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ISO JOE Johnson and Melo's future
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Uptown
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4/26/2017  8:58 AM
franco12 wrote:
LivingLegend wrote:Johnson has made more big shots in 1 series than Fugazy Melo has in all his years with the Knicks.

One guy makes big shots the other makes excuses for everything under the son.

Give me Joe Johnson 100X out of 100X over Melo who is Mr 1st quarter stat padder and builds his reputation on big shots against weak ass teams in meaningless regular season games on crappy teams.

Johnson > Melo the Cheat

Melo finally hit some crunch time/game winning shots. I agree that he has come up small a lot - but this year, he did start to turn that around.

Even the best clutch players have low fg% during the last 15 seconds of a tie-game or shooting to take the lead. I think Paul (I need to have the last shot) George is something like 2-30 or some similar ridiculous stat. The stat was posted during the Pacers/Cavs game 4, i believe..

AUTOADVERT
Uptown
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4/26/2017  9:01 AM
BTW...I wonder if phil had this info when he offered Melo the NTC
Nalod
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4/26/2017  10:07 AM
Kobe was about 30% in clutch shots which was very high.
But........Lets be fair, its also important to understand what clutch moments are. Close games? Important games?
Better to fail in playoffs then not be in them.
nixluva
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4/26/2017  10:07 AM
franco12 wrote:
nixluva wrote:
LivingLegend wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
nixluva wrote:
franco12 wrote:9 & 51.

That's a nice little factoid but really who gives F? We need to build a team that can contend for a Title and not just win games but have NO SHOT at a Title.

This team needs to be free of Melo. He's a crutch for the rest of the team and when he's gone you can get a much clearer picture of what this team has and what it's going to need. We need to see the ugly truth and not have it masked by Melo scoring a bunch of points.

Minus Melo this team can try to develop more of the abilities of the rest of the team. If Melo was less of a Ball Stopper they would all get more touches and maybe develop faster.


You just can't let it go. If you think this team is going to do anything without Melo, your......


Now I see the inner workings of a poor Jet fan. Lol. Didn't know you need Melo removed to rate D League talent. Just placed a bet in Vegas that KP forces a trade by threatening to go back to Euro league. What odds do you think I got?

Female or teenager?

ISO JOE helping to make the Melo to Clippers deal a reality. LOL. I'll help Melo pack if he waives that NTC. This team has to move on and Melo does too. He should want to play on a playoff team with guys his age.

And we know Phil won't be able to make that happen here!


Look, whether Melo goes or not, doesn't matter to me - in terms of a rebuild, our goal has to be 3-5 years out. That is when KP might be able to be physically strong enough to contend, and hopefully play a season without nagging little injuries.

The only reason Melo has to go is because of Phil- and after this past season, I don't understand how any Knick fan can trust Phil's judgement.

How can you defend the Noah signing?

How can you defend the Rose trade?

And then support Phil to continue to guide this franchise?

And now the one thing everyone hangs Phil's hat on - drafting the future Franchise cornerstone, KP- is potentially undone by either KP rebelling or Phil trading him.

So what positive contributions to this franchise has Phil made? And you CANNOT answer that he hasn't traded away any future first round picks- an empty chair could have done that.

And come to think of it, if they had simply not made any moves and not had a GM and stayed the course, I think this team would be in better shape.


Noah's 1st season was not what anyone wanted but when he was healthy he did actually play better as he got more in shape.
From what KP said Noah was doing what we most expected him to do from a leadership standpoint. He just has to get his body right. Now he won't have to log heavy minutes since we have enough young bigs.

Rose was a low risk move. Same as BJ. You take a shot and see if you can catch lightning in a bottle. IMO it was worth a shot.

Once you get past those 2 major issues the rest of this isn't nearly as bad as people try to make it. The best thing I came away with from the season is how the Younger players developed by the end of the season. The continued development of the younger players and adding even more talented young players is a very positive aspect to look forward to.

From the D League to the Young players on the roster there was some good that happened. Another good thing is that Jeff was able to finally find a balance between his offensive concepts and Phil's. The Modern Triangle Jeff was working and actually looked really good once the kids got more playing time. That's a very positive thing for the future.

