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This is what we hope Frank plays like by next year(or anything close to it)
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Knickoftime
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10/24/2017  1:39 PM
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Frank averaged 2 rebounds a game in France which concerns me a bit, because he should have an advantage over some players with his wingspan. Frank has to rebound more, and drive more, if he wants to be a starter.

Will be happy when I see more of both. Of what little Ive seen of his game, to this point. Hope its tonight! (Need a prayer emoji)

Great PGs usually rebound very well. Youre exactly right--he was underwhelming in France rebounding the ball--hes got to watch film and practice floating to the boards. When the PG can take a rebound--look at how much his play can be improved. If he is 6-4 /6-5 with a true 7 foot wingspan---he has a responsibility to get 5-6 rebounds when he gets his chance.

Kind of scratching my head how anyone can make an conclusions about rebounding with Frank given his circumstance.

At 18 and obviously a bit underdeveloped physically, playing in a league of grown men who would dominate all Div 1 teams, averaging 18 minutes a game, Frank got about 2 rebounds per game. Per 36 average of about 4+ rebounds per game.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/frank-ntilikina-1.html

Is 4+ rebounds per game good? Not good? average? for a PG?

Frank is young, athletic, with a long wingspan, and can go all out for those 18 minutes. Two rebounds doesnt really do much for me from a top ten pick. Not someone who is supposed to be our PG of the future.

Looks right now like Frank has the most work to do in the paint. Driving, and rebounding. This is what "raw" looks like. Not like we didnt know this when he was drafted. Pointing it out doesnt mean I dont believe he can improve, just that Frank has a lot of work to do.


Ricky Rubio, who is considered one of the better rebounding guards in the league, averaged about 4.4 rebounds per game his rookie season. He was 21. He was at about 6 rebs per 36 last year. THJ averaged a little under 4 rebs per 36 last year. So yeah, I think Frank's rebounding number are fine for where he was at last year.

I'd be careful trying to translate Euro stats to NBA stats. It's a different game.

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Nalod
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10/24/2017  1:48 PM    LAST EDITED: 10/24/2017  1:50 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Frank averaged 2 rebounds a game in France which concerns me a bit, because he should have an advantage over some players with his wingspan. Frank has to rebound more, and drive more, if he wants to be a starter.

Will be happy when I see more of both. Of what little Ive seen of his game, to this point. Hope its tonight! (Need a prayer emoji)

Great PGs usually rebound very well. Youre exactly right--he was underwhelming in France rebounding the ball--hes got to watch film and practice floating to the boards. When the PG can take a rebound--look at how much his play can be improved. If he is 6-4 /6-5 with a true 7 foot wingspan---he has a responsibility to get 5-6 rebounds when he gets his chance.

Kind of scratching my head how anyone can make an conclusions about rebounding with Frank given his circumstance.

At 18 and obviously a bit underdeveloped physically, playing in a league of grown men who would dominate all Div 1 teams, averaging 18 minutes a game, Frank got about 2 rebounds per game. Per 36 average of about 4+ rebounds per game.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/frank-ntilikina-1.html

Is 4+ rebounds per game good? Not good? average? for a PG?

Frank is young, athletic, with a long wingspan, and can go all out for those 18 minutes. Two rebounds doesnt really do much for me from a top ten pick. Not someone who is supposed to be our PG of the future.

Looks right now like Frank has the most work to do in the paint. Driving, and rebounding. This is what "raw" looks like. Not like we didnt know this when he was drafted. Pointing it out doesnt mean I dont believe he can improve, just that Frank has a lot of work to do.


Ricky Rubio, who is considered one of the better rebounding guards in the league, averaged about 4.4 rebounds per game his rookie season. He was 21. He was at about 6 rebs per 36 last year. THJ averaged a little under 4 rebs per 36 last year. So yeah, I think Frank's rebounding number are fine for where he was at last year.

I'd be careful trying to translate Euro stats to NBA stats. It's a different game.

This. Good point.
Also, Murray got to chill his rookie year. SAS tends to bring their yoots along nice and easy.
Also, team constructed matters bigly.
SAS won 60 games last year.
And, Frank has played 9 min this season.
But then its me. Im reading this crap and responding.
Murry is two years older for most practical purposes. And yeah briggs, if your going to bring up stuff, accuracy lends itself to credibility.
If your not credible, then your opinions don't hold much weight.
Making shyt up is not credible. You wrote an opinion piece, but you still have to cite correct facts in support or to frame it.

Anger sells, don't buy!
BigDaddyG
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10/24/2017  2:00 PM    LAST EDITED: 10/24/2017  2:01 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Frank averaged 2 rebounds a game in France which concerns me a bit, because he should have an advantage over some players with his wingspan. Frank has to rebound more, and drive more, if he wants to be a starter.

