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The Case for Emmanuel Mudiay
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Knicks1969
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4/2/2015  10:20 PM
holfresh wrote:It's not like he is lights out in China either..His numbers there are pretty pedestrian for an NBA caliber talent..


And 57% ft shooting??..what's up with that?

Dude is not worthy of a lotto pick. If drafted by the Knicks, he will quickly become the new Shumpert

Thank God Fisher is no longer our coach, now let's get Calderon out of here:)
AUTOADVERT
nixluva
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4/2/2015  11:05 PM
Knicks1969 wrote:
holfresh wrote:It's not like he is lights out in China either..His numbers there are pretty pedestrian for an NBA caliber talent..


And 57% ft shooting??..what's up with that?

Dude is not worthy of a lotto pick. If drafted by the Knicks, he will quickly become the new Shumpert

You guys do realize that he was playing at 18 at the time? He just turned 19 on March 5th! I think we need to relax on the idea of kicking dirt on the kid. He played in like 10 games before he went down. You have to project with young prospects like him. The pros who do this for a living are all pretty high on him. Top NCAA coaches wanted the kid. So in terms of making a preliminary judgement on the kid i'm gonna go with those individuals over you guys assessment of the kid's potential.

There are no guarantees when it comes to prospects but this kid is being listed as a top draft prospect for a reason. We'll see how he looks at the combine and in workouts. It'll be interesting to see how he compares to the other top guards.

Knicks1969
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4/2/2015  11:24 PM    LAST EDITED: 4/2/2015  11:24 PM
I don't care what any pro scouts can tell me about that kid; he aint better then Russell nor Winslow. Those same pro scouts said great things about Kwame Brown, Eddie Curry, millicic, etc
Thank God Fisher is no longer our coach, now let's get Calderon out of here:)
nixluva
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4/2/2015  11:30 PM
Knicks1969 wrote:I don't care what any pro scouts can tell me about that kid; he aint better then Russell nor Winslow. Those same pro scouts said great things about Kwame Brown, Eddie Curry, millicic, etc

That's right Cherry pick some flops rather than talk about how much more often they're right. Still there are no guarantees with any of the kids we're looking at in college. Things are completely different at the next level. Mudiay is a legit prospect and has as much of a chance as any of the other top players to be a good NBA player. I love Winslow and have no problem with Russell either. I just see Mudiay as a different kind of player and one who could provide much needed creativity and the ability to break a defense down and score of hit his teammates for open shots. He's also athletic enough to be a good defender as well.

Knicks1969
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4/2/2015  11:35 PM
nixluva wrote:
Knicks1969 wrote:I don't care what any pro scouts can tell me about that kid; he aint better then Russell nor Winslow. Those same pro scouts said great things about Kwame Brown, Eddie Curry, millicic, etc

That's right Cherry pick some flops rather than talk about how much more often they're right. Still there are no guarantees with any of the kids we're looking at in college. Things are completely different at the next level. Mudiay is a legit prospect and has as much of a chance as any of the other top players to be a good NBA player. I love Winslow and have no problem with Russell either. I just see Mudiay as a different kind of player and one who could provide much needed creativity and the ability to break a defense down and score of hit his teammates for open shots. He's also athletic enough to be a good defender as well.

No one knows deedly crop about this kid. I would not throw away a lottery pick on that dude. Again, he is worth a risk, but not with a top 5 pick

Thank God Fisher is no longer our coach, now let's get Calderon out of here:)
blkexec
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4/3/2015  12:02 AM
Knicks1969 wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Knicks1969 wrote:I don't care what any pro scouts can tell me about that kid; he aint better then Russell nor Winslow. Those same pro scouts said great things about Kwame Brown, Eddie Curry, millicic, etc

That's right Cherry pick some flops rather than talk about how much more often they're right. Still there are no guarantees with any of the kids we're looking at in college. Things are completely different at the next level. Mudiay is a legit prospect and has as much of a chance as any of the other top players to be a good NBA player. I love Winslow and have no problem with Russell either. I just see Mudiay as a different kind of player and one who could provide much needed creativity and the ability to break a defense down and score of hit his teammates for open shots. He's also athletic enough to be a good defender as well.

