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It's just hard to believe our pg situation
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Jmpasq
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10/25/2017  6:48 AM
knickscity wrote:This is no surprise. the team put zero effort into the most important position on the floor. Mills gave out an abysmal contract to hardaway, and Perry didn't even try to secure suitable pg. They only called the Suns so gullible fans will think they're trying to improve by blowing smoke up their ass. "Hey, we tried to get Bledsoe, but Phx wants all our youngins".

By the time Perry got here there was no cap room

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Nalod
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10/25/2017  7:11 AM
A trade for Bledsoe with youth would be awful. He would not move the needle enough.
doubtful playoff and lower our odds for another franchise talent via draft.
rebuilding is a long and hard road. Doubts will taint the most faithful.
Anger sells, don't buy!
StarksEwing1
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10/25/2017  7:39 AM
Jmpasq wrote:
knickscity wrote:This is no surprise. the team put zero effort into the most important position on the floor. Mills gave out an abysmal contract to hardaway, and Perry didn't even try to secure suitable pg. They only called the Suns so gullible fans will think they're trying to improve by blowing smoke up their ass. "Hey, we tried to get Bledsoe, but Phx wants all our youngins".

By the time Perry got here there was no cap room

Exactly. there wasn't anything Perry could do. Its funny after all the mistakes we made in the past by trading numerous picks/young assets for injury prone players with bloated contracts people still want to go down that road again
fishmike
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10/25/2017  8:43 AM
TripleThreat wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Russell Westbrook was Thursday. Kyrie Irving on Tuesday. James Harden on deck for next week. Then, eventually, it's John Wall, Steph Curry, Mike Conley, Kyle Lowry, Dame Lillard, Kemba Walker, etc., etc

It's unquestionably a point guard's league these days, and the Knicks are trotting out a combo of Ramon Sessions and Ron Baker. And, frankly, being overmatched at the position is nothing new for the Knicks. You have to go all the way back to Mark Jackson in 1989 to find their last All-Star point guard.

The drought is remarkable.

How did we not make this a major priority this off season is beyond stupidity, especially knowing frank is about 4 yrs away from being relevant..

nobody to set up our shooters, and nobody to set up the bigs

You've brought this point up several times. And several times people have asked you, what specifically do you think the Knicks should do. You've said nothing most times, the Rondo once or twice.

I'd really like you to go into some actual depth into who specifically you think the Knicks should have gone after, would have actually come here, and how they would actually help this team short term and long term.

A lot of players you think the Knicks should sign would likely have never come here anyway. If they did, it would be a gross overpay in years and AAV.

you will hear crickets. He's great at crying but offers no alternatives. The two guys he harps on are Rose and Rondo, which tells you everything you need to know.
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Welpee
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10/25/2017  10:18 AM
knicks1248 wrote:
Russell Westbrook was Thursday. Kyrie Irving on Tuesday. James Harden on deck for next week. Then, eventually, it's John Wall, Steph Curry, Mike Conley, Kyle Lowry, Dame Lillard, Kemba Walker, etc., etc

It's unquestionably a point guard's league these days, and the Knicks are trotting out a combo of Ramon Sessions and Ron Baker. And, frankly, being overmatched at the position is nothing new for the Knicks. You have to go all the way back to Mark Jackson in 1989 to find their last All-Star point guard.

The drought is remarkable.

How did we not make this a major priority this off season is beyond stupidity, especially knowing frank is about 4 yrs away from being relevant..

nobody to set up our shooters, and nobody to set up the bigs

Wasn't our lottery pick a PG? How was it not a priority? I also think it was a priority to not overpay for people like Jeff Teague or Jrue Holliday. I hindsight, even though he's injured now, Rondo might have been the move we let pass us by(though I've never been a fan of his).
SupremeCommander
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10/25/2017  11:01 AM
Welpee wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Russell Westbrook was Thursday. Kyrie Irving on Tuesday. James Harden on deck for next week. Then, eventually, it's John Wall, Steph Curry, Mike Conley, Kyle Lowry, Dame Lillard, Kemba Walker, etc., etc

It's unquestionably a point guard's league these days, and the Knicks are trotting out a combo of Ramon Sessions and Ron Baker. And, frankly, being overmatched at the position is nothing new for the Knicks. You have to go all the way back to Mark Jackson in 1989 to find their last All-Star point guard.

The drought is remarkable.

How did we not make this a major priority this off season is beyond stupidity, especially knowing frank is about 4 yrs away from being relevant..

nobody to set up our shooters, and nobody to set up the bigs

Wasn't our lottery pick a PG? How was it not a priority? I also think it was a priority to not overpay for people like Jeff Teague or Jrue Holliday. I hindsight, even though he's injured now, Rondo might have been the move we let pass us by(though I've never been a fan of his).

