HofstraBBall wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:I have to say, part of me is still open to the idea of trading for Eric Gordon, because the team doesn't have enough firepower to compete. Lets say the best player we get is Harkless - the projectiing starting 5 is Hernangomez/Porzingis/Harkless/Hardaway/Baker. That lineup will struggle to score over the long run of the regular season. Getting an Eric Gordon, and having CLee as well, both off the bench, all of a sudden you have serious perimeter scoring now with being able to put out Gordon, Clee, Hardaway all at once with KP. 4 shot makers.

To be competitive we need to be able to keep our scoring up like last year (105) and then improve defense with having more younger, active players. No point of getting better on defense and then not being able to even score 100. Right now in the league 105 is an average output. We're losing both Rose and Melo this summer. If we replace them with Baker and Harkless. Scoring wise. we're screwed.

Maybe a deal with Gordon and Harkless coming back.

Willy/O'Quinn/(Porzingis)
Porzingis/Thomas
Harkless/Lee
Hardaway/Gordon
Baker/Ntilikina/(Gordon)

Sometimes even go with a Gordon, Hardaway, Lee, Thomas, Porzingis lineup that will flat out be able to spread and shoot/score the ball.

Knick fans.... We just won 54 games but Melo sucks, need a PG, need another outside shooter and we may win the East. Management does nothing and we win 37 games. Knicks fans... scrap these losers! Phil comes in and does just that.

Knicks fans...we need to scrap everything for the sake of building with the draft. Phil signs Noah and Rose. Knick fans..great they may stay healthy? Phil knows what he is doing.

Phil ****s the bed for three years and Knick fans say the triangle is best route and it will be here for years. Melo us the cancer. Phil gets fired.No more triangle but Triangle draft pick made.

Knick fans...Gteat no problem. Now we just need to get rid of our biggest thorn and start fresh via the draft and young core. Management gives a player they gave up on 71M. Knick fans, great he is much better than a year ago when he was in D league. Great priced signing. And he still fits the young movement.

Knicks fans...Anderson id fine, Bledsoe sure, we need to get guys to be competitive and forget the tanking????

And people wonder how management makes stupid moves and walk in circles?

I don't care how many times you come with the "Fans are stupid so Knicks management is stupid, Melo is a god" posts. It is complete nonsense. Knicks are re-building. This is clear. They have:

Porzingis - 3rd best player from his class of 2015 rookies
Willy - Top 10 player from his class of 2016 rookies
Hardaway - Top 8 player from his class of 2013 rookies
Frank - Top 8 pick in this most recent 2017 draft

They are re-building, but it doesn't always mean you have to be a joke out there. If the team has needs, why not fill it? What it clear is they don't move forward with Melo. The only people who think Melo should stay are a few of his fans. The front office even without Phil, are convinced it's time to go. NBA analysts think the same.

If you trade Melo, you are trading a very good shot creator. If you let Rose walk, you are losing a very good driver. If I suggest taking on Eric Gordon, I don't see it as a big negative, because he can help a team in my opinion as he can shoot and drive the ball. I've never said I want the #1 pick and 60 losses next year. What I've said is if the team winds up being really bad without Melo, it is not all for nothing as you get a top 3 pick and you get to see who from the young current players is really good. The Knicks already have a re-build going with KP, Willy, Frank, THj. They have drafted all four of those players. Doesn't mean you avoid every veteran in the league. We are keeping CLee, who is easily tradable. Clee is a veteran. Doesn't mean you re-build with 12 players on rookie contracts and do a Sam Hinkie.There are many ways to re-build. To me, we already are somewhere because we have Porzingis, Willy, Frank and THj. To others we are nothing without Melo. To which I say, enjoy rooting for the Rockets or Cavs.

knickinthehead wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:I have to say, part of me is still open to the idea of trading for Eric Gordon, because the team doesn't have enough firepower to compete. Lets say the best player we get is Harkless - the projectiing starting 5 is Hernangomez/Porzingis/Harkless/Hardaway/Baker. That lineup will struggle to score over the long run of the regular season. Getting an Eric Gordon, and having CLee as well, both off the bench, all of a sudden you have serious perimeter scoring now with being able to put out Gordon, Clee, Hardaway all at once with KP. 4 shot makers.