No one knows deedly crop about this kid. I would not throw away a lottery pick on that dude. Again, he is worth a risk, but not with a top 5 pick

To Nix point, nobody knew about Kobe, Garnet, Tmac, Moses Malone, etc....These guys came out of HS. And if Mudiay came into the league back then, he would've been a top 3 pick....

This is why I said Phil would simply trade the top pick, IF he thinks Mudiay is on the same level with higher potential. Because he will be able to get Mudiay and a young big for 1 pick. But it depends on Phils ranking and scouting. We have some of the best overseas scouts in the NBA, so if he's legit, I'm sure they are all over him. Using Towns and OK4 as a cover up.

With this draft, you never know because there is no clear cut lottery pick. Kaminsky could be the next Larry Bird for all we know. Russell could be a Steph Curry type....Mudiay aka John Wall. It's going to be a fun and exciting off season for fans....with all the pressure on Phil.

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TPercy
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4/3/2015  9:49 AM
Mudiay decison making is Russell Westbrook like.
To be honest, you could probably stick the current Delon Wright in china and he would be lighting it up.
The Future is Bright!
Hector
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4/3/2015  10:05 AM
Mudiay looks pretty bad ass but the one thing that gets me nervous is - remember OJ Mayo coming out?
He was supposed to be like the next Jordan or something. He hasn't panned out too well.

Shit like that gets me nervous.

[quote="jrodmc"] Melo is stupid. [/quote]
nixluva
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4/3/2015  10:43 AM
Hector wrote:Mudiay looks pretty bad ass but the one thing that gets me nervous is - remember OJ Mayo coming out?
He was supposed to be like the next Jordan or something. He hasn't panned out too well.

Shit like that gets me nervous.


Every player is a different case. We can't let that cloud our judgment. When we get to the Combine and Workouts that will help to tell more of the story of what he is in comparison to the guys who went to college. This is all just a theory of what I think could be a consideration by Phil about what this team needs. We need that elite perimeter talent to give this team the same kind of X Factor that he's had on his other teams. I just think Mudiay is the closest thing to that kind of player.
Vmart
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4/3/2015  11:03 AM
nixluva wrote:
Hector wrote:Mudiay looks pretty bad ass but the one thing that gets me nervous is - remember OJ Mayo coming out?
He was supposed to be like the next Jordan or something. He hasn't panned out too well.

Shit like that gets me nervous.


Every player is a different case. We can't let that cloud our judgment. When we get to the Combine and Workouts that will help to tell more of the story of what he is in comparison to the guys who went to college. This is all just a theory of what I think could be a consideration by Phil about what this team needs. We need that elite perimeter talent to give this team the same kind of X Factor that he's had on his other teams. I just think Mudiay is the closest thing to that kind of player.

I agree with you on this. A dynamic PG/SG is exactly what needs to be considered. It all depends on where the Knicks select. If the Knicks select number 1 overall I can see only one player being considered and that is Ok4. Between Towns and Mudiay will be a tough choice but I'm leaning towards Mudiay simply because Phils system always had that dynamic PG/SG that do everything type player. I'm looking at Phils past teams and only one time he had a dominant center in Shaq the rest of the time it was center by committee or an average C at best. If the Knicks can get Mudiay and get Kanter, Gasol or Monroe.

nixluva
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4/3/2015  11:27 AM
Vmart wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Hector wrote:Mudiay looks pretty bad ass but the one thing that gets me nervous is - remember OJ Mayo coming out?
He was supposed to be like the next Jordan or something. He hasn't panned out too well.

Shit like that gets me nervous.


Every player is a different case. We can't let that cloud our judgment. When we get to the Combine and Workouts that will help to tell more of the story of what he is in comparison to the guys who went to college. This is all just a theory of what I think could be a consideration by Phil about what this team needs. We need that elite perimeter talent to give this team the same kind of X Factor that he's had on his other teams. I just think Mudiay is the closest thing to that kind of player.

