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C. Lee for Brandon Knight Trade Scenario...
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Knickoftime
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7/15/2017  2:09 AM
fitzfarm wrote:Knight is a talent and we need talent, he also had his best years with horny. he can play the one or the two. if we can get him for Lee strait up how could we say no? he is young, a very talented scorer needs to work on defense but the kid scores buckets.

I think he could really help solidify our second unit.

now can we some how trade lee and lance for Knight and TJ warren

warren is a free agent after this year and i think he wants to start not be behind chriss phx will prob let him walk

KP,oquin
Melo,Willy
warren,Kuz
timmy,dotson,baker
frank,knight,baker

If Courtney Lee took 18 shots a game instead of 9, he'd be the far superior scorer.

Knight's stand out talent is finding shots for himself, he is below average in making them.

http://insider.espn.com/nba/hollinger/statistics/_/position/pg/sort/trueShootingPct/page/2

If the priority is to play someone who find himself shots but convert them poorly, he's your guy.

AUTOADVERT
smackeddog
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7/15/2017  3:52 AM
I fear this story was leaked to prepare fans for us taking on Knight as part of a Melo deal (Melo to Rockets, Anderson to Blazers, Meyers to Suns, Knight and Harkless to Knicks). I don't want Knight because he is the player I fear Frank will become if he doesn't pan out. I'd be happy if he were replaced with Bledsoe, but knight salary is awful and runs one more year than melo's. No thanks.

Plus, if our aim is to get younger and build via that, how does it make any sense to have Knight and Lee in the backcourt?Where does Tim Jr play? where are the minutes for our rookies and Ron Baker?

TheGame
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7/15/2017  4:47 AM
It seems that if the goal is to get a mentor, a guy like Lee would be a better mentor for Frank than Knight. Plus Lee is a better player no matter how old he is. The Suns would have to give us a second round pick before I made that trade.
Playoffs or bust
nyknickzingis
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7/15/2017  7:08 AM
Knight is a good 3 point shooter,
25 years of age,
Can handle and pass the rock.

Career averages of 15 points, 4 assists and 35% three point shooting.
Knows Hornachek's offense.

I don't see any issue with taking him on in a Melo trade.

He makes between 13-15 million the next three years.

Vmart
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7/15/2017  8:04 AM    LAST EDITED: 7/15/2017  8:06 AM
I still say the Knicks should look into acquiring Lin from the Nets Clee for Lin works. Might have to give a second round pick or rights to Jamaraz. Because Lin is an expiring contract.i like Rondo the most for the Knicks.
newyorker4ever
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7/15/2017  9:39 AM
SocraticBallin22 wrote:Reports have surfaced that the Knicks recently discussed a trade with Phoenix and Brandon Knight is on the trading block. Although I would want Bledsoe, I don't think the Suns would ever trade him.

This trade actually helps both teams:

1) Knight is 25 and fits into the current youth movement we are having

2) Knight can mentor Frank as a young vet and ease him into the starting gig--a need we have

3) Knight and Lee make exactly the same money

4) Suns have a logjam at pg and want to unload him. They could use a vet in Lee.

5) Although Knight had a down season last year, he is still young and talented and had his best years under Horny where he averaged 18 ppg.

This is the type of trade that makes sense for both teams.


They'd have to give us a asset to take on Knight's contract and he's not really a PG and more of a SG. I'd actually be alright taking him on if we got something with him for taking on his contract as long as JH gives his approval since he's coached him so he knows if he can be a positive for us.

Bonn1997
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7/15/2017  10:52 AM
By almost all of the advanced stats (win shares, on/off +/-, box plus minus, real plus minus), Knight is one of the worst players in the league. He's an average 3 point shooter and good FT shooter but he's terrible at virtually everything else. Phoenix was terrible with him on the court. He had the worst on/off differential on the worst team in the west.
frenchy00
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7/15/2017  11:11 AM
A knight and Harkless package should not be considered. Our back court is loaded and the only add that makes sense is a vet or an upgrade to what we have. I'll pass on Harkless as I think he pretty much reached his ceiling. Both players contract go pass Melos btw. Knicks should hold on to Melo if they are not getting market value back in return. Period. Lee for knight doesnt make sense either.
smackeddog
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7/15/2017  12:13 PM
nyknickzingis wrote:Knight is a good 3 point shooter,
25 years of age,
Can handle and pass the rock.

Career averages of 15 points, 4 assists and 35% three point shooting.
Knows Hornachek's offense.

I don't see any issue with taking him on in a Melo trade.

He makes between 13-15 million the next three years.

