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The Official Frank Ntilikina Versus DSJr Thread
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Juliano
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12/3/2017  5:21 AM
BRIGGS wrote:Let me say this
First off I did not want Mitchell because I didn't think he could shoot and I just felt the nba was going in that direction
Forget smith
What I saw out of Mitchell
He's a smaller Lebron. He's physically and athletically imposing and plays way bigger than 6-3. He has shown he can not only shoot it but w extended range. He has the power athletiscm overmatch-- he's not going to be stoppable. Hey we missed on him so did 10 other teams but he's the best player in the last draft-- always continue to learn.

He's way above frank but he's pretty much above everyone else to. Hrs the star of this draft

I also have the feeling he's going to be a star. He has all the attributes, his attitude seems spot on, he looks like a level headed young man with the desire to get better. No tattoos, not gangsta wannabe postures. And he grew up a Knicks fan too

One can be both supportive of Frank and appreciative of other talents in his draft class.

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nyknickzingis
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12/3/2017  6:52 AM
If I recall correctly, the Knicks were higher on Frank and Mitchell than they were Smith.
Justifiable.
Many still writing off Frank.
He's got major league talent.
You can't teach his reaction to the live ball on defense, his length, his IQ. These are things many basketball players lack. It's much easier to develop a consistent jumper than it is to develop the things Frank already has.
NardDogNation
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12/3/2017  8:49 AM    LAST EDITED: 12/3/2017  8:51 AM
Juliano wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:Let me say this
First off I did not want Mitchell because I didn't think he could shoot and I just felt the nba was going in that direction
Forget smith
What I saw out of Mitchell
He's a smaller Lebron. He's physically and athletically imposing and plays way bigger than 6-3. He has shown he can not only shoot it but w extended range. He has the power athletiscm overmatch-- he's not going to be stoppable. Hey we missed on him so did 10 other teams but he's the best player in the last draft-- always continue to learn.

He's way above frank but he's pretty much above everyone else to. Hrs the star of this draft

I also have the feeling he's going to be a star. He has all the attributes, his attitude seems spot on, he looks like a level headed young man with the desire to get better. No tattoos, not gangsta wannabe postures. And he grew up a Knicks fan too

One can be both supportive of Frank and appreciative of other talents in his draft class.

You mean like guys like LeBron James? Tim Duncan had ****ing tattoos along with most of the league, dude.

Nalod
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12/3/2017  9:59 AM
We should rename this the “Official every time a draft pick after frank has a better game lament thread”.
Today Frank will never imporove, and Mitchell is Dwade.
So we move from Smith to Mitchell.
Fair enough, until Frank becomes who he is this will go on.
Anger sells, don't buy!
Juliano
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12/3/2017  10:00 AM
NardDogNation wrote:You mean like guys like LeBron James? Tim Duncan had ****ing tattoos along with most of the league, dude.

Well that's actually kind of my point. For a young lad who wants to be a pro baller it would be easy to jump on the tattoo bandwagon, wear them like some kind of uniform. Not doing so shows character, a kind of quiet self confidence imo.

Nalod
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12/3/2017  10:04 AM
TripleThreat wrote this in a different thread. Speaks well here also.