I don't think anyone but the most delusional fans thought that Frank would get 30 to 35 mpg... that's why the position wasn't a priority. We didn't acquire anyone that would play meaningful minutes THIS season

fishmike said: Yes. Sometimes I confuse the alerts with when your mom calls. BTW she said defensive guards are really important.
newyorknewyork
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10/25/2017  11:15 AM
SupremeCommander wrote:
Welpee wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Russell Westbrook was Thursday. Kyrie Irving on Tuesday. James Harden on deck for next week. Then, eventually, it's John Wall, Steph Curry, Mike Conley, Kyle Lowry, Dame Lillard, Kemba Walker, etc., etc

It's unquestionably a point guard's league these days, and the Knicks are trotting out a combo of Ramon Sessions and Ron Baker. And, frankly, being overmatched at the position is nothing new for the Knicks. You have to go all the way back to Mark Jackson in 1989 to find their last All-Star point guard.

The drought is remarkable.

How did we not make this a major priority this off season is beyond stupidity, especially knowing frank is about 4 yrs away from being relevant..

nobody to set up our shooters, and nobody to set up the bigs

Wasn't our lottery pick a PG? How was it not a priority? I also think it was a priority to not overpay for people like Jeff Teague or Jrue Holliday. I hindsight, even though he's injured now, Rondo might have been the move we let pass us by(though I've never been a fan of his).

I don't think anyone but the most delusional fans thought that Frank would get 30 to 35 mpg... that's why the position wasn't a priority. We didn't acquire anyone that would play meaningful minutes THIS season

Out of all of the real options. Collison is the only player who it looks like we missed on. He really sucked pretty bad last yr though. So I could see the hesitation. Hill is being outplayed by Fox while making 20mil a yr. Holiday while making 25 has played very poor so far. Rondo has a herniated disc.

None of them would be here for the long term.

fishmike
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10/25/2017  11:21 AM
newyorknewyork wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
Welpee wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Russell Westbrook was Thursday. Kyrie Irving on Tuesday. James Harden on deck for next week. Then, eventually, it's John Wall, Steph Curry, Mike Conley, Kyle Lowry, Dame Lillard, Kemba Walker, etc., etc

It's unquestionably a point guard's league these days, and the Knicks are trotting out a combo of Ramon Sessions and Ron Baker. And, frankly, being overmatched at the position is nothing new for the Knicks. You have to go all the way back to Mark Jackson in 1989 to find their last All-Star point guard.

The drought is remarkable.

How did we not make this a major priority this off season is beyond stupidity, especially knowing frank is about 4 yrs away from being relevant..

nobody to set up our shooters, and nobody to set up the bigs

Wasn't our lottery pick a PG? How was it not a priority? I also think it was a priority to not overpay for people like Jeff Teague or Jrue Holliday. I hindsight, even though he's injured now, Rondo might have been the move we let pass us by(though I've never been a fan of his).

I don't think anyone but the most delusional fans thought that Frank would get 30 to 35 mpg... that's why the position wasn't a priority. We didn't acquire anyone that would play meaningful minutes THIS season

Out of all of the real options. Collison is the only player who it looks like we missed on. He really sucked pretty bad last yr though. So I could see the hesitation. Hill is being outplayed by Fox while making 20mil a yr. Holiday while making 25 has played very poor so far. Rondo has a herniated disc.

None of them would be here for the long term.

and when that is the case what do you do? The best move, the smart move, the move the Knicks never did in the past is simple. You do nothing. In the past we would have give up a pick and a player to sign and trade Hill for $20mm and declare we got the best guy on the market.

Smart move is do nothing and wait. Maybe we can get Bledsoe for Kanter and or spare parts. That would be the value of waiting and buying low. To me I think that is the deal to make happen.

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SupremeCommander
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10/25/2017  11:58 AM
fishmike wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
Welpee wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Russell Westbrook was Thursday. Kyrie Irving on Tuesday. James Harden on deck for next week. Then, eventually, it's John Wall, Steph Curry, Mike Conley, Kyle Lowry, Dame Lillard, Kemba Walker, etc., etc

It's unquestionably a point guard's league these days, and the Knicks are trotting out a combo of Ramon Sessions and Ron Baker. And, frankly, being overmatched at the position is nothing new for the Knicks. You have to go all the way back to Mark Jackson in 1989 to find their last All-Star point guard.

The drought is remarkable.

How did we not make this a major priority this off season is beyond stupidity, especially knowing frank is about 4 yrs away from being relevant..

nobody to set up our shooters, and nobody to set up the bigs

Wasn't our lottery pick a PG? How was it not a priority? I also think it was a priority to not overpay for people like Jeff Teague or Jrue Holliday. I hindsight, even though he's injured now, Rondo might have been the move we let pass us by(though I've never been a fan of his).

I don't think anyone but the most delusional fans thought that Frank would get 30 to 35 mpg... that's why the position wasn't a priority. We didn't acquire anyone that would play meaningful minutes THIS season

Out of all of the real options. Collison is the only player who it looks like we missed on. He really sucked pretty bad last yr though. So I could see the hesitation. Hill is being outplayed by Fox while making 20mil a yr. Holiday while making 25 has played very poor so far. Rondo has a herniated disc.