To be competitive we need to be able to keep our scoring up like last year (105) and then improve defense with having more younger, active players. No point of getting better on defense and then not being able to even score 100. Right now in the league 105 is an average output. We're losing both Rose and Melo this summer. If we replace them with Baker and Harkless. Scoring wise. we're screwed.

Maybe a deal with Gordon and Harkless coming back.

Willy/O'Quinn/(Porzingis)
Porzingis/Thomas
Harkless/Lee
Hardaway/Gordon
Baker/Ntilikina/(Gordon)

Sometimes even go with a Gordon, Hardaway, Lee, Thomas, Porzingis lineup that will flat out be able to spread and shoot/score the ball.

Knick fans.... We just won 54 games but Melo sucks, need a PG, need another outside shooter and we may win the East. Management does nothing and we win 37 games. Knicks fans... scrap these losers! Phil comes in and does just that.

Knicks fans...we need to scrap everything for the sake of building with the draft. Phil signs Noah and Rose. Knick fans..great they may stay healthy? Phil knows what he is doing.

Phil ****s the bed for three years and Knick fans say the triangle is best route and it will be here for years. Melo us the cancer. Phil gets fired.No more triangle but Triangle draft pick made.

Knick fans...Gteat no problem. Now we just need to get rid of our biggest thorn and start fresh via the draft and young core. Management gives a player they gave up on 71M. Knick fans, great he is much better than a year ago when he was in D league. Great priced signing. And he still fits the young movement.

Knicks fans...Anderson id fine, Bledsoe sure, we need to get guys to be competitive and forget the tanking????

And people wonder how management makes stupid moves and walk in circles?

I think the problem we all think we can play GM, Armchair GM's But In reality we as fans know very little about running a team.

Agreed. But think the Pro GM's should do a better job than the fans that change their minds more than their underwear. Be nice to make a plan, pick people that can carry out that plan till the end. And stick with it.

Reason why I get on people blaming Melo for our problems. We brought him over to build arpund him and scrapped it when we hit a speed bump. Not about Melo but more about the organization that failed and has done so repeatedly.

nyknickzingis wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:I have to say, part of me is still open to the idea of trading for Eric Gordon, because the team doesn't have enough firepower to compete. Lets say the best player we get is Harkless - the projectiing starting 5 is Hernangomez/Porzingis/Harkless/Hardaway/Baker. That lineup will struggle to score over the long run of the regular season. Getting an Eric Gordon, and having CLee as well, both off the bench, all of a sudden you have serious perimeter scoring now with being able to put out Gordon, Clee, Hardaway all at once with KP. 4 shot makers.

To be competitive we need to be able to keep our scoring up like last year (105) and then improve defense with having more younger, active players. No point of getting better on defense and then not being able to even score 100. Right now in the league 105 is an average output. We're losing both Rose and Melo this summer. If we replace them with Baker and Harkless. Scoring wise. we're screwed.

Maybe a deal with Gordon and Harkless coming back.

Willy/O'Quinn/(Porzingis)
Porzingis/Thomas
Harkless/Lee
Hardaway/Gordon
Baker/Ntilikina/(Gordon)

Sometimes even go with a Gordon, Hardaway, Lee, Thomas, Porzingis lineup that will flat out be able to spread and shoot/score the ball.

Knick fans.... We just won 54 games but Melo sucks, need a PG, need another outside shooter and we may win the East. Management does nothing and we win 37 games. Knicks fans... scrap these losers! Phil comes in and does just that.

Knicks fans...we need to scrap everything for the sake of building with the draft. Phil signs Noah and Rose. Knick fans..great they may stay healthy? Phil knows what he is doing.

