The True Status Of The Knicks
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nixluva
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4/21/2017  10:38 AM
blkexec wrote:Nix can sell water to a whale. Are you sure you from NY? They don't make em like you anymore. Gotta love the fans that see things half full. They are truly the minority. The majority are shallow thinkers.....Looking through negative goggles. Only see what the media betrays. Doesn't look long term. And haven't experience the lows of knick history.

Then you have me....I like to see what's obvious and not so obvious. Half full and half empty. I'm one of the few who agrees with Stephen A rant on Phil. But also see Phils positive long term impact.

With that said, Phil is developing and reshaping a culture around NY basketball fundamentals. That's a good foundation to build on. That's how Russell won so many rings. And that's why teams with individual talent, but lacks team chemistry..... rarely win in this league.

Yes I think Phil is a con man. I don't think he took this job with the knicks at heart. Same with Dolan hiring Phil or forcing a melo trade. They both have their own individual agenda (just my opinion)....

BUT...Like most things in history....when you have a clash of two storms, good things will follow. I like the fundamental culture we are developing in a nba culture of individualism....and self marketing.

To my half full fans. Keep it up. I read and hear enough negativity about the knicks all the time. Its refreshing to read about the positive light found in a dark.


Yeah, i'm basically a Jedi. LOL Even while Darth Vader is killing people I could feel the good in him! LOL.

No but really I by nature focus on the positives and it's not that I don't see the bad things but I simply look for the Silver Linings and try to highlight those things. In this case I truly feel that Phil's Fundamentals will win the day for this franchise long after he's gone.

You can see the kind of guys he's been bringing in for the most part are really good guys. There's a quiet toughness to guys like LT, Baker and Holiday because they were overlooked and had to earn everything.

Phil's team are clear on what he wants them to focus on when scouting and I think this will really help going forward. If he's given them marching orders to find Skilled players that have good On Ball Defense that can really have a huge impact for the future.

People have some concern and issues with KP but despite his struggles he was a top 100 in the NBA in Defensive Win Shares, tied for 94. He should get even better as he gets stronger and learns more about defense.

We have our picks going forward, so there's a lot of opportunity to build this thing up. This is nowhere close to the worst situations of the past that we've been in. I think the Media would like us to think that it is, but it's not.

AUTOADVERT
fishmike
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4/21/2017  11:04 AM
HofstraBBall wrote:
fishmike wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
fishmike wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:It's good that we have a few Knick fans , like you, that are pleased with the current status of the team. You guys are a dying breed. Question for you Nix, as it's pointless to argue our opposing views of the direction of the franchise....

What type of trades/moves/player protests would make you feel we might be heading in the wrong direction? How many more losing years would you take before saying it might not be working?

sorry to single you out as you are not the only one who does this, but it is clear of the Phil must die crowd.

You may have read his words but you didnt listen at all.

Lets look again at some direct quotes:

Phil is trying to build...
Phil wants a foundation of Defense...
This again is a recipe for future success...
How can anyone argue against building with these principles going forward?

Do any of these indicate Nix is "pleased with the current status?"

No... he never says that, nor indicates it. He simply said the situation is not as bad as some would spout daily (you among them), and that what Phil is TRYING to do is good. The plan and implementing the plan are two different things. Your response was to ask questions based on what you HEARD, not what Nix actually WROTE.

Sorry. Phil is not saying he loves Phil or that Phil's doing a great job. He's saying Phil has the right goals, and isnt as far away as some think to accomplishing some of those goal. Very different than what you are suggesting.

No need to apologize. Heated banter is why we come on here. I now Know Nix is a true Knick fan. Not just a guy trolling in a player. Which i thought he was.

I think for me, it is more than Phil. It's about Dolan. From day one I thought Dolan went with yet another big name regardless of positional experience. To me it was a red flag that his own Laker adopted family did not give him more control. hesitancy of Lakers to hire him, his ego and player relations were also a concern. But like I said, it's personal opinion that has been reinforced by his shortcomings.

As for the right goals. Agree about defense needing to be the foundation. However, its hard to believe in his defensive commitment once he passed on bringing in a defense minded coach. Which i hoped he would have. Also, choosing Rambo as his defensive coach is not exactly a huge endorsement to his commitment to defense. Just have seen this too many times before. Dolan hires some shield for a few years, one that does not have the energy or commitment to be here for the long haul. But I hope you guys are right.

dude those are all fair points. Every one. Phil has totally phucked up with the coaching. I think its especially clear that when it comes to coaching the Knicks both Fish and Phil had good things but couldnt work it out. That is totally on Phil.