Will be happy when I see more of both. Of what little Ive seen of his game, to this point. Hope its tonight! (Need a prayer emoji)

Great PGs usually rebound very well. Youre exactly right--he was underwhelming in France rebounding the ball--hes got to watch film and practice floating to the boards. When the PG can take a rebound--look at how much his play can be improved. If he is 6-4 /6-5 with a true 7 foot wingspan---he has a responsibility to get 5-6 rebounds when he gets his chance.

Kind of scratching my head how anyone can make an conclusions about rebounding with Frank given his circumstance.

At 18 and obviously a bit underdeveloped physically, playing in a league of grown men who would dominate all Div 1 teams, averaging 18 minutes a game, Frank got about 2 rebounds per game. Per 36 average of about 4+ rebounds per game.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/frank-ntilikina-1.html

Is 4+ rebounds per game good? Not good? average? for a PG?

Frank is young, athletic, with a long wingspan, and can go all out for those 18 minutes. Two rebounds doesnt really do much for me from a top ten pick. Not someone who is supposed to be our PG of the future.

Looks right now like Frank has the most work to do in the paint. Driving, and rebounding. This is what "raw" looks like. Not like we didnt know this when he was drafted. Pointing it out doesnt mean I dont believe he can improve, just that Frank has a lot of work to do.


Ricky Rubio, who is considered one of the better rebounding guards in the league, averaged about 4.4 rebounds per game his rookie season. He was 21. He was at about 6 rebs per 36 last year. THJ averaged a little under 4 rebs per 36 last year. So yeah, I think Frank's rebounding number are fine for where he was at last year.

I'd be careful trying to translate Euro stats to NBA stats. It's a different game.


Agreed. But there's nothing else to go on. It's about as effective as comparing a different, older player who played in a completely different farm system in the NCAA and landed on a far more structured NBA pro team. I wanted to see Frank's rebounding % numbers on Strasbourg, but couldn't find them.
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
reub
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10/24/2017  2:01 PM
Briggs, the vultures seem to be all over you here even though you add more to this site than anyone else.
GustavBahler
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10/24/2017  2:03 PM
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Frank averaged 2 rebounds a game in France which concerns me a bit, because he should have an advantage over some players with his wingspan. Frank has to rebound more, and drive more, if he wants to be a starter.

Will be happy when I see more of both. Of what little Ive seen of his game, to this point. Hope its tonight! (Need a prayer emoji)

Great PGs usually rebound very well. Youre exactly right--he was underwhelming in France rebounding the ball--hes got to watch film and practice floating to the boards. When the PG can take a rebound--look at how much his play can be improved. If he is 6-4 /6-5 with a true 7 foot wingspan---he has a responsibility to get 5-6 rebounds when he gets his chance.

Kind of scratching my head how anyone can make an conclusions about rebounding with Frank given his circumstance.

At 18 and obviously a bit underdeveloped physically, playing in a league of grown men who would dominate all Div 1 teams, averaging 18 minutes a game, Frank got about 2 rebounds per game. Per 36 average of about 4+ rebounds per game.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/frank-ntilikina-1.html

Is 4+ rebounds per game good? Not good? average? for a PG?

Frank is young, athletic, with a long wingspan, and can go all out for those 18 minutes. Two rebounds doesnt really do much for me from a top ten pick. Not someone who is supposed to be our PG of the future.

Looks right now like Frank has the most work to do in the paint. Driving, and rebounding. This is what "raw" looks like. Not like we didnt know this when he was drafted. Pointing it out doesnt mean I dont believe he can improve, just that Frank has a lot of work to do.


Ricky Rubio, who is considered one of the better rebounding point guards in the league, averaged about 4.4 rebounds per game his rookie season. He was 21. He was at about 6 rebs per 36 last year. THJ averaged a little under 4 rebs per 36 last year. So yeah, I think Frank's rebounding number are fine for where he was at last year.

Those are two different kind of players. Rubio wasnt the defensive stopper that Frank is supposed to be (busy dropping dimes) so it surprises me that he isnt cleaning up more around the rim. Altering shots with his wingspan and, grabbing boards (Did alter a shot nicely from the wing in his NBA debut)

Im sure there are other examples that you could have used. I get the point that its not the final word, and I agree. Like I said upthread, Frank seems to need the most work in the paint. Not just rebounding, but driving. Looks to me like a matter of Frank finding a comfort zone.

Nalod
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10/24/2017  2:07 PM
reub wrote:Briggs, the vultures seem to be all over you here even though you add more to this site than anyone else.

Opinion are one thing, omitting facts or making shyt up leaves your vulnerable.
What does he or anyone contribute? an opinion?
You think buying some tickets or hyperpostering opinions entitles you to be inaccurate or not get called out on things?

Anger sells, don't buy!
BRIGGS
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10/24/2017  2:07 PM
reub wrote:Briggs, the vultures seem to be all over you here even though you add more to this site than anyone else.

