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The Official Frank Ntilikina Versus DSJr Thread
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Jmpasq
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10/23/2017  6:51 AM
ekstarks94 wrote:
nixluva wrote:

All I’m sayin is the Media would be MERCILESS in ripping the Knicks if they had taken DSJ and this came out!

+ infinity

If the Knicks knew of this "which they probably did" they made the right choice avoiding DS jr.

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10/23/2017  8:08 AM    LAST EDITED: 10/23/2017  8:09 AM
nixluva wrote:

All I’m sayin is the Media would be MERCILESS in ripping the Knicks if they had taken DSJ and this came out!

I kept saying it after the draft and during the Summer League when everyone was bashing the Knicks by passing on this kid....The fact is DSJ is a BIGTIME injury risk. He has already had a major injury so its not a good sign. Yes I understand Frankie has been dealing with injuries as well but most of them have been bad luck. Also Frankie is the youngest player in the league so I don't expect him to be great in his first year. Overall I Like Frank's game better. yes he might not have the offensive upside of DSJ but his defense will be important for our backcourt. But the fact is DSJ despite being a good talent is probably gonna be dealing with a lot of injuries IMO
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10/23/2017  11:38 AM
Jmpasq wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
nixluva wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
reub wrote:It's water on the knee. Swelling. The body's response to trauma or injury.
nixluva wrote:
Knee effusion or swelling of the knee (colloquially known as water on the knee) occurs when excess synovial fluid accumulates in or around the knee joint. There are many common causes for the swelling, including arthritis, injury to the ligaments or meniscus, or fluid collecting in the bursa, a condition known as prepatellar bursitis.

Not a good thing to hear about that repaired knee. Hopefully it’s not something that will require surgery. Maybe just rest and treatment to bring the swelling down.


Remember that he wouldn't show us his medical records.

he went down awkward on his left knee in that game going to the basket

2:04

It aso looked like he hurt his ankle. He seemed a bit gimpy. Really impressive young player. He penetrates like Rose but passes to his teammates and has a jump shot. I would love to see KP with a point guard that puts that kind of pressure on a defense but is an elite passer. Hopefully the Knicks get some of that from Frank.

Kid has a nice game and in theory his skills and penetration would be ideal but you and I both know if Phil had drafted him the NY Media would’ve feasted on this. The kid needed to use DRose as a cautionary tale and toned it down. Instead he is just as reckless as DRose was. So many awkward landings!

,
much better player than Frank, but it looks like some of the fears about his health are justified dude is reckless. I don't know though I just don't think Frank is going to be any good, I haven't seen anything that justifies his selection at 8

Ntilikina is a different type of player. DSJ wishes he could be the kind of defender Nitty is capable of being. Nitty is yet to fully fill out and he might still grow. I like Nitty’s package of physical talent, skills and BBIQ. I think Nitty is going to be more of a Billups type of PG.

People keep predicting these lofty expectations on Frank with not a single shred of evidence he will ever reach those heights. Yeah he is long , sure I think he can defend at a high level , but the actually playing PG in the NBA I dont see those skills at all. Dude looks awful with the ball in his hands. I just want to see something that gives me hope for this kid because ever since he has been a Knick its been one failure after another.

Name them. Name all these "failures one after another" you're referring to?


Missed summer league , missed basically the entire preseason, plays 1 preseaon game looks bad, plays one regular season game and looks like the worst rookie in the class, gets hurt in practice will miss games again
almost as good as when your convincing us how smart it would be to trade KP
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Knickoftime
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10/23/2017  11:57 AM
I'm not jumping on the 'DSJr's damaged goods' bandwagon because he's missed a few games any more than I'm getting on the 'Ntilikina is too weak to stay on the floor' bandwagon a week into the season.

Give both kids a month, a half, a rookie season.

fishmike
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10/23/2017  12:04 PM
Jmpasq wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
nixluva wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
reub wrote:It's water on the knee. Swelling. The body's response to trauma or injury.
nixluva wrote:
Knee effusion or swelling of the knee (colloquially known as water on the knee) occurs when excess synovial fluid accumulates in or around the knee joint. There are many common causes for the swelling, including arthritis, injury to the ligaments or meniscus, or fluid collecting in the bursa, a condition known as prepatellar bursitis.

Not a good thing to hear about that repaired knee. Hopefully it’s not something that will require surgery. Maybe just rest and treatment to bring the swelling down.


