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Rockets reach deal with Harden 5YRs/80 mil..WOW...
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NYKBocker
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11/1/2012  12:47 PM
earthmansurfer wrote:
NUPE wrote:Harden looked great and looks to be worth every penny. Lin, looked average at best.

3 insane passes, 12 pts, 4stls and 8 assists all while considering he is not 100% back physically from his surgery, and that is average to you

Add 4 boards and +23.

AUTOADVERT
holfresh
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11/1/2012  1:07 PM    LAST EDITED: 11/1/2012  1:08 PM
earthmansurfer wrote:
holfresh wrote:Here is why and don't use me as a barometer...When I got to college and my handle wasn't "good enough", I knew I was done as a ball player...Because of all the ball you play and handling the ball is elementary and mastered at a very young age...Lin is in the Pros, nothing he does off court will simulate the amount of on court time he handles the ball...He is what he is as far as handle and ball control...

But my overall point if signing Lin would cost us 60 mil in flexibility then it isn't worth it...I think we are all seeing it...I would have love to have Lin back coming off the bench until he grows as a player...But he ran for the money and thats all good...Knicks won't miss a beat by not signing him...

You knew you were done as a ball player cause your handle wasn't good enough? You can improve every facet of your game though, I don't follow you. Lin showed he can improve his handle and improve going left, and he did it in the pros. And, he isn't even 100% healthy from his knee surgery yet - yes a long time, but still the truth.

Signing Lin gave us flexibility, not cost us. Due to the new CBA it is very hard, if not impossible, for us to improve our team. If we had retained Lin we would at least have had him as an asset. Remember, many of us were worried about Stat's knees and health. To let Lin go was stupid as far as insurance with offensive production should Stat go down. I don't even think it is fair to call him Stat, we should call him "Crack".

The only thing Lin would have cost us was money out of Dolans pocket. But his marketability, jersey sales, etc. would have more than made up for that imo. Judging by all the fans coming to see him, that seems true. Again, Dolans decision appears to have been personal.

Well we all have a TV or two..Let's see how much his handle improves...Late game situations right now has Harden bringing up the ball...Lin didn't just find out his handle is suspect..As a player, you are the first to know...And it still needs lots of work...Look at most rookies coming into the league, it like the ball is part of them...Not so with Lin...But not to knock the kid..Lin will be ok...I just think all the brew ha ha about him leaving is just that...Felton will fill the bill at half price just fine, with defense to boot...

Cap-ologist say it would cost a lot more than u guys are admitting...Hey we all saw the games...We aren't missing out on Chris Paul 2.0...

gunsnewing
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11/1/2012  1:11 PM
Lin wouldve been fine playing with prigs and kidd
gunsnewing
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11/1/2012  1:13 PM
Amare and Melo make 20mil each. Dont want to hear and the cap. We have no flexibility with or without Lin
ChuckBuck
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11/1/2012  1:13 PM
gunsnewing wrote:Lin wouldve been fine playing with prigs and kidd

No he wouldn't. He can't play off the ball.

Lin needs to dominate the ball alot to make plays. He's a high "usage" player, not necessarily in scoring, but in having the ball in his hands.

earthmansurfer
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11/1/2012  1:14 PM
holfresh - He is 23 and he improved on going left just last year. His handle isn't great but when he drives to the hoop it is great. Well, it has more to do with him getting down very low making it very difficult to get at the ball - Shump mentioned that last year.

The thing is, is that he is just 23 years old and some of you guys are putting him up to a higher standard. Look at the contracts being handed out. The last year of his deal is a harder one, but overall it is a great contract.

We don't need him to be Chris Paul 2.0 - but he sure has that "it" factor and not many guys, even those that put up big numbers, have "it". And that you can't put in a box. So, I take the player with the suspect handle, or the guy who isn't quite tall enough, etc. but he got that "it" factor.

And, we all saw the games? That was the most incredible run I have seen in my life, in any sport and many feel the same. What is your point there?

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holfresh
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11/1/2012  1:16 PM
gunsnewing wrote:Amare and Melo make 20mil each. Dont want to hear and the cap. We have no flexibility with or without Lin

Lin isn't on their level...

earthmansurfer
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11/1/2012  1:18 PM
ChuckBuck wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:Lin wouldve been fine playing with prigs and kidd

No he wouldn't. He can't play off the ball.

Lin needs to dominate the ball alot to make plays. He's a high "usage" player, not necessarily in scoring, but in having the ball in his hands.

He would have played great with them. Just as Harden can bring the ball up the court to relieve pressure on Lin, so can Kidd or Prigs. Kidd can play 2G and does, so I don'T see your point? Lin is a great scorer and he played a ton off the ball in college as well. Again, I don't see your point. Anyway, Lin is fine bringing the ball up, but he did have his moments last year. Obviously for a team to throw 25 million at him they must have saw what most of us here did. As for Fields contract, they must have saw something none of us saw.

