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Video: Jahlil Okafor Gets Into Fight In Boston and Punches a heckler
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Knixkik
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11/29/2015  12:50 PM
WaltLongmire wrote:
crzymdups wrote:Yeesh, the Process.

Philly has made a ton of terrible moves.


They wanted Russell, had the Embiid injury to consider, and a decent prospect in Saric overseas. OK4 was the right pick in many ways, except for the fact that it has seemingly screwed up Noel's development.

They actually ended up drafting what everyone would agree are 3 of the top bigs in the last 3 drafts in OK4, Noel, and Embiid, yet one of them has not yet been in a regular season game, another has been put into a position he is not suited best to play, and now OK4 is showing some character flaws which most of us never would have expected from him.

Underlying all of this, of course, is that there is a good possibility that none of these 3 big men can thrive on the court together.

Have to think that Noel will be trade bait, and they will try to find their PF in the upcoming draft. Embiid has no value for other teams until he actually steps on an NBA court and shows he can play for an extended period of time.


The "process" seems to be tarnishing right before our eyes. Not sure whether I would want Hinkie in control for the upcoming draft...might want someone who actually knows how to mix ingredients and create a team.

Feel bad for the coach and the players, because they play hard.

Porzingis was the right pick for them, and not in retrospect. I really thought at the time of the draft if LA took Russell we were getting okafor because porzingis made more sense for their "process." He was a high-potential player who was advertised as being a couple years away, plus fit better next to embiid and Noels. What good is okafor for them? He was advertised as an nba ready contributor who is a center like their other 2 best prospects. Lower risk but lower ceiling too. He doesn't fit hinkies MO at all. Porzingis did. And as it so happens, not only is porzingis a better longterm fit for them, but he's a better player now too.
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CrushAlot
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11/29/2015  1:05 PM
crzymdups wrote:I wonder if he's acting out - trying to get traded? This seems like a by-product of The Process, rather than a character flaw with Okafor. He went from playing for one of the best basketball coaches in the country and winning a national championship to playing for a rudderless, terrible team with no leadership.
Also, I have to think that Duke is a much more structured, self contained situation. There is a big piece missing from Philly in their attempt to develop young talent. They have a great coach, are reported to have state of the art training and nutrition programs in place, but they are lacking in having vets that can mentor their young players and ignoring the impact that losing at a record rate in professional sports has on players. Okafor should be a cornerstone player for their franchise. The kid is 19 and aside from Landry, the oldest vet is Covington. Covington started last year in the d league and is only 24. Pretty sure Rautins was the same age when the Knicks drafted him. The Sixers needed a plan in place to develop Okafor that included solid vet role models. He is their first high lotto pick coming into the league ready to play/not sit out the year. The ball was dropped here in my opinion.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
knickscity
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11/29/2015  1:17 PM
To be honest, a player who's done nothing but win in his career should bring a non stop winning attitude to the game with him. Statistically they play better with him OFF the court. Sure, pile on the vets. Sometimes it has to also be IN YOU as well.
WaltLongmire
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11/29/2015  3:58 PM
knickscity wrote:
WaltLongmire wrote:
mreinman wrote:
crzymdups wrote:
mreinman wrote:
crzymdups wrote:I wonder if he's acting out - trying to get traded? This seems like a by-product of The Process, rather than a character flaw with Okafor. He went from playing for one of the best basketball coaches in the country and winning a national championship to playing for a rudderless, terrible team with no leadership.

dude you are a really good poster, one of the best here IMHO but please please don't make excuses for this behavior. He could just have his own issues. Blaming it on "the process" is a cop out.

That situation in Philly is dire. They need to re-think what they are doing to these kids by putting them through the embarrassment of being 0-18 or whatever it is now. Look at the difference with how Minnesota is bringing along Towns and Wiggins and Levine - under the tutelage on court of KG, Prince, Andre Miller, etc.

But you are right - this could be a personal issue. It seems he may be fighting alcoholism or depression or something.

Though you do have to wonder if the circumstances triggered the break down. It's a chicken/egg thing with these things. And I say this as someone who has had two very close friends deal with similar demons.

is 3-15 or 4-14 better than 0-18? Not really. Minny has added vets now but what about the other years? Boston too.

I do think that this summer he will add some of the required pieces and spend some money. I think that this will be the last official tank year.

I would so much rather be 0-18 and get Towns than win a handful of stupid games and get Stein/Mudiay/Kaminsky.

Its more than just going to the Sixers... everything was set up perfectly for him to land in LA with the Lakers, his team when he was younger, from everything I've read. He was a big man...the Lakers have been identified with their big men, and here he was on the board for them.