IRC, blkexec has discussed that he has a heavy affiliation with AAU basketball ( Amateur Athletic Union) I'm not going to sweep this with a broad brush completely, but nothing about what Frank Ntilikina has to offer is going to vibe with someone with the average AAU mindset ( Heavy volume of games, stacked talent teams, emphasis for the players on getting noticed by scouts, team handlers looking for cash kickbacks, "jobs" with either the brands or a college program and just riding athleticism to get as many wins as possible to keep the various shoe brands happy. There is very little emphasis on team play and team defense, I'd wager some teams do, but it would appear to be the exception rather than the rule.
blkexec is right in one way, Ntilikina might not pan out. But he's right for the wrong reason, i.e. almost everything blkexec says comes from a guy who appears to apply AAU methodology onto the actual NBA. It's nowhere near the same. But it requires letting go of one's own ego to get to that point. You can win in the AAU just be feeding the ball to a kid who just overpowers everyone else because he's more athletic or more developed than them. To be totally fair, college ball is just as exploitative as the worst elements in AAU. And lots of kids would not get a college scholarship otherwise, without the AAU. And playing against better competition has it's benefits. But what Ntilikina brings is really not going to sell hard to the typical AAU brand jockey.
There's no money in great footwork. There's no money in fundamental play. You don't get a shoe deal for being a solid glue guy. You get the full bore swag and attention from dunking over a car. From beating the living **** out of your Disney pop star princess girlfriend. From shooting up a nightclub with an Uzi and getting on TMZ. There's also no money in time. AAU is ready now/win now/get now kind of methodology. Actually waiting for Ntilikina to get 2-3 seasons under his belt to see what he might be is just waiting too long for the typical AAU brand jockey.
Anger sells, don't buy!
NardDogNation
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12/3/2017  1:01 PM
Nalod wrote:We should rename this the “Official every time a draft pick after frank has a better game lament thread”.
Today Frank will never imporove, and Mitchell is Dwade.
So we move from Smith to Mitchell.
Fair enough, until Frank becomes who he is this will go on.

Frank, IMO, will be better than both Mitchell and Smith in the long run. And as for Smith, my opinion of him becoming a star plummets everytime I see him play. He is listed at 6"3' but looks woefully smaller than that and relies heavily on his athleticism to create. Players of that ilk normally don't have long-shelf lives (e.g. Shane Larkin, Jonny Flynn, Andre Barrett, Aaron Brooks, Sebastian Telfair, etc.) despite being skilled (though Smith might be the most talented of that bunch).

I'm shocked that I'm saying this but I definitely think we made the right call on Ntilikina. Now, we just need to make sure to establish the right kind of culture and regimen for him to succeed. As I said in another post, we should look to re-acquire a guy like Jose Calderon now that we are no longer emphasizing the triangle. He'd be a perfect 3rd string PG (great lockerroom guy, very skilled, very cerebral) to mentor Frank and get him to wear he was skillwise in Toronto. I also feel that Jamal Crawford would make for a great sergeant, helping to drill Ntilikina with his ballhandling.

NardDogNation
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12/3/2017  1:02 PM
Juliano wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:You mean like guys like LeBron James? Tim Duncan had ****ing tattoos along with most of the league, dude.

Well that's actually kind of my point. For a young lad who wants to be a pro baller it would be easy to jump on the tattoo bandwagon, wear them like some kind of uniform. Not doing so shows character, a kind of quiet self confidence imo.

He's also French. I can't think of a tatted French player so it just might he a cultural thing instead of some kind of statement.

CrushAlot
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12/3/2017  1:12 PM
Nalod wrote:We should rename this the “Official every time a draft pick after frank has a better game lament thread”.
Today Frank will never imporove, and Mitchell is Dwade.
So we move from Smith to Mitchell.
Fair enough, until Frank becomes who he is this will go on.
Mitchell is already top 3 in this class and that is with Simmons and Tatum. He looks like he will be a very good player for a long time. It isn't about him having a good game. He just is a very good player and has been playing that way.
I think we know what we're doing..... Phil Jackson
CrushAlot
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12/3/2017  1:13 PM
Nalod wrote:TripleThreat wrote this in a different thread. Speaks well here also.


