nixluva wrote:This metric doesn't take into account the effect playing in the Triangle can have on his production. Melo is just about the most perfect player for the Triangle. He's able to post, shoot from anywhere on the floor and is quick enough to get around defenders. His array of skills offensively make him a nightmare in this system. I just don't think people realize how his skills fit this system to a tee.

Melo in the Pinch post will be dominant. Melo in the low post with cutters taking defenders away is murder. He's a dangerous 3pt shooter so that is yet another option. Most of all he'll score easier and more efficiently. He won't have to get killed so much with the way sets are run in the Triangle. Also he'll have help with all the off ball motion. It's not gonna be like we've played in the past.

i hope your assertions and declarations prove prescient. i have my doubts... because looking ahead to summer of 2015 i think the knicks will have a tough time bringing in big time players if they fail to make an impression in the playoffs of 2015-- assuming they make the playoffs.

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:This metric doesn't take into account the effect playing in the Triangle can have on his production. Melo is just about the most perfect player for the Triangle. He's able to post, shoot from anywhere on the floor and is quick enough to get around defenders. His array of skills offensively make him a nightmare in this system. I just don't think people realize how his skills fit this system to a tee.

Melo in the Pinch post will be dominant. Melo in the low post with cutters taking defenders away is murder. He's a dangerous 3pt shooter so that is yet another option. Most of all he'll score easier and more efficiently. He won't have to get killed so much with the way sets are run in the Triangle. Also he'll have help with all the off ball motion. It's not gonna be like we've played in the past.

i hope your assertions and declarations prove prescient. i have my doubts... because looking ahead to summer of 2015 i think the knicks will have a tough time bringing in big time players if they fail to make an impression in the playoffs of 2015-- assuming they make the playoffs.

funny... you start your posts with things like Melo isnt elite or he's not coachable. Then make comments on folks "assertions" and "declarations."

Knicks will be very good scoring the ball. I will be curious to see who starts and what the team concept is to defend.

i make my assertions and declarations based on the evidence gathered from the past. nixluva is making assertions and declarations on an unknown future. huge difference.

the knicks, based on their personnel and their individual and collective history, are going to be a below average defensive team. they will have to be surprisingly efficient on offense to make up for that.

dk7th wrote:

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:This metric doesn't take into account the effect playing in the Triangle can have on his production. Melo is just about the most perfect player for the Triangle. He's able to post, shoot from anywhere on the floor and is quick enough to get around defenders. His array of skills offensively make him a nightmare in this system. I just don't think people realize how his skills fit this system to a tee.

Melo in the Pinch post will be dominant. Melo in the low post with cutters taking defenders away is murder. He's a dangerous 3pt shooter so that is yet another option. Most of all he'll score easier and more efficiently. He won't have to get killed so much with the way sets are run in the Triangle. Also he'll have help with all the off ball motion. It's not gonna be like we've played in the past.

i hope your assertions and declarations prove prescient. i have my doubts... because looking ahead to summer of 2015 i think the knicks will have a tough time bringing in big time players if they fail to make an impression in the playoffs of 2015-- assuming they make the playoffs.

funny... you start your posts with things like Melo isnt elite or he's not coachable. Then make comments on folks "assertions" and "declarations."

Knicks will be very good scoring the ball. I will be curious to see who starts and what the team concept is to defend.

i make my assertions and declarations based on the evidence gathered from the past. nixluva is making assertions and declarations on an unknown future. huge difference.

the knicks, based on their personnel and their individual and collective history, are going to be a below average defensive team. they will have to be surprisingly efficient on offense to make up for that.

FACT: Melo is an elite scorer
FACT: Melo has no structural damage to his shoulders, has never had surgery and after rehab (thats just strengthening exercises if you have never done them) won player of the month.

But thats cool. Dont let reality get in the way of your facts based on your opinions.

smackeddog wrote:like you need a metric for this type of thing! The contract will bite us towards the second half of it, we all know this. However most contracts these days are bad, its tough building a team, when there's always some moron team willing to up the price on any given player.

It comes down to good management. Are you paying him market? Are you bidding against yourself? Can you afford to lose him? Can you replace him? You factor all those things and the Knicks resigning him is fine. Hey... I wish it was Durant or Lebron but it was Melo we resigned. Anything can happen, and its not always bad.

nixluva wrote:The contract being bad or not depends on this idea that Melo will decline. I actually think Melo will not significantly decline. He was NEVER an athletic player so his game is not dependent on him being able to jump over guys. He's highly skilled and he'll remain effective for a good while IMO. His jumper will be good when he's 40!!! He's got big strong legs that can quickly move his body where it needs to go. I think Melo will be one of those guys that can still play at a high level even into his late 30's. The contract is not going to be an issue based on his production.

He has at least 4 to 5 more all star appearances starts, baring injury.

Papabear wrote:Papabear Says

Nalod Why did you put up this thread? It's like candy land for D7th and TK LOL.
My take is this, there was not any team in the NBA who would not give Melo 20 million if they had to give and Melo wanted to come to them. I think that Phil knows how to build around Melo and Melo and the Knicks will be ok. Enough of this hate sh!t. If you don't like the man find another team. It not healthy to have all of this hate in your heart. I mean 24/7 when do they work? This is Phils dream and he knows that if he wins a chip here in New York they will build a statue of him and Melo.

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:This metric doesn't take into account the effect playing in the Triangle can have on his production. Melo is just about the most perfect player for the Triangle. He's able to post, shoot from anywhere on the floor and is quick enough to get around defenders. His array of skills offensively make him a nightmare in this system. I just don't think people realize how his skills fit this system to a tee.