The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift. Albert Einstein
gunsnewing
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11/1/2012  1:18 PM
Jrue holiday never sniffed lins 25game stretch and got 48mil. Lin got 25mil
earthmansurfer
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11/1/2012  1:20 PM
holfresh wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:Amare and Melo make 20mil each. Dont want to hear and the cap. We have no flexibility with or without Lin

Lin isn't on their level...

You mean Lin is healthy and has a brain, respectfully? And Lin can actually lead a team and make his team mates better? Guess you are right, he isn't at their level. He is on a higher level.

The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift. Albert Einstein
holfresh
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11/1/2012  1:24 PM
earthmansurfer wrote:holfresh - He is 23 and he improved on going left just last year. His handle isn't great but when he drives to the hoop it is great. Well, it has more to do with him getting down very low making it very difficult to get at the ball - Shump mentioned that last year.

The thing is, is that he is just 23 years old and some of you guys are putting him up to a higher standard. Look at the contracts being handed out. The last year of his deal is a harder one, but overall it is a great contract.

We don't need him to be Chris Paul 2.0 - but he sure has that "it" factor and not many guys, even those that put up big numbers, have "it". And that you can't put in a box. So, I take the player with the suspect handle, or the guy who isn't quite tall enough, etc. but he got that "it" factor.

And, we all saw the games? That was the most incredible run I have seen in my life, in any sport and many feel the same. What is your point there?

Well I think the 18-6 run was better after MDA but that's me...We got Felton who is better right now at half the price...Right now Felton is better at 0.5..That is my point...As far as "it" factor, hey listen, lots of people got caught up into Linsanity and love all the hype that goes along with it...There is a place for all that too, it's entertainment...But at some point the kid has to sign the dotted line to be here, he didn't...Kicking out 60 mil to keep him is just foolish...We are now solid at PG...Solid...

AnubisADL
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11/1/2012  1:24 PM    LAST EDITED: 11/1/2012  1:25 PM
Lin can lead a team? To a top lottery pick,yes.

I cant wait to see Lin go against Curry, Holiday, Lawson, Jennings, Paul, Williams, Dragic, Irving, etc.

We shall see what the excuse will be then.

*Waits for Harden to be blamed for making Lin play off the ball*

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NYKBocker
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11/1/2012  1:25 PM
holfresh wrote:
earthmansurfer wrote:holfresh - He is 23 and he improved on going left just last year. His handle isn't great but when he drives to the hoop it is great. Well, it has more to do with him getting down very low making it very difficult to get at the ball - Shump mentioned that last year.

The thing is, is that he is just 23 years old and some of you guys are putting him up to a higher standard. Look at the contracts being handed out. The last year of his deal is a harder one, but overall it is a great contract.

We don't need him to be Chris Paul 2.0 - but he sure has that "it" factor and not many guys, even those that put up big numbers, have "it". And that you can't put in a box. So, I take the player with the suspect handle, or the guy who isn't quite tall enough, etc. but he got that "it" factor.

And, we all saw the games? That was the most incredible run I have seen in my life, in any sport and many feel the same. What is your point there?

Well I think the 18-6 run was better after MDA but that's me...We got Felton who is better right now at half the price...Right now Felton is better at 0.5..That is my point...As far as "it" factor, hey listen, lots of people got caught up into Linsanity and love all the hype that goes along with it...There is a place for all that too, it's entertainment...But at some point the kid has to sign the dotted line to be here, he didn't...Kicking out 60 mil to keep him is just foolish...We are now solid at PG...Solid...

Knicks never offered him a contract.

AnubisADL
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11/1/2012  1:27 PM    LAST EDITED: 11/1/2012  1:27 PM
gunsnewing wrote:Jrue holiday never sniffed lins 25game stretch and got 48mil. Lin got 25mil

Jrue Holiday didnt get to play with Melo, Amare, and Chandler either. Nor did he play for D'Antoni.

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ChuckBuck
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11/1/2012  1:30 PM
gunsnewing wrote:Jrue holiday never sniffed lins 25game stretch and got 48mil. Lin got 25mil

You're right, Jrue actually played 82 games one season. 3+ years of solid point guard play and playoff experience will justify 48mil, just like Ty Lawsons is too. Stephen Curry, not so much. Lin, To be determined, but based on 25 games, phuck no.

holfresh
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11/1/2012  1:32 PM    LAST EDITED: 11/1/2012  1:35 PM
NYKBocker wrote:
holfresh wrote:
earthmansurfer wrote:holfresh - He is 23 and he improved on going left just last year. His handle isn't great but when he drives to the hoop it is great. Well, it has more to do with him getting down very low making it very difficult to get at the ball - Shump mentioned that last year.