How many times does the perfect situation unfold for a player being drafted in a process where he has not control over who takes him? James and Cavs is one, but in most cases you don't have the perfect pairing.

He clearly has some character issues which are now being exposed under the pressure and situation he seems to be feeling, and I think it has as much to do with where he did not end up as with where he is right now.


The Lakers arent as dumb as some may think. They didnt want a Bynum repeat. The Lakers have just as much history with centers as they do guards. Okafor could not have expected "Lakers or bust". if he did, his mental is more fragile than his defensive game.

Throwing out possibilities...

So let me get this straight...

...You don't think that as a 19yr old kid, given his lifelong rooting interest in the Lakers and the fact that he worked out for them twice and was linked to them at times by many draft sites, he was not upset or even devastated when he was not picked by the Lakers and instead ended up with a team that he had chosen not work out for?

We are not talking about 35 yr old guys getting turned down for a job at another office- we are talking about young kids who are taken by a team who have to wait 5 years to get away from them if they are unhappy.

EnySpree: Can we agree to agree not to mention Phil Jackson and triangle for the rest of our lives?
mreinman
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11/29/2015  4:00 PM
WaltLongmire wrote:
knickscity wrote:
WaltLongmire wrote:
mreinman wrote:
crzymdups wrote:
mreinman wrote:
crzymdups wrote:I wonder if he's acting out - trying to get traded? This seems like a by-product of The Process, rather than a character flaw with Okafor. He went from playing for one of the best basketball coaches in the country and winning a national championship to playing for a rudderless, terrible team with no leadership.

dude you are a really good poster, one of the best here IMHO but please please don't make excuses for this behavior. He could just have his own issues. Blaming it on "the process" is a cop out.

That situation in Philly is dire. They need to re-think what they are doing to these kids by putting them through the embarrassment of being 0-18 or whatever it is now. Look at the difference with how Minnesota is bringing along Towns and Wiggins and Levine - under the tutelage on court of KG, Prince, Andre Miller, etc.

But you are right - this could be a personal issue. It seems he may be fighting alcoholism or depression or something.

Though you do have to wonder if the circumstances triggered the break down. It's a chicken/egg thing with these things. And I say this as someone who has had two very close friends deal with similar demons.

is 3-15 or 4-14 better than 0-18? Not really. Minny has added vets now but what about the other years? Boston too.

I do think that this summer he will add some of the required pieces and spend some money. I think that this will be the last official tank year.

I would so much rather be 0-18 and get Towns than win a handful of stupid games and get Stein/Mudiay/Kaminsky.

Its more than just going to the Sixers... everything was set up perfectly for him to land in LA with the Lakers, his team when he was younger, from everything I've read. He was a big man...the Lakers have been identified with their big men, and here he was on the board for them.

How many times does the perfect situation unfold for a player being drafted in a process where he has not control over who takes him? James and Cavs is one, but in most cases you don't have the perfect pairing.

He clearly has some character issues which are now being exposed under the pressure and situation he seems to be feeling, and I think it has as much to do with where he did not end up as with where he is right now.


The Lakers arent as dumb as some may think. They didnt want a Bynum repeat. The Lakers have just as much history with centers as they do guards. Okafor could not have expected "Lakers or bust". if he did, his mental is more fragile than his defensive game.

Throwing out possibilities...

So let me get this straight...

...You don't think that as a 19yr old kid, given his lifelong rooting interest in the Lakers and the fact that he worked out for them twice and was linked to them at times by many draft sites, he was not upset or even devastated when he was not picked by the Lakers and instead ended up with a team that he had chosen not work out for?

We are not talking about 35 yr old guys getting turned down for a job at another office- we are talking about young kids who are taken by a team who have to wait 5 years to get away from them if they are unhappy.

of course he was. Now suck it up and deal with it (and go make millions anyway)

so here is what phil is thinking ....
dk7th
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11/29/2015  4:29 PM
can anybody explain why the lakers chose russell over okafor? was guard a position of need, and regardless don't you always draft the bigger player all other things being equal?

or did the lakers have some doubts about okafor's character? he is currently ranked towards the bottom of the league in rpm, along with mudiay, by the way.

the more i think about that draft the weirder the lakers choice becomes.

