic message board argument that we all know his flaws, other teams don't, so we'll get a king's ransom and laugh all the way to the bank while KP never becomes that superstar the other team expects him to be.

How some fans do not understand that the biggest flaw of the concept of trading, your newly declared, franchise player is not that a better return may be had but rather that a change of direction, after just 4 games, is dysfunction at its highest form.

+1

The dysfunction will remain until mills is gone. This is our 3rd rebuild in 4 yrs. 17 wins, entire new roster, 32 wins, entire new roster, 31 wins, primarily the same roster, but now were rebuilding.

your suppose to be able to flush the roster down the toilet like walsh did and start fresh with cap space and a couple of draft picks.

Almost the entire roster is signed through next season and we have just one 1st rnd pick..How is that a rebuild when 75% of your roster are vets

knicks1248 wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

jskinny35 wrote:Just to stir the pot... would KP for 2 solid young players make sense? Instead of 1 unicorn we get 2 quality young players to add to our talentless pool? Not sure we should do it, but trying to make the point that everyone is available at a price. Should we put all our eggs in his basket or spread them out? The PHX one would make me strongly consider it...

KP for J.Jackson and M.Chriss?

KP for Zach LaVine and Lauri M and future pick?

KP and player for Harrison Barnes and Nerlens Noel?

To answer someone's previous question, the reason this is a topic today because he's coming off of a bad game. There's 79 games to play and 22-yo KP's third season. I think it's only logical to defer this entire topic until June.

Or the rest of us can have fun talking about it and you can just include yourself in June?? As i said, i love KP and am his biggest fan and have been since we drafted him but the Knicks as a franchise comes first for me and i think with the right return for KP we could put together a better young team but it has to be the right return or i obviously wouldn't make the trade. I have no problem keeping KP and re-signing him but KP does come with some negatives about him and his game and i'm not sure he's the #1 piece on a championship team. He's easily a #2 piece just not a #1 piece IMO. The injury concerns are there for a kid as tall and lanky as he is, i don't see much of an inside game from him because he's still not strong enough to go up against these bigger guys, he's too slow top guard most PF's and too weak to guard the centers. There's no way that these things can't be concerns for any of you guys cause they're all realistic concerns.

If the question is, should the next trade KP if they're guaranteed to get a better return, the answer is of course yes. There really is a much a of discussion to be had about that, is there?

What the return might be and IF it will be better than KP seems to be the subject ripe for discussion.

And on that note, you just punched a LOT of holes in KP's game. So the better question is why are you expecting this huge return despite all the red flags you think are realistic concerns.

This reads to me like a classic message board argument that we all know his flaws, other teams don't, so we'll get a king's ransom and laugh all the way to the bank while KP never becomes that superstar the other team expects him to be.

How some fans do not understand that the biggest flaw of the concept of trading, your newly declared, franchise player is not that a better return may be had but rather that a change of direction, after just 4 games, is dysfunction at its highest form.

+1

The dysfunction will remain until mills is gone. This is our 3rd rebuild in 4 yrs. 17 wins, entire new roster, 32 wins, entire new roster, 31 wins, primarily the same roster, but now were rebuilding.

your suppose to be able to flush the roster down the toilet like walsh did and start fresh with cap space and a couple of draft picks.

Almost the entire roster is signed through next season and we have just one 1st rnd pick..How is that a rebuild when 75% of your roster are vets

Phil tried to win now, that's what pretty much what got him in trouble. Trading Tyson for Jose, reupping Melo, signing Noah & Lee.

Regardless, Knicks will have their lotto pick this coming draft. If Kanter and KOQ opt out they are looking at 30 mil in cap space. If they can acquire 2 impact players with that while balancing the roster. Would be a giant step in the right direction.

Knickoftime wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

jskinny35 wrote:Just to stir the pot... would KP for 2 solid young players make sense? Instead of 1 unicorn we get 2 quality young players to add to our talentless pool? Not sure we should do it, but trying to make the point that everyone is available at a price. Should we put all our eggs in his basket or spread them out? The PHX one would make me strongly consider it...

KP for J.Jackson and M.Chriss?

KP for Zach LaVine and Lauri M and future pick?

KP and player for Harrison Barnes and Nerlens Noel?

To answer someone's previous question, the reason this is a topic today because he's coming off of a bad game. There's 79 games to play and 22-yo KP's third season. I think it's only logical to defer this entire topic until June.

Or the rest of us can have fun talking about it and you can just include yourself in June?? As i said, i love KP and am his biggest fan and have been since we drafted him but the Knicks as a franchise comes first for me and i think with the right return for KP we could put together a better young team but it has to be the right return or i obviously wouldn't make the trade. I have no problem keeping KP and re-signing him but KP does come with some negatives about him and his game and i'm not sure he's the #1 piece on a championship team. He's easily a #2 piece just not a #1 piece IMO. The injury concerns are there for a kid as tall and lanky as he is, i don't see much of an inside game from him because he's still not strong enough to go up against these bigger guys, he's too slow top guard most PF's and too weak to guard the centers. There's no way that these things can't be concerns for any of you guys cause they're all realistic concerns.