The thing is, is that he is just 23 years old and some of you guys are putting him up to a higher standard. Look at the contracts being handed out. The last year of his deal is a harder one, but overall it is a great contract.

We don't need him to be Chris Paul 2.0 - but he sure has that "it" factor and not many guys, even those that put up big numbers, have "it". And that you can't put in a box. So, I take the player with the suspect handle, or the guy who isn't quite tall enough, etc. but he got that "it" factor.

And, we all saw the games? That was the most incredible run I have seen in my life, in any sport and many feel the same. What is your point there?

Well I think the 18-6 run was better after MDA but that's me...We got Felton who is better right now at half the price...Right now Felton is better at 0.5..That is my point...As far as "it" factor, hey listen, lots of people got caught up into Linsanity and love all the hype that goes along with it...There is a place for all that too, it's entertainment...But at some point the kid has to sign the dotted line to be here, he didn't...Kicking out 60 mil to keep him is just foolish...We are now solid at PG...Solid...

Knicks never offered him a contract.

For the hundredth time that was already covered in these pages....Under the new and old CBA, If Lin wanted more than 5 mil per, which he did, the Knicks could not offer him a contract...All Lin could do is go elsewhere and get an offer above the 5 mil per threshold so the Knicks could match that deal...Well he got a deal with a poison pill so the Knicks won't match it and we didn't match, call it ego...If some one is letting me know he doesn't want to play here then I won't play the role of a regected girlfriend either...I don't blame Dolan...He is not the only player that went elsewhere...Batum in Portland couldn't get an offer from his team...Hibbert couldn't get an offer from his team..Their teams had to wait from some to offer more than the minimum threshold to match...But Lin was the only one to sign onto a poison pill...

earthmansurfer
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11/1/2012  1:39 PM
AnubisADL wrote:Lin can lead a team? To a top lottery pick,yes.

I cant wait to see Lin go against Curry, Holiday, Lawson, Jennings, Paul, Williams, Dragic, Irving, etc.

We shall see what the excuse will be then.

*Waits for Harden to be blamed for making Lin play off the ball*

No guard can stop a top guard. It makes no sense even bringing it up. Shump is near as good as a guard can get defensively and on a given night he will get lit up. But that said, you look for a guard who can guard well and can score and distribute. Lin did all those things. And his defense was GREAT before he got burned out from playing so many minutes. I look forward to seeing how he plays in another month or so.

holfresh wrote:
NYKBocker wrote:
Knicks never offered him a contract.

For the hundredth time that was already covered in these pages....Under the new and old CBA, If Lin wanted more than 5 mil per, which he did, the Knicks could not offer him a contract...All Lin could do is go elsewhere and get an offer above the 5 mil per threshold so the Knicks could match that deal...Well he got a deal with a poison pill so the Knicks won't match it and we didn't match, call it ego...If some one is letting me know he doesn't want to play here then I won't play the role of a regected girlfriend either...I don't blame Dolan...He is not the only player that went elsewhere...Batum in Portland couldn't get an offer from his team...Hibbert couldn't get an offer from his team..Their teams had to wait from some to offer more than the minimum threshold to match...But Lin was the only one to sign onto a poison pill...

The Knicks should have offered him all they could. That is the basis for something not to mention respect. Lin never came out and said anything. Lin did what the Knicks asked him to do. Something is fishy there. And most of us suspect it was Dolan being pissed at Houston's second offer and not the money.

The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift. Albert Einstein
holfresh
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11/1/2012  1:41 PM    LAST EDITED: 11/1/2012  1:43 PM
earthmansurfer wrote:
AnubisADL wrote:Lin can lead a team? To a top lottery pick,yes.

I cant wait to see Lin go against Curry, Holiday, Lawson, Jennings, Paul, Williams, Dragic, Irving, etc.

We shall see what the excuse will be then.

*Waits for Harden to be blamed for making Lin play off the ball*

No guard can stop a top guard. It makes no sense even bringing it up. Shump is near as good as a guard can get defensively and on a given night he will get lit up. But that said, you look for a guard who can guard well and can score and distribute. Lin did all those things. And his defense was GREAT before he got burned out from playing so many minutes. I look forward to seeing how he plays in another month or so.

holfresh wrote:
NYKBocker wrote:
Knicks never offered him a contract.

For the hundredth time that was already covered in these pages....Under the new and old CBA, If Lin wanted more than 5 mil per, which he did, the Knicks could not offer him a contract...All Lin could do is go elsewhere and get an offer above the 5 mil per threshold so the Knicks could match that deal...Well he got a deal with a poison pill so the Knicks won't match it and we didn't match, call it ego...If some one is letting me know he doesn't want to play here then I won't play the role of a regected girlfriend either...I don't blame Dolan...He is not the only player that went elsewhere...Batum in Portland couldn't get an offer from his team...Hibbert couldn't get an offer from his team..Their teams had to wait from some to offer more than the minimum threshold to match...But Lin was the only one to sign onto a poison pill...