Remember that he wouldn't show us his medical records.

he went down awkward on his left knee in that game going to the basket

2:04

It aso looked like he hurt his ankle. He seemed a bit gimpy. Really impressive young player. He penetrates like Rose but passes to his teammates and has a jump shot. I would love to see KP with a point guard that puts that kind of pressure on a defense but is an elite passer. Hopefully the Knicks get some of that from Frank.

Kid has a nice game and in theory his skills and penetration would be ideal but you and I both know if Phil had drafted him the NY Media would’ve feasted on this. The kid needed to use DRose as a cautionary tale and toned it down. Instead he is just as reckless as DRose was. So many awkward landings!

,
much better player than Frank, but it looks like some of the fears about his health are justified dude is reckless. I don't know though I just don't think Frank is going to be any good, I haven't seen anything that justifies his selection at 8

Ntilikina is a different type of player. DSJ wishes he could be the kind of defender Nitty is capable of being. Nitty is yet to fully fill out and he might still grow. I like Nitty’s package of physical talent, skills and BBIQ. I think Nitty is going to be more of a Billups type of PG.

People keep predicting these lofty expectations on Frank with not a single shred of evidence he will ever reach those heights. Yeah he is long , sure I think he can defend at a high level , but the actually playing PG in the NBA I dont see those skills at all. Dude looks awful with the ball in his hands. I just want to see something that gives me hope for this kid because ever since he has been a Knick its been one failure after another.

Name them. Name all these "failures one after another" you're referring to?


Missed summer league , missed basically the entire preseason, plays 1 preseaon game looks bad, plays one regular season game and looks like the worst rookie in the class, gets hurt in practice will miss games again

Getting hurt is a failure? If you're good you know how to avoid it?

That's a new one.

Give me one positive from this kid since we drafted him. All I want is to see some reason to hope my eye test was wrong on him.

coaching staff loves him, his BB IQ and his work ethic. Teammates have given high praise as well

(now is the part where you say how stupid our coaching staff is, or how the players suck so what do they know)

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nixluva
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10/23/2017  1:50 PM
Knickoftime wrote:I'm not jumping on the 'DSJr's damaged goods' bandwagon because he's missed a few games any more than I'm getting on the 'Ntilikina is too weak to stay on the floor' bandwagon a week into the season.

Give both kids a month, a half, a rookie season.

I can agree you have to give these kids time but there’s no way the Media would be preaching patience if DSJ was a Knick! They’d be SAVAGING the Knicks for drafting a kid with an ACL that refused to provide medical info and was having swelling in that knee since Training Camp!

Knickoftime
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10/23/2017  1:54 PM
nixluva wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:I'm not jumping on the 'DSJr's damaged goods' bandwagon because he's missed a few games any more than I'm getting on the 'Ntilikina is too weak to stay on the floor' bandwagon a week into the season.

Give both kids a month, a half, a rookie season.

I can agree you have to give these kids time but there’s no way the Media would be preaching patience if DSJ was a Knick! They’d be SAVAGING the Knicks for drafting a kid with an ACL that refused to provide medical info and was having swelling in that knee since Training Camp!

Maybe. I just don't care about what the media might be saying about the Knicks.

HofstraBBall
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10/23/2017  2:22 PM
nixluva wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:I'm not jumping on the 'DSJr's damaged goods' bandwagon because he's missed a few games any more than I'm getting on the 'Ntilikina is too weak to stay on the floor' bandwagon a week into the season.

Give both kids a month, a half, a rookie season.

I can agree you have to give these kids time but there’s no way the Media would be preaching patience if DSJ was a Knick! They’d be SAVAGING the Knicks for drafting a kid with an ACL that refused to provide medical info and was having swelling in that knee since Training Camp!

True. But we cant say on one hand that we need to give Frank some time before judgement and do the same thing you are claiming the press would be doing to DSJR if he was picked. Which is label him as damaged goods this early in his career. And keep in mind, we gave Noah 4 years. And we paid Rose 20M+ for one year. So to say we were smart enough to stay away from Smith due to his medical concern is hard to believe.

But think we all agree it will take some time before the real winners of this years draft are realized.

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fishmike
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10/23/2017  3:28 PM
HofstraBBall wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:I'm not jumping on the 'DSJr's damaged goods' bandwagon because he's missed a few games any more than I'm getting on the 'Ntilikina is too weak to stay on the floor' bandwagon a week into the season.

Give both kids a month, a half, a rookie season.

I can agree you have to give these kids time but there’s no way the Media would be preaching patience if DSJ was a Knick! They’d be SAVAGING the Knicks for drafting a kid with an ACL that refused to provide medical info and was having swelling in that knee since Training Camp!

