Author | Thread |
CrushAlot
Posts: 59764 Alba Posts: 0 Joined: 7/25/2003 Member: #452 USA |
8/24/2016 3:23 PM
Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL: I haven't listened yet but I think all of these guys know their stuff. I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
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CrushAlot
Posts: 59764 Alba Posts: 0 Joined: 7/25/2003 Member: #452 USA |
8/24/2016 8:07 PM
EnySpree wrote:I listened to the first few minutes then deleted it. I don't want to hear two douche bags making fun of Knicks fans and calling Derek Rose a d league player. It was brutal. I agree. I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
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CrushAlot
Posts: 59764 Alba Posts: 0 Joined: 7/25/2003 Member: #452 USA |
8/24/2016 8:12 PM
CrushAlot wrote:ONe other thing that really bothered me. I thought Windhorst was more neutral towards the Knicks but he said that he thinks Hornacek comes in as a weakened coach and that the presence of Rambis weakens Hornacek and his ability to implement what he wants. I don't see anyway the Knicks go after Rose and Jennings if they are planning traditional RAmbis triangle. I think those moves were made to help the coach implement his system. I also think Phil/Jeff are simpatico and Phil is going to let Jeff do his thing.EnySpree wrote:I listened to the first few minutes then deleted it. I don't want to hear two douche bags making fun of Knicks fans and calling Derek Rose a d league player. I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
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EnySpree
Posts: 44917 Alba Posts: 138 Joined: 4/18/2003 Member: #397 |
8/24/2016 10:21 PM
I'm just tired of arguing about it. No games have been played yet it's ok to predict doom and gloom and bully knick fans all summer. Season can't stay soon enough
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dk7th
Posts: 30006 Alba Posts: 1 Joined: 5/14/2012 Member: #4228 USA |
8/24/2016 10:41 PM LAST EDITED: 8/24/2016 10:42 PM
EnySpree wrote:I'm just tired of arguing about it. No games have been played yet it's ok to predict doom and gloom and bully knick fans all summer. Season can't stay soon enough there's no arguing with projection models. most had the knicks in the mid-to-upper 30s next season. i see no reason to set expectations any higher, given the number of games that melo, rose, and noah are going to miss. my strategy would be to limit their minutes to around 24-28 minutes a game, use a deep bench while developing players, and have the focus of the team shift to kp6, who should be able to exceed 32 minutes a game. everyone wins in this scenario. the brittle preserve their bodies while serving the phenom, the europeans get some seasoning, thomas gets a deserved utility 6th man role. kp6 34 thomas 32 knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
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CrushAlot
Posts: 59764 Alba Posts: 0 Joined: 7/25/2003 Member: #452 USA |
8/24/2016 11:00 PM
dk7th wrote:Actually there is arguing with projection models. For instance the model totally ignores the impact a new or competent coach can have on a team. Is there anyway Thibs' Wolves finish 3 or 4 spots behind the Nuggets? Also, there was no mention of Jennings in the podcast. I was driving and sometimes miss things but I can't remember anyone mentioning him. If you devalue rose so much you have to look at Jennings.EnySpree wrote:I'm just tired of arguing about it. No games have been played yet it's ok to predict doom and gloom and bully knick fans all summer. Season can't stay soon enough I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
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nixluva
Posts: 56258 Alba Posts: 0 Joined: 10/5/2004 Member: #758 USA |
8/24/2016 11:32 PM
CrushAlot wrote:dk7th wrote:Actually there is arguing with projection models. For instance the model totally ignores the impact a new or competent coach can have on a team. Is there anyway Thibs' Wolves finish 3 or 4 spots behind the Nuggets? Also, there was no mention of Jennings in the podcast. I was driving and sometimes miss things but I can't remember anyone mentioning him. If you devalue rose so much you have to look at Jennings.EnySpree wrote:I'm just tired of arguing about it. No games have been played yet it's ok to predict doom and gloom and bully knick fans all summer. Season can't stay soon enough I was bothered by their take on Hornacek as well. In addition no real talk about Jennings. Overall I didn't like how they never really addressed how the parts fit together in a very logical way in Hornacek's style of ball. The Triangle is not going to be the main thrust of Hornacek's scheme. It's a foundation he can use but he's gonna tweak the hell out of it. He's already said they'll play faster, spread the normal Triangle spacing out to 3pt range, add more PnR action and look to attack the close out aggressively. That's not same ole Triangle!!! As you say Crush, adding Rose and Jennings are not signs of a team looking to run pure Triangle. Plus they are considering Chasson Randle who is also very similar to Rose and Jennings in how he plays. These are scoring guards and not pure PG's. As I mentioned earlier we have Lee, Holiday and maybe Baker in the mix as Catch and Shoot guards, that fit well with Rose and Jennings. Noah will be setting up Melo and KP a lot as well as Rose and Lee. He's not just here to play the role of Lopez. He's not a RoLo replacement. Noah is a great fit in a PnR or Triangle style as he can run PnR perfectly as well as pass from the High or Mid Post. I think the predictions are simply not capable of figuring out all of these variables. This Knicks team is the most well constructed team we've seen in a long time in terms of the skills these players have and how they should fit together in Hornacek's schemes. Most of the media guys have not even come close to recognizing this. |
callmened
Posts: 24448 Alba Posts: 1 Joined: 5/26/2012 Member: #4234 |
8/25/2016 10:53 AM LAST EDITED: 8/25/2016 11:03 AM
i listened and i thought it was good. i like how they systematically went thru each team in the east and asked: are the knicks better..yes or no?