None of them would be here for the long term.

and when that is the case what do you do? The best move, the smart move, the move the Knicks never did in the past is simple. You do nothing. In the past we would have give up a pick and a player to sign and trade Hill for $20mm and declare we got the best guy on the market.

Smart move is do nothing and wait. Maybe we can get Bledsoe for Kanter and or spare parts. That would be the value of waiting and buying low. To me I think that is the deal to make happen.

well then why give THJ $30 to 40 mil more than he deserves?

fishmike said: Yes. Sometimes I confuse the alerts with when your mom calls. BTW she said defensive guards are really important.
Markji
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10/25/2017  12:15 PM    LAST EDITED: 10/25/2017  12:20 PM
SupremeCommander wrote:
fishmike wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
Welpee wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Russell Westbrook was Thursday. Kyrie Irving on Tuesday. James Harden on deck for next week. Then, eventually, it's John Wall, Steph Curry, Mike Conley, Kyle Lowry, Dame Lillard, Kemba Walker, etc., etc

It's unquestionably a point guard's league these days, and the Knicks are trotting out a combo of Ramon Sessions and Ron Baker. And, frankly, being overmatched at the position is nothing new for the Knicks. You have to go all the way back to Mark Jackson in 1989 to find their last All-Star point guard.

The drought is remarkable.

How did we not make this a major priority this off season is beyond stupidity, especially knowing frank is about 4 yrs away from being relevant..

nobody to set up our shooters, and nobody to set up the bigs

Wasn't our lottery pick a PG? How was it not a priority? I also think it was a priority to not overpay for people like Jeff Teague or Jrue Holliday. I hindsight, even though he's injured now, Rondo might have been the move we let pass us by(though I've never been a fan of his).

I don't think anyone but the most delusional fans thought that Frank would get 30 to 35 mpg... that's why the position wasn't a priority. We didn't acquire anyone that would play meaningful minutes THIS season

Out of all of the real options. Collison is the only player who it looks like we missed on. He really sucked pretty bad last yr though. So I could see the hesitation. Hill is being outplayed by Fox while making 20mil a yr. Holiday while making 25 has played very poor so far. Rondo has a herniated disc.

None of them would be here for the long term.

and when that is the case what do you do? The best move, the smart move, the move the Knicks never did in the past is simple. You do nothing. In the past we would have give up a pick and a player to sign and trade Hill for $20mm and declare we got the best guy on the market.

Smart move is do nothing and wait. Maybe we can get Bledsoe for Kanter and or spare parts. That would be the value of waiting and buying low. To me I think that is the deal to make happen.

well then why give THJ $30 to 40 mil more than he deserves?


Fishmike, I agree with your post from other thread - Kanter is a beast inside. He isn't perfectly well-rounded in all of his skills but - against the Celtics he had 17 rebounds in the first half. Only played a little in the 2nd half and wound up with 19 reb; 16 pts. Kanter is probably being showcased but he can't be traded until Dec 14 if in a group of players but could be traded now by himself. O'Q is also being showcased.

Also, the game plan might have been to attack the Celtics inside. Neither Kanter nor Willy got an assist but they both were the highest and most efficient scorers for us. ALso, just to note: Willy only had 1 reb in 11 minutes while Kanter had 19 reb.

To get Bledsoe, Perry can try to put together a 3 way trade - O'Q and either Lance or CLee to a contender team and or Kuz; they send young players and maybe a pick to Phoenix; we get Bledsoe.

Why I want Bledsoe - we need a starting caliber PG badly. Very badly. So many posters want to develop the young players....well....you need a pg who knows how to play and can play, so the team can function correctly on the court. Bledsoe isn't the best pg in the NBA but he is good and knows how to play. Having him lead the offense, all of the young players will learn how to play NBA basketball much more quickly.

The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense. Tom Clancy - author
franco12
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10/25/2017  12:17 PM
I'd like to see us start Ron Baker at SF, and move THjr back to SG. I think that, and maybe Willy as our PF, would help with getting our offense on the right track.
fishmike
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10/25/2017  12:27 PM
SupremeCommander wrote:
fishmike wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
Welpee wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Russell Westbrook was Thursday. Kyrie Irving on Tuesday. James Harden on deck for next week. Then, eventually, it's John Wall, Steph Curry, Mike Conley, Kyle Lowry, Dame Lillard, Kemba Walker, etc., etc

It's unquestionably a point guard's league these days, and the Knicks are trotting out a combo of Ramon Sessions and Ron Baker. And, frankly, being overmatched at the position is nothing new for the Knicks. You have to go all the way back to Mark Jackson in 1989 to find their last All-Star point guard.

The drought is remarkable.