The Knicks should have offered him all they could. That is the basis for something not to mention respect. Lin never came out and said anything. Lin did what the Knicks asked him to do. Something is fishy there. And most of us suspect it was Dolan being pissed at Houston's second offer and not the money.

They could only offer 5 mil which they would have done but Lin wanted more...By rule he had to go elsewhere to get more..What is so difficult to understand..

KnicksFE
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11/1/2012  1:42 PM    LAST EDITED: 11/1/2012  1:44 PM
earthmansurfer wrote:
holfresh wrote:Here is why and don't use me as a barometer...When I got to college and my handle wasn't "good enough", I knew I was done as a ball player...Because of all the ball you play and handling the ball is elementary and mastered at a very young age...Lin is in the Pros, nothing he does off court will simulate the amount of on court time he handles the ball...He is what he is as far as handle and ball control...

But my overall point if signing Lin would cost us 60 mil in flexibility then it isn't worth it...I think we are all seeing it...I would have love to have Lin back coming off the bench until he grows as a player...But he ran for the money and thats all good...Knicks won't miss a beat by not signing him...

You knew you were done as a ball player cause your handle wasn't good enough? You can improve every facet of your game though, I don't follow you. Lin showed he can improve his handle and improve going left, and he did it in the pros. And, he isn't even 100% healthy from his knee surgery yet - yes a long time, but still the truth.

Signing Lin gave us flexibility, not cost us. Due to the new CBA it is very hard, if not impossible, for us to improve our team. If we had retained Lin we would at least have had him as an asset. Remember, many of us were worried about Stat's knees and health. To let Lin go was stupid as far as insurance with offensive production should Stat go down. I don't even think it is fair to call him Stat, we should call him "Crack".

The only thing Lin would have cost us was money out of Dolans pocket. But his marketability, jersey sales, etc. would have more than made up for that imo. Judging by all the fans coming to see him, that seems true. Again, Dolans decision appears to have been personal.

What flexibility are you talking about? the Knicks are and will be over the cap with little flexibility going foward. Remember teams get penilized for being over the cap, so three years from now the Knicks will still pay luxury tax regardless, how much money you think Felton, Kidd, Novak or Camby are really costing the Knicks when you consider the luxury tax?

earthmansurfer
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11/1/2012  1:44 PM
holfresh wrote:
earthmansurfer wrote:
AnubisADL wrote:Lin can lead a team? To a top lottery pick,yes.

I cant wait to see Lin go against Curry, Holiday, Lawson, Jennings, Paul, Williams, Dragic, Irving, etc.

We shall see what the excuse will be then.

*Waits for Harden to be blamed for making Lin play off the ball*

No guard can stop a top guard. It makes no sense even bringing it up. Shump is near as good as a guard can get defensively and on a given night he will get lit up. But that said, you look for a guard who can guard well and can score and distribute. Lin did all those things. And his defense was GREAT before he got burned out from playing so many minutes. I look forward to seeing how he plays in another month or so.

holfresh wrote:
NYKBocker wrote:
Knicks never offered him a contract.

For the hundredth time that was already covered in these pages....Under the new and old CBA, If Lin wanted more than 5 mil per, which he did, the Knicks could not offer him a contract...All Lin could do is go elsewhere and get an offer above the 5 mil per threshold so the Knicks could match that deal...Well he got a deal with a poison pill so the Knicks won't match it and we didn't match, call it ego...If some one is letting me know he doesn't want to play here then I won't play the role of a regected girlfriend either...I don't blame Dolan...He is not the only player that went elsewhere...Batum in Portland couldn't get an offer from his team...Hibbert couldn't get an offer from his team..Their teams had to wait from some to offer more than the minimum threshold to match...But Lin was the only one to sign onto a poison pill...

The Knicks should have offered him all they could. That is the basis for something not to mention respect. Lin never came out and said anything. Lin did what the Knicks asked him to do. Something is fishy there. And most of us suspect it was Dolan being pissed at Houston's second offer and not the money.

They could only offer 5 mil which they would have done but Lin wanted more...By rule he had to go elsewhere to get more..What is so difficult to understand..

You are looking at it purely as a numbers thing. I am saying there is the basis of communication and respect involved. The Knicks were eerily silent the whole way through. You can turn a business into a nice place to work or you can keep it purely business. Lin brought something more to the team and I think they should have responded in like.

The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift. Albert Einstein
Rockets reach deal with Harden 5YRs/80 mil..WOW...

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