If the question is, should the next trade KP if they're guaranteed to get a better return, the answer is of course yes. There really is a much a of discussion to be had about that, is there?

What the return might be and IF it will be better than KP seems to be the subject ripe for discussion.

And on that note, you just punched a LOT of holes in KP's game. So the better question is why are you expecting this huge return despite all the red flags you think are realistic concerns.

This reads to me like a classic message board argument that we all know his flaws, other teams don't, so we'll get a king's ransom and laugh all the way to the bank while KP never becomes that superstar the other team expects him to be.

How some fans do not understand that the biggest flaw of the concept of trading, your newly declared, franchise player is not that a better return may be had but rather that a change of direction, after just 4 games, is dysfunction at its highest form.

+1

The dysfunction will remain until mills is gone. This is our 3rd rebuild in 4 yrs. 17 wins, entire new roster, 32 wins, entire new roster, 31 wins, primarily the same roster, but now were rebuilding.

your suppose to be able to flush the roster down the toilet like walsh did and start fresh with cap space and a couple of draft picks.

Almost the entire roster is signed through next season and we have just one 1st rnd pick..How is that a rebuild when 75% of your roster are vets

It'll be sloooow... but a year or 2 faster than if they tried to "win" this season.

A year or 2 faster to what exactly?

Jmpasq wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

jskinny35 wrote:Just to stir the pot... would KP for 2 solid young players make sense? Instead of 1 unicorn we get 2 quality young players to add to our talentless pool? Not sure we should do it, but trying to make the point that everyone is available at a price. Should we put all our eggs in his basket or spread them out? The PHX one would make me strongly consider it...

KP for J.Jackson and M.Chriss?

KP for Zach LaVine and Lauri M and future pick?

KP and player for Harrison Barnes and Nerlens Noel?

To answer someone's previous question, the reason this is a topic today because he's coming off of a bad game. There's 79 games to play and 22-yo KP's third season. I think it's only logical to defer this entire topic until June.

Or the rest of us can have fun talking about it and you can just include yourself in June?? As i said, i love KP and am his biggest fan and have been since we drafted him but the Knicks as a franchise comes first for me and i think with the right return for KP we could put together a better young team but it has to be the right return or i obviously wouldn't make the trade. I have no problem keeping KP and re-signing him but KP does come with some negatives about him and his game and i'm not sure he's the #1 piece on a championship team. He's easily a #2 piece just not a #1 piece IMO. The injury concerns are there for a kid as tall and lanky as he is, i don't see much of an inside game from him because he's still not strong enough to go up against these bigger guys, he's too slow top guard most PF's and too weak to guard the centers. There's no way that these things can't be concerns for any of you guys cause they're all realistic concerns.

If the question is, should the next trade KP if they're guaranteed to get a better return, the answer is of course yes. There really is a much a of discussion to be had about that, is there?

What the return might be and IF it will be better than KP seems to be the subject ripe for discussion.

And on that note, you just punched a LOT of holes in KP's game. So the better question is why are you expecting this huge return despite all the red flags you think are realistic concerns.

This reads to me like a classic message board argument that we all know his flaws, other teams don't, so we'll get a king's ransom and laugh all the way to the bank while KP never becomes that superstar the other team expects him to be.

How some fans do not understand that the biggest flaw of the concept of trading, your newly declared, franchise player is not that a better return may be had but rather that a change of direction, after just 4 games, is dysfunction at its highest form.

Keeping KP is fine but building a winner around him will be impossible because of all the other bad decisions the FO has made. You know how hard it will be to build a true contender once KP gets a max deal? Its not about KP necessarily but all the other dumb moves that have already destroyed his timeline. There was no reason to give Hardaway that deal, especially when you already have useless Noah. You can absorb one awful deal but 2 long-term cap crushing deals? No one is signing here in Free agency so the best way to build is through the draft. The best way to build through the draft is getting a core of 5-6 players in a 4 year span. Its to bad the last regime robbed all of the draft picks because we would probably have enough pieces to trade for help or at least be further along by now. In my opinion unless we get extremely lucky and ger Porter or Doncic we probably need to go the nuclear option. Be horrible until Hardaway and Noah are gone gain as many assets as possible which will be hard to do because we are capped out. We should of took on a bad contract from the Lakers to get Russel but this organization has no forward thinking whatsoever.

4 yrs, waiting for lottery picks are you kidding me..smh..why not just hire a scout to run the franchise if that's the case.