I agree with you on this. A dynamic PG/SG is exactly what needs to be considered. It all depends on where the Knicks select. If the Knicks select number 1 overall I can see only one player being considered and that is Ok4. Between Towns and Mudiay will be a tough choice but I'm leaning towards Mudiay simply because Phils system always had that dynamic PG/SG that do everything type player. I'm looking at Phils past teams and only one time he had a dominant center in Shaq the rest of the time it was center by committee or an average C at best. If the Knicks can get Mudiay and get Kanter, Gasol or Monroe.

That is exactly my thinking. We don't have that dynamic Guard who can breakdown defenses and pretty much get whatever he wants. A guy that is a one man fast break and would change the pace we play at. You could see how some of our young prospects could run with him on the Wings. Mudiay, Early, Thanasis etc. could run and finish with ease.

Vmart
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4/3/2015  11:54 AM
nixluva wrote:
Vmart wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Hector wrote:Mudiay looks pretty bad ass but the one thing that gets me nervous is - remember OJ Mayo coming out?
He was supposed to be like the next Jordan or something. He hasn't panned out too well.

Shit like that gets me nervous.


Every player is a different case. We can't let that cloud our judgment. When we get to the Combine and Workouts that will help to tell more of the story of what he is in comparison to the guys who went to college. This is all just a theory of what I think could be a consideration by Phil about what this team needs. We need that elite perimeter talent to give this team the same kind of X Factor that he's had on his other teams. I just think Mudiay is the closest thing to that kind of player.

I agree with you on this. A dynamic PG/SG is exactly what needs to be considered. It all depends on where the Knicks select. If the Knicks select number 1 overall I can see only one player being considered and that is Ok4. Between Towns and Mudiay will be a tough choice but I'm leaning towards Mudiay simply because Phils system always had that dynamic PG/SG that do everything type player. I'm looking at Phils past teams and only one time he had a dominant center in Shaq the rest of the time it was center by committee or an average C at best. If the Knicks can get Mudiay and get Kanter, Gasol or Monroe.

That is exactly my thinking. We don't have that dynamic Guard who can breakdown defenses and pretty much get whatever he wants. A guy that is a one man fast break and would change the pace we play at. You could see how some of our young prospects could run with him on the Wings. Mudiay, Early, Thanasis etc. could run and finish with ease.

You could add THJ to the fast break.

nixluva
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4/3/2015  12:24 PM
Vmart wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Vmart wrote:
nixluva wrote:
Hector wrote:Mudiay looks pretty bad ass but the one thing that gets me nervous is - remember OJ Mayo coming out?
He was supposed to be like the next Jordan or something. He hasn't panned out too well.

Shit like that gets me nervous.


Every player is a different case. We can't let that cloud our judgment. When we get to the Combine and Workouts that will help to tell more of the story of what he is in comparison to the guys who went to college. This is all just a theory of what I think could be a consideration by Phil about what this team needs. We need that elite perimeter talent to give this team the same kind of X Factor that he's had on his other teams. I just think Mudiay is the closest thing to that kind of player.

I agree with you on this. A dynamic PG/SG is exactly what needs to be considered. It all depends on where the Knicks select. If the Knicks select number 1 overall I can see only one player being considered and that is Ok4. Between Towns and Mudiay will be a tough choice but I'm leaning towards Mudiay simply because Phils system always had that dynamic PG/SG that do everything type player. I'm looking at Phils past teams and only one time he had a dominant center in Shaq the rest of the time it was center by committee or an average C at best. If the Knicks can get Mudiay and get Kanter, Gasol or Monroe.

That is exactly my thinking. We don't have that dynamic Guard who can breakdown defenses and pretty much get whatever he wants. A guy that is a one man fast break and would change the pace we play at. You could see how some of our young prospects could run with him on the Wings. Mudiay, Early, Thanasis etc. could run and finish with ease.