Phil ****s the bed for three years and Knick fans say the triangle is best route and it will be here for years. Melo us the cancer. Phil gets fired.No more triangle but Triangle draft pick made.

Knick fans...Gteat no problem. Now we just need to get rid of our biggest thorn and start fresh via the draft and young core. Management gives a player they gave up on 71M. Knick fans, great he is much better than a year ago when he was in D league. Great priced signing. And he still fits the young movement.

Knicks fans...Anderson id fine, Bledsoe sure, we need to get guys to be competitive and forget the tanking????

And people wonder how management makes stupid moves and walk in circles?

You lost credibility when you suggested moving Melo to the 4 and bringing KP off the bench. There was no WORSE move for the franchise moving forward than that.

I don't care how many times you come with the "Fans are stupid so Knicks management is stupid, Melo is a god" posts. It is complete nonsense. Knicks are re-building. This is clear. They have:

Porzingis - 3rd best player from his class of 2015 rookies
Willy - Top 10 player from his class of 2016 rookies
Hardaway - Top 8 player from his class of 2013 rookies
Frank - Top 8 pick in this most recent 2017 draft

They are re-building, but it doesn't always mean you have to be a joke out there. If the team has needs, why not fill it? What it clear is they don't move forward with Melo. The only people who think Melo should stay are a few of his fans. The front office even without Phil, are convinced it's time to go. NBA analysts think the same.

If you trade Melo, you are trading a very good shot creator. If you let Rose walk, you are losing a very good driver. If I suggest taking on Eric Gordon, I don't see it as a big negative, because he can help a team in my opinion as he can shoot and drive the ball. I've never said I want the #1 pick and 60 losses next year. What I've said is if the team winds up being really bad without Melo, it is not all for nothing as you get a top 3 pick and you get to see who from the young current players is really good. The Knicks already have a re-build going with KP, Willy, Frank, THj. They have drafted all four of those players. Doesn't mean you avoid every veteran in the league. We are keeping CLee, who is easily tradable. Clee is a veteran. Doesn't mean you re-build with 12 players on rookie contracts and do a Sam Hinkie.There are many ways to re-build. To me, we already are somewhere because we have Porzingis, Willy, Frank and THj. To others we are nothing without Melo. To which I say, enjoy rooting for the Rockets or Cavs.

Trading melo doesn't solve a single problem, depending on what you get for him.

KP, Willy, THJ, and FRANK will be on a roster voided of leadership and defense, so the same problems will still exist, without melo, just like they did without JR, shump, and Amare.

The knicks are so famous for taking 2 steps forward, and 2 steps backwards, basically putting them in the same position with different players...smdh

nyknickzingis wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:I have to say, part of me is still open to the idea of trading for Eric Gordon, because the team doesn't have enough firepower to compete. Lets say the best player we get is Harkless - the projectiing starting 5 is Hernangomez/Porzingis/Harkless/Hardaway/Baker. That lineup will struggle to score over the long run of the regular season. Getting an Eric Gordon, and having CLee as well, both off the bench, all of a sudden you have serious perimeter scoring now with being able to put out Gordon, Clee, Hardaway all at once with KP. 4 shot makers.

To be competitive we need to be able to keep our scoring up like last year (105) and then improve defense with having more younger, active players. No point of getting better on defense and then not being able to even score 100. Right now in the league 105 is an average output. We're losing both Rose and Melo this summer. If we replace them with Baker and Harkless. Scoring wise. we're screwed.

Maybe a deal with Gordon and Harkless coming back.

Willy/O'Quinn/(Porzingis)
Porzingis/Thomas
Harkless/Lee
Hardaway/Gordon
Baker/Ntilikina/(Gordon)

Sometimes even go with a Gordon, Hardaway, Lee, Thomas, Porzingis lineup that will flat out be able to spread and shoot/score the ball.

Knick fans.... We just won 54 games but Melo sucks, need a PG, need another outside shooter and we may win the East. Management does nothing and we win 37 games. Knicks fans... scrap these losers! Phil comes in and does just that.