IRC, blkexec has discussed that he has a heavy affiliation with AAU basketball ( Amateur Athletic Union) I'm not going to sweep this with a broad brush completely, but nothing about what Frank Ntilikina has to offer is going to vibe with someone with the average AAU mindset ( Heavy volume of games, stacked talent teams, emphasis for the players on getting noticed by scouts, team handlers looking for cash kickbacks, "jobs" with either the brands or a college program and just riding athleticism to get as many wins as possible to keep the various shoe brands happy. There is very little emphasis on team play and team defense, I'd wager some teams do, but it would appear to be the exception rather than the rule.
blkexec is right in one way, Ntilikina might not pan out. But he's right for the wrong reason, i.e. almost everything blkexec says comes from a guy who appears to apply AAU methodology onto the actual NBA. It's nowhere near the same. But it requires letting go of one's own ego to get to that point. You can win in the AAU just be feeding the ball to a kid who just overpowers everyone else because he's more athletic or more developed than them. To be totally fair, college ball is just as exploitative as the worst elements in AAU. And lots of kids would not get a college scholarship otherwise, without the AAU. And playing against better competition has it's benefits. But what Ntilikina brings is really not going to sell hard to the typical AAU brand jockey.
There's no money in great footwork. There's no money in fundamental play. You don't get a shoe deal for being a solid glue guy. You get the full bore swag and attention from dunking over a car. From beating the living **** out of your Disney pop star princess girlfriend. From shooting up a nightclub with an Uzi and getting on TMZ. There's also no money in time. AAU is ready now/win now/get now kind of methodology. Actually waiting for Ntilikina to get 2-3 seasons under his belt to see what he might be is just waiting too long for the typical AAU brand jockey.
This was worth copying and pasting from another thread?
I think we know what we're doing..... Phil Jackson
Juliano
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12/3/2017  1:40 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/3/2017  2:11 PM
NardDogNation wrote:He's also French. I can't think of a tatted French player so it just might he a cultural thing instead of some kind of statement.

Nah, I was actually talking about Mitchell, not Frank. Mitchell doesn't have tattoos, and I know plenty of frenchmen with tattoos. Heck, even my bloody accountant has tattoos! I don't really care for tattoos, I wouldn't have one myself, I feel a human being is always evolving. I'm not the same guy now (early 40s) as the one I was 10 years ago let alone 20, so it doesn't feel right with me to ink something on my skin that's gonna stay for the remaining of my life. I have no problem with people doing it though, but it seems strange to do it young, before say 20. It smack of artificial character building to me.

Nalod
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12/3/2017  5:13 PM
CrushAlot wrote:
Nalod wrote:We should rename this the “Official every time a draft pick after frank has a better game lament thread”.
Today Frank will never imporove, and Mitchell is Dwade.
So we move from Smith to Mitchell.
Fair enough, until Frank becomes who he is this will go on.
Mitchell is already top 3 in this class and that is with Simmons and Tatum. He looks like he will be a very good player for a long time. It isn't about him having a good game. He just is a very good player and has been playing that way.

DOnt kid yourself, its about the fan having the benefit of hindsight and thinking the are smarter.
20 games in. Let’s talk after 200? By then Briggs will have fallen in love 200 times.
I care only about Frank and his development, not second guessing. BTW there will always be someone u which we would have picked. Every year. Always.

Anger sells, don't buy!
BigDaddyG
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12/3/2017  5:32 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/3/2017  5:34 PM
CrushAlot wrote:
Nalod wrote:We should rename this the “Official every time a draft pick after frank has a better game lament thread”.
Today Frank will never imporove, and Mitchell is Dwade.
So we move from Smith to Mitchell.
Fair enough, until Frank becomes who he is this will go on.
Mitchell is already top 3 in this class and that is with Simmons and Tatum. He looks like he will be a very good player for a long time. It isn't about him having a good game. He just is a very good player and has been playing that way.

Markkanen? Kuzma? Still too much season to say anything except Simmon is a the runaway leader for rookie of the year.
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
GustavBahler
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12/3/2017  7:19 PM
Frank had a nice shooting game today. Was more aggressive. More willing to look for his own shot. Eventually the defense is going to have to respect Frank's jumper, which should make it easier for Frank to get to the rim. Just has to take advantage of those opportunities.
Nalod
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12/3/2017  9:59 PM
GustavBahler wrote:Frank had a nice shooting game today. Was more aggressive. More willing to look for his own shot. Eventually the defense is going to have to respect Frank's jumper, which should make it easier for Frank to get to the rim. Just has to take advantage of those opportunities.