True. But we cant say on one hand that we need to give Frank some time before judgement and do the same thing you are claiming the press would be doing to DSJR if he was picked. Which is label him as damaged goods this early in his career. And keep in mind, we gave Noah 4 years. And we paid Rose 20M+ for one year. So to say we were smart enough to stay away from Smith due to his medical concern is hard to believe.

But think we all agree it will take some time before the real winners of this years draft are realized.

Noah and Rose were mistakes no? What do you they have to do with anything?

I mean if you draft a player coming off a major surgery and that injury is slowing the player there is some responsibility from the team who drafted him.

Consider what Smith's fans say about him, Hofstra you included one could easily say the only reason he was available this late in the lottery is he's an injury risk. Dallas may simply be willing to take it slow with him. Just like the Knicks may be willing to take it slow with Frank, youngest player in draft and all.

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nixluva
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10/23/2017  3:54 PM    LAST EDITED: 10/23/2017  3:55 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:I'm not jumping on the 'DSJr's damaged goods' bandwagon because he's missed a few games any more than I'm getting on the 'Ntilikina is too weak to stay on the floor' bandwagon a week into the season.

Give both kids a month, a half, a rookie season.

I can agree you have to give these kids time but there’s no way the Media would be preaching patience if DSJ was a Knick! They’d be SAVAGING the Knicks for drafting a kid with an ACL that refused to provide medical info and was having swelling in that knee since Training Camp!

Maybe. I just don't care about what the media might be saying about the Knicks.

It does matter tho. Coaches and FO people lose jobs based on public sentiment fostered by the Media. Potential Free Agents also can be swayed by Media created perceptions of the franchise. No one wants to be laughed at or go somewhere they think they’ll be relentlessly attacked. The NY Media is a very real part of way the team is viewed.

The issue is that not only is DSJ having an ACL surgery a bigger risk but his game is greatly predicated on him pushing his body to use his explosive talent. He lands awkwardly a LOT and his recent flair up came after a nasty left leg landing. There’s no comparison between the injuries Ntilikina has suffered and DSJ.

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10/23/2017  3:57 PM
Smith Jr was an absolute injury risk out of college; his rare anatomy (extra knee ligaments) also make him an outlier for treatment. He's superhuman, but like Luke Cage you may need to bathe him in acid to heal him.

In a way he's not unlike Baron Davis, who came to the NBA with unbelievable athleticism, even after tearing his ACL at UCLA. Similar types of players. Sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn't with these guys.

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Knickoftime
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10/23/2017  4:15 PM
nixluva wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:I'm not jumping on the 'DSJr's damaged goods' bandwagon because he's missed a few games any more than I'm getting on the 'Ntilikina is too weak to stay on the floor' bandwagon a week into the season.

Give both kids a month, a half, a rookie season.

I can agree you have to give these kids time but there’s no way the Media would be preaching patience if DSJ was a Knick! They’d be SAVAGING the Knicks for drafting a kid with an ACL that refused to provide medical info and was having swelling in that knee since Training Camp!

Maybe. I just don't care about what the media might be saying about the Knicks.

It does matter tho. Coaches and FO people lose jobs based on public sentiment fostered by the Media. Potential Free Agents also can be swayed by Media created perceptions of the franchise. No one wants to be laughed at or go somewhere they think they’ll be relentlessly attacked. The NY Media is a very real part of way the team is viewed.

The issue is that not only is DSJ having an ACL surgery a bigger risk but his game is greatly predicated on him pushing his body to use his explosive talent. He lands awkwardly a LOT and his recent flair up came after a nasty left leg landing. There’s no comparison between the injuries Ntilikina has suffered and DSJ.

I'm not comparing and contrasting them, you are.

I'm saying I'm not interested in this topic after a week of the NBA season, period. Not for Smith, not for Ntilikina, not for anyone.

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10/23/2017  4:27 PM
fishmike wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:I'm not jumping on the 'DSJr's damaged goods' bandwagon because he's missed a few games any more than I'm getting on the 'Ntilikina is too weak to stay on the floor' bandwagon a week into the season.

Give both kids a month, a half, a rookie season.

I can agree you have to give these kids time but there’s no way the Media would be preaching patience if DSJ was a Knick! They’d be SAVAGING the Knicks for drafting a kid with an ACL that refused to provide medical info and was having swelling in that knee since Training Camp!

True. But we cant say on one hand that we need to give Frank some time before judgement and do the same thing you are claiming the press would be doing to DSJR if he was picked. Which is label him as damaged goods this early in his career. And keep in mind, we gave Noah 4 years. And we paid Rose 20M+ for one year. So to say we were smart enough to stay away from Smith due to his medical concern is hard to believe.