How did we not make this a major priority this off season is beyond stupidity, especially knowing frank is about 4 yrs away from being relevant..

nobody to set up our shooters, and nobody to set up the bigs

Wasn't our lottery pick a PG? How was it not a priority? I also think it was a priority to not overpay for people like Jeff Teague or Jrue Holliday. I hindsight, even though he's injured now, Rondo might have been the move we let pass us by(though I've never been a fan of his).

I don't think anyone but the most delusional fans thought that Frank would get 30 to 35 mpg... that's why the position wasn't a priority. We didn't acquire anyone that would play meaningful minutes THIS season

Out of all of the real options. Collison is the only player who it looks like we missed on. He really sucked pretty bad last yr though. So I could see the hesitation. Hill is being outplayed by Fox while making 20mil a yr. Holiday while making 25 has played very poor so far. Rondo has a herniated disc.

None of them would be here for the long term.

and when that is the case what do you do? The best move, the smart move, the move the Knicks never did in the past is simple. You do nothing. In the past we would have give up a pick and a player to sign and trade Hill for $20mm and declare we got the best guy on the market.

Smart move is do nothing and wait. Maybe we can get Bledsoe for Kanter and or spare parts. That would be the value of waiting and buying low. To me I think that is the deal to make happen.

well then why give THJ $30 to 40 mil more than he deserves?

well thats your opinion not mine. When I look at ALL the recent contracts given to wings I think the Knicks did OK with THJ. Evan Turner, Alan Crabbe, Kent Bazemore, Reddick, Wes Mathews, Jamal Crawford, the pope guy... THJ is right about where the market is. He's like the 15th highest paid guy at his position. He's gotta play better. Its been a really bad 3 games.
fishmike - Making UltimateKnicks great again
fishmike
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10/25/2017  12:29 PM
Markji wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
fishmike wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
Welpee wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Russell Westbrook was Thursday. Kyrie Irving on Tuesday. James Harden on deck for next week. Then, eventually, it's John Wall, Steph Curry, Mike Conley, Kyle Lowry, Dame Lillard, Kemba Walker, etc., etc

It's unquestionably a point guard's league these days, and the Knicks are trotting out a combo of Ramon Sessions and Ron Baker. And, frankly, being overmatched at the position is nothing new for the Knicks. You have to go all the way back to Mark Jackson in 1989 to find their last All-Star point guard.

The drought is remarkable.

How did we not make this a major priority this off season is beyond stupidity, especially knowing frank is about 4 yrs away from being relevant..

nobody to set up our shooters, and nobody to set up the bigs

Wasn't our lottery pick a PG? How was it not a priority? I also think it was a priority to not overpay for people like Jeff Teague or Jrue Holliday. I hindsight, even though he's injured now, Rondo might have been the move we let pass us by(though I've never been a fan of his).

I don't think anyone but the most delusional fans thought that Frank would get 30 to 35 mpg... that's why the position wasn't a priority. We didn't acquire anyone that would play meaningful minutes THIS season

Out of all of the real options. Collison is the only player who it looks like we missed on. He really sucked pretty bad last yr though. So I could see the hesitation. Hill is being outplayed by Fox while making 20mil a yr. Holiday while making 25 has played very poor so far. Rondo has a herniated disc.

None of them would be here for the long term.

and when that is the case what do you do? The best move, the smart move, the move the Knicks never did in the past is simple. You do nothing. In the past we would have give up a pick and a player to sign and trade Hill for $20mm and declare we got the best guy on the market.

Smart move is do nothing and wait. Maybe we can get Bledsoe for Kanter and or spare parts. That would be the value of waiting and buying low. To me I think that is the deal to make happen.

well then why give THJ $30 to 40 mil more than he deserves?


Fishmike, I agree with your post from other thread - Kanter is a beast inside. He isn't perfectly well-rounded in all of his skills but - against the Celtics he had 17 rebounds in the first half. Only played a little in the 2nd half and wound up with 19 reb; 16 pts. Kanter is probably being showcased but he can't be traded until Dec 14 if in a group of players but could be traded now by himself. O'Q is also being showcased.

Also, the game plan might have been to attack the Celtics inside. Neither Kanter nor Willy got an assist but they both were the highest and most efficient scorers for us. ALso, just to note: Willy only had 1 reb in 11 minutes while Kanter had 19 reb.

To get Bledsoe, Perry can try to put together a 3 way trade - O'Q and either Lance or CLee to a contender team and or Kuz; they send young players and maybe a pick to Phoenix; we get Bledsoe.