I have no endorsement. I am patient though.

No Dolan
Continues to get young and value the draft
Has not followed any mold of player or prospect. Seems open on talent.
It will be a big offseason.
There is a lottery pick.
There will be a Melo trade.
There will be a chunk of cap space. I am not projecting one way or another, but the Knicks are very fluid right now. Things are going to change very quickly, yet many of these guys will return, and will return the year after that as well. Some of them I believe in. Others are wait and see.
I love KP and Willy.

If we had the Lance from last year I honestly think we are .500 and in the playoffs. I love Lance and hope his health isnt an issue. If Noah and Lance are healthy this is a different conversation. Yes I agree that Noah's inability to get on the court is on Phil. He signed a guy with an injury history. However I dont see this a McDyess part II. Yes Noah is costly, but even if he's half the player he will be incredibly valuable playing with KP and Willy and possibly Plumlee if he sticks.


Those are the bullet points that allow me to be comfortable with simply a wait and see approach. That is not an endorsement of anything Phil has done here. I just dont think its that bad and Phil has put us in a position for things to turn around very quickly. That does not mean they WILL, so I give Phil ZERO CREDIT at this point. But we will see offers from 3 teams for Melo. We will draft a lottery player and some #2s. We have a chunk of cap space. Its going to be a big offseason. Lets see what happens. Thats it man!

Agree with most. Like Willy and KP as well. Think we wont get much for Melo. Still think Melo was not to blame but feel his body has broken down and needs to be in a different situation. Seems like draft will be less of a crap shoot. Although we have said that many times before. Will be interesting to see if and which FA's are opened to the Knicks.

Keeping Phil out of conversation, my worries for next year are:
How KP and Willy will fit defensively together.
Noah's contract and health.
Fact KP and by extention...Willy(as they are close) do not have a favorable opinion of the organization.
Who we can add in free agent market to replace Melo's scoring ability.

Hopes
We do well in draft. Like Tatum, Isaac, Smith.
Get young up and coming player and a draft pick for Melo.

We unload Noah.
We sign the Holiday brothers.
Boston and Clips lose in 1st round and get desperate to add Melo.

Will focus on the positives.

Knicks move up to 2nd and take Josh Jackson
Knicks trade Melo for Austin Rivers (with other parts from Clippers going other places)
Knicks max out JRue, resign Justin for the MLE
Knicks trade Kuz for a future #2
Knicks SL line up next year is
Holiday
Holiday
Lance
KP
Noah
Bench: Courtney Lee, Austin Rivers, Josh Jackson, Willy, Baker, KOQ, etc
fishmike - Making UltimateKnicks great again
martin
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4/21/2017  11:42 AM
shinmen wrote:The last 2 or 3 seasons, Melo has asked for help to take advantage of his window. He wanted and still do a team to win during his window. Phil had Melo on his team. He had no choice but to sign him. He would have been crucified if he let him walk for nothing. For proof, we see how he's villified for shumpert and jr. Imagine if he had done the same for Melo.

Melo is still a very good player but to win now, you need veterans. 2 years ago, Phil signed Affalo, Lopez and Seraphin. Obviously it was not enough but he did what he could. We can all agree that Durant was not coming here.

Last summer, Melo was very vocal about wanting a better cast. His window closing and so on. Phil obliged and did what he could.
We needed a penetrating guard. He got that in Rose but it cost him Lopez and Grant. Noah was to compensate for Lopez. Honestly, I hated the signings as I liked Grant and Lopez. I would have prefered incremental improvements. However, I understood the thinking. Remember the quote of Phil to Melo. "Are you happy now?" Melo said he was.

Everything has backfired badly but Phil tried and did what he could for Melo and form him only.
Now Phil and the knicks don't owe anything to Melo's window. If he wants to stay, fine, he can bring something to the team but he shouldn't expect any consideration from the knicks. That's why this offseason is different from the others.

Phil failed to build a competitive veteran team. To preserve his legacy, he must succeed to build a young improving team. Otherwise, his stint in NY will be seen as complete failure.

i think this is a fair summary

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GoNyGoNyGo
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4/21/2017  12:20 PM
Is it Phil? Is it Melo? Is it Dolan?

I want the Knicks to be competitors again. It's time to move on from Melo. At that point, we can really judge what Jax is doing and whether he can really run the team.

Melo is a noose hanging around the team's neck.