Vmart
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4/26/2017  10:43 AM
Paris907 wrote:Watching Isolation Joe lead the Jazz with 28 last night, I couldn't help think of Melo. Neither one is in top condition, Joe now at 35 and clearly not able to bring it night in and night out. Yet there he was scoring double figures in the 4th when Utah needed baskets with Hayward out. A team like Utah or a variety of other Playoff teams could use an ISO scorer when their offense isn't breaking down defenses. Boston, LA Clippers and 3-4 other teams could use a Melo --- how much does Joe earn anyway ?

The thing about Joe Johnson's isolation is that he is a very willing passer. Joe has always been a good assist numbers guy.

TripleThreat
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4/27/2017  4:55 AM
nixluva wrote:Rose was a low risk move. Same as BJ. You take a shot and see if you can catch lightning in a bottle. IMO it was worth a shot.


The Rose trade was a personnel decision going against the grain of market convention.

Never trade big for small
Never trade durable for injury prone
Never trade off the court stability for off the court trouble
Never trade cost control cycle years for a player well into his decline phase
Never trade a good defender for a poor defender
Never trade a good contract for a bad contract

You'd have to go back to Otis Smith desperately trading Marcin Gortat for Jason Richardson to find a trade as equally as bizarre. ( I suppose that's one thing Rose can hang his hat on, unlike Richardson, he didn't get another players wife pregnant. Then again Steve Nash is Canadian, and they are typically very polite and forgiving people, otherwise I have no idea why guys like Richardson and Tony Parker are still alive. You try that happy horsesh#t in other countries, in other places in the world, and they will cut your throat open for it)

Rose was a lose/lose situation from the start

It created a hole at center.
If Rose was lights out, the Knicks would be under pressure to max out an injury prone, off the court troubled, aging and into his decline player who doesn't defend ad doesn't hit the three point shot
If Rose blew chunks ( which he did) , the Knicks would be inclined to let him walk, losing SIX YEARS of cost control/under market contract status with zero return. Other than a faint hope to take the 8th seed and likely ruin their best chance to get a higher draft pick.

What John Paxson and the Bulls got was a bailout. They got something for a player they didn't want or would likely have dumped for less anyway.

I'm supposed to say, to each their own, everyone has an opinion and a right to it and yadda yadda yadda and all that politically correct BS, but there are no NBA marketplace conventions in place that make the Rose trade seem either feasible or sensible. It was and is, to market convention, a completely senseless trade.

Who was the GM of the Mets back in the day? Omar Minaya from the Expos? And every other team, including Billy Beane, took turns basically gutting the guy in trades. He was like the scrawny guy in prison all the bullies took turns gang raping in the shower.

On the prison yard, Phil Jackson is definitely holding onto some dudes stuck out pocket.

HofstraBBall
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4/27/2017  10:21 AM
TripleThreat wrote:
nixluva wrote:Rose was a low risk move. Same as BJ. You take a shot and see if you can catch lightning in a bottle. IMO it was worth a shot.


The Rose trade was a personnel decision going against the grain of market convention.

Never trade big for small
Never trade durable for injury prone
Never trade off the court stability for off the court trouble
Never trade cost control cycle years for a player well into his decline phase
Never trade a good defender for a poor defender
Never trade a good contract for a bad contract

You'd have to go back to Otis Smith desperately trading Marcin Gortat for Jason Richardson to find a trade as equally as bizarre. ( I suppose that's one thing Rose can hang his hat on, unlike Richardson, he didn't get another players wife pregnant. Then again Steve Nash is Canadian, and they are typically very polite and forgiving people, otherwise I have no idea why guys like Richardson and Tony Parker are still alive. You try that happy horsesh#t in other countries, in other places in the world, and they will cut your throat open for it)

Rose was a lose/lose situation from the start

It created a hole at center.
If Rose was lights out, the Knicks would be under pressure to max out an injury prone, off the court troubled, aging and into his decline player who doesn't defend ad doesn't hit the three point shot
If Rose blew chunks ( which he did) , the Knicks would be inclined to let him walk, losing SIX YEARS of cost control/under market contract status with zero return. Other than a faint hope to take the 8th seed and likely ruin their best chance to get a higher draft pick.

What John Paxson and the Bulls got was a bailout. They got something for a player they didn't want or would likely have dumped for less anyway.