Why I want Bledsoe - we need a starting caliber PG badly. Very badly. So many posters want to develop the young players....well....you need a pg who knows how to play and can play, so the team can function correctly on the court. Bledsoe isn't the best pg in the NBA but he is good and knows how to play. Having him lead the offense, all of the young players will learn how to play NBA basketball much more quickly.

totally agree. Kanter for Bledsoe is the deal. Ill give up the Bulls second rounder (which is a nice pick). We need good PG play. Bledsoe would make everyone on the Knicks look better.
fishmike - Making UltimateKnicks great again
BigDaddyG
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10/25/2017  12:30 PM
Markji wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
fishmike wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
Welpee wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Russell Westbrook was Thursday. Kyrie Irving on Tuesday. James Harden on deck for next week. Then, eventually, it's John Wall, Steph Curry, Mike Conley, Kyle Lowry, Dame Lillard, Kemba Walker, etc., etc

It's unquestionably a point guard's league these days, and the Knicks are trotting out a combo of Ramon Sessions and Ron Baker. And, frankly, being overmatched at the position is nothing new for the Knicks. You have to go all the way back to Mark Jackson in 1989 to find their last All-Star point guard.

The drought is remarkable.

How did we not make this a major priority this off season is beyond stupidity, especially knowing frank is about 4 yrs away from being relevant..

nobody to set up our shooters, and nobody to set up the bigs

Wasn't our lottery pick a PG? How was it not a priority? I also think it was a priority to not overpay for people like Jeff Teague or Jrue Holliday. I hindsight, even though he's injured now, Rondo might have been the move we let pass us by(though I've never been a fan of his).

I don't think anyone but the most delusional fans thought that Frank would get 30 to 35 mpg... that's why the position wasn't a priority. We didn't acquire anyone that would play meaningful minutes THIS season

Out of all of the real options. Collison is the only player who it looks like we missed on. He really sucked pretty bad last yr though. So I could see the hesitation. Hill is being outplayed by Fox while making 20mil a yr. Holiday while making 25 has played very poor so far. Rondo has a herniated disc.

None of them would be here for the long term.

and when that is the case what do you do? The best move, the smart move, the move the Knicks never did in the past is simple. You do nothing. In the past we would have give up a pick and a player to sign and trade Hill for $20mm and declare we got the best guy on the market.

Smart move is do nothing and wait. Maybe we can get Bledsoe for Kanter and or spare parts. That would be the value of waiting and buying low. To me I think that is the deal to make happen.

well then why give THJ $30 to 40 mil more than he deserves?


Fishmike, I agree with your post from other thread - Kanter is a beast inside. He isn't perfectly well-rounded in all of his skills but - against the Celtics he had 17 rebounds in the first half. Only played a little in the 2nd half and wound up with 19 reb; 16 pts. Kanter is probably being showcased but he can't be traded until Dec 14 if in a group of players but could be traded now by himself. O'Q is also being showcased.

Also, the game plan might have been to attack the Celtics inside. Neither Kanter nor Willy got an assist but they both were the highest and most efficient scorers for us. ALso, just to note: Willy only had 1 reb in 11 minutes while Kanter had 19 reb.

To get Bledsoe, Perry can try to put together a 3 way trade - O'Q and either Lance or CLee to a contender team and or Kuz; they send young players and maybe a pick to Phoenix; we get Bledsoe.

Why I want Bledsoe - we need a starting caliber PG badly. Very badly. So many posters want to develop the young players....well....you need a pg who knows how to play and can play, so the team can function correctly on the court. Bledsoe isn't the best pg in the NBA but he is good and knows how to play. Having him lead the offense, all of the young players will learn how to play NBA basketball much more quickly.


The other side is that Bledsoe isn't really a PG, his playmaking is sub par, he's injury prone, he hasn't been a consistent defender in a while and he isn't a good backcourt matchup with THjr. I think a Frank/Bledsoe backcourt could work, but now we'd have an Allen Crabbe situation with THjr. And that's the best case scenario. And we'd still have a gaping hole at SF. And we'd still suck. I'd still do the trade if all we're giving up is KOQ, Lee and Lance. The tank would still stay on course
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
SupremeCommander
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10/25/2017  12:35 PM
fishmike wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
fishmike wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
Welpee wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Russell Westbrook was Thursday. Kyrie Irving on Tuesday. James Harden on deck for next week. Then, eventually, it's John Wall, Steph Curry, Mike Conley, Kyle Lowry, Dame Lillard, Kemba Walker, etc., etc

It's unquestionably a point guard's league these days, and the Knicks are trotting out a combo of Ramon Sessions and Ron Baker. And, frankly, being overmatched at the position is nothing new for the Knicks. You have to go all the way back to Mark Jackson in 1989 to find their last All-Star point guard.

The drought is remarkable.

How did we not make this a major priority this off season is beyond stupidity, especially knowing frank is about 4 yrs away from being relevant..

nobody to set up our shooters, and nobody to set up the bigs

Wasn't our lottery pick a PG? How was it not a priority? I also think it was a priority to not overpay for people like Jeff Teague or Jrue Holliday. I hindsight, even though he's injured now, Rondo might have been the move we let pass us by(though I've never been a fan of his).