Melo in the Pinch post will be dominant. Melo in the low post with cutters taking defenders away is murder. He's a dangerous 3pt shooter so that is yet another option. Most of all he'll score easier and more efficiently. He won't have to get killed so much with the way sets are run in the Triangle. Also he'll have help with all the off ball motion. It's not gonna be like we've played in the past.

i hope your assertions and declarations prove prescient. i have my doubts... because looking ahead to summer of 2015 i think the knicks will have a tough time bringing in big time players if they fail to make an impression in the playoffs of 2015-- assuming they make the playoffs.

funny... you start your posts with things like Melo isnt elite or he's not coachable. Then make comments on folks "assertions" and "declarations."

Knicks will be very good scoring the ball. I will be curious to see who starts and what the team concept is to defend.

i make my assertions and declarations based on the evidence gathered from the past. nixluva is making assertions and declarations on an unknown future. huge difference.

the knicks, based on their personnel and their individual and collective history, are going to be a below average defensive team. they will have to be surprisingly efficient on offense to make up for that.

by gathering evidence you mean listening to tfk? OK... sounds good.

FACT: Melo is an elite scorer
FACT: Melo has no structural damage to his shoulders, has never had surgery and after rehab (thats just strengthening exercises if you have never done them) won player of the month.

But thats cool. Dont let reality get in the way of your facts based on your opinions.

you are entitled to your opinion but not entitled to your own facts. so repeating opinion as though it is fact does not make it any more true, although josef goebbels used this technique during the nazi era-- it's called "propaganda."

so if you want your words to carry any weight instead of coming across as a blathering boor, you should at least make some sort of attempt to back up your claims of his being an "elite scorer" with some sort of research, research that has some persuasive math behind it.

i have gone to great lengths and with patience to point out that melo's status as a scorer comes with some very sobering statistics behind it, statistics that support the reasons why he has fallen short so much of his career.

and this leaves out the further sobering considerations of how sub-standard his defense has been bis entire career.

this thread is about value. is his contract a good value? you yourself have admitted that he is overpaid.

so now what on earth can you say to persuade others that he isn't?

here come the <crickets> and <bullfrogs>

CrushAlot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:This metric doesn't take into account the effect playing in the Triangle can have on his production. Melo is just about the most perfect player for the Triangle. He's able to post, shoot from anywhere on the floor and is quick enough to get around defenders. His array of skills offensively make him a nightmare in this system. I just don't think people realize how his skills fit this system to a tee.

Melo in the Pinch post will be dominant. Melo in the low post with cutters taking defenders away is murder. He's a dangerous 3pt shooter so that is yet another option. Most of all he'll score easier and more efficiently. He won't have to get killed so much with the way sets are run in the Triangle. Also he'll have help with all the off ball motion. It's not gonna be like we've played in the past.

i hope your assertions and declarations prove prescient. i have my doubts... because looking ahead to summer of 2015 i think the knicks will have a tough time bringing in big time players if they fail to make an impression in the playoffs of 2015-- assuming they make the playoffs.

funny... you start your posts with things like Melo isnt elite or he's not coachable. Then make comments on folks "assertions" and "declarations."

Knicks will be very good scoring the ball. I will be curious to see who starts and what the team concept is to defend.

i make my assertions and declarations based on the evidence gathered from the past. nixluva is making assertions and declarations on an unknown future. huge difference.

the knicks, based on their personnel and their individual and collective history, are going to be a below average defensive team. they will have to be surprisingly efficient on offense to make up for that.

by gathering evidence you mean listening to tfk? OK... sounds good.

FACT: Melo is an elite scorer
FACT: Melo has no structural damage to his shoulders, has never had surgery and after rehab (thats just strengthening exercises if you have never done them) won player of the month.

But thats cool. Dont let reality get in the way of your facts based on your opinions.

you are entitled to your opinion but not entitled to your own facts. so repeating opinion as though it is fact does not make it any more true, although josef goebbels used this technique during the nazi era-- it's called "propaganda."

so if you want your words to carry any weight instead of coming across as a blathering boor, you should at least make some sort of attempt to back up your claims of his being an "elite scorer" with some sort of research, research that has some persuasive math behind it.

i have gone to great lengths and with patience to point out that melo's status as a scorer comes with some very sobering statistics behind it, statistics that support the reasons why he has fallen short so much of his career.

and this leaves out the further sobering considerations of how sub-standard his defense has been bis entire career.

this thread is about value. is his contract a good value? you yourself have admitted that he is overpaid.

so now what on earth can you say to persuade others that he isn't?

here come the <crickets> and <bullfrogs>

Great lengths? Are you talking about providing links to two articles?

not in this thread, but historically over the last two+ seasons.

and elite scorers are not ranked 41st in points per shot in the nba. 1.29 points per shot is not going to cut it.

and ranking 6th among small forwards is also not going to cut it. understand that if you want to denigrate paul george then please tell me why is it that carmelo anthony at 1.29 pps is only only one one-hundredth ahead of paul george at 1.28 pps?

It seems to me that Paul George is not a good roll model. Making babies, screwing his centers girl friend. That child support is going to weigh heavy on him this season. His girlfriend broke up with him. Now for Melo his 1.29 pp is going to get better and he respects woman and his friends woman.

Silverfuel wrote:Phil Jackson signs Melo to a contract that is 6 million more than what Bosh is making over 5 years so its a little over a million a year. That sounds like a good deal to me. All you guys that don't like Melo were so excited when it sounded like Phil was going to let Melo walk. All you guys were so high on Phil then. All those draft picks for Felton and Chandler made you happy. But he signs Melo and all of a sudden he sucks and you believe you know more basketball than someone that has 11 rings? Because what, Melo is not Lebron? He is the best Knick since Ewing and one of the top 3 Knicks I have seen play. Phil knows we had to keep Melo so he did what needed to be done.