Knicks fans...we need to scrap everything for the sake of building with the draft. Phil signs Noah and Rose. Knick fans..great they may stay healthy? Phil knows what he is doing.

Phil ****s the bed for three years and Knick fans say the triangle is best route and it will be here for years. Melo us the cancer. Phil gets fired.No more triangle but Triangle draft pick made.

Knick fans...Gteat no problem. Now we just need to get rid of our biggest thorn and start fresh via the draft and young core. Management gives a player they gave up on 71M. Knick fans, great he is much better than a year ago when he was in D league. Great priced signing. And he still fits the young movement.

Knicks fans...Anderson id fine, Bledsoe sure, we need to get guys to be competitive and forget the tanking????

And people wonder how management makes stupid moves and walk in circles?

You lost credibility when you suggested moving Melo to the 4 and bringing KP off the bench. There was no WORSE move for the franchise moving forward than that.

I don't care how many times you come with the "Fans are stupid so Knicks management is stupid, Melo is a god" posts. It is complete nonsense. Knicks are re-building. This is clear. They have:

Porzingis - 3rd best player from his class of 2015 rookies
Willy - Top 10 player from his class of 2016 rookies
Hardaway - Top 8 player from his class of 2013 rookies
Frank - Top 8 pick in this most recent 2017 draft

They are re-building, but it doesn't always mean you have to be a joke out there. If the team has needs, why not fill it? What it clear is they don't move forward with Melo. The only people who think Melo should stay are a few of his fans. The front office even without Phil, are convinced it's time to go. NBA analysts think the same.

If you trade Melo, you are trading a very good shot creator. If you let Rose walk, you are losing a very good driver. If I suggest taking on Eric Gordon, I don't see it as a big negative, because he can help a team in my opinion as he can shoot and drive the ball. I've never said I want the #1 pick and 60 losses next year. What I've said is if the team winds up being really bad without Melo, it is not all for nothing as you get a top 3 pick and you get to see who from the young current players is really good. The Knicks already have a re-build going with KP, Willy, Frank, THj. They have drafted all four of those players. Doesn't mean you avoid every veteran in the league. We are keeping CLee, who is easily tradable. Clee is a veteran. Doesn't mean you re-build with 12 players on rookie contracts and do a Sam Hinkie.There are many ways to re-build. To me, we already are somewhere because we have Porzingis, Willy, Frank and THj. To others we are nothing without Melo. To which I say, enjoy rooting for the Rockets or Cavs.

"Lost credibility" or do you mean hurt your feelings or ego? Funny cuz I thought you claimed to have been over that immense insult? As for credibility, better check your Knick season summary. Just a couple of weeks after I suuggested KP come off the bench and Melo at PF, The Knicks started to bring KP out early, put Melo in at 4 and brought KP in to sub for Melo. But how credible is the coaching staff? And if you stop and think,it was also about Melo unable to guard the 3 and that I wanted KP to develop the go to guy scenario.

Btw, that is what you got out of my post above? Not that we, fans and management need to make a sound plan, commit to it and Ride it out. Melo or not. But I guess you think it's okay to say we should rebuild with young pieces and look five years out, a week ago and now, that Melo has one foot out the door, change that stance? I say NO. IF we are going to rebuild through the draft, we dont need Melo, an 80 year old Prez with antiquated system nor do we need Gordon, Anderson, Noah, and any other contract over 15M. But I guess you are too stubborn to take that as "Its not all about Melo."

CrushAlot wrote:No news on twitter. Nothing on Clutchfans.

I remember the seahawks on the 2 yrd line in the superbowl, you remember what happen?

lol

nyknickzingis wrote:We scrapped building around Melo? BWAHAHAHAHA
Here have been Melo's teammates, when they were actually productive and able to be good.