I don't think anyone but the most delusional fans thought that Frank would get 30 to 35 mpg... that's why the position wasn't a priority. We didn't acquire anyone that would play meaningful minutes THIS season

Out of all of the real options. Collison is the only player who it looks like we missed on. He really sucked pretty bad last yr though. So I could see the hesitation. Hill is being outplayed by Fox while making 20mil a yr. Holiday while making 25 has played very poor so far. Rondo has a herniated disc.

None of them would be here for the long term.

and when that is the case what do you do? The best move, the smart move, the move the Knicks never did in the past is simple. You do nothing. In the past we would have give up a pick and a player to sign and trade Hill for $20mm and declare we got the best guy on the market.

Smart move is do nothing and wait. Maybe we can get Bledsoe for Kanter and or spare parts. That would be the value of waiting and buying low. To me I think that is the deal to make happen.

well then why give THJ $30 to 40 mil more than he deserves?

well thats your opinion not mine. When I look at ALL the recent contracts given to wings I think the Knicks did OK with THJ. Evan Turner, Alan Crabbe, Kent Bazemore, Reddick, Wes Mathews, Jamal Crawford, the pope guy... THJ is right about where the market is. He's like the 15th highest paid guy at his position. He's gotta play better. Its been a really bad 3 games.

okay, well why commit $70 mil to a position if you aren't ready to commit anything to the PG position?

fishmike said: Yes. Sometimes I confuse the alerts with when your mom calls. BTW she said defensive guards are really important.
martin
Posts: 46304
Alba Posts: 106
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #2
USA
10/25/2017  1:50 PM
SupremeCommander wrote:
fishmike wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
fishmike wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
Welpee wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Russell Westbrook was Thursday. Kyrie Irving on Tuesday. James Harden on deck for next week. Then, eventually, it's John Wall, Steph Curry, Mike Conley, Kyle Lowry, Dame Lillard, Kemba Walker, etc., etc

It's unquestionably a point guard's league these days, and the Knicks are trotting out a combo of Ramon Sessions and Ron Baker. And, frankly, being overmatched at the position is nothing new for the Knicks. You have to go all the way back to Mark Jackson in 1989 to find their last All-Star point guard.

The drought is remarkable.

How did we not make this a major priority this off season is beyond stupidity, especially knowing frank is about 4 yrs away from being relevant..

nobody to set up our shooters, and nobody to set up the bigs

Wasn't our lottery pick a PG? How was it not a priority? I also think it was a priority to not overpay for people like Jeff Teague or Jrue Holliday. I hindsight, even though he's injured now, Rondo might have been the move we let pass us by(though I've never been a fan of his).

I don't think anyone but the most delusional fans thought that Frank would get 30 to 35 mpg... that's why the position wasn't a priority. We didn't acquire anyone that would play meaningful minutes THIS season

Out of all of the real options. Collison is the only player who it looks like we missed on. He really sucked pretty bad last yr though. So I could see the hesitation. Hill is being outplayed by Fox while making 20mil a yr. Holiday while making 25 has played very poor so far. Rondo has a herniated disc.

None of them would be here for the long term.

and when that is the case what do you do? The best move, the smart move, the move the Knicks never did in the past is simple. You do nothing. In the past we would have give up a pick and a player to sign and trade Hill for $20mm and declare we got the best guy on the market.

Smart move is do nothing and wait. Maybe we can get Bledsoe for Kanter and or spare parts. That would be the value of waiting and buying low. To me I think that is the deal to make happen.

well then why give THJ $30 to 40 mil more than he deserves?

well thats your opinion not mine. When I look at ALL the recent contracts given to wings I think the Knicks did OK with THJ. Evan Turner, Alan Crabbe, Kent Bazemore, Reddick, Wes Mathews, Jamal Crawford, the pope guy... THJ is right about where the market is. He's like the 15th highest paid guy at his position. He's gotta play better. Its been a really bad 3 games.

okay, well why commit $70 mil to a position if you aren't ready to commit anything to the PG position?

Knicks did just draft a kid at #8, and while not starting material, it is a path forward for that spot.

Was there a PG out there that the Knicks should have committed to long term? Or could have they have given a guy a 1 year overpay rental ala Reddick?

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BigDaddyG
Posts: 25023
Alba Posts: 3
Joined: 1/22/2010
Member: #3049

10/25/2017  2:44 PM
martin wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
fishmike wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
fishmike wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
Welpee wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Russell Westbrook was Thursday. Kyrie Irving on Tuesday. James Harden on deck for next week. Then, eventually, it's John Wall, Steph Curry, Mike Conley, Kyle Lowry, Dame Lillard, Kemba Walker, etc., etc

It's unquestionably a point guard's league these days, and the Knicks are trotting out a combo of Ramon Sessions and Ron Baker. And, frankly, being overmatched at the position is nothing new for the Knicks. You have to go all the way back to Mark Jackson in 1989 to find their last All-Star point guard.

The drought is remarkable.