Welcome to the new New York Knicks! The Porzingis Era!
Chandler
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4/21/2017  12:33 PM
martin wrote:
shinmen wrote:The last 2 or 3 seasons, Melo has asked for help to take advantage of his window. He wanted and still do a team to win during his window. Phil had Melo on his team. He had no choice but to sign him. He would have been crucified if he let him walk for nothing. For proof, we see how he's villified for shumpert and jr. Imagine if he had done the same for Melo.

Melo is still a very good player but to win now, you need veterans. 2 years ago, Phil signed Affalo, Lopez and Seraphin. Obviously it was not enough but he did what he could. We can all agree that Durant was not coming here.

Last summer, Melo was very vocal about wanting a better cast. His window closing and so on. Phil obliged and did what he could.
We needed a penetrating guard. He got that in Rose but it cost him Lopez and Grant. Noah was to compensate for Lopez. Honestly, I hated the signings as I liked Grant and Lopez. I would have prefered incremental improvements. However, I understood the thinking. Remember the quote of Phil to Melo. "Are you happy now?" Melo said he was.

Everything has backfired badly but Phil tried and did what he could for Melo and form him only.
Now Phil and the knicks don't owe anything to Melo's window. If he wants to stay, fine, he can bring something to the team but he shouldn't expect any consideration from the knicks. That's why this offseason is different from the others.

Phil failed to build a competitive veteran team. To preserve his legacy, he must succeed to build a young improving team. Otherwise, his stint in NY will be seen as complete failure.

i think this is a fair summary

Agreed. I also think a lot of the criticism is based on 20/20 hindsight.

As a president he's doing fine. As a GM with FA not so much but as a team we shouldn't be emphasizing FA anyway.

DJMUSIC: Fisher talked a good game in Post game but aside from that Derek Fisher was ALL CHIT CHAT SH_t and produced nothing!
nixluva
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4/21/2017  12:46 PM
Chandler wrote:
martin wrote:
shinmen wrote:The last 2 or 3 seasons, Melo has asked for help to take advantage of his window. He wanted and still do a team to win during his window. Phil had Melo on his team. He had no choice but to sign him. He would have been crucified if he let him walk for nothing. For proof, we see how he's villified for shumpert and jr. Imagine if he had done the same for Melo.

Melo is still a very good player but to win now, you need veterans. 2 years ago, Phil signed Affalo, Lopez and Seraphin. Obviously it was not enough but he did what he could. We can all agree that Durant was not coming here.

Last summer, Melo was very vocal about wanting a better cast. His window closing and so on. Phil obliged and did what he could.
We needed a penetrating guard. He got that in Rose but it cost him Lopez and Grant. Noah was to compensate for Lopez. Honestly, I hated the signings as I liked Grant and Lopez. I would have prefered incremental improvements. However, I understood the thinking. Remember the quote of Phil to Melo. "Are you happy now?" Melo said he was.

Everything has backfired badly but Phil tried and did what he could for Melo and form him only.
Now Phil and the knicks don't owe anything to Melo's window. If he wants to stay, fine, he can bring something to the team but he shouldn't expect any consideration from the knicks. That's why this offseason is different from the others.

Phil failed to build a competitive veteran team. To preserve his legacy, he must succeed to build a young improving team. Otherwise, his stint in NY will be seen as complete failure.

i think this is a fair summary

Agreed. I also think a lot of the criticism is based on 20/20 hindsight.

As a president he's doing fine. As a GM with FA not so much but as a team we shouldn't be emphasizing FA anyway.


It's time to build with our own stars. This seems to be the PERFECT time to get this thing kicked into high gear. Just look at how the Bucks are progressing. How the Wiz have finally taken the next step. You can build a core thru the draft.
knicks1248
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4/21/2017  3:18 PM
nixluva wrote:
Chandler wrote:
martin wrote:
shinmen wrote:The last 2 or 3 seasons, Melo has asked for help to take advantage of his window. He wanted and still do a team to win during his window. Phil had Melo on his team. He had no choice but to sign him. He would have been crucified if he let him walk for nothing. For proof, we see how he's villified for shumpert and jr. Imagine if he had done the same for Melo.

Melo is still a very good player but to win now, you need veterans. 2 years ago, Phil signed Affalo, Lopez and Seraphin. Obviously it was not enough but he did what he could. We can all agree that Durant was not coming here.

Last summer, Melo was very vocal about wanting a better cast. His window closing and so on. Phil obliged and did what he could.
We needed a penetrating guard. He got that in Rose but it cost him Lopez and Grant. Noah was to compensate for Lopez. Honestly, I hated the signings as I liked Grant and Lopez. I would have prefered incremental improvements. However, I understood the thinking. Remember the quote of Phil to Melo. "Are you happy now?" Melo said he was.