I'm supposed to say, to each their own, everyone has an opinion and a right to it and yadda yadda yadda and all that politically correct BS, but there are no NBA marketplace conventions in place that make the Rose trade seem either feasible or sensible. It was and is, to market convention, a completely senseless trade.

Who was the GM of the Mets back in the day? Omar Minaya from the Expos? And every other team, including Billy Beane, took turns basically gutting the guy in trades. He was like the scrawny guy in prison all the bullies took turns gang raping in the shower.

On the prison yard, Phil Jackson is definitely holding onto some dudes stuck out pocket.

Good post.

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
meloshouldgo
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4/27/2017  11:25 AM    LAST EDITED: 4/27/2017  11:26 AM
HofstraBBall wrote:
LivingLegend wrote:Johnson has made more big shots in 1 series than Fugazy Melo has in all his years with the Knicks.

One guy makes big shots the other makes excuses for everything under the son.

Give me Joe Johnson 100X out of 100X over Melo who is Mr 1st quarter stat padder and builds his reputation on big shots against weak ass teams in meaningless regular season games on crappy teams.

Johnson > Melo the Cheat

Keep talking.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2695076-carmelo-anthony-nails-16th-late-game-winning-shots-since-2003-04

How many has your Asian girlfriend made? Is she still with the Nets?

This has to be the most sexist and racist basketball post I have read in a while. Keep it clean or STFU

I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only try to make them think - Socrates
Vmart
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4/27/2017  12:05 PM
HofstraBBall wrote:
LivingLegend wrote:Johnson has made more big shots in 1 series than Fugazy Melo has in all his years with the Knicks.

One guy makes big shots the other makes excuses for everything under the son.

Give me Joe Johnson 100X out of 100X over Melo who is Mr 1st quarter stat padder and builds his reputation on big shots against weak ass teams in meaningless regular season games on crappy teams.

Johnson > Melo the Cheat

Keep talking.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2695076-carmelo-anthony-nails-16th-late-game-winning-shots-since-2003-04

How many has your Asian girlfriend made? Is she still with the Nets?

You know that is roughly one a year it's 2017.

nixluva
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4/27/2017  2:19 PM
TripleThreat wrote:
nixluva wrote:Rose was a low risk move. Same as BJ. You take a shot and see if you can catch lightning in a bottle. IMO it was worth a shot.


The Rose trade was a personnel decision going against the grain of market convention.

Never trade big for small
Never trade durable for injury prone
Never trade off the court stability for off the court trouble
Never trade cost control cycle years for a player well into his decline phase
Never trade a good defender for a poor defender
Never trade a good contract for a bad contract

You'd have to go back to Otis Smith desperately trading Marcin Gortat for Jason Richardson to find a trade as equally as bizarre. ( I suppose that's one thing Rose can hang his hat on, unlike Richardson, he didn't get another players wife pregnant. Then again Steve Nash is Canadian, and they are typically very polite and forgiving people, otherwise I have no idea why guys like Richardson and Tony Parker are still alive. You try that happy horsesh#t in other countries, in other places in the world, and they will cut your throat open for it)

Rose was a lose/lose situation from the start

It created a hole at center.
If Rose was lights out, the Knicks would be under pressure to max out an injury prone, off the court troubled, aging and into his decline player who doesn't defend ad doesn't hit the three point shot
If Rose blew chunks ( which he did) , the Knicks would be inclined to let him walk, losing SIX YEARS of cost control/under market contract status with zero return. Other than a faint hope to take the 8th seed and likely ruin their best chance to get a higher draft pick.

What John Paxson and the Bulls got was a bailout. They got something for a player they didn't want or would likely have dumped for less anyway.

I'm supposed to say, to each their own, everyone has an opinion and a right to it and yadda yadda yadda and all that politically correct BS, but there are no NBA marketplace conventions in place that make the Rose trade seem either feasible or sensible. It was and is, to market convention, a completely senseless trade.

Who was the GM of the Mets back in the day? Omar Minaya from the Expos? And every other team, including Billy Beane, took turns basically gutting the guy in trades. He was like the scrawny guy in prison all the bullies took turns gang raping in the shower.

On the prison yard, Phil Jackson is definitely holding onto some dudes stuck out pocket.