You could add THJ to the fast break.


He was in the etc. But really there is an easy shift coming with the draft and free agency this summer. We already have young prospects who are athletic and you can see how this team can go from plodding to rather fast and explosive with just a few more additions. A guard who is a terror on the break would be an addition that makes a huge impact.
knicks1248
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4/3/2015  12:32 PM
Knicks1969 wrote:
holfresh wrote:It's not like he is lights out in China either..His numbers there are pretty pedestrian for an NBA caliber talent..


And 57% ft shooting??..what's up with that?

Dude is not worthy of a lotto pick. If drafted by the Knicks, he will quickly become the new Shumpert

this you tube clip showed zero defense of him, which means he doesn't play any at all. I remember when we drafted tony douglas, he had a 5 minute youtube clip, in that clip he failed to make a pass to anyone. I had never seen a highlight reel of a pg that didnt make any passes, low and behold, he turned out to be an awful passer to say the laest

ES
nixluva
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4/3/2015  2:33 PM
knicks1248 wrote:
Knicks1969 wrote:
holfresh wrote:It's not like he is lights out in China either..His numbers there are pretty pedestrian for an NBA caliber talent..


And 57% ft shooting??..what's up with that?

Dude is not worthy of a lotto pick. If drafted by the Knicks, he will quickly become the new Shumpert

this you tube clip showed zero defense of him, which means he doesn't play any at all. I remember when we drafted tony douglas, he had a 5 minute youtube clip, in that clip he failed to make a pass to anyone. I had never seen a highlight reel of a pg that didnt make any passes, low and behold, he turned out to be an awful passer to say the laest

Mudiay may not be a good defender, I don't know, but he's got long arms, quick hands and quick feet so he's got the components of what he would need to be a decent defender. Scouting suggests he's OK defensively. This is all just theory at this point. I would guess that the Knicks scouts have a better handle on what his actual ability is. If they're at pick 4 and he's the guy waiting there I wonder if they go for it or go with a kid like Winslow?

blkexec
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4/3/2015  3:52 PM
nixluva wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Knicks1969 wrote:
holfresh wrote:It's not like he is lights out in China either..His numbers there are pretty pedestrian for an NBA caliber talent..


And 57% ft shooting??..what's up with that?

Dude is not worthy of a lotto pick. If drafted by the Knicks, he will quickly become the new Shumpert

this you tube clip showed zero defense of him, which means he doesn't play any at all. I remember when we drafted tony douglas, he had a 5 minute youtube clip, in that clip he failed to make a pass to anyone. I had never seen a highlight reel of a pg that didnt make any passes, low and behold, he turned out to be an awful passer to say the laest

Mudiay may not be a good defender, I don't know, but he's got long arms, quick hands and quick feet so he's got the components of what he would need to be a decent defender. Scouting suggests he's OK defensively. This is all just theory at this point. I would guess that the Knicks scouts have a better handle on what his actual ability is. If they're at pick 4 and he's the guy waiting there I wonder if they go for it or go with a kid like Winslow?

The question is what happens if Gragic is a legit option free agent pickup? Then I would pick a solid big and solidify those two positions (PG / Center). If you pick Mudiay, then what big will be equivalent to Towns on defense or OK4 on offense, as a free agent? At least Dragic can also get anywhere he wants on the floor, with veteran nba skills that exceeds Mudiay....

Option 1: Dragic + Towns / OK4
Option 2: Mudiay + Monroe? / Kanter?

Remember, Dragic is looking for a team he can call his own. In Miami, he will always play as Wades shadow. In NY, there is no competition at the PG position. If we get Mudiay, we will continue to have the same rim protection issues as we've had for years. If we pick Towns, we have an option to get Dragic and possibly a tall big for cheap and have a twin tower offense and defense, with a dynamic guard.

I think it's up to Dragic, if he's willing to except a new contract. Because outside of him, there aren't too many dynamic guards to choose from, except for Mudiay and Russell. BUT, there are plenty of bigs...Just not on the same defensive level and potential as Towns / OK4.