Everything has backfired badly but Phil tried and did what he could for Melo and form him only.
Now Phil and the knicks don't owe anything to Melo's window. If he wants to stay, fine, he can bring something to the team but he shouldn't expect any consideration from the knicks. That's why this offseason is different from the others.

Phil failed to build a competitive veteran team. To preserve his legacy, he must succeed to build a young improving team. Otherwise, his stint in NY will be seen as complete failure.

i think this is a fair summary

Agreed. I also think a lot of the criticism is based on 20/20 hindsight.

As a president he's doing fine. As a GM with FA not so much but as a team we shouldn't be emphasizing FA anyway.


It's time to build with our own stars. This seems to be the PERFECT time to get this thing kicked into high gear. Just look at how the Bucks are progressing. How the Wiz have finally taken the next step. You can build a core thru the draft.

what do you think is going to happen when phil is gone in 2 yrs or less, you think some other president or gm is going to just continue with his mess. He's going to do the exact same thing every new exec that comes in the door does, strip the roster of ever player the previous regime brought in.

ES
nixluva
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4/21/2017  3:49 PM
knicks1248 wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Chandler wrote:
martin wrote:
shinmen wrote:The last 2 or 3 seasons, Melo has asked for help to take advantage of his window. He wanted and still do a team to win during his window. Phil had Melo on his team. He had no choice but to sign him. He would have been crucified if he let him walk for nothing. For proof, we see how he's villified for shumpert and jr. Imagine if he had done the same for Melo.

Melo is still a very good player but to win now, you need veterans. 2 years ago, Phil signed Affalo, Lopez and Seraphin. Obviously it was not enough but he did what he could. We can all agree that Durant was not coming here.

Last summer, Melo was very vocal about wanting a better cast. His window closing and so on. Phil obliged and did what he could.
We needed a penetrating guard. He got that in Rose but it cost him Lopez and Grant. Noah was to compensate for Lopez. Honestly, I hated the signings as I liked Grant and Lopez. I would have prefered incremental improvements. However, I understood the thinking. Remember the quote of Phil to Melo. "Are you happy now?" Melo said he was.

Everything has backfired badly but Phil tried and did what he could for Melo and form him only.
Now Phil and the knicks don't owe anything to Melo's window. If he wants to stay, fine, he can bring something to the team but he shouldn't expect any consideration from the knicks. That's why this offseason is different from the others.

Phil failed to build a competitive veteran team. To preserve his legacy, he must succeed to build a young improving team. Otherwise, his stint in NY will be seen as complete failure.

i think this is a fair summary

Agreed. I also think a lot of the criticism is based on 20/20 hindsight.

As a president he's doing fine. As a GM with FA not so much but as a team we shouldn't be emphasizing FA anyway.


It's time to build with our own stars. This seems to be the PERFECT time to get this thing kicked into high gear. Just look at how the Bucks are progressing. How the Wiz have finally taken the next step. You can build a core thru the draft.

what do you think is going to happen when phil is gone in 2 yrs or less, you think some other president or gm is going to just continue with his mess. He's going to do the exact same thing every new exec that comes in the door does, strip the roster of ever player the previous regime brought in.


For all we know Phil might re-sign if things turn around. Also we have Mills, Mathews and Houston in place already. You are really not paying much attention to what is going on with this Franchise if you don't know Phil is grooming these guys to take over.

2 years from now things can look completely different from a progress standpoint. We'd have several more drafted players and internal growth. Maybe a good Free Agent or 2 along the way. Your assumption that things will not get better doesn't have to be true just cuz you have no faith.

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4/22/2017  6:14 PM
I haven't been spending much time on this board, so hi everybody here.

The true status is that this franchise depends on Melo since they gave him an NTC.

Melo was on his way to the Lakers in free agency, and if there was one executive who couldn't let Melo join Kobe, that was Phil Jackson.
Not to mention Dolan's MSG company like the Knicks would just not accept their higher profile scorer to sign to AEG's Lakers.

When Melo's reps requested an NTC, Phil shoulda just let Melo walk, but I understand why he accepted.

Fans blame Phil for not getting Durant, LaMarcus or even Monroe (yikes), I can't imagine the reaction had he let Melo walk with nothing in return, three months into the job.

It was a difficult job for Phil to take over regardless, that's why I think fans and medias who spend their day bashing Phil, have zero understanding of the business and credibility.
I am especially disappointed by a guy like Stephen A, whom I remember yelling at Marbury on the air for not being a point guard, who today spreads out the notion that Phil didn't want the job. Stephen A has just become Melo's puppet.