“He just has to.......”

Yes, he just has to develop. Kid is doing just fine. Future is uncertain. Embrace the possibilities not life’s uncertainty.

Anger sells, don't buy!
GustavBahler
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12/3/2017  10:18 PM
Nalod wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Frank had a nice shooting game today. Was more aggressive. More willing to look for his own shot. Eventually the defense is going to have to respect Frank's jumper, which should make it easier for Frank to get to the rim. Just has to take advantage of those opportunities.

“He just has to.......”

Yes, he just has to develop. Kid is doing just fine. Future is uncertain. Embrace the possibilities not life’s uncertainty.

Did I take a wrong turn into "UltimateHallmark"? Lol.

knickstorrents
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12/4/2017  8:06 AM
SupremeCommander wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
SupremeCommander wrote:Hopefully Frank pans out. He measures well... seems to have some cerebral aspects.

But I wanted Donovan. Regardless of how Frank ends up, I thought and think we may have missed out on someone special in Donovan

Best case scenario, what do you see Donovan Mitchell becoming?

Absolute best-case? Dwyane Wade. Certainly not my expectation but if he fully develops I could see that, especially when you consider he is more of a scorer than playmaker... but certainly Donovan has playmaking ability (as did Wade)

From the highlights I saw he has a very good shot, but I don't think he is as explosive as Wade was during his prime. Almost every drive he did ended with a finger roll layup. The highlights I saw had him do one pass. He's a nice player, but not what the Knicks need. Franks skillset, size and IQ are a much better fit for the Knicks.

Rose is not the answer.
Nalod
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12/4/2017  1:00 PM
GustavBahler wrote:
Nalod wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Frank had a nice shooting game today. Was more aggressive. More willing to look for his own shot. Eventually the defense is going to have to respect Frank's jumper, which should make it easier for Frank to get to the rim. Just has to take advantage of those opportunities.

“He just has to.......”

Yes, he just has to develop. Kid is doing just fine. Future is uncertain. Embrace the possibilities not life’s uncertainty.

Did I take a wrong turn into "UltimateHallmark"? Lol.

Yes, and don't forget motivational coffee cup positive affirmations!!

Anger sells, don't buy!
BigRedDog
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12/4/2017  2:09 PM
nyknickzingis wrote:If I recall correctly, the Knicks were higher on Frank and Mitchell than they were Smith.
Justifiable.
Many still writing off Frank.
He's got major league talent.
You can't teach his reaction to the live ball on defense, his length, his IQ. These are things many basketball players lack. It's much easier to develop a consistent jumper than it is to develop the things Frank already has.

I hate posts like this. Where did you hear this? Some idiotic newspaper journalist? The Knicks never came out and said this. Under Phil he cleaned up all the snitches that would leak this crap. Honestly we have NO F'in idea who the Knicks were higher on except that they liked Frank better than Smith or Mitchell. People keep repeating this crap from wherever they heard it and soon it becomes fact.

CrushAlot
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12/5/2017  10:29 PM
Nalod wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
Nalod wrote:We should rename this the “Official every time a draft pick after frank has a better game lament thread”.
Today Frank will never imporove, and Mitchell is Dwade.
So we move from Smith to Mitchell.
Fair enough, until Frank becomes who he is this will go on.
Mitchell is already top 3 in this class and that is with Simmons and Tatum. He looks like he will be a very good player for a long time. It isn't about him having a good game. He just is a very good player and has been playing that way.

DOnt kid yourself, its about the fan having the benefit of hindsight and thinking the are smarter.
20 games in. Let’s talk after 200? By then Briggs will have fallen in love 200 times.
I care only about Frank and his development, not second guessing. BTW there will always be someone u which we would have picked. Every year. Always.


Mitchell had 31 tonight.
I think we know what we're doing..... Phil Jackson
The Official Frank Ntilikina Versus DSJr Thread

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