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Vmart
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4/3/2015  5:24 PM
blkexec wrote:
nixluva wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Knicks1969 wrote:
holfresh wrote:It's not like he is lights out in China either..His numbers there are pretty pedestrian for an NBA caliber talent..


And 57% ft shooting??..what's up with that?

Dude is not worthy of a lotto pick. If drafted by the Knicks, he will quickly become the new Shumpert

this you tube clip showed zero defense of him, which means he doesn't play any at all. I remember when we drafted tony douglas, he had a 5 minute youtube clip, in that clip he failed to make a pass to anyone. I had never seen a highlight reel of a pg that didnt make any passes, low and behold, he turned out to be an awful passer to say the laest

Mudiay may not be a good defender, I don't know, but he's got long arms, quick hands and quick feet so he's got the components of what he would need to be a decent defender. Scouting suggests he's OK defensively. This is all just theory at this point. I would guess that the Knicks scouts have a better handle on what his actual ability is. If they're at pick 4 and he's the guy waiting there I wonder if they go for it or go with a kid like Winslow?

The question is what happens if Gragic is a legit option free agent pickup? Then I would pick a solid big and solidify those two positions (PG / Center). If you pick Mudiay, then what big will be equivalent to Towns on defense or OK4 on offense, as a free agent? At least Dragic can also get anywhere he wants on the floor, with veteran nba skills that exceeds Mudiay....

Option 1: Dragic + Towns / OK4
Option 2: Mudiay + Monroe? / Kanter?

Remember, Dragic is looking for a team he can call his own. In Miami, he will always play as Wades shadow. In NY, there is no competition at the PG position. If we get Mudiay, we will continue to have the same rim protection issues as we've had for years. If we pick Towns, we have an option to get Dragic and possibly a tall big for cheap and have a twin tower offense and defense, with a dynamic guard.

I think it's up to Dragic, if he's willing to except a new contract. Because outside of him, there aren't too many dynamic guards to choose from, except for Mudiay and Russell. BUT, there are plenty of bigs...Just not on the same defensive level and potential as Towns / OK4.

I was thinking the same but Riley won't let Dragic get away he can't afford to lose two straight FA in back to back years he will over pay to keep Dragic. I like Dragic but Shved might make signing Dragic redundant as Shved might come at much cheaper price. The reason behind Mudiay for me is he can be that hybrid pg/sg that Kobe and MJ were. Now I'm not saying Mudiay is Kobe or MJ but he possesses the skills that translate to those type of players and what better hands would those skills be under the watch of the man who coached them.

This FA is full if Bigs that are ideal. I think Briggs has exhausted the possibilities of all the Bigs for the Knicks.

nixluva
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4/3/2015  9:57 PM
Vmart wrote:
blkexec wrote:
nixluva wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Knicks1969 wrote:
holfresh wrote:It's not like he is lights out in China either..His numbers there are pretty pedestrian for an NBA caliber talent..


And 57% ft shooting??..what's up with that?

Dude is not worthy of a lotto pick. If drafted by the Knicks, he will quickly become the new Shumpert

this you tube clip showed zero defense of him, which means he doesn't play any at all. I remember when we drafted tony douglas, he had a 5 minute youtube clip, in that clip he failed to make a pass to anyone. I had never seen a highlight reel of a pg that didnt make any passes, low and behold, he turned out to be an awful passer to say the laest

Mudiay may not be a good defender, I don't know, but he's got long arms, quick hands and quick feet so he's got the components of what he would need to be a decent defender. Scouting suggests he's OK defensively. This is all just theory at this point. I would guess that the Knicks scouts have a better handle on what his actual ability is. If they're at pick 4 and he's the guy waiting there I wonder if they go for it or go with a kid like Winslow?