Number one, if it was about the money, Phil would have found money elsewhere than NY.
He's a 13 time champion for X sakes. Since when does nobody in the league seeks that kind of résumé ?

Number two, take your sunglasses off, Melo is the one who has been about the money. He had the Knicks to overpay on a trade to keep his bird rights and make the most possible income in free agency in 2011. Then when he became a FA, he used the most cards he could (Lakers, Bulls, etc) to get NY to pay the most they had to. In return, he got them like $7M back to improve the cap situation, and requested the NTC to maintain his alternative business in NY.

But he's never been about the Knicks. Duncan was exclusively a Spur. Kobe was a Laker. Dirk is a Maverick. Those guys never bothered to meet other teams when they were free agent.
Melo's not a true Knick. He's always used competition to reach where he wanted, and already said in Feb it wouldn't be weird for him to play for Boston.

Fans who understand the process are a minority sadly, as it's so much easier to cheer for the star scorer, and yell and blame the regime for losses.

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4/22/2017  7:03 PM    LAST EDITED: 4/22/2017  7:12 PM
Heart and Soul

nixluva wrote:WHO really likes losing??? I don't like being embarrassed by dumb Dolan crap or Phil tweeting. None of that is good or acceptable. However, underneath all of that is some very constructive things. We head into the offseason with some real opportunity to get some positive growth and roster improvement for the long term. No guarantees but there is real opportunity to add the kind of 2 Way Talent we need.

Phil has to eventually get with KP and straighten out that relationship and I trust that he will. The Melo thing is HUGE and it won't be easy. I think all parties are motivated to resolve the issue and that's a start. Melo said he wanted to know what the Knicks direction is and now he knows.

Dolan is the trump of NBA Basketball. You cannot have a foul relationship with ANY of the players who made the Knicks the Knicks. The Charles Oakley saga leaves a nasty mark and sends a loud message to other players in the fraternity. Drama with season ticket holders is foolish and uncalled for. It detracts from the spirit of the franchise. The heart and soul. The things one cannot measure with stats are the things that separate winners from losers. Karma. Feng shui, whatever you wanna call it... it is NOT good.

Think about what that means to the future.

once a knick always a knick
nixluva
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4/22/2017  7:36 PM
misterearl wrote:Heart and Soul

nixluva wrote:WHO really likes losing??? I don't like being embarrassed by dumb Dolan crap or Phil tweeting. None of that is good or acceptable. However, underneath all of that is some very constructive things. We head into the offseason with some real opportunity to get some positive growth and roster improvement for the long term. No guarantees but there is real opportunity to add the kind of 2 Way Talent we need.

Phil has to eventually get with KP and straighten out that relationship and I trust that he will. The Melo thing is HUGE and it won't be easy. I think all parties are motivated to resolve the issue and that's a start. Melo said he wanted to know what the Knicks direction is and now he knows.

Dolan is the trump of NBA Basketball. You cannot have a foul relationship with ANY of the players who made the Knicks the Knicks. The Charles Oakley saga leaves a nasty mark and sends a loud message to other players in the fraternity. Drama with season ticket holders is foolish and uncalled for. It detracts from the spirit of the franchise. The heart and soul. The things one cannot measure with stats are the things that separate winners from losers. Karma. Feng shui, whatever you wanna call it... it is NOT good.

Think about what that means to the future.

Don't know about mystical karma but I do know that the Knicks have their 1st rd picks and some quality young talent already on the roster!!! This team is on the verge of putting together a talented new young CORE! Let's see how things work out from here. IMO it's not a bad spot to be in.

martin
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4/22/2017  7:36 PM
FKF wrote:I haven't been spending much time on this board, so hi everybody here.

The true status is that this franchise depends on Melo since they gave him an NTC.

Melo was on his way to the Lakers in free agency, and if there was one executive who couldn't let Melo join Kobe, that was Phil Jackson.
Not to mention Dolan's MSG company like the Knicks would just not accept their higher profile scorer to sign to AEG's Lakers.

When Melo's reps requested an NTC, Phil shoulda just let Melo walk, but I understand why he accepted.

Fans blame Phil for not getting Durant, LaMarcus or even Monroe (yikes), I can't imagine the reaction had he let Melo walk with nothing in return, three months into the job.

It was a difficult job for Phil to take over regardless, that's why I think fans and medias who spend their day bashing Phil, have zero understanding of the business and credibility.
I am especially disappointed by a guy like Stephen A, whom I remember yelling at Marbury on the air for not being a point guard, who today spreads out the notion that Phil didn't want the job. Stephen A has just become Melo's puppet.