Not a big deal--everyone is a Knick fan. The title of the thread is what its all about--and everyone should be on the same page there--we "hope" Frank can play like this by year 2 as a Knicks fan. I hope--Im sure you and everyone else hopes. The whole post was comparing a player of similar size and hoping that Frank can have similar effect by year 2. If I read his date of birth incorrectly--that has no meaning on what I was trying to say.

Nalod
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10/24/2017  2:09 PM
GustavBahler wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Frank averaged 2 rebounds a game in France which concerns me a bit, because he should have an advantage over some players with his wingspan. Frank has to rebound more, and drive more, if he wants to be a starter.

Will be happy when I see more of both. Of what little Ive seen of his game, to this point. Hope its tonight! (Need a prayer emoji)

Great PGs usually rebound very well. Youre exactly right--he was underwhelming in France rebounding the ball--hes got to watch film and practice floating to the boards. When the PG can take a rebound--look at how much his play can be improved. If he is 6-4 /6-5 with a true 7 foot wingspan---he has a responsibility to get 5-6 rebounds when he gets his chance.

Kind of scratching my head how anyone can make an conclusions about rebounding with Frank given his circumstance.

At 18 and obviously a bit underdeveloped physically, playing in a league of grown men who would dominate all Div 1 teams, averaging 18 minutes a game, Frank got about 2 rebounds per game. Per 36 average of about 4+ rebounds per game.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/frank-ntilikina-1.html

Is 4+ rebounds per game good? Not good? average? for a PG?

Frank is young, athletic, with a long wingspan, and can go all out for those 18 minutes. Two rebounds doesnt really do much for me from a top ten pick. Not someone who is supposed to be our PG of the future.

Looks right now like Frank has the most work to do in the paint. Driving, and rebounding. This is what "raw" looks like. Not like we didnt know this when he was drafted. Pointing it out doesnt mean I dont believe he can improve, just that Frank has a lot of work to do.


Ricky Rubio, who is considered one of the better rebounding point guards in the league, averaged about 4.4 rebounds per game his rookie season. He was 21. He was at about 6 rebs per 36 last year. THJ averaged a little under 4 rebs per 36 last year. So yeah, I think Frank's rebounding number are fine for where he was at last year.

Those are two different kind of players. Rubio wasnt the defensive stopper that Frank is supposed to be (busy dropping dimes) so it surprises me that he isnt cleaning up more around the rim. Altering shots with his wingspan and, grabbing boards (Did alter a shot nicely from the wing in his NBA debut)

Im sure there are other examples that you could have used. I get the point that its not the final word, and I agree. Like I said upthread, Frank seems to need the most work in the paint. Not just rebounding, but driving. Looks to me like a matter of Frank finding a comfort zone.

We all so good at telling frank what he needs to do, as if he or coaches don't?
Kid would be a college freshman if he was here in the states.

Anger sells, don't buy!
GustavBahler
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10/24/2017  2:13 PM
Nalod wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Frank averaged 2 rebounds a game in France which concerns me a bit, because he should have an advantage over some players with his wingspan. Frank has to rebound more, and drive more, if he wants to be a starter.

Will be happy when I see more of both. Of what little Ive seen of his game, to this point. Hope its tonight! (Need a prayer emoji)

Great PGs usually rebound very well. Youre exactly right--he was underwhelming in France rebounding the ball--hes got to watch film and practice floating to the boards. When the PG can take a rebound--look at how much his play can be improved. If he is 6-4 /6-5 with a true 7 foot wingspan---he has a responsibility to get 5-6 rebounds when he gets his chance.

Kind of scratching my head how anyone can make an conclusions about rebounding with Frank given his circumstance.

At 18 and obviously a bit underdeveloped physically, playing in a league of grown men who would dominate all Div 1 teams, averaging 18 minutes a game, Frank got about 2 rebounds per game. Per 36 average of about 4+ rebounds per game.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/frank-ntilikina-1.html

Is 4+ rebounds per game good? Not good? average? for a PG?

Frank is young, athletic, with a long wingspan, and can go all out for those 18 minutes. Two rebounds doesnt really do much for me from a top ten pick. Not someone who is supposed to be our PG of the future.

Looks right now like Frank has the most work to do in the paint. Driving, and rebounding. This is what "raw" looks like. Not like we didnt know this when he was drafted. Pointing it out doesnt mean I dont believe he can improve, just that Frank has a lot of work to do.


Ricky Rubio, who is considered one of the better rebounding point guards in the league, averaged about 4.4 rebounds per game his rookie season. He was 21. He was at about 6 rebs per 36 last year. THJ averaged a little under 4 rebs per 36 last year. So yeah, I think Frank's rebounding number are fine for where he was at last year.