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
dk7th
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11/29/2015  4:31 PM
and then there's this incident which i did not know about. just gets worse and worse.

http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/deep-sixer/Okafor-stopped-for-going-108-MPH-over-bridge.html

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
mreinman
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11/29/2015  4:35 PM
dk7th wrote:can anybody explain why the lakers chose russell over okafor? was guard a position of need, and regardless don't you always draft the bigger player all other things being equal?

or did the lakers have some doubts about okafor's character? he is currently ranked towards the bottom of the league in rpm, along with mudiay, by the way.

the more i think about that draft the weirder the lakers choice becomes.

because this has become a guards league. A guy like Lillard is much more important to a team than Aldridge.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
mreinman
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11/29/2015  4:35 PM
dk7th wrote:and then there's this incident which i did not know about. just gets worse and worse.

http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/deep-sixer/Okafor-stopped-for-going-108-MPH-over-bridge.html

was reported here

so here is what phil is thinking ....
dk7th
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11/29/2015  4:36 PM
mreinman wrote:
dk7th wrote:can anybody explain why the lakers chose russell over okafor? was guard a position of need, and regardless don't you always draft the bigger player all other things being equal?

or did the lakers have some doubts about okafor's character? he is currently ranked towards the bottom of the league in rpm, along with mudiay, by the way.

the more i think about that draft the weirder the lakers choice becomes.

because this has become a guards league. A guy like Lillard is much more important to a team than Aldridge.

by that reasoning the sixers or the knicks should have taken mudiay.

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
dk7th
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11/29/2015  4:36 PM
mreinman wrote:
dk7th wrote:and then there's this incident which i did not know about. just gets worse and worse.

http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/deep-sixer/Okafor-stopped-for-going-108-MPH-over-bridge.html

was reported here

really? when? as soon as it happened?

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
mreinman
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11/29/2015  4:37 PM
dk7th wrote:
mreinman wrote:
dk7th wrote:can anybody explain why the lakers chose russell over okafor? was guard a position of need, and regardless don't you always draft the bigger player all other things being equal?

or did the lakers have some doubts about okafor's character? he is currently ranked towards the bottom of the league in rpm, along with mudiay, by the way.

the more i think about that draft the weirder the lakers choice becomes.

because this has become a guards league. A guy like Lillard is much more important to a team than Aldridge.

by that reasoning the sixers or the knicks should have taken mudiay.

perhaps but mudiay has many issues that may inhibit him from becoming a star.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
mreinman
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11/29/2015  4:37 PM    LAST EDITED: 11/29/2015  4:38 PM
dk7th wrote:
mreinman wrote:
dk7th wrote:and then there's this incident which i did not know about. just gets worse and worse.

http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/deep-sixer/Okafor-stopped-for-going-108-MPH-over-bridge.html

was reported here

really? when? as soon as it happened?

in this thread. I think by walt. Check page 2.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
dk7th
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11/29/2015  4:50 PM
for some of the resident huckleberries, a trip down memory lane....

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=50871&page=8

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
mreinman
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11/29/2015  6:21 PM
dk7th wrote:for some of the resident huckleberries, a trip down memory lane....

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=50871&page=8

seems to be a pattern of who gets it and who does not

so here is what phil is thinking ....
WaltLongmire
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11/29/2015  7:13 PM
EnySpree: Can we agree to agree not to mention Phil Jackson and triangle for the rest of our lives?
CrushAlot
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11/29/2015  7:33 PM
dk7th wrote:for some of the resident huckleberries, a trip down memory lane....

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=50871&page=8


Wow. Can't imagine wanting to say I told you so about something like this. Don't break your arm patting yourself on the back.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
WaltLongmire
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11/29/2015  7:33 PM
Probably one of the people he SHOULD be talking to...

...and it illustrates one of the reasons the late Flip Saunders got it right, and Hinkie did not.

Analytics have there limits when putting together a team, and this kind of stuff really illustrates this.

EnySpree: Can we agree to agree not to mention Phil Jackson and triangle for the rest of our lives?
mreinman
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11/29/2015  7:35 PM
WaltLongmire wrote:Probably one of the people he SHOULD be talking to...

...and it illustrates one of the reasons the late Flip Saunders got it right, and Hinkie did not.

Analytics have there limits when putting together a team, and this kind of stuff really illustrates this.

huh?

so here is what phil is thinking ....
CrushAlot
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11/29/2015  7:41 PM
mreinman wrote:
WaltLongmire wrote:Probably one of the people he SHOULD be talking to...

...and it illustrates one of the reasons the late Flip Saunders got it right, and Hinkie did not.

Analytics have there limits when putting together a team, and this kind of stuff really illustrates this.

huh?

Okafor would be fine if he was hurt and rehabbing his first season or staying in Europe. This is the first time in the Hinkie era that they have gotten a healthy high lottery pick and unlike Flip, the team didn't come up with a complete plan to nurture and mentor him. He maybe making millions but he is still 19. Lack of foresight here on how to create an environment that develops young players is what is missing. Brett Brown is a huge piece of the puzzle but not having vets around to mentor because of tunnel vision regarding the cap, the ability to acquire assets and acquiring assets is hurting the Sixers' biggest asset right now.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
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