2011 - Chauncey Billups, Amare Stoudemire
2012 - Tyson Chandler, Amare Stoudemire, JR Smith, Shumpert
2013 - Tyson Chandler, Amare Stoudemire, Jason Kidd, JR Smith, Shumpert
2014 - Tyson Chandler, Andrea Bargnani, JR Smith, Shumpert
(I'll give Melo a pass that 2 years the team was not good enough to compete for the playoffs as they didn't have enough talent, Phil was not really focusing on immediate moves) BUT then
2016 - Kristaps Porzingis, Derrick Rose, Courtney Lee, Willy Hernangomez, Brandon Jennings

The team's between 2011-2014 were all built around Melo to win now.
The team in 2016-17 was built around Melo to win now.

There were 2 years in between where I agree Melo had no point guard (Jose/Larkin etc) and no real second option. I do not put those years on him, plus he was hurt with a knee injury most of the 2014-15 season.

But to say we didn't build around him, is crazy. The Knicks give Lebron, Westbrook, Durant, Curry, Harden, Wall or any top 10 player in the league (like Melo was paid to be and invested in with so much going out trade wise) the talent he has had, they would do better.

I don't think Melo is the problem alone, but one of the problems has been that Melo was invested in and paid like a top 10 player and he has never delivered outside of 1 year. His usage rate is extremely high and he wants to play the role of a franchise player. When push comes to shove, he can't really sustain the abilities and production of a top 10 player. He wasn't even a top 20 player last year, he made the all-star team based on the team's oringinal selections not being available. The guy is declining. Knicks were robbed of the best Melo years, where he was close to or actually a top 10 player. That was from 2007-2012. We got a few years, but not what they paid or what type of role he had. High usage, high isolation, low impact basketball. Not enough leadership.

You just lost all credibility. Most on here are smatter than to take your crippled STAT, crippled Noah, players in final years of careers and BAR FN GNANI? As players used to build around a 3 on 3 competition winner, let alone, an NBA chip team? Bahahahaha!

Your right, I heard Lebron was angling to replace his winning teams with those stars. BTW,I will be done laughing in 10 minutes and will need another good laugh. So can you post the full rosters for those years and tell me "Where are those players now?"

But once again, what was the organizations plan? So we won 54 games and they made the right adjustments? Forget about Melo, what would good organizations do? Throw a tantrum and scrap all the pieces like a three year old that gets frustrated they cant figure out a puzzle?

CrushAlot wrote:

SupremeCommander wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:No news on twitter. Nothing on Clutchfans.

one of the first rumors I heard this week was that nothing was going to happen until next week. That confused me because what's the wait? But then again it is summer and maybe some of the owners are on vacation or whatever

That might be it. I also heard speculation that they were waiting until after Paul was introduced. That doesn't make sense to me. I think a multi team trade is too fragile to wait if you get things figured out.

According to the reports that I have been reading, they are looking for a 3rd or 4th or any team that will take Ryans contract.

knicks1248 wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:No news on twitter. Nothing on Clutchfans.

I remember the seahawks on the 2 yrd line in the superbowl, you remember what happen?

lol

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/NykInsider/status/885243825375129600

knicks1248 wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:I have to say, part of me is still open to the idea of trading for Eric Gordon, because the team doesn't have enough firepower to compete. Lets say the best player we get is Harkless - the projectiing starting 5 is Hernangomez/Porzingis/Harkless/Hardaway/Baker. That lineup will struggle to score over the long run of the regular season. Getting an Eric Gordon, and having CLee as well, both off the bench, all of a sudden you have serious perimeter scoring now with being able to put out Gordon, Clee, Hardaway all at once with KP. 4 shot makers.

To be competitive we need to be able to keep our scoring up like last year (105) and then improve defense with having more younger, active players. No point of getting better on defense and then not being able to even score 100. Right now in the league 105 is an average output. We're losing both Rose and Melo this summer. If we replace them with Baker and Harkless. Scoring wise. we're screwed.

Maybe a deal with Gordon and Harkless coming back.