How did we not make this a major priority this off season is beyond stupidity, especially knowing frank is about 4 yrs away from being relevant..

nobody to set up our shooters, and nobody to set up the bigs

Wasn't our lottery pick a PG? How was it not a priority? I also think it was a priority to not overpay for people like Jeff Teague or Jrue Holliday. I hindsight, even though he's injured now, Rondo might have been the move we let pass us by(though I've never been a fan of his).

I don't think anyone but the most delusional fans thought that Frank would get 30 to 35 mpg... that's why the position wasn't a priority. We didn't acquire anyone that would play meaningful minutes THIS season

Out of all of the real options. Collison is the only player who it looks like we missed on. He really sucked pretty bad last yr though. So I could see the hesitation. Hill is being outplayed by Fox while making 20mil a yr. Holiday while making 25 has played very poor so far. Rondo has a herniated disc.

None of them would be here for the long term.

and when that is the case what do you do? The best move, the smart move, the move the Knicks never did in the past is simple. You do nothing. In the past we would have give up a pick and a player to sign and trade Hill for $20mm and declare we got the best guy on the market.

Smart move is do nothing and wait. Maybe we can get Bledsoe for Kanter and or spare parts. That would be the value of waiting and buying low. To me I think that is the deal to make happen.

well then why give THJ $30 to 40 mil more than he deserves?

well thats your opinion not mine. When I look at ALL the recent contracts given to wings I think the Knicks did OK with THJ. Evan Turner, Alan Crabbe, Kent Bazemore, Reddick, Wes Mathews, Jamal Crawford, the pope guy... THJ is right about where the market is. He's like the 15th highest paid guy at his position. He's gotta play better. Its been a really bad 3 games.

okay, well why commit $70 mil to a position if you aren't ready to commit anything to the PG position?

Knicks did just draft a kid at #8, and while not starting material, it is a path forward for that spot.

Was there a PG out there that the Knicks should have committed to long term? Or could have they have given a guy a 1 year overpay rental ala Reddick?

A one year overpay would've been ideal, but out of the question once we signed THjr and the Melo trade didn't happen till the start of the season. I honestly think the Knicks did the best they could, unless you think bringing back Rose was an option. It's way too early in the season say whether Frank can be starting material or not. I think anyone who just harps on our need of a veteran starting point guard doesn't have a clear idea of how many cracks there are in this foundation.

Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
knicks1248
Posts: 36274
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 2/3/2004
Member: #582
10/25/2017  2:58 PM    LAST EDITED: 10/25/2017  3:02 PM
fishmike wrote:
TripleThreat wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Russell Westbrook was Thursday. Kyrie Irving on Tuesday. James Harden on deck for next week. Then, eventually, it's John Wall, Steph Curry, Mike Conley, Kyle Lowry, Dame Lillard, Kemba Walker, etc., etc

It's unquestionably a point guard's league these days, and the Knicks are trotting out a combo of Ramon Sessions and Ron Baker. And, frankly, being overmatched at the position is nothing new for the Knicks. You have to go all the way back to Mark Jackson in 1989 to find their last All-Star point guard.

The drought is remarkable.

How did we not make this a major priority this off season is beyond stupidity, especially knowing frank is about 4 yrs away from being relevant..

nobody to set up our shooters, and nobody to set up the bigs

You've brought this point up several times. And several times people have asked you, what specifically do you think the Knicks should do. You've said nothing most times, the Rondo once or twice.

I'd really like you to go into some actual depth into who specifically you think the Knicks should have gone after, would have actually come here, and how they would actually help this team short term and long term.

A lot of players you think the Knicks should sign would likely have never come here anyway. If they did, it would be a gross overpay in years and AAV.

you will hear crickets. He's great at crying but offers no alternatives. The two guys he harps on are Rose and Rondo, which tells you everything you need to know.

You preferred jack and sessions over rose or rondo, that says a lot about you..

jack and session do nothing good on the court, they're not good defenders, passers, penetrating, they're slow as hell, they can't shoot 2's or 3's, they certainly dont make anyone better, and they can't play JH system, so we signed these guys (who certainly will be cut as soon as possible) who are way passed their prime to do what.

They were better off signing them as part of the coaching staff.

the knicks could have engaged the lakers in trading for Russel, giving them the 8th pick, for their recent #2 pick, through Noah in there for Mosgov..

Mills could have been creative, but he has the negotiating skills of a idiot

ES
SupremeCommander
Posts: 31791
Alba Posts: 35
Joined: 4/28/2006
Member: #1127

10/25/2017  3:15 PM
martin wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
fishmike wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
fishmike wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:
Welpee wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Russell Westbrook was Thursday. Kyrie Irving on Tuesday. James Harden on deck for next week. Then, eventually, it's John Wall, Steph Curry, Mike Conley, Kyle Lowry, Dame Lillard, Kemba Walker, etc., etc

It's unquestionably a point guard's league these days, and the Knicks are trotting out a combo of Ramon Sessions and Ron Baker. And, frankly, being overmatched at the position is nothing new for the Knicks. You have to go all the way back to Mark Jackson in 1989 to find their last All-Star point guard.