Those are two different kind of players. Rubio wasnt the defensive stopper that Frank is supposed to be (busy dropping dimes) so it surprises me that he isnt cleaning up more around the rim. Altering shots with his wingspan and, grabbing boards (Did alter a shot nicely from the wing in his NBA debut)

Im sure there are other examples that you could have used. I get the point that its not the final word, and I agree. Like I said upthread, Frank seems to need the most work in the paint. Not just rebounding, but driving. Looks to me like a matter of Frank finding a comfort zone.

We all so good at telling frank what he needs to do, as if he or coaches don't?
Kid would be a college freshman if he was here in the states.

Back to the old, "why are we talking about basketball on a basketball forum?" Again Nalod?

BigDaddyG
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10/24/2017  2:13 PM
GustavBahler wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Frank averaged 2 rebounds a game in France which concerns me a bit, because he should have an advantage over some players with his wingspan. Frank has to rebound more, and drive more, if he wants to be a starter.

Will be happy when I see more of both. Of what little Ive seen of his game, to this point. Hope its tonight! (Need a prayer emoji)

Great PGs usually rebound very well. Youre exactly right--he was underwhelming in France rebounding the ball--hes got to watch film and practice floating to the boards. When the PG can take a rebound--look at how much his play can be improved. If he is 6-4 /6-5 with a true 7 foot wingspan---he has a responsibility to get 5-6 rebounds when he gets his chance.

Kind of scratching my head how anyone can make an conclusions about rebounding with Frank given his circumstance.

At 18 and obviously a bit underdeveloped physically, playing in a league of grown men who would dominate all Div 1 teams, averaging 18 minutes a game, Frank got about 2 rebounds per game. Per 36 average of about 4+ rebounds per game.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/frank-ntilikina-1.html

Is 4+ rebounds per game good? Not good? average? for a PG?

Frank is young, athletic, with a long wingspan, and can go all out for those 18 minutes. Two rebounds doesnt really do much for me from a top ten pick. Not someone who is supposed to be our PG of the future.

Looks right now like Frank has the most work to do in the paint. Driving, and rebounding. This is what "raw" looks like. Not like we didnt know this when he was drafted. Pointing it out doesnt mean I dont believe he can improve, just that Frank has a lot of work to do.


Ricky Rubio, who is considered one of the better rebounding point guards in the league, averaged about 4.4 rebounds per game his rookie season. He was 21. He was at about 6 rebs per 36 last year. THJ averaged a little under 4 rebs per 36 last year. So yeah, I think Frank's rebounding number are fine for where he was at last year.

Those are two different kind of players. Rubio wasnt the defensive stopper that Frank is supposed to be (busy dropping dimes) so it surprises me that he isnt cleaning up more around the rim. Altering shots with his wingspan and, grabbing boards (Did alter a shot nicely from the wing in his NBA debut)

Im sure there are other examples that you could have used. I get the point that its not the final word, and I agree. Like I said upthread, Frank seems to need the most work in the paint. Not just rebounding, but driving. Looks to me like a matter of Frank finding a comfort zone.


Rubio was praised for his defensive potential coming. He was always considered a solid rebounder for his position and a, potentially good defender. I think Rubio is a decent bench mark for Frank in terms of defensive effectiveness. Keep in mind, Rubio was two years older than Frank when he came into the league.
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
Knickoftime
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10/24/2017  2:14 PM
reub wrote:Briggs, the vultures seem to be all over you here even though you add more to this site than anyone else.

Bros before hos (and pretty much everyone else not white male)!!!!!

GustavBahler
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10/24/2017  2:23 PM
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Frank averaged 2 rebounds a game in France which concerns me a bit, because he should have an advantage over some players with his wingspan. Frank has to rebound more, and drive more, if he wants to be a starter.

Will be happy when I see more of both. Of what little Ive seen of his game, to this point. Hope its tonight! (Need a prayer emoji)

Great PGs usually rebound very well. Youre exactly right--he was underwhelming in France rebounding the ball--hes got to watch film and practice floating to the boards. When the PG can take a rebound--look at how much his play can be improved. If he is 6-4 /6-5 with a true 7 foot wingspan---he has a responsibility to get 5-6 rebounds when he gets his chance.

Kind of scratching my head how anyone can make an conclusions about rebounding with Frank given his circumstance.

At 18 and obviously a bit underdeveloped physically, playing in a league of grown men who would dominate all Div 1 teams, averaging 18 minutes a game, Frank got about 2 rebounds per game. Per 36 average of about 4+ rebounds per game.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/frank-ntilikina-1.html

Is 4+ rebounds per game good? Not good? average? for a PG?

Frank is young, athletic, with a long wingspan, and can go all out for those 18 minutes. Two rebounds doesnt really do much for me from a top ten pick. Not someone who is supposed to be our PG of the future.