Why take on his salary? its an extra $16mil on the cap at year 3- if I'm trading Lee I'm doing it to get rid of his salary and get a young player or a pick. Why take on salary for a trash player? If frank panned out, Knight would also be a bench player at that point and on that salary. He is not a good 3pt shooter. 35% is not good and the last three years its been: 31%, 34% and 32%. He is awful.

I do wonder if the Spurs would be interested in lee for a 1st or something- he's their kind of player and they need a SG now Simmons has walked.

martin
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7/15/2017  12:36 PM
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newyorker4ever
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7/15/2017  1:03 PM
I would take Knight back in a Melo deal to help make salaries match but we'd have to find a way to add C.Lee into that deal cause Lee and Knight have pretty much the same contracts but we'd have to have some draft picks and young assets included in the deal. We're gonna have to take back a big contract in any Melo deal anyway cause we have to take back money to match Melo's so why not B.Knight who already knows JH's system and could just need a change os scenes to help him get back to being a pretty good player like he used to be.

Houston gets--Melo

Phoenix gets--C.Lee, R.Anderson

Knicks get--B.Knight, I.Hartenstein, TJ.Warren, 1st round pick


I don't know the numbers on these guys but something like this with Melo, R.Anderson and B.Knight being the big money guys moving. Maybe even give Phoenix another young guy for taking on R.Anderson's contract or something.

90sKnicks
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7/15/2017  1:05 PM
I think the sooner we all accept that Brandon Knight or Derrick Rose will be our starting point guard next season the better. We are not going with Baker and Frank and no one else is out there but Rose or Knight. Bledsoe would've been a nice pipe dream, but we're the Knicks so we'll get Rose or Knight. Sigh.
smackeddog
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7/15/2017  1:19 PM
martin wrote:

Watching that, that dude was born to be an IT era Knick- bring him home!

WaltLongmire
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7/15/2017  7:06 PM
Something to consider...

Baker and Frank can play both guard positions...Dotson can play at the 2, and Hardaway can play at SG or SF, especially if Anthony is traded. Seems to give us some positional flexibility.

EnySpree: Can we agree to agree not to mention Phil Jackson and triangle for the rest of our lives?
LivingLegend
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7/16/2017  1:08 AM
Read a good article on Knight the other day......it basically showed that he was a very good & respected young PG prior to the PHX trade.


Prior to PHX he basically played PG +90% of the time and flourished.

When he was traded to PHX he was forced to share the ball with the likes of Bledsoe/Dragic and his time at PG fell closer to the 50% level with the rest of his time moved to off the ball (SG) and he has NOT been the same since.

He could be a player that needs to know he is the guy (the PG)....he may lose his confidence off the ball and at the same time not feel like a lead guard when he's really not the lead guard. He may also shoot better off the dribble and suffer catching/shooting off the ball.

I have not watched himmuch at all the past few years but at 25 I think he had a great defensive reputation before PHX....I'd rather take an asset to gamble on a 25 year old Knight vs lose an asset for in trading for a 29 year old, often injured Bledsoe.

Maybe in NY Horny puts the ball in his hands...goes uptempo and some of this guys game comes back.

LivingLegend
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7/16/2017  1:13 AM
BRIGGS wrote:Why does anyone have to mentor Frank??
Did anyone mentor Kobe Bryant or KG?

His body isn't ready for heavy minutes over the long grueling NBA season and how silly is it to compare Frank to an all time great? Frank also comes from a different culture, will have to adjust to the US, the NBA and NYC. Not everyone can handle that transition like KP for example.

Frank should be targeted for 20-25 mins per night...sometimes playing next to the other PG and he should keep building the body like KP is having to do.

EnySpree
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7/16/2017  4:51 AM
Knickoftime wrote:
fitzfarm wrote:Knight is a talent and we need talent, he also had his best years with horny. he can play the one or the two. if we can get him for Lee strait up how could we say no? he is young, a very talented scorer needs to work on defense but the kid scores buckets.

I think he could really help solidify our second unit.

now can we some how trade lee and lance for Knight and TJ warren

warren is a free agent after this year and i think he wants to start not be behind chriss phx will prob let him walk

KP,oquin
Melo,Willy
warren,Kuz
timmy,dotson,baker
frank,knight,baker

If Courtney Lee took 18 shots a game instead of 9, he'd be the far superior scorer.

Knight's stand out talent is finding shots for himself, he is below average in making them.

http://insider.espn.com/nba/hollinger/statistics/_/position/pg/sort/trueShootingPct/page/2

If the priority is to play someone who find himself shots but convert them poorly, he's your guy.