they came up with the 10-13th best team...tied with orlando. and i agree. i see this team winning 37-43 wins. and thats an IMPROVEMENT! injury prone starters, poor defense and weak bench like they said in the pod, i just wish they built around KP instead of melo ian begley....who COVERS the knicks, even admitted maybe 10th at best...and he's the knicks BEAT reporter. he was the most optimistic anyways, ill stop before i get labeled a knicks hater. i bleed blue and orange - just keeping it real #tbt wedding day - tie? check! vest? check! custom made knicks cufflinks? check lol Knicks should be improved: win about 40 games and maybe sneak into the playoffs. Melo, Rose and even Noah will have some nice moments however this team should be about PORZINGUS. the sooner they make him the primary player, the better
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Moonangie
Posts: 24728 Alba Posts: 5 Joined: 7/9/2009 Member: #2788 |
8/25/2016 11:12 AM
callmened wrote:i listened and i thought it was good. i like how they systematically went thru each team in the east and asked: are the knicks better..yes or no? Lookin dapper. Gotta give respect for representing on your wrists at your own wedding. Still, I think you're being a pessimist. As Nix said, there's just no way to account for all the variables with the number of changed aspects to the team (coach, system, players, etc.) The first month will give a lot more insight, and I am stoked to see how it goes. |
callmened
Posts: 24448 Alba Posts: 1 Joined: 5/26/2012 Member: #4234 |
8/25/2016 11:19 AM
Moonangie wrote: thanks man. our wedding anniversary today but yeah i think the knicks will be much much improved. my main concern is the injuries and lack of bench depth. i wish we had gallo still. we shall see though. i hope im wrong Knicks should be improved: win about 40 games and maybe sneak into the playoffs. Melo, Rose and even Noah will have some nice moments however this team should be about PORZINGUS. the sooner they make him the primary player, the better
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ChuckBuck
Posts: 28851 Alba Posts: 11 Joined: 1/3/2012 Member: #3806 USA |
8/25/2016 1:23 PM
Good listen, all their points and the RPM system is spot on. Nothing wrong with being an optimistic homer fan, but computer projections are based on statistics and numbers, so don't hate on them for Math and probability.
The Knicks should take this 34 win RPM projection and put it on their locker room bulletin board. Use it for motivation. Stop bitching about it and ball out. Knicks fans that are expecting contenders have to lower their expectations or you'll be heart broken. They'll be better than 32 wins, but are they that much better to contend in the east? Nope. But if the Knicks main players play at least 75% of the games, KP ascends to All Star status, no distractions, and team gel time is accelerated somehow from the 15-20 games it takes most newly assembled teams....then maybe 40-45 wins and a playoff berth could be in reach. Otherwise all these prognosticators are on the money. |
nixluva
Posts: 56258 Alba Posts: 0 Joined: 10/5/2004 Member: #758 USA |
8/25/2016 2:36 PM LAST EDITED: 8/25/2016 2:36 PM
ChuckBuck wrote:Good listen, all their points and the RPM system is spot on. Nothing wrong with being an optimistic homer fan, but computer projections are based on statistics and numbers, so don't hate on them for Math and probability. 35 wins is not likely "right on the money"! They can guess based on individual stats from last year but the circumstances are so different on this roster. The number of new variables that come with this new group coming together might render a lot of the stats less predictable going forward. For example, Assist numbers may increase given the scoring talent and change in style of play. IMO all these dire predictions based on Rose or even Noah playing poorly are overstated. When you look at how Rose was actually playing Post All Star Break, once he got his vision straight, legs under him and his game back to form, Rose was playing at a very good level offensively. This is a list of Guards after the All Star Break with at least 10 FGA's and 4 assists. Meaning these guards were key performers for their teams.