Looks right now like Frank has the most work to do in the paint. Driving, and rebounding. This is what "raw" looks like. Not like we didnt know this when he was drafted. Pointing it out doesnt mean I dont believe he can improve, just that Frank has a lot of work to do.


Ricky Rubio, who is considered one of the better rebounding point guards in the league, averaged about 4.4 rebounds per game his rookie season. He was 21. He was at about 6 rebs per 36 last year. THJ averaged a little under 4 rebs per 36 last year. So yeah, I think Frank's rebounding number are fine for where he was at last year.

Those are two different kind of players. Rubio wasnt the defensive stopper that Frank is supposed to be (busy dropping dimes) so it surprises me that he isnt cleaning up more around the rim. Altering shots with his wingspan and, grabbing boards (Did alter a shot nicely from the wing in his NBA debut)

Im sure there are other examples that you could have used. I get the point that its not the final word, and I agree. Like I said upthread, Frank seems to need the most work in the paint. Not just rebounding, but driving. Looks to me like a matter of Frank finding a comfort zone.


Rubio was praised for his defensive potential coming. He was always considered a solid rebounder for his position and a, potentially good defender. I think Rubio is a decent bench mark for Frank in terms of defensive effectiveness. Keep in mind, Rubio was two years older than Frank when he came into the league.

Rubio saw the court a lot better than Frank has to this point in his career. Better than most players coming into the league. His ability to anticipate. It helped him on defense as well, even though he took too many chances at times.

As I wrote, its not just rebounding where Frank needs to be more comfortable in the paint. Has to be able to consistently get to the rim. I dont believe thats a coincidence. Looks like a matter of confidence in that part of his game. That takes time.

Knixkik
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10/24/2017  2:28 PM
BRIGGS wrote:


Murray is 8 months older than Frank. I think he may be slightly taller(an inch or so) but has higher end to end speed right now. My hope is Frank goes up a notch physically and can move around the court like DEjounte does. Year 1 with the Spurs he got to watch and play a little--9 minutes a game.

When we see Frank starting to get 5-10 rebounds--well know where he is. To me a key to Franks success is being able to use his length in a material way--get up on the glass--use length and angles to create driving holes. Push the ball etc..


Just curious where the 8 month age difference came from? It's about 2 years age difference. But otherwise i agree, hoping Frank can make this sort of jump in year 2.
Knickoftime
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10/24/2017  2:31 PM
Knixkik wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:


Murray is 8 months older than Frank. I think he may be slightly taller(an inch or so) but has higher end to end speed right now. My hope is Frank goes up a notch physically and can move around the court like DEjounte does. Year 1 with the Spurs he got to watch and play a little--9 minutes a game.

When we see Frank starting to get 5-10 rebounds--well know where he is. To me a key to Franks success is being able to use his length in a material way--get up on the glass--use length and angles to create driving holes. Push the ball etc..


Just curious where the 8 month age difference came from? It's about 2 years age difference. But otherwise i agree, hoping Frank can make this sort of jump in year 2.

Hell, I'm still waiting to see what he does in year one. We still have 98.3% of that left.

Nalod
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10/24/2017  3:38 PM
GustavBahler wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Frank averaged 2 rebounds a game in France which concerns me a bit, because he should have an advantage over some players with his wingspan. Frank has to rebound more, and drive more, if he wants to be a starter.

Will be happy when I see more of both. Of what little Ive seen of his game, to this point. Hope its tonight! (Need a prayer emoji)

Great PGs usually rebound very well. Youre exactly right--he was underwhelming in France rebounding the ball--hes got to watch film and practice floating to the boards. When the PG can take a rebound--look at how much his play can be improved. If he is 6-4 /6-5 with a true 7 foot wingspan---he has a responsibility to get 5-6 rebounds when he gets his chance.

Kind of scratching my head how anyone can make an conclusions about rebounding with Frank given his circumstance.

At 18 and obviously a bit underdeveloped physically, playing in a league of grown men who would dominate all Div 1 teams, averaging 18 minutes a game, Frank got about 2 rebounds per game. Per 36 average of about 4+ rebounds per game.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/frank-ntilikina-1.html

Is 4+ rebounds per game good? Not good? average? for a PG?

Frank is young, athletic, with a long wingspan, and can go all out for those 18 minutes. Two rebounds doesnt really do much for me from a top ten pick. Not someone who is supposed to be our PG of the future.

Looks right now like Frank has the most work to do in the paint. Driving, and rebounding. This is what "raw" looks like. Not like we didnt know this when he was drafted. Pointing it out doesnt mean I dont believe he can improve, just that Frank has a lot of work to do.


Ricky Rubio, who is considered one of the better rebounding point guards in the league, averaged about 4.4 rebounds per game his rookie season. He was 21. He was at about 6 rebs per 36 last year. THJ averaged a little under 4 rebs per 36 last year. So yeah, I think Frank's rebounding number are fine for where he was at last year.