Courtney Lee has been in this league a long time. He's had his opportunity really on to prove he can be a 18 shot guy. He's not. Even though he has great percentages, he's never going to be an aggressive scorer. It's not in his game.

You know why I'm here....
EnySpree
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7/16/2017  4:59 AM    LAST EDITED: 7/16/2017  7:23 AM
LivingLegend wrote:Read a good article on Knight the other day......it basically showed that he was a very good & respected young PG prior to the PHX trade.


Prior to PHX he basically played PG +90% of the time and flourished.

When he was traded to PHX he was forced to share the ball with the likes of Bledsoe/Dragic and his time at PG fell closer to the 50% level with the rest of his time moved to off the ball (SG) and he has NOT been the same since.

He could be a player that needs to know he is the guy (the PG)....he may lose his confidence off the ball and at the same time not feel like a lead guard when he's really not the lead guard. He may also shoot better off the dribble and suffer catching/shooting off the ball.

I have not watched himmuch at all the past few years but at 25 I think he had a great defensive reputation before PHX....I'd rather take an asset to gamble on a 25 year old Knight vs lose an asset for in trading for a 29 year old, often injured Bledsoe.

Maybe in NY Horny puts the ball in his hands...goes uptempo and some of this guys game comes back.

Yes....

Before he went to Phoenix guys here were raving about him. He was playing at an all star level for the Bucks, then they traded him. Weird...

Knight and Tim Hardaway Jr as the starters every night is legit. Frenchy and Dotson growing off the bench is legit too. Baker in a 3rd string role is legit too. Young solid back court. That's a nice rebuild.

You know why I'm here....
Bonn1997
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7/16/2017  7:57 AM    LAST EDITED: 7/16/2017  7:57 AM
LivingLegend wrote:Read a good article on Knight the other day......it basically showed that he was a very good & respected young PG prior to the PHX trade.


Prior to PHX he basically played PG +90% of the time and flourished.

When he was traded to PHX he was forced to share the ball with the likes of Bledsoe/Dragic and his time at PG fell closer to the 50% level with the rest of his time moved to off the ball (SG) and he has NOT been the same since.

He could be a player that needs to know he is the guy (the PG)....he may lose his confidence off the ball and at the same time not feel like a lead guard when he's really not the lead guard. He may also shoot better off the dribble and suffer catching/shooting off the ball.

I have not watched himmuch at all the past few years but at 25 I think he had a great defensive reputation before PHX....I'd rather take an asset to gamble on a 25 year old Knight vs lose an asset for in trading for a 29 year old, often injured Bledsoe.

Maybe in NY Horny puts the ball in his hands...goes uptempo and some of this guys game comes back.

Flourished? He's been really bad every year except 2014-15. You want to play him at PG? He's probably the worst passing PG in the league. He doesn't do enough things well to make up for that. I assume if the Knicks were willing to take back Knight, a deal would be done by now. At least, I'm hoping that's the case.

BigDaddyG
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7/16/2017  9:00 AM    LAST EDITED: 7/16/2017  9:02 AM
Bonn1997 wrote:
LivingLegend wrote:Read a good article on Knight the other day......it basically showed that he was a very good & respected young PG prior to the PHX trade.


Prior to PHX he basically played PG +90% of the time and flourished.

When he was traded to PHX he was forced to share the ball with the likes of Bledsoe/Dragic and his time at PG fell closer to the 50% level with the rest of his time moved to off the ball (SG) and he has NOT been the same since.

He could be a player that needs to know he is the guy (the PG)....he may lose his confidence off the ball and at the same time not feel like a lead guard when he's really not the lead guard. He may also shoot better off the dribble and suffer catching/shooting off the ball.

I have not watched himmuch at all the past few years but at 25 I think he had a great defensive reputation before PHX....I'd rather take an asset to gamble on a 25 year old Knight vs lose an asset for in trading for a 29 year old, often injured Bledsoe.

Maybe in NY Horny puts the ball in his hands...goes uptempo and some of this guys game comes back.

Flourished? He's been really bad every year except 2014-15. You want to play him at PG? He's probably the worst passing PG in the league. He doesn't do enough things well to make up for that. I assume if the Knicks were willing to take back Knight, a deal would be done by now. At least, I'm hoping that's the case.


I'll give him the benefit of the doubt since Phoenix has been shaky from the top down during a good portion of his time there. But Im not keen on taking on a rehabilitation project at that price, especially when he plays a position we just drafted. We need to regain some cap flexibility.
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
C. Lee for Brandon Knight Trade Scenario...

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