The question is what happens if Gragic is a legit option free agent pickup? Then I would pick a solid big and solidify those two positions (PG / Center). If you pick Mudiay, then what big will be equivalent to Towns on defense or OK4 on offense, as a free agent? At least Dragic can also get anywhere he wants on the floor, with veteran nba skills that exceeds Mudiay....

Option 1: Dragic + Towns / OK4
Option 2: Mudiay + Monroe? / Kanter?

Remember, Dragic is looking for a team he can call his own. In Miami, he will always play as Wades shadow. In NY, there is no competition at the PG position. If we get Mudiay, we will continue to have the same rim protection issues as we've had for years. If we pick Towns, we have an option to get Dragic and possibly a tall big for cheap and have a twin tower offense and defense, with a dynamic guard.

I think it's up to Dragic, if he's willing to except a new contract. Because outside of him, there aren't too many dynamic guards to choose from, except for Mudiay and Russell. BUT, there are plenty of bigs...Just not on the same defensive level and potential as Towns / OK4.

I was thinking the same but Riley won't let Dragic get away he can't afford to lose two straight FA in back to back years he will over pay to keep Dragic. I like Dragic but Shved might make signing Dragic redundant as Shved might come at much cheaper price. The reason behind Mudiay for me is he can be that hybrid pg/sg that Kobe and MJ were. Now I'm not saying Mudiay is Kobe or MJ but he possesses the skills that translate to those type of players and what better hands would those skills be under the watch of the man who coached them.

This FA is full if Bigs that are ideal. I think Briggs has exhausted the possibilities of all the Bigs for the Knicks.


I don't know how Phil and his scouts feel about Mudiay, but I do think that he could actually give this team an X Factor on offense that we need. As good of a pair of prospects as OK4 and Towns are there are Free Agent bigs we can get who would provide much of the production either of them would give us right now without the risk of a bust or waiting on them to fully mature. Phil has some tough decisions to make. He can't afford to miss with this pick. I like the idea of OK4 or Towns but also think a kid like Mudiay could eventually be a star guard who can be that creative threat you need to make something out of nothing and to be that break down guard against tough D.
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4/6/2015  8:40 PM    LAST EDITED: 4/6/2015  8:41 PM
http://hoopshype.com/columns/david-nurse/emmanuel-mudiay-made-in-china

"For Mudiay (now at the old age of 19) to already possess a high-level basketball IQ, natural PG feel for the game, and the want and desire to get his teammates involved first and foremost, that in itself is very rare. It’s the unteachable ability the great ones have to make everyone around them better. What I call the ‘LeBron James Factor.’ In no way am I comparing him to LBJ, but don’t sleep on Mudiay and his basketball savvy. You might not think his choice to bolt to China was smart, but on court, he’s as smart as you will find in a young, high potential-packed point guard."

Q: What is the difference between a Knicks fan and a baby? A: The baby will stop whining after awhile.
blkexec
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4/6/2015  8:44 PM    LAST EDITED: 4/6/2015  8:44 PM
blkexec wrote:http://hoopshype.com/columns/david-nurse/emmanuel-mudiay-made-in-china

"For Mudiay (now at the old age of 19) to already possess a high-level basketball IQ, natural PG feel for the game, and the want and desire to get his teammates involved first and foremost, that in itself is very rare. It’s the unteachable ability the great ones have to make everyone around them better. What I call the ‘LeBron James Factor.’ In no way am I comparing him to LBJ, but don’t sleep on Mudiay and his basketball savvy. You might not think his choice to bolt to China was smart, but on court, he’s as smart as you will find in a young, high potential-packed point guard."

The more I read about him, the more I want him on our team. He's another sleeper pickup, if we could do a 1 for 2 trade. Philly is not planning to just keep selecting draft picks every year. Eventually they or Boston (anybody with a lot of draft picks) will try and package their picks for a franchise player. OK4 is a potential franchise player that may not be high on Phils list, but could be high on everybody else's list.

Q: What is the difference between a Knicks fan and a baby? A: The baby will stop whining after awhile.
The Case for Emmanuel Mudiay

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