Those are two different kind of players. Rubio wasnt the defensive stopper that Frank is supposed to be (busy dropping dimes) so it surprises me that he isnt cleaning up more around the rim. Altering shots with his wingspan and, grabbing boards (Did alter a shot nicely from the wing in his NBA debut)

Im sure there are other examples that you could have used. I get the point that its not the final word, and I agree. Like I said upthread, Frank seems to need the most work in the paint. Not just rebounding, but driving. Looks to me like a matter of Frank finding a comfort zone.


Rubio was praised for his defensive potential coming. He was always considered a solid rebounder for his position and a, potentially good defender. I think Rubio is a decent bench mark for Frank in terms of defensive effectiveness. Keep in mind, Rubio was two years older than Frank when he came into the league.

Rubio saw the court a lot better than Frank has to this point in his career. Better than most players coming into the league. His ability to anticipate. It helped him on defense as well, even though he took too many chances at times.

As I wrote, its not just rebounding where Frank needs to be more comfortable in the paint. Has to be able to consistently get to the rim. I dont believe thats a coincidence. Looks like a matter of confidence in that part of his game. That takes time.

The kid played 9 minutes. Yes it takes time.
How can you compare him to Rubio. Two different types of players! Rubio was showcasing in the Olympics at ate 18.
Rubio has a wonderful court sense and handle. he was compared to Marovich regarding his passing.
But Rubio shot is not that good. Frank has yet to produce but from what we know (not as much as you), his shot should be OK.

Anger sells, don't buy!
Nalod
Posts: 54076
Alba Posts: 151
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
10/24/2017  3:42 PM
BRIGGS wrote:
reub wrote:Briggs, the vultures seem to be all over you here even though you add more to this site than anyone else.

Not a big deal--everyone is a Knick fan. The title of the thread is what its all about--and everyone should be on the same page there--we "hope" Frank can play like this by year 2 as a Knicks fan. I hope--Im sure you and everyone else hopes. The whole post was comparing a player of similar size and hoping that Frank can have similar effect by year 2. If I read his date of birth incorrectly--that has no meaning on what I was trying to say.

Lazy. Can't say "my bad"? Deflect "everyone a knick fan".
Nope, your gonna get called out on facts man. Otherwise why should we take you seriously if you not accurate?
We all make mistakes. Own it. Nobody here is a pro.

Anger sells, don't buy!
GustavBahler
Posts: 32938
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186

10/24/2017  3:51 PM
Nalod wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Frank averaged 2 rebounds a game in France which concerns me a bit, because he should have an advantage over some players with his wingspan. Frank has to rebound more, and drive more, if he wants to be a starter.

Will be happy when I see more of both. Of what little Ive seen of his game, to this point. Hope its tonight! (Need a prayer emoji)

Great PGs usually rebound very well. Youre exactly right--he was underwhelming in France rebounding the ball--hes got to watch film and practice floating to the boards. When the PG can take a rebound--look at how much his play can be improved. If he is 6-4 /6-5 with a true 7 foot wingspan---he has a responsibility to get 5-6 rebounds when he gets his chance.

Kind of scratching my head how anyone can make an conclusions about rebounding with Frank given his circumstance.

At 18 and obviously a bit underdeveloped physically, playing in a league of grown men who would dominate all Div 1 teams, averaging 18 minutes a game, Frank got about 2 rebounds per game. Per 36 average of about 4+ rebounds per game.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/frank-ntilikina-1.html

Is 4+ rebounds per game good? Not good? average? for a PG?

Frank is young, athletic, with a long wingspan, and can go all out for those 18 minutes. Two rebounds doesnt really do much for me from a top ten pick. Not someone who is supposed to be our PG of the future.

Looks right now like Frank has the most work to do in the paint. Driving, and rebounding. This is what "raw" looks like. Not like we didnt know this when he was drafted. Pointing it out doesnt mean I dont believe he can improve, just that Frank has a lot of work to do.


Ricky Rubio, who is considered one of the better rebounding point guards in the league, averaged about 4.4 rebounds per game his rookie season. He was 21. He was at about 6 rebs per 36 last year. THJ averaged a little under 4 rebs per 36 last year. So yeah, I think Frank's rebounding number are fine for where he was at last year.

Those are two different kind of players. Rubio wasnt the defensive stopper that Frank is supposed to be (busy dropping dimes) so it surprises me that he isnt cleaning up more around the rim. Altering shots with his wingspan and, grabbing boards (Did alter a shot nicely from the wing in his NBA debut)

Im sure there are other examples that you could have used. I get the point that its not the final word, and I agree. Like I said upthread, Frank seems to need the most work in the paint. Not just rebounding, but driving. Looks to me like a matter of Frank finding a comfort zone.