But think we all agree it will take some time before the real winners of this years draft are realized.

Noah and Rose were mistakes no? What do you they have to do with anything?

I mean if you draft a player coming off a major surgery and that injury is slowing the player there is some responsibility from the team who drafted him.

Consider what Smith's fans say about him, Hofstra you included one could easily say the only reason he was available this late in the lottery is he's an injury risk. Dallas may simply be willing to take it slow with him. Just like the Knicks may be willing to take it slow with Frank, youngest player in draft and all.

Noah and Rose were in response to the belief Knicks are discouraged by a players medical history.

Do think the injury was the ONLY thing that dropped him this low. But he is a special player and I thought was worth the risk. But I am going on the theory that Frank was picked for the Triangle. If the injury was a big red flag, I would have preffered, Mitchell, Monk or to trade down and get two later picks.

But again, its all a mute point. It will be interesting how it all turns out. We wont know for years. But I wish Smith luck and hope Frank can turn into a good player for us. Everything else is just fun to watch and see how our predictions turn out.

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HofstraBBall
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10/23/2017  8:51 PM
Fyi. Playing tonight.

https://sportsday.dallasnews.com/dallas-mavericks/mavericks/2017/10/23/dennis-smith-jr-says-play-mavericks-tonight-vs-warriors

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10/23/2017  9:31 PM    LAST EDITED: 10/23/2017  9:34 PM
fishmike wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
nixluva wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
reub wrote:It's water on the knee. Swelling. The body's response to trauma or injury.
nixluva wrote:
Knee effusion or swelling of the knee (colloquially known as water on the knee) occurs when excess synovial fluid accumulates in or around the knee joint. There are many common causes for the swelling, including arthritis, injury to the ligaments or meniscus, or fluid collecting in the bursa, a condition known as prepatellar bursitis.

Not a good thing to hear about that repaired knee. Hopefully it’s not something that will require surgery. Maybe just rest and treatment to bring the swelling down.


Remember that he wouldn't show us his medical records.

he went down awkward on his left knee in that game going to the basket

2:04

It aso looked like he hurt his ankle. He seemed a bit gimpy. Really impressive young player. He penetrates like Rose but passes to his teammates and has a jump shot. I would love to see KP with a point guard that puts that kind of pressure on a defense but is an elite passer. Hopefully the Knicks get some of that from Frank.

Kid has a nice game and in theory his skills and penetration would be ideal but you and I both know if Phil had drafted him the NY Media would’ve feasted on this. The kid needed to use DRose as a cautionary tale and toned it down. Instead he is just as reckless as DRose was. So many awkward landings!

,
much better player than Frank, but it looks like some of the fears about his health are justified dude is reckless. I don't know though I just don't think Frank is going to be any good, I haven't seen anything that justifies his selection at 8

Ntilikina is a different type of player. DSJ wishes he could be the kind of defender Nitty is capable of being. Nitty is yet to fully fill out and he might still grow. I like Nitty’s package of physical talent, skills and BBIQ. I think Nitty is going to be more of a Billups type of PG.

People keep predicting these lofty expectations on Frank with not a single shred of evidence he will ever reach those heights. Yeah he is long , sure I think he can defend at a high level , but the actually playing PG in the NBA I dont see those skills at all. Dude looks awful with the ball in his hands. I just want to see something that gives me hope for this kid because ever since he has been a Knick its been one failure after another.

Name them. Name all these "failures one after another" you're referring to?


Missed summer league , missed basically the entire preseason, plays 1 preseaon game looks bad, plays one regular season game and looks like the worst rookie in the class, gets hurt in practice will miss games again
almost as good as when your convincing us how smart it would be to trade KP

i would still do it i wouldnt build a team around a center. Its a wing and guard league, swap Porzingis for Jackson and another lottery pick id still do it
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10/23/2017  10:46 PM
technomaster wrote:Smith Jr was an absolute injury risk out of college; his rare anatomy (extra knee ligaments) also make him an outlier for treatment. He's superhuman, but like Luke Cage you may need to bathe him in acid to heal him.

in this day and age I would not be surprised if the extra ligament thing was a story floated to improve his draft stock.

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10/23/2017  10:57 PM
I know it was against the Warriors but DSJr was a minus 34 tonight.
nixluva
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10/24/2017  11:40 AM
Ntilikina is getting closer. Looks like he’s healing up.

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10/24/2017  11:42 AM
Knickoftime
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10/24/2017  11:46 AM
nixluva wrote:

2-5 from 3 in practice.

Trade his ass!!!

The Official Frank Ntilikina Versus DSJr Thread

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