The idea wasn't to just make the 8th seed in the playoffs! This was a shot to try and do something while you still had Melo. If it doesn't work you have your pick and you can let Rose walk. The Rose deal was not done to meet criteria of Market Convention!!! It was more of a Hail Mary than a long term calculated move. You take a shot and see if it works. If not you move in a different direction and that is what is happening now.

The Melo Era is now OVER!!! There is no longer any reason to continue doing anything in the interests of making it work with Melo. This is now 100% about foundation building.

HofstraBBall
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4/27/2017  3:43 PM
nixluva wrote:
TripleThreat wrote:
nixluva wrote:Rose was a low risk move. Same as BJ. You take a shot and see if you can catch lightning in a bottle. IMO it was worth a shot.


The Rose trade was a personnel decision going against the grain of market convention.

Never trade big for small
Never trade durable for injury prone
Never trade off the court stability for off the court trouble
Never trade cost control cycle years for a player well into his decline phase
Never trade a good defender for a poor defender
Never trade a good contract for a bad contract

You'd have to go back to Otis Smith desperately trading Marcin Gortat for Jason Richardson to find a trade as equally as bizarre. ( I suppose that's one thing Rose can hang his hat on, unlike Richardson, he didn't get another players wife pregnant. Then again Steve Nash is Canadian, and they are typically very polite and forgiving people, otherwise I have no idea why guys like Richardson and Tony Parker are still alive. You try that happy horsesh#t in other countries, in other places in the world, and they will cut your throat open for it)

Rose was a lose/lose situation from the start

It created a hole at center.
If Rose was lights out, the Knicks would be under pressure to max out an injury prone, off the court troubled, aging and into his decline player who doesn't defend ad doesn't hit the three point shot
If Rose blew chunks ( which he did) , the Knicks would be inclined to let him walk, losing SIX YEARS of cost control/under market contract status with zero return. Other than a faint hope to take the 8th seed and likely ruin their best chance to get a higher draft pick.

What John Paxson and the Bulls got was a bailout. They got something for a player they didn't want or would likely have dumped for less anyway.

I'm supposed to say, to each their own, everyone has an opinion and a right to it and yadda yadda yadda and all that politically correct BS, but there are no NBA marketplace conventions in place that make the Rose trade seem either feasible or sensible. It was and is, to market convention, a completely senseless trade.

Who was the GM of the Mets back in the day? Omar Minaya from the Expos? And every other team, including Billy Beane, took turns basically gutting the guy in trades. He was like the scrawny guy in prison all the bullies took turns gang raping in the shower.

On the prison yard, Phil Jackson is definitely holding onto some dudes stuck out pocket.

The idea wasn't to just make the 8th seed in the playoffs! This was a shot to try and do something while you still had Melo. If it doesn't work you have your pick and you can let Rose walk. The Rose deal was not done to meet criteria of Market Convention!!! It was more of a Hail Mary than a long term calculated move. You take a shot and see if it works. If not you move in a different direction and that is what is happening now.

The Melo Era is now OVER!!! There is no longer any reason to continue doing anything in the interests of making it work with Melo. This is now 100% about foundation building.

You keep leaving out one important thing...Phil cares the most about what? TRIANGLE. It just not right when you guys keep saying that Rose and Noah were brought over to build around Melo. I give Phil more credit than that. Why would he put a high usage player , like Rose, with another one in Melo. And what does that say for his plan for KP in the lineup? Nah. He wanted guys he thought could fit the Triangle model. If he wanted to build around Melo he would have traded/signed three point shooting pieces, pass first point guard, had Melo at 4 and fed Melo the ball. Anyway. Lets focus on draft date. Think the Phil/Melo debate has been put through the ringer.

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
yellowboy90
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4/27/2017  7:19 PM
nixluva wrote:
TripleThreat wrote:
nixluva wrote:Rose was a low risk move. Same as BJ. You take a shot and see if you can catch lightning in a bottle. IMO it was worth a shot.


The Rose trade was a personnel decision going against the grain of market convention.