Rubio was praised for his defensive potential coming. He was always considered a solid rebounder for his position and a, potentially good defender. I think Rubio is a decent bench mark for Frank in terms of defensive effectiveness. Keep in mind, Rubio was two years older than Frank when he came into the league.

Rubio saw the court a lot better than Frank has to this point in his career. Better than most players coming into the league. His ability to anticipate. It helped him on defense as well, even though he took too many chances at times.

As I wrote, its not just rebounding where Frank needs to be more comfortable in the paint. Has to be able to consistently get to the rim. I dont believe thats a coincidence. Looks like a matter of confidence in that part of his game. That takes time.

The kid played 9 minutes. Yes it takes time.
How can you compare him to Rubio. Two different types of players! Rubio was showcasing in the Olympics at ate 18.
Rubio has a wonderful court sense and handle. he was compared to Marovich regarding his passing.
But Rubio shot is not that good. Frank has yet to produce but from what we know (not as much as you), his shot should be OK.

Wasn't me who made the analogy, you're on a roll.

BigDaddyG
Posts: 25023
Alba Posts: 3
Joined: 1/22/2010
Member: #3049

10/24/2017  4:24 PM    LAST EDITED: 10/24/2017  4:28 PM
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Frank averaged 2 rebounds a game in France which concerns me a bit, because he should have an advantage over some players with his wingspan. Frank has to rebound more, and drive more, if he wants to be a starter.

Will be happy when I see more of both. Of what little Ive seen of his game, to this point. Hope its tonight! (Need a prayer emoji)

Great PGs usually rebound very well. Youre exactly right--he was underwhelming in France rebounding the ball--hes got to watch film and practice floating to the boards. When the PG can take a rebound--look at how much his play can be improved. If he is 6-4 /6-5 with a true 7 foot wingspan---he has a responsibility to get 5-6 rebounds when he gets his chance.

Kind of scratching my head how anyone can make an conclusions about rebounding with Frank given his circumstance.

At 18 and obviously a bit underdeveloped physically, playing in a league of grown men who would dominate all Div 1 teams, averaging 18 minutes a game, Frank got about 2 rebounds per game. Per 36 average of about 4+ rebounds per game.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/frank-ntilikina-1.html

Is 4+ rebounds per game good? Not good? average? for a PG?

Frank is young, athletic, with a long wingspan, and can go all out for those 18 minutes. Two rebounds doesnt really do much for me from a top ten pick. Not someone who is supposed to be our PG of the future.

Looks right now like Frank has the most work to do in the paint. Driving, and rebounding. This is what "raw" looks like. Not like we didnt know this when he was drafted. Pointing it out doesnt mean I dont believe he can improve, just that Frank has a lot of work to do.


Ricky Rubio, who is considered one of the better rebounding point guards in the league, averaged about 4.4 rebounds per game his rookie season. He was 21. He was at about 6 rebs per 36 last year. THJ averaged a little under 4 rebs per 36 last year. So yeah, I think Frank's rebounding number are fine for where he was at last year.

Those are two different kind of players. Rubio wasnt the defensive stopper that Frank is supposed to be (busy dropping dimes) so it surprises me that he isnt cleaning up more around the rim. Altering shots with his wingspan and, grabbing boards (Did alter a shot nicely from the wing in his NBA debut)

Im sure there are other examples that you could have used. I get the point that its not the final word, and I agree. Like I said upthread, Frank seems to need the most work in the paint. Not just rebounding, but driving. Looks to me like a matter of Frank finding a comfort zone.


Rubio was praised for his defensive potential coming. He was always considered a solid rebounder for his position and a, potentially good defender. I think Rubio is a decent bench mark for Frank in terms of defensive effectiveness. Keep in mind, Rubio was two years older than Frank when he came into the league.

Rubio saw the court a lot better than Frank has to this point in his career. Better than most players coming into the league. His ability to anticipate. It helped him on defense as well, even though he took too many chances at times.

As I wrote, its not just rebounding where Frank needs to be more comfortable in the paint. Has to be able to consistently get to the rim. I dont believe thats a coincidence. Looks like a matter of confidence in that part of his game. That takes time.

The kid played 9 minutes. Yes it takes time.
How can you compare him to Rubio. Two different types of players! Rubio was showcasing in the Olympics at ate 18.
Rubio has a wonderful court sense and handle. he was compared to Marovich regarding his passing.
But Rubio shot is not that good. Frank has yet to produce but from what we know (not as much as you), his shot should be OK.

Wasn't me who made the analogy, you're on a roll.