Number one, if it was about the money, Phil would have found money elsewhere than NY.
He's a 13 time champion for X sakes. Since when does nobody in the league seeks that kind of résumé ?

Number two, take your sunglasses off, Melo is the one who has been about the money. He had the Knicks to overpay on a trade to keep his bird rights and make the most possible income in free agency in 2011. Then when he became a FA, he used the most cards he could (Lakers, Bulls, etc) to get NY to pay the most they had to. In return, he got them like $7M back to improve the cap situation, and requested the NTC to maintain his alternative business in NY.

But he's never been about the Knicks. Duncan was exclusively a Spur. Kobe was a Laker. Dirk is a Maverick. Those guys never bothered to meet other teams when they were free agent.
Melo's not a true Knick. He's always used competition to reach where he wanted, and already said in Feb it wouldn't be weird for him to play for Boston.

Fans who understand the process are a minority sadly, as it's so much easier to cheer for the star scorer, and yell and blame the regime for losses.

Welcome and well said. First post 3 years in the making

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martin
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4/22/2017  7:37 PM
misterearl wrote:Heart and Soul

nixluva wrote:WHO really likes losing??? I don't like being embarrassed by dumb Dolan crap or Phil tweeting. None of that is good or acceptable. However, underneath all of that is some very constructive things. We head into the offseason with some real opportunity to get some positive growth and roster improvement for the long term. No guarantees but there is real opportunity to add the kind of 2 Way Talent we need.

Phil has to eventually get with KP and straighten out that relationship and I trust that he will. The Melo thing is HUGE and it won't be easy. I think all parties are motivated to resolve the issue and that's a start. Melo said he wanted to know what the Knicks direction is and now he knows.

Dolan is the trump of NBA Basketball. You cannot have a foul relationship with ANY of the players who made the Knicks the Knicks. The Charles Oakley saga leaves a nasty mark and sends a loud message to other players in the fraternity. Drama with season ticket holders is foolish and uncalled for. It detracts from the spirit of the franchise. The heart and soul. The things one cannot measure with stats are the things that separate winners from losers. Karma. Feng shui, whatever you wanna call it... it is NOT good.

Think about what that means to the future.

Dolan and Spree made up. What the heck is up with Oak that he would be the one on the outs?

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nixluva
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4/22/2017  7:48 PM
martin wrote:
misterearl wrote:Heart and Soul

nixluva wrote:WHO really likes losing??? I don't like being embarrassed by dumb Dolan crap or Phil tweeting. None of that is good or acceptable. However, underneath all of that is some very constructive things. We head into the offseason with some real opportunity to get some positive growth and roster improvement for the long term. No guarantees but there is real opportunity to add the kind of 2 Way Talent we need.

Phil has to eventually get with KP and straighten out that relationship and I trust that he will. The Melo thing is HUGE and it won't be easy. I think all parties are motivated to resolve the issue and that's a start. Melo said he wanted to know what the Knicks direction is and now he knows.

Dolan is the trump of NBA Basketball. You cannot have a foul relationship with ANY of the players who made the Knicks the Knicks. The Charles Oakley saga leaves a nasty mark and sends a loud message to other players in the fraternity. Drama with season ticket holders is foolish and uncalled for. It detracts from the spirit of the franchise. The heart and soul. The things one cannot measure with stats are the things that separate winners from losers. Karma. Feng shui, whatever you wanna call it... it is NOT good.

Think about what that means to the future.

Dolan and Spree made up. What the heck is up with Oak that he would be the one on the outs?

There are a bunch of former Knicks involved with the organization so it's not even close to accurate to suggest that Dolan has been mistreating former players based on what's been going on with Oak. No one wants to see what happened with Oak and Dolan but it's a 2 way street and it's not all Dolan.

I'm glad Dolan is staying out of Basketball decisions now and is letting Phil finish his deal. This is going to be a critical 2 years and I want to see how Phil and his team handle this opportunity to build this team.

misterearl
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4/22/2017  8:21 PM    LAST EDITED: 4/22/2017  8:38 PM
nixluva wrote:
misterearl wrote:Heart and Soul

nixluva wrote:WHO really likes losing??? I don't like being embarrassed by dumb Dolan crap or Phil tweeting. None of that is good or acceptable. However, underneath all of that is some very constructive things. We head into the offseason with some real opportunity to get some positive growth and roster improvement for the long term. No guarantees but there is real opportunity to add the kind of 2 Way Talent we need.