The drought is remarkable.

How did we not make this a major priority this off season is beyond stupidity, especially knowing frank is about 4 yrs away from being relevant..

nobody to set up our shooters, and nobody to set up the bigs

Wasn't our lottery pick a PG? How was it not a priority? I also think it was a priority to not overpay for people like Jeff Teague or Jrue Holliday. I hindsight, even though he's injured now, Rondo might have been the move we let pass us by(though I've never been a fan of his).

I don't think anyone but the most delusional fans thought that Frank would get 30 to 35 mpg... that's why the position wasn't a priority. We didn't acquire anyone that would play meaningful minutes THIS season

Out of all of the real options. Collison is the only player who it looks like we missed on. He really sucked pretty bad last yr though. So I could see the hesitation. Hill is being outplayed by Fox while making 20mil a yr. Holiday while making 25 has played very poor so far. Rondo has a herniated disc.

None of them would be here for the long term.

and when that is the case what do you do? The best move, the smart move, the move the Knicks never did in the past is simple. You do nothing. In the past we would have give up a pick and a player to sign and trade Hill for $20mm and declare we got the best guy on the market.

Smart move is do nothing and wait. Maybe we can get Bledsoe for Kanter and or spare parts. That would be the value of waiting and buying low. To me I think that is the deal to make happen.

well then why give THJ $30 to 40 mil more than he deserves?

well thats your opinion not mine. When I look at ALL the recent contracts given to wings I think the Knicks did OK with THJ. Evan Turner, Alan Crabbe, Kent Bazemore, Reddick, Wes Mathews, Jamal Crawford, the pope guy... THJ is right about where the market is. He's like the 15th highest paid guy at his position. He's gotta play better. Its been a really bad 3 games.

okay, well why commit $70 mil to a position if you aren't ready to commit anything to the PG position?

Knicks did just draft a kid at #8, and while not starting material, it is a path forward for that spot.

Was there a PG out there that the Knicks should have committed to long term? Or could have they have given a guy a 1 year overpay rental ala Reddick?

again, to repeat previous comments, Frank could be a stud but anyone expected him to contribute 30 to 35 minutes a game THIS year is off their rocker. The KID played in ~18 mpg in ~30 games

fishmike said: Yes. Sometimes I confuse the alerts with when your mom calls. BTW she said defensive guards are really important.
Nalod
Posts: 54074
Alba Posts: 151
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
10/25/2017  3:22 PM
knicks1248 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
TripleThreat wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Russell Westbrook was Thursday. Kyrie Irving on Tuesday. James Harden on deck for next week. Then, eventually, it's John Wall, Steph Curry, Mike Conley, Kyle Lowry, Dame Lillard, Kemba Walker, etc., etc

It's unquestionably a point guard's league these days, and the Knicks are trotting out a combo of Ramon Sessions and Ron Baker. And, frankly, being overmatched at the position is nothing new for the Knicks. You have to go all the way back to Mark Jackson in 1989 to find their last All-Star point guard.

The drought is remarkable.

How did we not make this a major priority this off season is beyond stupidity, especially knowing frank is about 4 yrs away from being relevant..

nobody to set up our shooters, and nobody to set up the bigs

You've brought this point up several times. And several times people have asked you, what specifically do you think the Knicks should do. You've said nothing most times, the Rondo once or twice.

I'd really like you to go into some actual depth into who specifically you think the Knicks should have gone after, would have actually come here, and how they would actually help this team short term and long term.

A lot of players you think the Knicks should sign would likely have never come here anyway. If they did, it would be a gross overpay in years and AAV.

you will hear crickets. He's great at crying but offers no alternatives. The two guys he harps on are Rose and Rondo, which tells you everything you need to know.

You preferred jack and sessions over rose or rondo, that says a lot about you..

jack and session do nothing good on the court, they're not good defenders, passers, penetrating, they're slow as hell, they can't shoot 2's or 3's, they certainly dont make anyone better, and they can't play JH system, so we signed these guys (who certainly will be cut as soon as possible) who are way passed their prime to do what.

They were better off signing them as part of the coaching staff.

the knicks could have engaged the lakers in trading for Russel, giving them the 8th pick, for their recent #2 pick, through Noah in there for Mosgov..

Mills could have been creative, but he has the negotiating skills of a idiot

Wait, that's your answer? You think that's a viable trade scenario the Lakers want? You do realize Bropez is an expiring? right, so they did that to get cap space for Lebron or Pg13. They drafted Ball so they were willing to give up value (Russell)to have that cap space. Ok, how is Rondo doing? Yeah. Not good.
Nobody says "wow, I am so happy with our guard situation". You think you have a unique perspective. Its freaking awesome BTW!!! You are so the man!!!

Anger sells, don't buy!
It's just hard to believe our pg situation

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