Wasn't me who said they were the same player. I believe the original point was Rubio, who is considered an above average rebounding point guard, averaged about 4 rebounds per 36 minutes a game as a rookie, the same per minute as Frank did I last year. The thread went other places about comparisons to their passing etc. I might also add that Rubio was considered a plus defender coming into the league, same as Frank. Never mentioned anything about offense.
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
GustavBahler
Posts: 32938
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186

10/24/2017  4:54 PM
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Frank averaged 2 rebounds a game in France which concerns me a bit, because he should have an advantage over some players with his wingspan. Frank has to rebound more, and drive more, if he wants to be a starter.

Will be happy when I see more of both. Of what little Ive seen of his game, to this point. Hope its tonight! (Need a prayer emoji)

Great PGs usually rebound very well. Youre exactly right--he was underwhelming in France rebounding the ball--hes got to watch film and practice floating to the boards. When the PG can take a rebound--look at how much his play can be improved. If he is 6-4 /6-5 with a true 7 foot wingspan---he has a responsibility to get 5-6 rebounds when he gets his chance.

Kind of scratching my head how anyone can make an conclusions about rebounding with Frank given his circumstance.

At 18 and obviously a bit underdeveloped physically, playing in a league of grown men who would dominate all Div 1 teams, averaging 18 minutes a game, Frank got about 2 rebounds per game. Per 36 average of about 4+ rebounds per game.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/frank-ntilikina-1.html

Is 4+ rebounds per game good? Not good? average? for a PG?

Frank is young, athletic, with a long wingspan, and can go all out for those 18 minutes. Two rebounds doesnt really do much for me from a top ten pick. Not someone who is supposed to be our PG of the future.

Looks right now like Frank has the most work to do in the paint. Driving, and rebounding. This is what "raw" looks like. Not like we didnt know this when he was drafted. Pointing it out doesnt mean I dont believe he can improve, just that Frank has a lot of work to do.


Ricky Rubio, who is considered one of the better rebounding point guards in the league, averaged about 4.4 rebounds per game his rookie season. He was 21. He was at about 6 rebs per 36 last year. THJ averaged a little under 4 rebs per 36 last year. So yeah, I think Frank's rebounding number are fine for where he was at last year.

Those are two different kind of players. Rubio wasnt the defensive stopper that Frank is supposed to be (busy dropping dimes) so it surprises me that he isnt cleaning up more around the rim. Altering shots with his wingspan and, grabbing boards (Did alter a shot nicely from the wing in his NBA debut)

Im sure there are other examples that you could have used. I get the point that its not the final word, and I agree. Like I said upthread, Frank seems to need the most work in the paint. Not just rebounding, but driving. Looks to me like a matter of Frank finding a comfort zone.


Rubio was praised for his defensive potential coming. He was always considered a solid rebounder for his position and a, potentially good defender. I think Rubio is a decent bench mark for Frank in terms of defensive effectiveness. Keep in mind, Rubio was two years older than Frank when he came into the league.

Rubio saw the court a lot better than Frank has to this point in his career. Better than most players coming into the league. His ability to anticipate. It helped him on defense as well, even though he took too many chances at times.

As I wrote, its not just rebounding where Frank needs to be more comfortable in the paint. Has to be able to consistently get to the rim. I dont believe thats a coincidence. Looks like a matter of confidence in that part of his game. That takes time.

The kid played 9 minutes. Yes it takes time.
How can you compare him to Rubio. Two different types of players! Rubio was showcasing in the Olympics at ate 18.
Rubio has a wonderful court sense and handle. he was compared to Marovich regarding his passing.
But Rubio shot is not that good. Frank has yet to produce but from what we know (not as much as you), his shot should be OK.

Wasn't me who made the analogy, you're on a roll.


Wasn't me who said they were the same player. I believe the original point was Rubio, who is considered an above average rebounding point guard, averaged about 4 rebounds per 36 minutes a game as a rookie, the same per minute as Frank did I last year. The thread went other places about comparisons to their passing etc. I might also add that Rubio was considered a plus defender coming into the league, same as Frank. Never mentioned anything about offense.

C'mon Man, You made them sound like they were conjoined twins!

knicks1248
Posts: 36274
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 2/3/2004
Member: #582
10/24/2017  4:55 PM
EnySpree wrote:Frank can't penitrate.... so far his game is all step back jumpers. He only seems drives if he's given a lane. He doesn't habe take moves going towards the basket. He's got to develop that. He plays alot like Calderon... The old Calderon. Young Calderon could get into the paint. Still got alot of basketball to play but he's got alot to work on as well.

your right

he looks a lot like calderon, that's why phil drafted him, because he's skill set is that of a triangle player. He is not going to light up the score board, and he's not a full time pg.

I really don't see this kid as an all star, like ever, but then again what do we know. We only get to see him in a empty gym or playing pick up games.

The coaching staff seems to be really high on him, or maybe they just don't want to look stupid trading him before he plays an actually game.

ES
This is what we hope Frank plays like by next year(or anything close to it)

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