Phil has to eventually get with KP and straighten out that relationship and I trust that he will. The Melo thing is HUGE and it won't be easy. I think all parties are motivated to resolve the issue and that's a start. Melo said he wanted to know what the Knicks direction is and now he knows.

Dolan is the trump of NBA Basketball. You cannot have a foul relationship with ANY of the players who made the Knicks the Knicks. The Charles Oakley saga leaves a nasty mark and sends a loud message to other players in the fraternity. Drama with season ticket holders is foolish and uncalled for. It detracts from the spirit of the franchise. The heart and soul. The things one cannot measure with stats are the things that separate winners from losers. Karma. Feng shui, whatever you wanna call it... it is NOT good.

Think about what that means to the future.

Don't know about mystical karma but I do know that the Knicks have their 1st rd picks and some quality young talent already on the roster!!! This team is on the verge of putting together a talented new young CORE! Let's see how things work out from here. IMO it's not a bad spot to be in.

nixluva - every team in the NBA has talent. Every team in the NBA is about improving. The NBA is a competitive business where change does not happen in a vacuum. Change is no guarantee of anything except new nameplates and numbers on the backs of jerseys.

The difference is unselfishness, heart and soul. The difference is how players are nourished and guided. On and off the court.

once a knick always a knick
CrushAlot
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4/22/2017  9:01 PM
martin wrote:
misterearl wrote:Heart and Soul

nixluva wrote:WHO really likes losing??? I don't like being embarrassed by dumb Dolan crap or Phil tweeting. None of that is good or acceptable. However, underneath all of that is some very constructive things. We head into the offseason with some real opportunity to get some positive growth and roster improvement for the long term. No guarantees but there is real opportunity to add the kind of 2 Way Talent we need.

Phil has to eventually get with KP and straighten out that relationship and I trust that he will. The Melo thing is HUGE and it won't be easy. I think all parties are motivated to resolve the issue and that's a start. Melo said he wanted to know what the Knicks direction is and now he knows.

Dolan is the trump of NBA Basketball. You cannot have a foul relationship with ANY of the players who made the Knicks the Knicks. The Charles Oakley saga leaves a nasty mark and sends a loud message to other players in the fraternity. Drama with season ticket holders is foolish and uncalled for. It detracts from the spirit of the franchise. The heart and soul. The things one cannot measure with stats are the things that separate winners from losers. Karma. Feng shui, whatever you wanna call it... it is NOT good.

Think about what that means to the future.

Dolan and Spree made up. What the heck is up with Oak that he would be the one on the outs?

I think the incident with Oak was handled really badly. Wasn't Spree given a reprieve to ease tension with the Oak situation?
I've seen scant proof that a majestic aura trumps a sound plan, but maybe that's just because I wasn't looking at Phil Jackson... Seth Rosenthal 2014
CrushAlot
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4/22/2017  9:06 PM    LAST EDITED: 4/22/2017  9:10 PM
GoNyGoNyGo wrote:Is it Phil? Is it Melo? Is it Dolan?

I want the Knicks to be competitors again. It's time to move on from Melo. At that point, we can really judge what Jax is doing and whether he can really run the team.

Melo is a noose hanging around the team's neck.

The noose is the ntc and trade kicker and the guy that put that around the franchise's neck is staying for two more years. Melo is one of three players in the league with a ntc. They are not given out in negotiations.
I've seen scant proof that a majestic aura trumps a sound plan, but maybe that's just because I wasn't looking at Phil Jackson... Seth Rosenthal 2014
nixluva
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4/22/2017  9:12 PM
misterearl wrote:
nixluva wrote:
misterearl wrote:Heart and Soul

nixluva wrote:WHO really likes losing??? I don't like being embarrassed by dumb Dolan crap or Phil tweeting. None of that is good or acceptable. However, underneath all of that is some very constructive things. We head into the offseason with some real opportunity to get some positive growth and roster improvement for the long term. No guarantees but there is real opportunity to add the kind of 2 Way Talent we need.

Phil has to eventually get with KP and straighten out that relationship and I trust that he will. The Melo thing is HUGE and it won't be easy. I think all parties are motivated to resolve the issue and that's a start. Melo said he wanted to know what the Knicks direction is and now he knows.

Dolan is the trump of NBA Basketball. You cannot have a foul relationship with ANY of the players who made the Knicks the Knicks. The Charles Oakley saga leaves a nasty mark and sends a loud message to other players in the fraternity. Drama with season ticket holders is foolish and uncalled for. It detracts from the spirit of the franchise. The heart and soul. The things one cannot measure with stats are the things that separate winners from losers. Karma. Feng shui, whatever you wanna call it... it is NOT good.