Like I keep saying, walsh took 1 1/2 yrs to get rid of some of the worst contracts the knicks every had, and that roster was 10x worse. He manage to keep all the young guys, and got amare, and we were playoff bound with a solid young core, until the melo trade.

meloshouldgo wrote:Switching from building a team around Melo to building a team around KP is NOT a rebuild. Its going from starfukkA to starfukkB. This is why we need tho stop trying tho build teams around people and demand they start plaguing basketball the right way. We weren't able to build teams around Ewing, Houston, Marbury, Amare, Melo ...
At some point out should sink in that this is a STUPID approach.

You need to start somewhere. You start with the best player you can find then go from them. KP is the starting point.

Jmpasq wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

jskinny35 wrote:Just to stir the pot... would KP for 2 solid young players make sense? Instead of 1 unicorn we get 2 quality young players to add to our talentless pool? Not sure we should do it, but trying to make the point that everyone is available at a price. Should we put all our eggs in his basket or spread them out? The PHX one would make me strongly consider it...

KP for J.Jackson and M.Chriss?

KP for Zach LaVine and Lauri M and future pick?

KP and player for Harrison Barnes and Nerlens Noel?

To answer someone's previous question, the reason this is a topic today because he's coming off of a bad game. There's 79 games to play and 22-yo KP's third season. I think it's only logical to defer this entire topic until June.

Or the rest of us can have fun talking about it and you can just include yourself in June?? As i said, i love KP and am his biggest fan and have been since we drafted him but the Knicks as a franchise comes first for me and i think with the right return for KP we could put together a better young team but it has to be the right return or i obviously wouldn't make the trade. I have no problem keeping KP and re-signing him but KP does come with some negatives about him and his game and i'm not sure he's the #1 piece on a championship team. He's easily a #2 piece just not a #1 piece IMO. The injury concerns are there for a kid as tall and lanky as he is, i don't see much of an inside game from him because he's still not strong enough to go up against these bigger guys, he's too slow top guard most PF's and too weak to guard the centers. There's no way that these things can't be concerns for any of you guys cause they're all realistic concerns.

If the question is, should the next trade KP if they're guaranteed to get a better return, the answer is of course yes. There really is a much a of discussion to be had about that, is there?

What the return might be and IF it will be better than KP seems to be the subject ripe for discussion.

And on that note, you just punched a LOT of holes in KP's game. So the better question is why are you expecting this huge return despite all the red flags you think are realistic concerns.

This reads to me like a classic message board argument that we all know his flaws, other teams don't, so we'll get a king's ransom and laugh all the way to the bank while KP never becomes that superstar the other team expects him to be.

How some fans do not understand that the biggest flaw of the concept of trading, your newly declared, franchise player is not that a better return may be had but rather that a change of direction, after just 4 games, is dysfunction at its highest form.

Keeping KP is fine but building a winner around him will be impossible because of all the other bad decisions the FO has made. You know how hard it will be to build a true contender once KP gets a max deal? Its not about KP necessarily but all the other dumb moves that have already destroyed his timeline. There was no reason to give Hardaway that deal, especially when you already have useless Noah. You can absorb one awful deal but 2 long-term cap crushing deals? No one is signing here in Free agency so the best way to build is through the draft. The best way to build through the draft is getting a core of 5-6 players in a 4 year span. Its to bad the last regime robbed all of the draft picks because we would probably have enough pieces to trade for help or at least be further along by now. In my opinion unless we get extremely lucky and ger Porter or Doncic we probably need to go the nuclear option. Be horrible until Hardaway and Noah are gone gain as many assets as possible which will be hard to do because we are capped out. We should of took on a bad contract from the Lakers to get Russel but this organization has no forward thinking whatsoever.

Come deadline you make have a point... McD and KOQ are both expiring (KOQ has a PO). Knicks will at least have some pieces to work with.

The trade KP talk is just stupid. Only time you entertain that is after he signs his extension, is here for a few years, has 2 years left and the Knicks are simply terrible, then maybe you reboot and restart. Knicks should be able to do better than that.

meloshouldgo wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:Switching from building a team around Melo to building a team around KP is NOT a rebuild. Its going from starfukkA to starfukkB. This is why we need tho stop trying tho build teams around people and demand they start plaguing basketball the right way. We weren't able to build teams around Ewing, Houston, Marbury, Amare, Melo ...
At some point out should sink in that this is a STUPID approach.

You need to start somewhere. You start with the best player you can find then go from them. KP is the starting point.

We have had lots of different starting points and we are yet to get started. How about we just rethink the approach? Do we really need to keep doing the same **** and expect different results?

Building anything starts with a foundation. The approach is that you need to decide what foundation you want to lay down. Knicks has decided that KP is this foundation along with Frank and hopefully Willy. Unless there is another way of building anything then this is the only way to go.

I mean...what approach do you think we should be doing?