Never trade big for small
Never trade durable for injury prone
Never trade off the court stability for off the court trouble
Never trade cost control cycle years for a player well into his decline phase
Never trade a good defender for a poor defender
Never trade a good contract for a bad contract

You'd have to go back to Otis Smith desperately trading Marcin Gortat for Jason Richardson to find a trade as equally as bizarre. ( I suppose that's one thing Rose can hang his hat on, unlike Richardson, he didn't get another players wife pregnant. Then again Steve Nash is Canadian, and they are typically very polite and forgiving people, otherwise I have no idea why guys like Richardson and Tony Parker are still alive. You try that happy horsesh#t in other countries, in other places in the world, and they will cut your throat open for it)

Rose was a lose/lose situation from the start

It created a hole at center.
If Rose was lights out, the Knicks would be under pressure to max out an injury prone, off the court troubled, aging and into his decline player who doesn't defend ad doesn't hit the three point shot
If Rose blew chunks ( which he did) , the Knicks would be inclined to let him walk, losing SIX YEARS of cost control/under market contract status with zero return. Other than a faint hope to take the 8th seed and likely ruin their best chance to get a higher draft pick.

What John Paxson and the Bulls got was a bailout. They got something for a player they didn't want or would likely have dumped for less anyway.

I'm supposed to say, to each their own, everyone has an opinion and a right to it and yadda yadda yadda and all that politically correct BS, but there are no NBA marketplace conventions in place that make the Rose trade seem either feasible or sensible. It was and is, to market convention, a completely senseless trade.

Who was the GM of the Mets back in the day? Omar Minaya from the Expos? And every other team, including Billy Beane, took turns basically gutting the guy in trades. He was like the scrawny guy in prison all the bullies took turns gang raping in the shower.

On the prison yard, Phil Jackson is definitely holding onto some dudes stuck out pocket.

The idea wasn't to just make the 8th seed in the playoffs! This was a shot to try and do something while you still had Melo. If it doesn't work you have your pick and you can let Rose walk. The Rose deal was not done to meet criteria of Market Convention!!! It was more of a Hail Mary than a long term calculated move. You take a shot and see if it works. If not you move in a different direction and that is what is happening now.

The Melo Era is now OVER!!! There is no longer any reason to continue doing anything in the interests of making it work with Melo. This is now 100% about foundation building.

How about taking a shot with a player that is actually good? Why not try to work out a deal with ATL or Indy for Teague or Hill. Maybe try not to include Calderon in the deal so you can pick up a 1st rounder to trade with a 3rd team.

How about wait until the Bulls cut him since they were ready to move on from him just like the knicks were. Why didn't Phil listen to Paxon in his end of year press conference when he said it would be best for Rose to move on. Oh wait.

HofstraBBall
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4/27/2017  9:47 PM
Vmart wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
LivingLegend wrote:Johnson has made more big shots in 1 series than Fugazy Melo has in all his years with the Knicks.

One guy makes big shots the other makes excuses for everything under the son.

Give me Joe Johnson 100X out of 100X over Melo who is Mr 1st quarter stat padder and builds his reputation on big shots against weak ass teams in meaningless regular season games on crappy teams.

Johnson > Melo the Cheat

Keep talking.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2695076-carmelo-anthony-nails-16th-late-game-winning-shots-since-2003-04

How many has your Asian girlfriend made? Is she still with the Nets?

You know that is roughly one a year it's 2017.

Great job. Now read the article and tell me who had more.

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
HofstraBBall
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4/27/2017  9:52 PM
meloshouldgo wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
LivingLegend wrote:Johnson has made more big shots in 1 series than Fugazy Melo has in all his years with the Knicks.

One guy makes big shots the other makes excuses for everything under the son.

Give me Joe Johnson 100X out of 100X over Melo who is Mr 1st quarter stat padder and builds his reputation on big shots against weak ass teams in meaningless regular season games on crappy teams.

Johnson > Melo the Cheat

Keep talking.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2695076-carmelo-anthony-nails-16th-late-game-winning-shots-since-2003-04

How many has your Asian girlfriend made? Is she still with the Nets?

This has to be the most sexist and racist basketball post I have read in a while. Keep it clean or STFU

Right to the race card. Once again. Please Stfu. Go root for the Nets and your girl and stop trolling. Say what you want. It's predictable. But don't try to make your narrow viewed hate caused by Lin wanting to get paid sound like Knick status input. Off with you.

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
ISO JOE Johnson and Melo's future

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