Think about what that means to the future.

Don't know about mystical karma but I do know that the Knicks have their 1st rd picks and some quality young talent already on the roster!!! This team is on the verge of putting together a talented new young CORE! Let's see how things work out from here. IMO it's not a bad spot to be in.

nixluva - every team in the NBA has talent. Every team in the NBA is about improving. The NBA is a competitive business where change does not happen in a vacuum. Change is no guarantee of anything except new nameplates and numbers on the backs of jerseys.

The difference is unselfishness, heart and soul. The difference is how players are nourished and guided. On and off the court.

So you don't think the Principles that Phil is looking to instill in our players are the right ones?

Phil is all about the right things and even if you don't like how things have worked out so far that doesn't mean he's on the wrong track. In fact it's a shame so many fans on Twitter and Media types don't really look past the W/L or the much hyped up drama.

I started this thread to KILL THAT NONSENSE! We have to stop treating this like the worst of situations when it's far from that. Stop ignoring the fact that we have a legit opportunity to build a team from this point. We already have some young talent and we'll have a chance to add more. Phil can build a real foundation here.

nixluva
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4/22/2017  9:28 PM
CrushAlot wrote:
GoNyGoNyGo wrote:Is it Phil? Is it Melo? Is it Dolan?

I want the Knicks to be competitors again. It's time to move on from Melo. At that point, we can really judge what Jax is doing and whether he can really run the team.

Melo is a noose hanging around the team's neck.

The noose is the ntc and trade kicker and the guy that put that around the franchise's neck is staying for two more years. Melo is one of three players in the league with a ntc. They are not given out in negotiations.

It is what it is. If a team really wants Melo they can make it work. Lets stop with the feelings of despair and pessimism. There is more possibility for GOOD ahead than you seem to want to allow yourself to accept. Trading Melo is not impossible. Difficult but not impossible. Phil and Melo's team will figure something out.

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4/23/2017  4:15 AM
misterearl wrote:
nixluva wrote:
misterearl wrote:Heart and Soul

nixluva wrote:WHO really likes losing??? I don't like being embarrassed by dumb Dolan crap or Phil tweeting. None of that is good or acceptable. However, underneath all of that is some very constructive things. We head into the offseason with some real opportunity to get some positive growth and roster improvement for the long term. No guarantees but there is real opportunity to add the kind of 2 Way Talent we need.

Phil has to eventually get with KP and straighten out that relationship and I trust that he will. The Melo thing is HUGE and it won't be easy. I think all parties are motivated to resolve the issue and that's a start. Melo said he wanted to know what the Knicks direction is and now he knows.

Dolan is the trump of NBA Basketball. You cannot have a foul relationship with ANY of the players who made the Knicks the Knicks. The Charles Oakley saga leaves a nasty mark and sends a loud message to other players in the fraternity. Drama with season ticket holders is foolish and uncalled for. It detracts from the spirit of the franchise. The heart and soul. The things one cannot measure with stats are the things that separate winners from losers. Karma. Feng shui, whatever you wanna call it... it is NOT good.

Think about what that means to the future.

Don't know about mystical karma but I do know that the Knicks have their 1st rd picks and some quality young talent already on the roster!!! This team is on the verge of putting together a talented new young CORE! Let's see how things work out from here. IMO it's not a bad spot to be in.

nixluva - every team in the NBA has talent. Every team in the NBA is about improving. The NBA is a competitive business where change does not happen in a vacuum. Change is no guarantee of anything except new nameplates and numbers on the backs of jerseys.

The difference is unselfishness, heart and soul. The difference is how players are nourished and guided. On and off the court.

Unselfishness, heart and soul, are exactly what we have been missing since the resignation of Jeff Van Gundy.
And are exactly the purpose of Phil Jackson's hiring.

Phil is here to build a system and play basket-ball the right way, where players can handle the basketball, stop with the ball, pass, use footwork, timing and team play. That's what he did when he was coach, or what Popovich did in San Antonio. He mentioned examples of building identities in NFL, but i'm not an expert in NFL.

Phil acknowledged Melo is holding the ball. I beg his fans to argue.
The Rangers are doing well as far as I know, why wouldn't the Knicks ? Dolan is not devil.

Players who have held the ball in New York since JVG left, and there have been a few, like Stephon Marbury, Al Harrington, Eddy Curry and lately Carmelo Anthony, are just not welcome any more.

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