Willy/O'Quinn/(Porzingis)
Porzingis/Thomas
Harkless/Lee
Hardaway/Gordon
Baker/Ntilikina/(Gordon)

Sometimes even go with a Gordon, Hardaway, Lee, Thomas, Porzingis lineup that will flat out be able to spread and shoot/score the ball.

Knick fans.... We just won 54 games but Melo sucks, need a PG, need another outside shooter and we may win the East. Management does nothing and we win 37 games. Knicks fans... scrap these losers! Phil comes in and does just that.

Knicks fans...we need to scrap everything for the sake of building with the draft. Phil signs Noah and Rose. Knick fans..great they may stay healthy? Phil knows what he is doing.

Phil ****s the bed for three years and Knick fans say the triangle is best route and it will be here for years. Melo us the cancer. Phil gets fired.No more triangle but Triangle draft pick made.

Knick fans...Gteat no problem. Now we just need to get rid of our biggest thorn and start fresh via the draft and young core. Management gives a player they gave up on 71M. Knick fans, great he is much better than a year ago when he was in D league. Great priced signing. And he still fits the young movement.

Knicks fans...Anderson id fine, Bledsoe sure, we need to get guys to be competitive and forget the tanking????

And people wonder how management makes stupid moves and walk in circles?

You lost credibility when you suggested moving Melo to the 4 and bringing KP off the bench. There was no WORSE move for the franchise moving forward than that.

I don't care how many times you come with the "Fans are stupid so Knicks management is stupid, Melo is a god" posts. It is complete nonsense. Knicks are re-building. This is clear. They have:

Porzingis - 3rd best player from his class of 2015 rookies
Willy - Top 10 player from his class of 2016 rookies
Hardaway - Top 8 player from his class of 2013 rookies
Frank - Top 8 pick in this most recent 2017 draft

They are re-building, but it doesn't always mean you have to be a joke out there. If the team has needs, why not fill it? What it clear is they don't move forward with Melo. The only people who think Melo should stay are a few of his fans. The front office even without Phil, are convinced it's time to go. NBA analysts think the same.

If you trade Melo, you are trading a very good shot creator. If you let Rose walk, you are losing a very good driver. If I suggest taking on Eric Gordon, I don't see it as a big negative, because he can help a team in my opinion as he can shoot and drive the ball. I've never said I want the #1 pick and 60 losses next year. What I've said is if the team winds up being really bad without Melo, it is not all for nothing as you get a top 3 pick and you get to see who from the young current players is really good. The Knicks already have a re-build going with KP, Willy, Frank, THj. They have drafted all four of those players. Doesn't mean you avoid every veteran in the league. We are keeping CLee, who is easily tradable. Clee is a veteran. Doesn't mean you re-build with 12 players on rookie contracts and do a Sam Hinkie.There are many ways to re-build. To me, we already are somewhere because we have Porzingis, Willy, Frank and THj. To others we are nothing without Melo. To which I say, enjoy rooting for the Rockets or Cavs.

Trading melo doesn't solve a single problem, depending on what you get for him.

KP, Willy, THJ, and FRANK will be on a roster voided of leadership and defense, so the same problems will still exist, without melo, just like they did without JR, shump, and Amare.

The knicks are so famous for taking 2 steps forward, and 2 steps backwards, basically putting them in the same position with different players...smdh

Should be KP's team at some point, and now is a good time to see if he can emerge.

Don't know about Frank in terms to being a leader right now, unless he really impresses in training camp. A PG/lead guard is always a potential leader, just don't know what he can offer right now unless he asserts himself early on.

Baker, an intelligent player, might emerge if his game has improved enough. Hardaway also returns as a more mature player who has been able to experience life on another team...maybe he emerges.

Want to throw a healthy Lance Thomas into the mix...fine. He has a lot of respect, and without Melo he has a chance to get solid minutes and lead through example.

Time for Melo to move on to greener pastures and see if our younger players can grow up.

Growing pains are fine, as long as all your players are working together on the court. Melo is not part of the future of this team, and in my opinion, now is the best time to move him to a better situation, and get on with the future.