http://stats.nba.com/league/player/?ls=iref:nba:gnav#!/?Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&PlayerPosition=G&SeasonSegment=Post%20All-Star&sort=FG_PCT&dir=1&CF=GP*G*17%7CFGA*G*10%7CAST*G*4 The key IMO will be Rose being able to not only play more efficiently but also stepping up his defensive effort. If he can do that he'll be supported by his teammates behind him and I think this team can really outperform the predictions. |
crzymdups
Posts: 52018 Alba Posts: 0 Joined: 5/1/2004 Member: #671 USA |
8/25/2016 7:53 PM
This is quite literally the dumbest podcast I've ever listened to. I got about fifteen minutes in. ESPN is a flaming dumpster fire.
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dk7th
Posts: 30006 Alba Posts: 1 Joined: 5/14/2012 Member: #4228 USA |
8/25/2016 8:23 PM
ChuckBuck wrote:Good listen, all their points and the RPM system is spot on. Nothing wrong with being an optimistic homer fan, but computer projections are based on statistics and numbers, so don't hate on them for Math and probability. jackson had a choice to go with youth and a complete rebuild around kp6, or kowtow to the 124 million dollar man and jerk the team into win-now mode. jackson went with the latter, and the result is what we see here. a brittle pg on a one year, another underachieving pg coming back from achilles and on his fourth team, a truly great center who is on a four year deal but is liable to be limited to reserve minutes and will be good for perhaps 60 games. all for the sake of helping melo become relevant in the next 2 seasons. he has one conference finals appearance, maybe he gets a second chance in the next two seasons. lets just hope it isn't at the expense of kp6. factoring for injury the knicks are going to win between 38-43 games. being a fan doesn't require being unrealistic, and projection models that factor in injury history are as reliable as anything out there. i will say that espn's 25 win projection last season was rubbish, and i had the knicks at 34 wins. my prediction exceeded theirs by a healthy 9 games. this year the difference is closer-- knicks should win 38 wins. the knicks don't get to 38 wins drastic measures involving carmelo anthony should take place summer of 2017. just sayin' knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
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jrodmc
Posts: 32927 Alba Posts: 50 Joined: 11/24/2004 Member: #805 USA |
8/25/2016 8:33 PM
crzymdups wrote:This is quite literally the dumbest podcast I've ever listened to. I got about fifteen minutes in. ESPN is a flaming dumpster fire. +1 You can almost gauge the quality of the podcast by the responses from Chuckybooboo and Son of tkf. |
nixluva
Posts: 56258 Alba Posts: 0 Joined: 10/5/2004 Member: #758 USA |
8/25/2016 9:18 PM LAST EDITED: 8/25/2016 9:18 PM
dk7th wrote:ChuckBuck wrote:Good listen, all their points and the RPM system is spot on. Nothing wrong with being an optimistic homer fan, but computer projections are based on statistics and numbers, so don't hate on them for Math and probability. How is it that the Knicks should only win 6 more games than last year? What is it about this new roster that makes them such a sorry team in your opinion? Is it going to be the coaching? The overall guard play? Please explain how the team is basically the same as last year with a bit of better luck health wise cuz last year's team could easily have won 6 more games minus key injuries. So basically your point and that of many of the Analysts is that the team is the same. |
CrushAlot
Posts: 59764 Alba Posts: 0 Joined: 7/25/2003 Member: #452 USA |
8/26/2016 12:31 AM
callmened wrote:i listened and i thought it was good. i like how they systematically went thru each team in the east and asked: are the knicks better..yes or no? Congratulations and happy anniversary. Those cuff links are awesome. I am a little older than you but have a Knick related wedding story. My wife and I got married in August of 92. One of my buddies got me the Ewing Dream Team jersey and gave it to me at the reception. I had the jersey in my hand for quite a few of the wedding pictures. My wife used a sharpie to black out the jersey in some of the pictures. I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
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martin
Posts: 67880 Alba Posts: 108 Joined: 7/24/2001 Member: #2 USA |
8/26/2016 10:00 AM
callmened wrote:#tbt wedding day - tie? check! vest? check! custom made knicks cufflinks? check lol AWESOME Official sponsor of the PURE KNICKS LOVE Program
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